The gun knowledge kings explain what moa is and Google has it as the first hit as what MOA is.
Why is it everyone, even on this sight, in gun shops or just about anywhere, describe MOA as a form of accuracy when "grouping" is the term for accuracy. It's like confusing Kansas and Arkansas when they are clearly different.
Even then MOA is a measurement of angle in the equation for drop
Isaiah Hernandez
Lazy and tempting shorthand to say "the rifle shoots 3 MOA" instead of "the rifle groups 3 inches at 100 yards"
Noah Lee
Tell them your rifle holds .5 mil over a 10 round string and make them do math.
Daniel Myers
>Why is it everyone, even on this sight, in gun shops or just about anywhere, describe MOA as a form of accuracy when "grouping" is the term for accuracy. Technically none of that is right, as a group is a measure of precision, not accuracy. So nobody is actually talking about accuracy...a gun might print a 1" group at 100 but if it does it 10 inches from where you aimed it was not "accurate."
Jason Hill
tl;dr a gun can be more or less precise but accuracy is decided by the shooter.
Hudson Long
I fucking hate mils, everything should just standardize on MOA
Jace Mitchell
And it sounds fancy. Don't forget that.
Josiah Butler
Fair.
But I think some people have bastardized the "Precision first. If I get a good group I can move it to my point of aim." to mean "All that matters is the group size, not what I can hit"
Christopher Lee
Then they would laugh at me for having such garbage groups... MOA is often misused, but OP is still a fag...
Henry White
OP is still wrong MOA is a drop factor that you calculate then use with your BDC
Nobody I've ever met says "the gun shoots 3 inches of MOA." If they were to say that, I could assume that they mean 3 inches at one hundred yards since it's mixing the two together into an odd hodgepodge of measurement.
If I were to say that my gun can shoot 2 MOA groups, it can be readily inferred that at 100 yards, it will shoot a group within 2 inches.
You're just being kind of a pedantic bitch with shitty examples.
Aiden Gray
Still wrong my man. MOA is "measurement of angle"
No where does it mention in the name group size. It's how much you have to compensate for drop
Can't tell if stroke or bait, either way I shall illuminate.
Minute of angle, when referenced in the context of a firearm is referring to the maximum expected angular dispersion from that firearm. When someone claims a minute of angle, you are expected to be able to mentally interpolate that to a specific maximum expected group size at a given range. >Why don't you just say what group you get at a range? You could, but a measure of angular dispersion is both linguistically and logically simpler than saying "It shoots X group at Y range" and lends itself to an easy comparison between rifles, especially if shooting at dissimilar ranges. >But muh wind drift and bullet drop Yes, in this instance, the angular deviation due to either wind drift or bullet drop is being represented in MOA which can then be used to calculate the expected distance deviated at a given range and in turn the correction necessary to account for that deviation. >So why do we use MOA instead of [insert some other angular measure here] Because Jow Forums is an American board, and we Americans think in the Imperial system. Because 1 MOA is approximately 1 inch at 100 yards, it allows for quick and easy calculation. (it's actually about 1.047 inches, but that level of precision if beyond human to correct for). It is also relatively trivial for an Imperial brain to estimate an object's size in inches, which allows the shooter to estimate anything from whether or not he should be reasonably able to hit a given target, to what the range to a known (or estimated) sized target is. >But accuracy and precision aren't the same thing. True, but if you have a precise rifle, you can adjust its point of aim to make it accurate. The underlying assumption in the shooting world is that the rifle, when properly appointed, will be aligned towards that which you wish to shoot, thus leaving its precision as the deciding factor for its ultimate accuracy.
Brandon Lee
10/10
Owen Gonzalez
No it’s not you blithering idiot. It’s minute of angle
Ryan Sullivan
It's minute of angle you fuckwit.
