Universal Basic Income

>Rutger bregman
Millionaire being paid by billionaires. Ubi is the last step in goyim domestication.

Why would mass laziness be a bad thing?
Climate thanks you when you just stay at home and don't drive around with your car or buy excess shit...

We’d introduce it Europe-wide, paid by your hookers.

Rich are rich, they can pay.

no. we will all become increased leisure citizens

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>(((Bregman)))

i would absolutely continue working.
beyond the fact that a measly thousand dollars a month would suck, I actually really like my job and I'd continue to do it even if the government was giving me quadruple that.
it's a great safety net and investment opportunity.

There is already welfare money. The difference is that to get welfare money, you need to be unemployed and without any assets.

>dude free money lmao

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>Help community.
Do you think that people think about that when wage slaving every day?

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

In a sense, yeah, until UBI becomes so low thanks to inflation that it needs to be increased.

UBI needs to be worse than a minimum wage job for it to work. Giving it to black people or arabs is the very worst thing you can do, since they will have 5+ adults living in one house.

Instead of handouts, maybe should stop taxing people, how about that.

I wouldn’t

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depends on the people.
some would use it to just supplement their income and save it for emergencies or whatever.
but i can see a group of people using it to work towards buying a house or just contributing to their household while they just do what they want, good or bad.

It simplifies the genocide, pay for UBI and wait for the weak and unwilled to die out peacefully until the numbers stabilise.

Who wants to deal with the fuss of several billion unemployed people?

What kind of crazy marxist garbage is this? With a UBI the biggest justification for ANY minimum wage goes out the window. You should expect minimum wage to be zero or whatever accounting minimums are..

one problem one can forsee: retards will take loans secured by UBI

I'd probably quit my job I fucking loathe if I had a little security money and look for something that doesn't make me want to kill myself, even if it paid less. We'll be transitioning into a post-labor society in about half a century whether people like it or not thanks to automation and the creation of general AI, I'm just glad boomers will finally fucking be gone from this planet so they can't fuck that up as well.

I think it would have to be global or else it would just encourage people to migrate to countries that have it.

Maybe that is the point of a global carbon tax and would be a good thing.

even worse, each election cycle, all parties would each boaster they'll be the ones who will raise UBI the most

>We'll be transitioning into a post-labor society in about half a century
no, dude we won't. read a non-vice article or a book once in a while

I didn't say that had anything to do with minimum wage. I don't think the minimum wage is effective at all.

I just said it would increase worker's bargaining power if they weren't forced to work just for basic survival needs.

> UBI is equivalent to global per capita income
> Would occur at the same time as open borders
ACCELERATE
ACCELERATE!

The person of that quote has never seen a government office worker , living proof free money = lazy

>Who wants to deal with the fuss of several billion unemployed people?

Nobody. See attached.

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I'd probably still work since I'd have a massive amount of income with UBI plus my pay from work. Although I'd probably be more tempted to quit and be a NEET as well since I live at home and could easily contribute with NEET bucks plus no expenses such as gas, lunches for work, etc... etc...

UBI is for citizens only, mate.

So they finally understand why welfare is killing this nation?

>Nothing could be further from the truth.

Why are Portland, San Francisco, and Los Angeles the way they are then?

Bored enough to shill a shitty discord server? why not fucking kill yourself?

So was Germany but your children are majority brown now.

so what are the possibilities for the future?
there's no way that robits will not be taking most jobs eventually, and there isn't likely going to be enough jobs made after to take on all of the people who want to work.
is UBI inevitable, or will we get to some crazy utopian future where everyone is taken care of?
or will things just keep going to shit forever?

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Would UBI work in a national socialist country?

The first thing I do when someone pushes communism/UBI or white genocide is checking their last name

Then we'll enter a brave new world where the wealthy have an even tighter grip on society since the overwhelming majority of jobs are gone because robots perform better, and I'll be mercifully killed by either the government or the starving insurgents. Either way I won't be miserable every single day of my life much longer.

>Why are Portland, San Francisco, and Los Angeles the way they are then?
because any time anyone says some faggot shit like
>nothing could be further from the truth
the exact opposite is true

ubi= socialism and economic suicide

>majority brown

By your standards, 98% of German residents are white.

Right, because we really need more lazy, unmotivated assholes running around with free time on their hands!

>overwhelming majority of jobs are gone because robots perform better,
the majority have always been entirely useless
>I'll be mercifully killed by either the government or the starving insurgents
good, your shrill beta whining is intolerable
get a real job, be a real man - robots aren't going to replace that, ever

It depends on how much you give them. For example, Andrew Yang's plan of giving everyone $1000 a month is not very much to live comfortably on. 12k a year is well below the poverty line and so people would still want to work. I'm sure some people would not, but the vast majority would not be happy living on that very meager income. Most would choose to get that in addition to their work income. Someone who was making 20k a year working would get 32k a year and be able to enjoy a modestly good lifestyle.

