Aphantasia round 3

don't close your #goodbyegoogle threads, but we had a good discussion going about aphantasia last night, 2 threads that archived with over 500 posts each, and I just want to put up this, the ABSOLUTE FUCKING STATE of normies. look at the replies to this video about aphantasia.

does video games cause this? TalmudVision? what is happening to people? I can visualize so strongly sometimes it blocks out what I am actually seeing with my eyes, if they are open.

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I talked with my coworker last night. I kinda slipped up when I said "Holy shit, if most people can't imagine like that I wonder whose the fucked up one." Hopefully she didn't catch that, but yeah. Most people can't imagine really well. That legitimately shocked the fuck outta me.

this isn't politics

The fact that you can't see the connection between Aphantasia

yes it is you faggot because people who can't imagine things (like you) should not hold office; that is the point I am making

Is this the new version of the no internal monologue NPC thing? I wonder what the overlap rate is.

probably 100%

some gems from the last thread

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I think in words, with pictures as well as sound and smell occasionally. I can imagine taste too, I assume everyone can do this as it would be evolutionary advantageous to do this, and highly detrimental to be unable to.

What I wanna know is does anyone else think in other people's accents? I hear Jordan Peterson, or Michael Pollen or Gordan Ramsay thinking in my head, or random Russian or my bosses voice. Often the thoughts are spelled out using every letter of the words, this gets kind of annoying though

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same here; I also hear other peoples words in their own voice in my head when I think about them; and sometimes when I give myself advice in my head, my internal voice will take on the voice of the person in my life who would be most likely to give me that advice; also, to elaborate on my OP, sometimes when I am reliving a particularly vivid event in my live, traumatic or otherwise, I see it so strongly that my surroundings seem to change to what I am thinking about and I stop seeing what is infront of my eyes.

What the fuck is this? Can some fags just see dinosaurs if they want to? Sounds like autism to me?

bait.
but if not, you are an NPC

I think I watched so much anime that I have to put in conscious effort to imagine things in somewhat photorealistic 3d instead of anime 2d(It can still be in a 3d environment with 3d objects, everything just has 2d anime graphics, but somehow in 3d.)

I've played vidya (too much) since I was like 6 years old and can easily visualize shit, so it's not that. I'd imagine it has nothing to do with media consumption at all, actually

hypothesize with me then... vaccines?

Does this mean they can't dream?

Do we really have any idea how common this is? I no longer have the link to the original "inner voice" study that kicked off our first round of NPC discussions last year, that got bastardized into the NPC meme, but I seem to recall the results indicated most people had no inner voice; however, I seem to recall that study had a suspect methodology.

what do these people do if left alone with out any instructions or tools?

How do they not get lost all the time?

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This isnt something people are born with. When mothers read to their children they are developing thier childs minds eye.

If Roastie moms gave a single fuck about their children and not treat them as some sort of accessory or entry fee into a private club then this would not be a thing.

Yes they are top tier NPC's but also they are mongrels among us. No imagination or dreams, unable to conceptualize, all the abilities that makes the human brain such a wonder are neglected and allowed to atrophy.

Feel nothing but pity for such creatures.

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>Jewish patent clerk thief
>Red Talks

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Never was this more appropriate

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This is a result of lack of early education, reading in particular.

I genuinely don't know, and it's probably the only thing to come from the Jow Forums-sphere to actually disturb me. I can't even fathom how people would be able to operate without the ability to visualize anything, especially since "visualization" is so deeply linked with cognition in general (i.e. planning, forethought, ability to consider something).

It literally sounds like how I would imagine an animal would process information, which is incredibly upsetting.

Hell, if I would do that 72 hour isolation room thing, I could easily entertain myself be walking up and down in the room and talking to myself and imagining stuff. Yesterday I was going to take a shower after I got home, but I ended up just walking up and down in the house while talking to myself for a whole hour (while naked) before getting into the bathtub to take a shower.

But thoughts are conceptual, this sounds like a massive own goal in brain function

I think it could be this. I still vividly remember visualizing things from the stories my parents read me when I was little even now.

