>itt we dis/k/uss "equivalents" to .357 mag & each other, such as:
>.357 sig
>.327 fed mag
>10mm auto
>7.62x25 tokarev
>fn 5.7x28mm
>7.5mm brno
>...the list goes on, and strays into weird places like "147gr 9mm +p+" & "moon pistol"
(You) reading this already know the vaunted statistical primacy of the (notably & effectively employed against humans in 125 grain) .357 Magnum as the best personal defense round, period, by virtue of thousands of police reports revealing .357 Magnum to be #1 in one-shot-stops (~98%) -- generally pushing a rapidly-expanding hollowpoint weighing between 120-160gr at about 1300 fps from a 5" barrel. The other day I started a thread which became interesting and continued for a couple of days about the .327 Federal Magnum and the 27oz, three-inch Ruger SP101 -- from whose 3" barrel 100gr .327 handily exceeds 1400 fps and 15" of FBI gelatin with easily handleable recoil -- and it's applicability to literal everyday carry in a variety of environs for effective protection (with good shot placement) from hostile & dangerous animals with any number of legs (snakes, 'gators, camel spiders, hippopotami, lions, tigers, bears, apes including humans, wolves, octopi, sharks, giant eagles & velociraptors).
...let's talk more about .327 Fed Mag & other .357ish guns & bullets, comparing them to one another and their inspiration: good ole' .357 S&W Magnum.
.357 Magnum Equivalence
Just to get the ball rolling, can anybody attest to 357 sig? What are it's advantages over 9mm? Is the power that much more advantageous? Availability?
if .357 Magnum is so good, why do police and militaries not carry it?
checkmate atheists
I never understood why 125 grain .357 is so well regarded. My only .357 so far is a model 19 so I avoid it because it apparently obliterates forcing cones.
What about skinwalkers? What kind of performance are people getting?
The .327 doesn't start to equal the .357 until longer barrel lengths, the .357 sig only equals it with 125 grain or lower weight bullets. 10mm is roughly equal without asterisk assuming strong loads. Everything else you've listed is either too weak or too odd to regard as equivalent.
People. The 125 .357 was one of the first hollow points to really work well and because of the velocity is almost assured to expand even from shorter barrels. Higher weights should be reserved for hunting.
>high velocity so guaranteed expansion
>dumps all its energy
>158gr loads overpenetrate and are better geared for hunting
>probably less recoil than 158gr bullets as well
>357sig
It's the preferred caliber of Gecko45, so it's gotta be good.
>police
They did, but WONDERNINE showed up, failed so hard that it created a much better caliber (.40) and even a SUPREME CALIBER (10mm).
>military
GIGN
Checkmate skydaddy
>GIGN
I can't express enough how awesome and aesthetic it is.
GIGN is police asshat
You are now aware that 9mm and .357 magnum have similar terminal ballistics
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Also stop making new threads on meme cartridges, the caliber wars are over and 9mm has won. And stop limp wristing.
10mm came first. FBI agents couldnt handle the recoil so they downloaded it. Eventually they shortened the case to .40.
Two guys who expect equal chances of running into black bears, wolves or bandits go deer hunting separately with "equivalent" handguns: one with a Beretta 92fs in 9mm; the other with a Smith & Wesson 686 in .357 Magnum... assuming that each is a regular Jow Forums-poster who brought plenty of ammunition for days worth of oper8ing, and that they encounter & shoot each of the listed targets *once*, how do their respective hunting trips go?
>9mm *can* kill polar bears (instantly with carefully placed shots into the brain or upper spine; after several dangerous minutes or not at all if you don't hit the brain and merely mangle heart or lungs)... but fuck your caliber supremacy; variety is the spice of life
Does your 9mm clock 1,500 fps with 500 ft-lbs out of a THREE inch barrel?
>3"
9mm confirmed for onions-wristed globalist commie scum
>the vaunted statistical primacy of the (notably & effectively employed against humans in 125 grain) .357 Magnum as the best personal defense round
Actually the difference isn't that big statistically speaking in most studies I've seen. Plenty of other calibers are in the 94-96% range according to Marshall & Sannow. He also directly advises people not to select ammo types just because one has an advantage of a few percentage points, but that you may want to consider a different ammo type if the gap is around 10% or greater.
OSS stats don't really capture the whole picture though because of the way they are collected/reported. Notably they exclude instances where a subject is shot more than one time and marshall/sannow was almost entirely self reported too. Both of these could inflate success rates and obscure failure rates. That being said the qualitative reports on the round seem to speak for themselves, 125gr SJHPs create a hell of a wound and everybody that's used them has stellar opinions of the loading compared to contemporaries.
