You people don’t understand Marxism.
It’s not a Jewish conspiracy. It’s not an attempt to form a totalitarian state. You guys constantly preach about the failures of capitalism, yet won’t accept a theoretically sound system that we can put into practice as capitalism inevitably fails?
Read some fucking books.
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>>Read some fucking books.
We did. This is how we know that you're a faggot.
I understand it!
What books? Did they have pretty pictures?
How come the Soviet genocides under Yagoda were blamed on Stalin instead? Doesn't that seem odd to you that the people specifically responsible are not held accountable but Stalin takes all the blame? And the doctors plot is treated like a tragedy despite it being a legitimate act of treason?
Also if you say "basic economics" I'm going to be convinced that the right only has one joke.
>It’s not a Jewish conspiracy.
yes it is
>It’s not an attempt to form a totalitarian state.
true, in theory it desires a classless stateless society, but in practice the state will never dissolve so it will always lead to jewish totalitarianism
> theoretically sound system
baahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Look I'm not for Marx, but communisms greatest enemies were within and they have yet to be named.
No response. Typical.
Stalinist USSR wasn’t communist. It wasn’t even socialist. At best, it was a degenerated workers state.
It’s important to remember, however, that it was an attempt at socialism while under the direction of Lenin.
en.wikipedia.org
>Meir Henoch Wallach was born into a wealthy Polish Jewish banking family
Daily reminder that communists aren't actually people.
“Yes it is” isn’t an argument. Neither is “bahahahahaha”.
>muh 66 gorrillion
>It wasn’t even socialist
According to it's 1936 Soviet constitution it was because the workers deputies were an intermediary for the workers to exact their despotism.
>It’s not a Jewish conspiracy.
Well, it's a Jewish revolutionary ideology. Jews always disguised their ethnic nationalism as "communism," and once they gained power, used "communism" as an excuse to kill gentiles en masse.
it's not that bad
"It isn't jewish (source: dude trust me)" isn't an argument, neither is "theoretically sound (source: dude trust me)".
So, a Polish banker advocated for a system that would make banking nonexistent?
You guys see red as soon as you learn somebody is Jewish. Adolph Hitler could be exposed as a Jew and all of you fucks would shift away from Nazism.
>Stalinist USSR wasn’t communist.
Correct if you want to argue semantics
>It wasn’t even socialist
Not true
>At best, it was a degenerated workers state
OK TROTSKY THAT'S NICE CAN WE GET BACK TO IMPROVING THE LIVES OF SOVIET WORKERS NOW
>but user there had to be SOME communist movements that weren't simply Jewish movements!
Well...
> an attempt at socialism while under the direction of Lenin.
Oof looks like you're retarded, your boy Noam Chomsky said that Lenin destroyed socialism.
As back in the day my 15 year old friend said "Marxism is good in theory but it doesn't work in practice, it's an utopia which is impossible to achieve."
>theoretically sound
>labor theory of value
Not to mention that the day after you brainless kike spawn redistribute all the productive folks property to subhumans, you will have to kill people to stop them from trading and have an authoritarian state.
>a theoretically sound system that we can put into practice
Explain this system and how we can put it into practice in 100 words or more
>theoretically sound system
>theoretically sound
>theoretically
What’s the argument against the LTV? Are you going to equivocate on value?
All communists are Jewish Supremacists.
Although you don't need to be Jewish yourself to be a Jewish Supremacist, most likely you will be.
I assume any communist is Jewish until proven otherwise. I'm right most of the time using this method.
(((Goldman)))
"Marxism" isn't really a system so much as it is a philosophical approach to anti-capitalism.
I agree that Marxism needs to be revisited, but tankyism is a bureaucratic clusterfuck that sure as shit doesn't.
Market socialism is a fair approach. Shame the the West is too cucked by the elites to consider something of that nature.
Stalin, Lenin, Mao, Castro were all good people. We need the USSR back, and need the U.S. to collapse. Stop trying to debate dumbass capitalists, and just accelerate the collapse of the United States
Ok fine, you strip capital from the rich, and remove the means of production from the producers. Who steps into the void? Statist politicos whose only skill is kissing ass and climbing the ladder. How long before these sychophants become the new wealthy elite? Or more importantly, how long before it all (the economy, goods, services, etc.) comes tumbling down?
Step 1. Topple the US
Step 2. World revolution
Step 3. Problem solved
You can pretend there's more words down here but it's really not that hard
Yeah, let me ask my 12 relatives who were murdered while under a Marxist government about how epic Marxism is
Communism has killed more than any ideology on earth, and Karl Marx is basically a little fucking girl when its come to "intellectual" thinking regarding sociology and politics.
