Is .243 an acceptable mule deer caliber?

bullets are too light and the only ones with a decent ballistic coefficient need to be seated so deep you lose powder capacity. there's no advantage over .308 for a deer rifle, and multiple disadvantages

if it's a hunting rifle, you won't shoot it enough for that to matter.

you don't get it. sometimes the way to the lung is through the shoulder. they don't line up for you perfectly every time

>high shoulder shots are unethical
Nah senpai

Almost None for a hunting rifle. .243 is really only considered a “barrel burner” for competition shooting where the throat opens up after 3000 rounds or so. And the accuracy difference that competition shooters eschew a barrel at are still good to go for most hunting purposes.

243 works for deer and is very accurate
Kids and women like to shoot it too because recoil

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and what do you do when a gust of wind pushes your bullet slightly left and it hits the shoulder? you don't want something that's going to deflect or blow-up. you need something that can drive through. you're the one being unethical.

.243 Win is acceptable for mule deer. In my state it meets the minimum cartridge requirements for big game, which are minimum bullet diameter of .243 and surpasses 1,000 ft/lbs of energy at 100 yards. I know people that kill elk with a .243, but many hunters regard it as a cartridge that should be reserved for deer-sized and smaller game.
You sound new to hunting, so please understand that shot placement everything. Get a rifle that is adequate for your quarry, practice, and only take shots that you know will quickly kill your target. Also, don't be taking 400 yard shots at deer until you become a little more seasoned and are a good marksman under pressure. Also, learn to track because deer can run a long ways if you don't drop them on the spot. That will happen eventually, especially if you are shooting at them from 400yds.

Just fucking make sure that you kill and harvest what you shoot. It is fucking disgusting how many people wound mulies and elk in my area by taking desperate pot shots or being too green to shoot straight when that animal enters the sight picture.

SeeHigh shoulder shots miss vital organs and do not guarantee a quick death

Yes.

Considering that I live in the west and deer hunting in the desert will likely require several hundred meter shots, I'll need to shoot it quite a bit in order to be accurate enough with it to ethically harvest a deer. I'll probably put over 1000 rounds through it before I even buy a deer tag.
I actually would prefer the .308, it's just that this rifle is being offered at half the MSRP on a clearance sale- but I am considering saving money for the .308.

I think you’re talking about a damn near withers shot. The “X” in Pic related is basically a “high shoulder” shot...

Apparently you don’t understand trajectory
Or how to compensate for windage

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apparently you don't understand wind gusts and there effect on 100gr bullets. you also apparently don't understand that a .308 with a 180gr has double the energy at 400 yards and much less wind sensitivity.

This is somewhat misleading. Boiler room shoots are indeed ethical. However, properly placed high shoulder shots drops em like a stone every time.

This guys video perfectly shows that.

BTW, pic related

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>spinal cord
>heart and top of lungs
>major blood vessels
u wot?

I have a Ruger American and just a warning but the bolts in all of these guns are a little rickety. Compared to a Remshit 700 they feel super rough. Otherwise I love it.

Anyone hunt with a Savage Axis?

Not as if you need to take shots at deer at 400 yards.

I just got a ruger american ranch and i was going to mention something similar. its pretty much bottom barrel, even against other entry level bolt guns. the bolt fit is terrible, wobbles like a mofo when not in battery. the machining on the bolt is incredibly rough. all the plastic parts on the gun, including the stock, are just of the lowest quality. the trigger is really nice though.
in anycase, i would avoid the ruger american.

I agree with this. If you can afford it, go one step up to Savage. If you’re willing to go a little further to the $650-$850 range, a huge world of quality bolt guns opens up.

that was OP's requirement not mine. I already advised him against it earlier in the thread. .308 is still better, and I don't even like .308.

Why would anyone take that shot?
That shot misses both lungs and the heart
Bones do bad things to bullets, like fragmentation
Which in turn effects penetration or the lack of penetration which mean superficial non lethal shot.