>can anybody attest to 357 sig?
This has been my thing lately
>What are it's advantages over 9mm
with top of the line loadings it hits around 1530fps out of a 4" bbl, and rounds are designed to take advantage of this power quite well. With meme 65gr bullets it can literally hit 2100fps.
>Is the power that much more advantageous
I think so. In terms of velocity it is equivalent or superior to those classic rounds which gave .357 mag it's reputation and even offers lighter faster rounds with rifle levels of velocity. However it is lacking in the category of well vetted semi fragmenting rounds that IMHO are probably half responsible if for .357s effectiveness. This is a pretty big deal, but solvable, currently I've been researching contemporary pre fragmented rounds but none seem quite comparable yet.
>Availability?
I can buy it at my local walmart or any gun store but opt to buy online...
Hot-loaded (1450 fps from 6" bbl) .357 S&W Magnum 200 grain *SILVER*-cored semi-jacketed hollowpoints (which were quenched in Holy Water after hard-casting) and hve been blessed by the Pope have been producing decent results on Skinwalkers.
>t. totally not a skinwalker trying to trick you into wasting money and being under-armed
7.62 tokarev is known to penetrate some bulletproof vests designed to stop pistol rounds.
.357 doesn't though.
We not mentioning .30 Carbine?
(cont)
People complaining it isn't as cheap as 9mm are silly. It offers .357 magnum performance(excluding max level/boutique loads/heavy bullets) at .357 magnum prices. Deal with it. Even max level boutique loadings out of 125s in 4" barrels only offer like 70fps more.
Capacity and cost.
Because of how effective it is IRL compared to other handgun rounds. Ask anybody who's actually used them. Monikers: "the thunderbolt", "the magic bullet", "the street king". Testing in actual calibrated gel or flesh/blood back this up.
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>g-guys! they performed the same in jello with my cherry picked tests!
Spotted the 9mm apologist
That isn't the discussion though, what you're talking about is basically hunting use and what matters then is sectional density and penetration so yes something like .357 magnum or 10mm with heavy loads would be better
>Cherry picked tests
They're by the same person using the same type of gel medium and I didn't even cherry pick rounds, if I did I would've compared the best of 9mm to the worst of .357 but what I did was give a few examples of the best of each
>only expanding bonded bullets instead of actual SJHPs that gave .357 its reputation and perform in a completely different manner
>3" bbl instead of 4" or more
>158gr @ less than 1200fps instead of 125gr at 1450-1500
>125gr at 1330 fps instead of the 1600fps it's capable of
>literally a 9mm +p+ at that point
Fair and balanced.
> what I did was give a few examples of the best of each
You either don't now anything about these calibers or are just lying at this point.
And that's part of it, but only one application; gimme a *versatile* round with nearly identical or superior performance to .357 S&W Magnum across the following range of targets:
>human
>deer
>wolf
>puma
>black bear
>brown bear
...but less recoil in a smaller gun... and, from paper & video, .327 Federal Magnum in a 3" compact revolver appears to fit the bill quite nicely.
Now, tell me: does .357 Sig do all of this *better* than .327 Federal Magnum, and by a significant margin?
>my preference is for revolver instead of autopistol cuz revolvers are fidget spinner for adults and sp101 is aesthetic & ergonomic for me
...And, yes, .357, .44 & 10mm are all on my field carry list, and CZ 2075 RAMI is just the cat's pajamas, but .327 is feeling Goldilocks as fuck, fammuh-lee.
All Euro nation military are glorifed police-tier, user.
How does .327 handle heavy rounds anyways? Imho .357 sig should only really be considered a replacement for .357 mag for social use. Innawoods ill pick my 686 over it for those 158/180gr pills.
So you would rather me compare extremely outdated bullets to modern bonded hollow points?
And the velocity is because revolvers have shit barrel length efficiency, that load is rated for 1475 fps from a 6" barrel, dropping to the 3" barrel you lose 300 fps- and before you say it was underloaded, Underwood has been verified as having accurate load info many times.