Blake Russell
I want more people to see this But I want less people to see this Hmmmm
Joshua Cooper
They are, they even added 2 letters to help you differentiate
Caleb Ortiz
Moa is basically "smol degrees" It's minutes of angle, which is 1degree divided by 60. Thank the Sumerians for that
It's used to report mechanical accuracy and measure adjustments made to aiming devices
/thread
Josiah Phillips
>smol degrees kek'd
Jason Gomez
Even you are mixing up precision and accuracy. Grouping is not the term for accuracy, it more aptly describes precision. MOA is the best measure of precision in common usage because it describes a cone with an angle of 1/60th of a degree and x height. People know that at 100yds, this represents a circular base with a diameter of 1 inch and can extrapolate to any distance using the law of similar triangles. Describing a group as X in. at Y yd. describes your group as a linear distance, which is a faulty system of measurement for describing an area of impact. By using that system, what you're really describing is extreme spread which is still useful, but not the same as the grouping.
Brayden Hall
>accuracy is decided by the shooter. no, accuracy is the relationship between the sights' point of aim and the impact point of the boolet.
Jordan Ramirez
Even though it is *technically* a measurement of angle, said math works out that it is *almost exactly* one inch of spread per 100 yards.
Cameron Ortiz
that's precision retard. even fucking marines can answer this question correctly
Christopher Williams
>Why is it everyone, even on this sight, in gun shops or just about anywhere, describe MOA as a form of accuracy when "grouping" is the term for accuracy
Uhm, because it is? If my gun shoots .3 inches at 100 yards and my friend's gun shoots 1 inch at 300 yards, they are of smilar accuracy, because a bullet's path deviates from the ideal point of impact by an angular amount, not by a fixed offset.
>It's like confusing Kansas and Arkansas when they are clearly different. only technically.
Landon Stewart
that's kind of true though, If the bullets somehow managed to come out of your barrel at a 90 degree angle but hit in the same spot it would still be precise, just turn your scope sideways to compensate
Zachary Perez
nope, that's accruacy. literally kys you're self precision is landing consistently in the same spot accuracy is landing where you intend it to land. LITERALLY kys you're self
Question, When most people measure their rifles grouping is the average grouping measured or the extreme grouping measured?
Caleb Hall
wow you are literaly LITERALLY fucking retarded because you just posted a picture proving yourself wrong, and the guy you're replying to right.
i dont even feel sorry for you
Wyatt Gutierrez
LMFAO you just told me i'm right and you're wrong.
this has been the easiest argument i've ever had on Jow Forums, so thank you for that
Aaron Gutierrez
this is correct. as seen here accuracy is the bullet landing where you have your sights pointed. precision is having the bullet land in the same spot every time.
You are an idiot.
Brody Ramirez
depends, if there is an extreme outlier it will be left out (like all bullets within 1in, except for one 6in away) because that round was likely due to shooter error, but if all the rounds are close together they are usually measured from the centers of the two farthest shots.
Aiden Hill
kys stands for "kill your self". You' the intellectual you *obviously* are, are saying "kill your self you are self".
So let me give you a plan for today: Go ask your teacher to give you practice English homework, because there's no fucking way you've graduated yet.
Blake Powell
You shoot five 5 shot groups and whichever group was the closest together, that's the MOA you report and take lots of pictures of. Remove any fliers by not getting them in the picture if you have to. If you ever shoot better than that group with 5 rounds later on, that's your new MOA.
Most people measure whichever one is better to be honest. Most people also will ignore fliers because they pulled a shot or they determine that shot is an anomaly. Ignoring fliers can be valid, but most people probably do it too loosely.
Jackson King
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Gavin Clark
anything worse than 1moa is a flier and should be excluded, especially if it is right on the line of the circle you drew. it's ok to use a cartridge to poke the holes in the paper that you know you're really capable of getting if most of your shots for the day are fliers.
Grayson Richardson
You guys are really helping me out here. I'm so glad I have experts like you helping me out here.
Oliver James
Almost this, there's also shooters moa and moa, shooters moa is 1" at 100 yards. Moa is iirc 1.054" at 100 yards.
The difference would never be noticable to a shooter but there is a technical difference.