> Theoretically sound
Someone's never heard of the First Welfare Theorem
>a theoretically sound system
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAH
>Who steps into the void?
The... workers? You know?
You've never been to Cuba, faggot.
>let me ask my 12 relatives who were murdered while under a Marxist government about how epic Marxism is
How much land did they own? How many slaves did they have? I bet they were from Cuba right?
>It’s not a Jewish conspiracy.
Literally invented by a Jew.
KYS
Hitler was half Jewish you fucking moron
Market socialism is just self managed capitalism. The USSR's bureaucratic system was necessary to suppress the law of value, and it was way better than Yugoslavia's system. Mainly because USSR guaranteed its citizens free education, housing, healthcare, and subsidized food.
>World Revolution
>Murder a shit ton of people
>Oppress even more
>Damage all infrastructure and utilities due this "World Revolution" making recovery more difficult and deadly
>Solving a problem
Critical thinking isn't really a strong point with commies
Nice emotional appeal, faggot
You're one of those dumbasses who actually believe US propaganda about Cuba. Cuba actually is amazing when you consider the fact the US government spent decades attempting to assassinate Castro, and coup his government. All because he nationalized U$. property (property the U$ stole anyways)
>he thinks communism will rise from the ashes of America
top kek
THE USSR BUT... WITH COMPUTERS
You don’t understand Jews. Jews are behind both capitalism and Marxism, you see that’s what they do — they insert themselves into both sides of every issue, that way no matter which side you choose to support, you’re supporting one group of Jews or another. They benefit under both systems — under capitalism they benefit by being in charge of the financial sector (banking in particular) which means that pretty much any time anybody buys or sells anything, takes out a loan or invests in something, Jews benefit. Under communism, Jews take control of the state and then use it to serve their own needs, including exploiting the proletariat to insert themselves (and other Jews) into the bourgeoisie, as well as using the power of the state to squash any who would rise up against them
>World Revolution
>Kill a bunch of people like you
>Put communists in charge
>Rebuild the world because communists care more about human need than profit
Literally, this is why the USSR was so successful post World War II.
The workers are retards
fag
>a theoretically sound system
Lmao. When?
Fpbp
War Communism + Computers
lol you commies are the biggest boot lickers that exist. You are the literal dogs of the capitalist elite.
>Murder a shit ton of people
Nah. Maybe a few but hopefully not. Not as many as the US have klilled in senseless wars over the past 100 years.
>Oppress even more
>Damage all infrastructure and utilities due this "World Revolution" making recovery more difficult and deadly
Nah. That sounds dumb.
Wow. Wow ok. Yikes.
Go dig a ditch for an hour faggot and see if anyone pays you for it. If no one pays you then proceed to bury yourself alive for being a brainlet commie.
STALINISM BUT WITH COMPUTERS (I MEAN WE LITERALLY BRING STALIN BACK TO LIFE AND GIVE HIM A GAMING LAPTOP WITH COOL LEDS)
EXCUSE ME I HAVE A RAGING BONER
didn't happen that way in the USSR, or anywhere else for that matter.
Furthermore, let's assume it somehow does happen. After a few generations wherein "smart & savvy" workers have "smart & savvy" kids who manage their situation well, and dumb workers have dumber kids. Do you seriously suggest that a new natural class system will not arise from the simple reality of eugenics?
>Read some fucking books
We did. That is why we know communism is a merely another tool to enslave humanity
source: my ass
Only 3 of those murdered we're Nobles who owned a bunch of farm land in Ukrainians. They didnt enslave any Ukrainians,and apparently treated them rather fairly in comparison to other nobles. In fact, when the famine hit, a mob of farmers came to their door and told them to leave or they'd kill them all, and the farmers kill every other noble in the region. Only my family on that side was spared. Obviously murdered because of classicide.
The remaining 9 were killed in Gulags for barely logical reasons, mainly based of their ethnicity, or the fact they were in the Polish army for 2 years, and so on. Like torturing someone for a false confession because they didnt like that he was religious. Christians in communist Poland weren't given human rights for the most part, and you couldnt get any decent jobs if you were religious. People had to sneak into church and prey the police wouldnt see and recognize them
My great uncle and family got forcibly conscripted from a Gulag into the polish-soviet army in WW2, and lost some more of family there, but thats not to closely related I feel.
The responses thus far have just been emotional appeals or misunderstandings of history. As expected, nothing but right wing talking points are being offered.