If we're going to compare 6" revolvers to semi autos, we should be comparing them to 7.5" barrel semi autos because revolvers have barrel length measured differently. A "revolver with a 4" barrel" is fucking huge compared to a compact semi auto with a true 4" barrel.
i really like the 327fedmag, but i feel like the option of being able to conceal 11 or 16 rounds of +p+ in a G26/G19, or just being able to open carry my 8 shot 327PD with hot 357 loads for the largest of the local game makes buying a snowflake round pointless
i wouldnt worry about it
It pushes higher velocity and more foot pounds of energy than 9mm. People say that using a snub nosed revolver with 357 is pointless but even out of a 2 inch barrel 357 has, on average, between 2 and 3 hundred fps velocity more than a 9mm fired from a full sized handgun
Probably still cost less than a box of buffalo bore 180gr
>So you would rather me compare extremely outdated bullets to modern bonded hollow points?
Show me a street vetted 9mm cartridge that can do this
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>wahhhhh it's fair to make broad generalities about a cartridge because its almost true if you put it in a format that nullifies those advantages
Bruh, .357s reputation is entirely based on it's performance out of 4-6" bbls. This is exactly what i mean about cherry picking your examples. You're comparing mediocre or irrelevant rounds out of a niche platform and claiming its representative of the whole and somehow debunks the performance the round is capable of with the kinds of guns it's actually meant for. This is cherry picking. Even if you compare a 5 or 6" 9mm to a 4" .357 the 9mm is going to get BTFOd, particularly if you're comparing typical JHPs in the 9mm to something like SJHPs.
OP here and I feel very similarly; I'm split on deciding which of these for everyday pocket carry (under 32oz; under 4"bbl):
>9mm sig p365
>9mm sig p938 (all stainless steel)
>.357 sig glock g33
>10mm auto glock g29sf
>.327 federal magnum ruger sp101
...each has benefits, but, in a court of law, I feel that a jury would be more sympathetic to the fuddy non-oper8or anti-tacticool honest to goodness olde fashioned little thirty-two caliber six-shooter, while the .327 loaded hot can kill a moose with decent placement, and the short format of the 3" SP101 coupled with usability during contact shots makes it a perfect pocket pistol pretty much anywhere.
>plz talk us into g29sf or p938 instead of sp101-327
It's basically fudd lore held over from when bullet tech wasn't as good as it is now. It used to be that lighter bullets at higher velocities gave more consistent expansion with the boolits of the day. There was really never a problem with the older boolits in heavier weights anywhere but on paper but gun fuckers love to haggle over minutiae because that's cheaper than shooting all day erry day.
I only shoot 158gr boolits in my .357s because I'm not a velocity whore. I also carry 147gr in my G19. You can holler all day about velocity is better than weight. I just don't care what you think.
Revolver vs semi-auto. A lot has to do with capacity. .357 might be powerful, but if you miss (which you will in a high stress combat situation) you just spent 1/6 of your ammo.
Kek
>7.62x25 tokarev
>fn 5.7x28mm
>equivalent to .357 Magnum
lolno
That's a nonsense statement, there's all kinds of vests, not just "pistol vests". 9mm Luger, 7.62mm Tokarev, and .357 Magnum, all defeats so called Lv1 vests, for instance.
So, I guess what I'm asking is:
>can 9mm, 10mm or .357 sig exceed 1400 fps from a 3" barrel?
Too small a caliber for expanding bullets, and too low a velocity from a pistol for fragmentation. It's a shit pistol round, but a decent PDW round. Unlike .357 Mag which is a good pistol round and a good PDW round to boot.
I fucking love 7.62x25, but it's NOT equivalent to .357
It's still the truth. Heavy bullets tend to just poke through if they have to encounter heavy clothing. There is no benefit to heavy bullets unless you are purposefully running subs.
It's essentially the same diameter as 327
And .327 is essentially the same diameter as .357. That's a shitty point.
ALL pistol rounds are underpowered and arguing over their differences is pointless.
Shot placement is king, penetration is queen, everything else is angels dancing on the head of pin.
Modern .380s can get the 14-16 inch penetration on both bare ballistic gel and through 4 layers of denim.
Anything greater than or equal to .380 is fine for self defense against people.
Obviously hunting, bear defense, and target applications have different standards.
Were your parents upset when you came out?
Actually
hot 125 grain 357 out of a 6 inch barrel will make 1600 fps and punch right though a level 2 vest. Think hornady custom criticals
Git off my lawn
My single seven birdshead should be here today. Should I go over pay for 32 long and shoot it today or wait for my cheap 327 ammo to come via fedex tomorrow?
Fuck, it’s coming ups so it likely won’t show up until it’s too late to go to the range
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>I wouldnt worry about it
Go back to your shitcave nigwalker