From what I recall of prior threads, they can dream. Although how they can confirm that they dream if their aphantasia prevents them from recalling images of the dream, I'm not so sure. I guess the verdict on aphantasia victims dreaming is a soft "probably".
I'm inclined to consider this as a possible explanation. Reading to them, telling them stories, or just conversing with them where you're describing places and events that are happening elsewhere, that's gotta contribute to a functioning mind.

Why the need to develop imagination, when your iPhone brings finger family to your 5-year-old brain 24/7.

when I was a kid I could used to taste names, I would avoid some kids based on their names

I still remember how 3 names tasted

Ivan or Ian tasted like composted grass and nickle

the word Germany tasted like conkers, it went away around 6-7 thankfully

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When the realization came out a few months ago that some people do not think in language, I attributed that to lack of reading. All people who read for more than to pass school, think in terms of language. I could partially understand that non-readers do not develop this.
But I can not imagine not being able to picture images in your head when you think about something. Daydreaming, imagining your new room decor so you know what color to paint the walls, remembering your child's face how they looked on their last birthday, thinking up what you want to draw before you draw it.
Because seeing images is from birth. Its not brought on by learning language or reading, something you need before you have an internal monologue. Images are from birth.
This is astonishing.
No wonder they don't get 'memes'.
No wonder they can't see beyond themselves. They actually can't.

A few things:

-Does anyone else have 2 mind visual spaces? Like, I can imagine something in a superficial. front-ish area, but it's blurrier. Then If I get deep I can imagine with far more quality, but it feels like more of a centered space, instead of front-ish

-Sometimes I have Matrix-tier dreams where I can touch the things and marvel at how detailed they are in a haptic (tactile) sense. Like I just lucid dream and spend the dream touching things, knowing it's a dream, but trying and failing to detect any difference from reality in touch. It's insane detail, this can't be made up by my brain.

It had a very suspect methodology. What I remember is that it was only about 30 college kids and consisted of a buzzer or something going off at random intervals at which point the students would write what they were thinking at the time with the majority of respondents regularly saying "nothing".

Finite number of souls

If we had any idea of the age demographics of...fuck it, we have to coin a neologism, "aphantasians", if we had any idea of the age demographics, that would go a long way towards weighing vaccines are a contributing factor. Every year they add more shots to the vaccine schedule. If the aphantasia is really rare among boomers, more common among Gen X, more common still among Millennials and Gen Z, that would be a correlation with the ever increasing number of vaccines.

>Does anyone else have 2 mind visual spaces? Like, I can imagine something in a superficial. front-ish area, but it's blurrier. Then If I get deep I can imagine with far more quality, but it feels like more of a centered space, instead of front-ish
Yep

So I can conceptualize objects, but there is no visual aspect so my thoughts.
Like I can troubleshoot things, be able to interpret cause and effect, draw conclusions of future events based on current information. But in my head, it's like I just 'know' how a machine works, rather than seeing components moving and interacting in my mind's eye
It's like the computer is running but the monitor is turned off

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I can't visualise things in detail as if they were real. I do know the properties of the objects and colours, textures etc and where I would expect all of this to be in my visual field, and that's just how I've always imagined something. No image is formed of the actual object in my mind, though. The only thing I see with my eyes shut is black, but with a very minor abstract noise on top of it which I can tune into and sort of manipulate into producing certain patterns or colours, though this was not reliable.

I might try to visualsie objects, it seems like a skill that can be developed, but isn't necessarily there or even necessary to function (unlike having an internal monologue, which you really need).

this

I maintain that majority of normies are really NPC., literally, not metaphorically. Search on youtube for "the shadow people" and you will understand.

Basically, majority of "people" lack souls. And you all suspected that, already.

>Does anyone else have 2 mind visual spaces? Like, I can imagine something in a superficial. front-ish area, but it's blurrier. Then If I get deep I can imagine with far more quality, but it feels like more of a centered space, instead of front-ish
Like imagining something visual but still being able to concentrate on what your eyes are seeing and concentrating on something you imagine so much that it basically takes over your vision?

This can be reversed, at least to a certain extent. My wife could not visualize things - but teaching her how to cook somehow unlocked the ability to visualize the outcome of a dish. Including the textures, smells, colors, and orientation for presentation - she is even better at describing things and making choices as a result of this too.