I've stretched out to about 350 before, and my dad took one once at 425. when you get drawn for a shitty 3rd choice area where there are almost no bucks, you take them if you're confident you can make the shot

In my neck of the woods, Savage Axis' can be had for under $400. That could just be a massive number of people selling them to feed their alcoholism, though.

Is buck meat different or do you hunt them for the trophy?

Because it’s the most ethical kill. It’s a spinal/CNS/artery shot. I’d say within 200 yards (really 100 since most people are fantastically mediocre shooters), if you can make that shot when the deer makes a good presentation while grazing, you’ll drop it immediately... so you take it over a boiler room shot to the heart/lungs.

Buck meat isn’t as tasty as doe meat. Both kinds of venison make very good eating if prepared correctly. Bucks make for better trophies for sure. It’s always nice to have a keep sake of a good hunt and a difficult adversary.

What do you mean by much less?
3 inches at 300 yards?
Study trajectory

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>not hunting with .50bmg.

antlerless hunts in AZ don't exist except for a youth only hunt in a specific area, and it's only 30 tags issued.

No doe tags at all? Wow, must be a lot of hunters.

Aiming at a small target instead of aiming at the large target.
Deer dropping from being hit in the spinal cord is not the same as a deer dying quickly
Deer don’t survive long when shot in both lungs and the heart
Even if you miss the top of the heart you still have both lungs. Its where ethical hunters aim.

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1: that's about doping a constant wind. I'm talking about GUSTS.
2: that's a 150 not a 180. 180 has a much better B.C. compared to a 100gr .243.
3: I said 400 yards, so that's 6"
4: even with that 3", it's still a nice margin for error in judging exact wind velocity and keeping it out of the shoulder you are so terrified of

tl;dr
it beats .243 in all performance metrics, from start to finish

ethical hunters use cartridges that aren't scared of bone

Deer passes out due to oxygen starvation in 30 seconds from a spine shot. Deer passes out in 30 seconds from oxygen starvation due to heart shot. Both die within a minute or so.

I don’t appreciate the implication that I’m an unethical Hunter by taking a high shoulder shot when I have the chance.

I’m not saying heart/lungs shots are unethical. However a heart and a spine shot are about the same in terms of target size and I’ve seen lung shot deer run for a good 5 even 10 min.

the dude is either a troll or never actually hunted. I hit a cow elk in the exact spot you're talking about, with a little .270 Win. it's feet fell out from it like it was hit by a truck. it never even tried to get up.

>hit right on: shatters shoulders and severs spinal cord and likely spinal artery
>hit low: heart, lungs, major blood vessels
>hit high: miss

Love .270. Have an old 1933 Mauser chambered in .270 that was my grand fathers. He actually bought it in Germany on a business trip before relations went bad and war broke out. Sweet shooter. Only been hunting with it once since I’m afraid of dinging up an heirloom. .270 shoots like a laser beam though.

Ad hominem much?
I’ve shot so many deer I have lost count.
With shotguns, rifles, and handguns,
I don’t care about your feelings. If you need a shoulder to cry on, go talk to dr Phil
Shooting a deer though the shoulders, which contain large bones and few vital organs is not optimal. And can result in injured deer.
End of story.

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why get a bare minimum, kids shoot .243 at like a small deer. its terrible for for hunting deer especially when a 200lb buck in rut comes by.

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Double lung shot
>>hit right on, both lungs and the top of the heart
>>hit low, still hit the heart and both lungs
>>hit high, still it both lungs and possible the spine and arteries you mention
>> hit forward shoulders and front of the lungs
>> hit back, two lungs or maybe the liver, which bleeds a lot and would still be lethal

Yeah I got the Ranch too in 7.62x39. I love having a bolt gun with a 20 round magazine in the caliber I have ridiculous amounts of but I agree with all the faults of the gun. Pretty disappointed

Well you’re a real peach.

Yes I have one in 30-06. It's a first gen so it doesn't have an accu-trigger but it's still a solid rifle. What's your question?

Has it shot like once from when which it was before seem like?

I was wondering if it is a solid rifle.

I've got a Ruger American .308 and have shot .243 a few times. The recoil is way softer. That being said, when comfort is the only advantage, go for practicality.

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