Capitalism’s collapse is empirically justified according to predictions made by the labor theory of value, one of which is the tendency for the rate of profit to fall. The question at that point is simply what system will follow.
Fascism? Can’t be — fascism is just nationalistic, authoritarian capitalism, and thus subject to the same criticism.
If you support the working class, you ought endorse Marxism. Capitalism’s implosion is inevitable, it’s just a question of how long you’ll be in denial for.
By definition it has to be totalitarian. Whomever will be trusted to impose "the will of the people" onto the minority will be your masters.
Subjugation and murder are not products of failed attempts at socialism. They are intentionally cooked into the equation.
Equivocating on value, as expected. Marx’s definition of value has nothing to do with subjective desire or market prices.
You flunked, faggot
I've seen more logical, comprehensive posts on the Roblox forums back in 2008.
You. Have. Never. Been. To. Cuba.
> Cuba actually is amazing
When you meet Cubans in Mexico who think Mexico is prosperous, you know Cuba is a goddamn shithole. I hate retards like you.
We do accept a theoretically and practically sound system that we can put into practice as capitalism inevitably fails. It's called National Socialism.
"I said equivocated daddy, look"
Why did the USSR use a sears roebuck catalogue to determine prices ?
he did respond, weve read the books. that's how we disqualified the ideology. besides, your deflection from kikery to Totalitarianism is pointless because there is no distinction between them, we dont want a Totalitarian state. Therefore, even if your deflection worked, we would still be against the totalitarian state created by communism. this is a valid response, and you know it.
did it ever occur to you that we already knew this, and youre not saying anything new? you ask us to read the books, we dont expect you to search and read all of the "Communism General"s you can find in the archives. youre the millionth person to say these things, if youd bothered to look youd know that, just like we know and understand that communism is Totalitarian.
I'm an anarchoecofascist. I am familiar with quite a bit of marxist rhetoric and I despise it. Particularly Baudrillard
>we live in a society
Thanks bro
Have you ever been to Cuba?
The second you leave the resort, its Africa tier.
If you give the locals like a bag of chips or fruit they fucking explode with happiness, I've never seen a women get so excited over a free banana
>he gets BTFO’d and changes the topic
Right wingers, everyone
see, thats the ideology im less familiar with. Is National Socialism a totalitarian ideology?
DING DING DING..We have a winrar
Well maybe instead of diving head first into "GLORIOUS COMMUNIST REVOLUTION" that inevitably results in abuse of state power, labeling literally anyone with an even slightly "wrong" opinion as dissidents, gross inefficiencies, and extrajudicial killings we can try easing into idealism by accepting that markets better manage themselves than state command. It's totally viable to start with socializing workplaces and democratizing labor. Far left extremists have had their turn, now it's time to let the mixed economy lefties give it a go.
You commies start losing credibility when all your endeavors end in collapse. It gets leftism a bad name and reputation. I get Western intervention played a role to some extent, but it's unavoidable that the organizational paradigm of how these countries have ran themselves has been inherently flawed all the same.
>didn't happen that way in the USSR, or anywhere else for that matter.
I know and that's a fair point to make. But since the USSR was in the transition stage to communism they thought central planning would work out better. It did work well too until Khrushchev reintroduced the capitalist profit motive.
>After a few generations wherein "smart & savvy" workers have "smart & savvy" kids who manage their situation well, and dumb workers have dumber kids
a) it doesn't work like that b) doesn't that mean there should already be dozens of classes? not just two? it's not like the rich are particularly smart (or good looking) either
>Only 3 of those murdered we're Nobles who owned a bunch of farm land in Ukrainians
lol obviously. kulaks.
Marx was right that capitalism would fall but that doesn't mean capitalism wouldn't attempt to defend itself. Fascism serves to save capitalism by putting tighter restrictions on it and its citizens until it returns to normalcy. See Chile and Pinochet. It also doesn't mean capitalism falling naturally rather than through revolution would be a better outcome. Millions will suffer when capitalism falls and I would rather have socialism now than that.
The Russian/Cuban/Chinese/etc revolution was not world revolution.
I thought this was someone satirising communists. then I realised this is your actual political theory. TOP KEK
>theoretically sound system
>theoretically sound
>theoretically
"Theoretically"
aAll previous attempts to implement in real life end in disaster.
Yep. That's it. That's all there's to it.
>Stalinist USSR wasn’t communist. It wasn’t even socialist.
kys
Quote me the Marx making that distinction in the Labor Theory, you filthy sodomite.