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>my brain is a depressed lump
Sucks to be you loser

If every body got 1k free a month, prices for everything would sky rocket, a can of Pepsi would cost 2k

see

There would undoubtedly be inflation but saying a can of coke would cost 2k is an exaggeration.
I wouldn't be surprised if the prices of everything doubled though.

if we print more money sure.
not like we aren't going to be printing more money soon anyways.
so expect that price increase soon with or without ubi

I mean have you ever talked to people?

Robots will just increase production until market demand is satisfied.

Negative Income Tax is a much more sound implementation and can actually be funded through removal of welfare's excessively wasteful system, and respected economists that aren't full of shit actually back it. UBI is just a nightmare that instigates "Why the fuck is bred 40$" and "Thank God I got 1,000 bucks so I can pay 900 on the new taxes"

attorneys would be automated away before some manual labor jobs.

I want free money so I don't have to work and can stay at home and play vidya all day, but that's shit's not going to happen

Depends on personality life and what kind of lifestyle you are satisfied with desu
Someone like me who is by nature an extremely lazy piece of shit would be fairly satisfied with instant ramen, a room the size of a glorified closet, no gf (don't even know what I'm missing anyway), etc.
Some people might want more than a very basic lifestyle and being alone however

I won't

Oh, and I forgot to mention, NIT actually gets rid of the welfare gap where people make more on welfare than working, which prevents them from actually making an effort to make more, because they get "punished" for making an effort.

>I want more control of the population a people's lives.
t. fascist

The problem is we don't have enough work for dumb people to do.

I would bet on a massive fucking war, right at the point where drones that can kill people are cost effective to mass produce. And it's not a matter of "not enough jobs". There's ALWAYS more shit to do. It's a question of whether it's cost effective or not.

Mass commie block poorhouses full of marginal neets is another. Democracies voting themselves to death under the weight of commercially ineffective sacks of meat trying to vote their way into prosperity by extrating money from rich people fleeing to other jurisdictions is a certainty.

UBI is only one component of this .

I suspect it's the only condition under which it might work.

I'm not a fascist, I really want free money so I can stay at home all day and play vidya, That was a truthful statement
IDK how the fuck you read into that wrong

Commies call anyone a fascist that they don't like.

The existence of a UBI dramatically changes the effective inflation rate.

Some (((entrepreneur))) will convince some (((financer))) to invest his real-estate property, all around the various markets in the nation/union/partnership, in (((communal dwellings))) ((((cds))) for short). These dwellings will offer monthly/whatever pay shedule is addopted by the ubi, rates that take a majority of your ubi credits per gib period. You will get a sleeping space (opportunity for variety here to best suit your desired sleeping fantasy...), food, internet access, rec space, and bit of whatever else each one adds to suit niches. This will happen fast and on masse in many western nations choosing to adopt ubi.

Sage

The only people that would find $12,000/year enough to not work are ones that live with their parents and only would work because they need money for Chinese cartoons or their parents force them. Yangposters are literally all a bunch of 19 year old losers. Most are neets, some probably work part-time at the grocery store. Basic income won't help the vast majority of people that actually need help unless they're seriously reconditioned.

What pisses me off, boomers got to look forward to a secured retirement, and I have to guess and doubt if my meager retirement savings is ever really going to be enough to actually retire . Sure , now it looks okay, but what about in 20 years?

IDK, I could survive off of 12k a year, just get an RV park it in the cheapest RV park and get some foodstamps

No, they won’t. Law is illogical and only socially weird chads can figure it out.

>Just to be clear, people would still work, even on UBI, no?

Are you trolling?? Of course people won't work, except in socialist dreams -- would YOU work if you were paid whether you worked or not?

I can see what they end result would probably be like if the transition doesn't go too badly, I can see some serious potential for problems with transitioning however.
The most important thing to look at is necessities, firstly necessities for survival (food, water, shelter), and then necessities for actually living which is more subjective to culture but could generally be seen as access to entertainment, things to keep your mind active, passions, etc.
If the production of food became entirely automated we would then be able to theoretically make food free. I mean sure those machines would still require a source of power, and some trained personnel to make sure everything runs smoothly, but the cost of compensating those relatively small number of personnel and power could be dealt with I believe, while still making the finished product free.
I mean imagine if power plants were also automated similarly to food production? Eventually what we would see is just everything automated with a relatively small number of humans there for maintenance, and as compensation for their labor they might be given some special status and afforded a much higher standard of living.
Because everything is so interconnected and interdependent though, there could be a lot of bumps in the road to get there.
I'm not sure how desirable of a future this would be, but I like to believe it would be great as long as society upheld of culture strongly focused on discipline and free thought.
Anyone who has lived as NEET is painfully aware that if you do not maintain discipline in your life, it can become extremely depressing and crippling over time. No delayal of gratification, nothing constructive, don't go outside, it can be really bad if you aren't at least somewhat strict on yourself.
If you do have the discipline it could be awesome though, every day learning new skills, reading interesting books, hanging out with frens, always striving to be better than what you were yesterday.