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>These trips

>This post

CHECKED

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I can only remember a few scents, but I can't recall them
I know them when I smell them tho

if you can't stop thinking in their accents, you might start hearing voice in the future
else it's just playful thinking

This is actually a thing??? People are that fucking retarded? I can visualize scenarios in explicit detail, play the scenario out, work out 3-dimensional problems, in addition to visualizing words and making up music in my head if I want to. I assumed this is how your brain is supposed to work. People are idiots if this is true they can’t do any of that. Next level NPC’s. Jesus.

And this is why white societies are successful orderly societies vs everywhere else.

It's like,

-First mode feels like it's in the front, and you are watching it, like TV. Blurrier, takes more concentration. Usually single objects.

-Second mode is deeper. Either feels in a center area, overlapping you, or it deletes your sense of location, like transitioning into a dream while being awake at the same time. It's way more detailed, can be a lot of objects, scenery, anything detailed.

samefag here.

I meant "backdrop people". Look it up.

Yep. I can hear other’s voices, accents, dialects. I can remember and think of scents and tastes. My saliva glands will spasm when I think of something sour, like a Lemonhead or lime juice. Just did it. People must have half a functioning brain. Explains so much.

I have dreams where I can control and change things, but I think its different from true lucid dreaming because I'm still living in the dream world. I've only had three dreams where I am consciously aware that I am actually sleeping and dreaming and start going off doing cool shit.

Can people describe how/where they feel is the space they are imagining in? I've practiced meditation a lot so I can't consider myself a normal baseline.

Maybe some people can do the first one but not the second, and that's why they think they are shit at visualization

Impossible to say without knowing distribution. Could just as easily be some kind of stunting in early development like this or this. I know baby talk can stunt children verbally so I wouldn’t be surprised if it was caused by lack of proper parental interaction. 1 in 4 kids are born to single mothers now and they probably just get left in carriers for hours on end while mommy plays on her phone causing the back of the baby’s head to be flat and maybe whatever gets smushed is responsible for the mind’s eye.

People dont see it unless theyre schizo or tripping
They imagine it in the back of their head
But many people can't even imagine it

THIS
If your mom reads to you, you'll be able to do this
did your parents read stories to you?

Telling stories causes the vivid imagination, I think.
I honestly think all those people must be baiting and everyone can think in visuals
but then again, most peoples survived without 'visualisation' or forethought..

>its like the computer is running but the monitor is turned off
interesting way to put it. are you saying you never have mental visuals and cannot imagine yourself on a beach in the sun with sand under you and a drink in your hand?

this interests me.

I can not imagine things like pic realted. Wehn i close my eyes and try to paint something on the black there will remain nothing.

But

I imagine things like a second vision. practicaly speaking it is located right above my real visual field. It's quite literaly on top of my head. there i can imagine everything in colour, moving you name it. And when i let my focus slip it wanders into my real visual field where i stop perceiving my real vision and "see" what i imagine.

>user what are you looking at?
>... auu nothing just thinking.

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>utorrent
Die.

I know where everything should be and what should be around me, the properties of it all, but I can't see it.

Could be due to lack of reading these days, too. I used to read a shit ton of novels, still do. Perhaps that develops internal imaging/visualization? Saying people can’t visualize is akin to trying to imagine how a dog thinks.

Yeah there seems to be kind of an in-between dream state where you can change things and have a relative awareness of it, but you really go with the flow. The actual conscious, full control dreams are harder. Those are the fun ones where I have tactile feedback. Like I grab a stick and I feel all the goddamn fibers and splinters and weight, everything. If I hit something I feel the inertia, the vibration after the shock, all of that. I keep doing those things because I'm marveled at this, since this should take way more brain power than I should have. Feels like you stepped into another realm, which is hilarious and interesting.

I can't remember explicitly my parents reading to me but I started reading novels in middle school and went from below par reading level to college+ level in 2 years

when I picture my dads house I can see the steps leading up to it, and every room in the house, and mentally explore the space, seeing in full color. what is it like when you think of a space you are not currently in?

that's exactly what it is. i only wonder when the "superpower" narrative elements will set in like no fap. IF its real, then fine, but just like the internal monologue thing its only debateable if it really does affect a person beyond experience of life and being able to call that person a mindless npc.
but yes, its npc meme version 3.0 i think: a shill meme phenomenon where lower tier disabilities are wagered against your morale hoping to suggest to you and all your frens that "you are actually zombies so give up, and vote democrat, and btw lets not forget the jews are the smartest people in the world, and we can safely assume they have none of said disabilities". hopefully this one will be re-engineered as well.