And without private property how would you determine prices and prevent shortages?
Cubans in Mexico are people who fled because Castro took their slave plantations, so, they bitch and moan about how totalitarian it is. Cuba's doing fine, you're just an idiot who believes propaganda from the US state department.
70% of the Venezuelan economy is in the private sector. Doesn't meant they're not socialist but they haven't seized the means of production.
>And without private property how would you determine prices and prevent shortages?
How exactly does private property help in determining prices and preventing shortages? If anything it hinders it.
John McAfee is based and REDPILLED
>The Russian/Cuban/Chinese/etc revolution was not world revolution.
Youre trying to argue a world revolution would not kill many people >Nah. Maybe a few but hopefully not
If a revolution in Russia alone killed 7-12 million, A revolution in Cuba killed 5000 + (Unknown numbers) and a Chinese revolution killed 2-4 million intentionally, another 20 million in the campaigns and famines, what the hell is to stop you from saying a global revolution wont kill something like a third of the planet?
Youre a retarded warmonging armchair general. The cost of life from a global revolution would doom humanity
>That Pic
You do realize Cuba has tourist areas to impress tourists, right? Drive farther away from the resort. Supermarkets near resorts are always packed with food and very clean. Go to the country.
Your jewish ideology has failed and capitalism has reigned supreme.
You absolute ultimo brainlet faggot. I thought you were serious but you're just larping.
>Read some fucking books.
Communism kills more people than religion
Communism starves people to death
Communism requires a police state to suppress opinon
speak out against communism go to labor camp
communism SUKKKKS!
Communists need to be KILLED!
>Cubans in Mexico are people who fled because Castro took their slave plantations, so, they bitch and moan about how totalitarian it is. Cuba's doing fine, you're just an idiot who believes propaganda from the US state department.
sounds like youve never been to cuba. only time in my life i was scared i might not get home, and thats saying a lot. an active volcano is a better vacation destination than cuba.
>you people
How dare you sir!
>infinitychan gets BTFO
>bunkerchan gets BTFO
>now all the hipster commie losers from those boards come to Jow Forums, a board where everyone hates them and is hostile to their ideas
HAHAHAHAHA YOU /LEFTYPOL/ MORONS ARE SUCH PATHETIC LOSERS YOU CAN'T EVEN KEEP A FUCKING IMAGEBOARD RUNNING, WHAT MAKES YOU THINK YOU CAN RUN A COUNTRY?
PATHETIC
Posadism forever!
Kikes love to make out it is but no. As long as the people are educated and not allowed to fall into jew traps, national socialism will be self-sustaining
Marxism literally can't resolve the economic calculation problem. Labor theory of value is hilariously wrong. Your entire ideology is a failure
>You people don’t understand Marxism.
Wrong. You don't understand it.
>It’s not a Jewish conspiracy.
Case in point, it literally is
>It’s not an attempt to form a totalitarian state.
Then why is every single communist state totalitarian?
>You guys constantly preach about the failures of capitalism
Nothing consolidates power at the top like communism, not even capitalism is as nasty or efficient at keeping the masses subjugated while lying through its teeth about equality.
>yet won’t accept a theoretically sound system
Laughing Out Loud, I spelled it out for emphasis
>that we can put into practice as capitalism inevitably fails?
As long as people get paid to work and they wish to exchange said currency for goods, it can't fail.
>Read some fucking books.
You should try a history book, the last century is riddled with communist despots and failed """classless states"""
Pure fuckery. Cubans would nut instantly at the central A/C I currently have set to 70F
>If a revolution in Russia alone killed 7-12 million
>a Chinese revolution killed 2-4 million intentionally
lolwut
>global revolution wont kill something like a third of the planet
The ruling class is not even close to one third of the planet.
>Drive farther away from the resort. Supermarkets near resorts are always packed with food and very clean. Go to the country
Same thing in every country. Travel to rural Michigan in America.
Please explain. Please.
The USSR didn't have shortages, in fact, their citizens ate better than American citizens. Also, you don't even need prices. You can ration goods, and set quotas based on need. You can just ask people what they need, and set a plan for it. Worked really well in the USSR.
You need to stop believing in U.S. propaganda. None of what you're saying is true.
I rarely see criticisms of capitalism here unless it's from faggots like you. Go back to chapo tranny house you economic illiterate.
>Marxism literally can't resolve the economic calculation problem
ricardo.ecn.wfu.edu
>You need to stop believing in U.S. propaganda
Easier said than done. Unfortunately.