I’m getting my MS in economics and we had a big argument in a global politics and economic class this week at UT. Holy shit I was embarrassed for a couple of my fellow students. They some how made it through a 4 year economics degree and still have no idea how it works. I tried to say something so low level that some might have considered it an insult. I said that at parks they have don’t feed the bears because they will become dependent on the handout. They came back with oh there is the old argument of telling people to pick themselves up by their bootstraps and stop being poor. Even the socialist we call a teacher told these yang gang idiots that it’s impossible.

NEET communities. Get four autism-bros together and you're now splitting $4k/mo. You can live a goddamn fantastic life.

Hell even a couple living on a $24K/yr income is better than quite a few Americans on minimum wage are doing now. And they aren't having to sell 120 hours of their life a month to a jew.

You'd absolutely get people falling off the grid.

>the same suckers that are already paying the gibs, will continue to be suckers, we're betting on it.

No. In fact I would invest every penny I get into weapons with which to rob law-abiding citizens of their UBI, were it ever implemented.

The problem is how we have adopted a seperation of our "personal lives" and our working lives. It is largely do to a breakdown of a sense of community surrounding your local living space. These breakdowns have been occuring for much of the last two centuries though, especially in large cities, so many people are essential breed/conditioned to see their lives this way; seeking employment for most money so they can consume more in their personal lives that have almost nothing to do with their working lives. Change the work to better impact our personal lives and the two can become one, giving us a better sense of community, and hopefully reality.

A stronger sense of community can be achieved if the work available is contributing to a direct resource the community needs (water, food, clothing, energy, waste mnmgt, use/maintenance of the various resource streams, etc). People raised in such a community will often feel more rooted and desire to do their part if someone gives them a part.

Many "jobs" that exist now could be replaced with these ubi credit jobs, and the effects on the overall community would be improved. Remove the junk and garbage retail/fast food/consumer picnics, and add jobs in improving the community, using the surplus in overall population savings to warrant investing and improving various community uses (all those junk and garbage purchases did nothing for the community).

Because the welfare class is super productive

Those votes are going to come in by themselves.

Well, in a couple years, candy-bars would cost 50$ and rent would be in the thousands for a 1 bed flat in flyovers.

the tests in finland were stopped because it didnt amount to anything

My wife and I are pretty poor and 24k/year for no work is probably a better deal than we have now. My point is that most people wouldn't be like us and budget...they would absolutely blow through the money and make a habit out of it. Then they'd be back at their McJob.

>A stronger sense of community
You ever just think nobody likes you, personally, and the rest of us are doing just fine as a community? That maybe it's your overbearing sense of self-righteous faggotry that makes people leave you alone, and the rest of us are quite happy taking care of each other?

Why would that be? Do candy bars cost 50 bucks now. You realize trillions are being spent by the gov right now, right?

Yes because UBI will replace welfare. UBI is just to help working people out, and help boost the economy with spending power.

Would you work if you got the same salary for doing nothing?
exactly.

We were supposed to be living in space and have flying cars by the year 2000, instead we have faceburg and 140 characters of cancer. Half the fucking country wants to jail someone for using the wrong pronoun and you think we will have automation anytime soon?

The stress honestly isn't worth it in a McJob, even if the money you get handed out is less at least you don't have to do anything for it.

No, the brown horde will draw us all back into the dark ages. You can pretend a there's hope for the future, in 100 or so years, the world will be back to using stone age level tech .

This has been the promise across every gibs ever.
And it has never changed a damn thing, EXCEPT, it employed faggots in government offices.
You faggots think Charity is a government duty, yet you don't believe there is a moral universe for which there to be a moral duty to charity. So, effectually, you disbelieve the every evolution you claim gives you the right to ignore moral laws, while claiming you have the right to demand what moral laws might otherwise give.

Stop trying to be a middle man on my Charity, you're a useless faggot, get a job painting houses and fences, and do them cheap, and do something that actually achieves a better community, if that is what you want.

>buying food would make it expensive
never understood this

"no"
- some guy

No, just give me money so I can buy weed, beer, and vidya in piece.

I agree, I'm always the one fixing other peoples mistakes and cleaning up other peoples messes.
Swear to god it's the only reason I haven't been fired, because I'm an asshole and no one likes me there because of it