Definitely likely. Reading is majorly important that way. Taking the author’s descriptions and turning them into a clear picture in your mind seems like a fundamental building block.

I have very vivid dreams but only occasional lucid dreaming. Be aware that I'm dreaming usually wakes me up and so I can't maintain it for very long.
I have had inception level dreams before, usually a nightmare of some kind where I become aware I'm dreaming and force myself to "wake up" but when I do I'm still in a dream just in a more peacful situation, often times my childhood home or with friends with just normal things going on, aware if the fact that I'm still dreaming.

>"i HAVE DEPRESSION"
>"MY BOYFRIEND HAS ANXIETY"
>"MY GIRLFRIEND HAS APHANTASIA"
>"I HAVE ADHD"
>"SORRY I CANT DO THAT CAUSE OF MY BPD"
>"I HAVE PTSD FROM COLLEGE WHEN MY ASS WAS TOUCHED"
HOLY SHIT SHUT THE FUCK UP. "I HAVE" HAS BECOME MY WARNING FOR BEJNG ABOUT TO HEAR SOME NARCISSISTIC SNOWFLAKE SHIT. FUCK OFF WITH THIS SHIT. I DONT CARE WHAT YOU HAVE. I DONT CARE ABOUT YOU. STOP POSTING SHIT FRONM REDDIT.

>Most people are fucking retarded
So... is this actually the case? And I haven’t just been biased all these years? I thought even little kids could imagine and visualize things from an early age.

Calm the fuck down

I have a theory on this, but I need to know more. What are the general age ranges for this? Because my thoughts on the subject are as follows:
>we used to read everything
>then we had radio to entertain us
>then we had television to entertain us
>we used to play outside all the time
>we used to play "let's pretend"
>now we play video games
>we used to have to do all math and what not in our heads at school
>then we were allowed to use calculators
>now everybody is using Google for everything

It used to be some people would claim "reading is boring." I used to write that off as people who were lazy. Maybe these were people who lack the ability to visualize anything at all? Now I'm reading about this all fucking over the place. Assuming this new "condition" isn't some sort of hoax, is this possibly due to technology hijacking very basic thought processes?

>I DONT CARE ABOUT YOU
>No empathy
>No inner voice
>probably can't visualize or think with language
NPC detected

Yeah, mine's a bit different. First mode allows me to still see and hear things, so visual imagination in this mode is basically almost non-existent and is just sometimes an opaque, almost transparent overlay on my vision, imagining sounds goes as normal, although I have a tendency of saying things out loud and just generally talking to myself while walking up and down. Second mode is basically the same, except not safe for times when I'm walking somewhere, because my visual and auditory imagination takes over what I see and hear. Even if I'm walking somewhere on autopilot, I still have to be careful about doing this because I won't notice the car that's about to hit me while I'm crossing the road. Thankfully I can easily switch between the two.

I wonder if this can be developed after childhood. can you build your...imagination?... later in life?

Could you set booby traps tho? If you can’t visualize how someone setting the trap off would play out it seems impossible to stage/place things correctly?

My grandma use to read me curious George and these scratch n sniff Christmas stories lol
The first novels I read were those "series of unfortunate events" books

You would just imagine how the events would play out. You just don't 'see' it visually as if it were real.

Maybe if you had to like Cast Away style. No distractions or anything..I’m not sure

Yeah a lot of would be lucid dreams end quickly by you waking up, it sucks.
I haven't had nightmares for a looong time, at most some rare uncomfortable dreams. Layered dreams, I've had more than nightmares, but still very few.

I'm trying this now. Front mode is like the pic you posted, even with open eyes. It's really hard to imagine something there, takes a lot of effort, and it always loses concreteness when you slip.
Front-up mode has similar quality to my center-mode, but you still feel like you are watching something in front of you. Seems good for single objects. Also seems easier to daydream with and superimpose it to reality, to a degree.

That’s what imagining something is though.

I don't think its a hoax but I think possibly the phenomena is being described poorly and people think it means something that it doesn't mean and they attribute themselves to have this thing that they are thinking means what it doesn't mean

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So I know what sitting on the beach feels like, I know what the sun and sand and drink in my hand feels like
But there is no visual aspect to my thoughts, it's like I'm using my memories to create concepts of what an imagined scene would involve
It's not like I worry if I'm an NPC, if I am, I'm a self aware one that knows the only thing I can trust as existing is my mind
Cogito, ergo sum.

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I realized that there are huge differnces when i was a kid. I talked to some kids about how i can listen to music in my head, and make it louder or quieter and it sounds 1 to 1 as if im listening to it in real life. Many kids said they cant hear anything or imagine anything. I have a problem with visualizing tho. I can see the stuff that i want, i can also manipulate it, but if i have a shape, and rotate it, its not always right. Its like when you dream, you see a hand for example. It looks like a hand, but it might turn out to have 6 fingers. So my brain kinda just uses this dream algorithm to create the visuals when rotating, and not the conscious part of the brain used for logically thinking. So the rotated object might seem fitting at first, but it has a high probability of being objectively wrong in its shape in some form.
I wonder if you can train this to get objectively correct results and not have this „ill just make it seem somewhat realistic rather than actually putting computer power to calculate the shape correctly“ mindset of the brain

I have to pee

thanks, I was looking for this one

Oh wtf man it’s like we’ve unknowingly been living on the Island of Dr. Moreau

According to some psychological schools, people have a main circuit that's more active than others,either thoughts, emotions or body. I assume people who think reading is boring are body-active.

Like, they can read, but their body control is screaming MOVE MOVE DO SOMETHING COME ON. So they accumulate tension. Maybe ADHD is an extreme version of that.

Not 100%. I have an internal monolouge and I have Aphanstia.

There's that guy on the thread who describes as computer running with monitor shut down. So he would "know" how to set up the bobby trap no problem, he just wouldn't be able to imagine the scene. It's probably unconscious processing whose visual component he can't access, but it does the job no problem.

Interesting. Why do you think that is?

>NPCs can't think in their inner voice
>NPCs can't imagine images, speaking of detailed 3d objects
Oh my god, I knew it. World is a simulation, with only handful of real people.

Weird but I can see the logic there

>aphantasians
hmm, or maybie
>aphantasites?
>aphantoyans
.....
>aphaniggers?

Do you "know" or do you "feel" the sun, drink, etc?
You may have more haptic (tactile) or propioception (body) sense than visual sense

I generally can imagine things fairly vividly, especially when it comes to music. I envision entire landscapes and patterns and geometric colors. I dont want to call it synesthesia but I definitely feel like certain sounds and tones conjure up different colors or shapes/textures

I don't give a shit, I'm just not going to type "people with aphantasia" or "aphantasia victims" every time.

I like "aphantasians"

I'm not sure.
Its a bit like the other user here described, the computer working with the monitor shut off.
I think a good analogy would be that I think in text files, while you think in image files. If you ask me to describe a sunset, I know exactly what it is, the properties of it, etc but I can't actually see it.

It's also not linked to reading, I read a shit ton when I was younger, and my parents also read me stories.

It was supermetaphysical sense to find pleasing and displeasing people.
Did it just randomly disappear or did you do something?

I trap feral hog all the time, I can look at the environment and draw conclusions of hog movement, how the trap would spring, about how many I'd capture.
Just because I can't visually see the trap in action in my head doesn't mean I can't have an instinctual sense of how the trap would work
Most of the time, I find myself at an advantage over non-aphantasias when it comes to predicting mechanical outcomes, their mind's eye may not give the right interpretation and cause doubt, I have a more instinctual interpretation of interactions

There's a few ways to explain inter-sense interaction:

-Some of it is due to memory. For example, it is proven smell is the best sense to instantly evoke memories.

-Others are due to mental association. Freud style. One concept leads to another due to meaning being tangentially related. Like dreams. Or music's rythm, tones, melody...

-Arbitrary associations like synesthesia are probably because of extra white matter connecting brain areas, like visual cortex and temporal lobes. So some perceptions are randomly tied to anothers.

-Collective unconscious