lets say I would have to bury a rifle and ammo in the ground for a period of 10years, ideally by storing it safely and preventing damage from rust and other influences. How would the ideal storage container look like that is able to stay intact for 10years?
My idea: Aluminium welded box with something like a peli case inside and rifle/ammo sealed in vacuum pouches with lots of that grease the russians used for storage? Give me some ideas, the times are changing in my country and it may be wise to take measures before (they) do...
Hell yeah, you could fit a lot of bug out items in one of these. Just grease the gun up very well, Cosmoline like said or maybe some of that marine automotive grease? If you don't have the space or willpower to bury one of these, you could get a large diameter PVC pipe from home depot, two end caps and PVC cement.
Question - if I "destroy" one of my rifles per ATF procedure, do I need to alert anyone? Is there anything stopping me from scratching the serials of a gun and hiding it in the wilderness?
no you need the PVC cement but I think I said the wrong stuff get the pipe that is used for electrical lines it is plastic but maybe not pvc Or do like I did (see pic)
Nope. But the act of defacing the serial number certainly isn't a good idea. If someone comes asking, the best way to handle that is to say you cut it into more than three pieces starting with the receiver. You then took those pieces, separated the feric and non-feric metals into your scrap buckets and sold them to a junk metal buyer who scrapped them. Defacing the serials just guarantees you trouble if someone finds guns before whatever you're planning for happens.
Gavin Stewart
mylar bags, vacuum sealed
Jaxon Bennett
Ok I will see what I can get, thanks.
Benjamin Parker
For firearms, you want to disassemble your funs as much as humanly possible, and coat every square inch of every single part with a gun grease of your choice. Fit these parts into bags, throw in a silica packet, vacuum seal with a sealer you can get on the internet for cheap and wrap the bags together with a shit ton of strong tape. Throw those bags into a PVC pipe, put some more silica packets into the pipe itself, and seal the caps with PVC cement. Put however many pipes you have into blue water barrels. The barrel should be lined with some sort of vapor barrier. Coating the inside with vapor-retardant paint and then lining with polyethylene sheets will work great. Once you put your stuff in the barrels, throw in even more silica packets in the barrel and seal that shit like no other with some good ass sealant. Once buried, there shouldn't be a damn thing in the world that could get even a drop of moisture into your funs.
Ammunition gets the exact same treatment except greasing isn't needed.
Easton Gutierrez
a note for some of the posts in this thread: opt for long term storage grease or cosmoline rather than traditional gun oil
Hudson Hughes
That is correct, standard gun oil would be way to runny to protect all parts.
Carter Scott
Very good ideas. ty
Jason Collins
Not really, Aluminum oxide forms a layer around the aluminum that protects it, you need a liquid metal paste with mercury to eat through aluminum.
Brayden Clark
What's the point of putting a shitty vapor barrier inside a blue water barrel, which is in and out of itself a fucking fantastic vapor barrier? That's like trying to upgrade a bulletproof vest by adding a layer of masking tape.
Daniel Scott
minerals in the ground or in salt water do the job just fine too. aluminum would be a poor choice for a long-term weather resistant storage container.
Nathan Smith
Step by step >dissemble rifle >buy 10ft pipe of 4+" sch 40 PVC >buy a end cap and a "clean out" threaded lid with PVC threaded cap >buy purple primer and pvc glue >buy from plumbing supplies shop near you >watch plumbing video to learn to put it all together If you do it right you will have no problems. Trust me I'm a plumber
Ryder Kelly
Advantages to PVC >readily available >can be put together by hand >cheap >lasts for 20+ years minimum >glue joint/seal will fail before the pipe will >want to store stuff for 200+ years underground buy SCH 80 PVC and use Weldon brand glue and primer
it gets oxidized, if you think a non noble metal is not prone to rust/oxidize then youre the big gay nigger
Anthony Turner
>My idea: >Aluminium welded box with something like a peli case inside and rifle/ammo sealed in vacuum pouches with lots of that grease the russians used for storage? >Give me some ideas, the times are changing in my country and it may be wise to take. Chemistry user here. Thats good but let the vakuum away. >use petrol jelly >vakuum seal the gunparts inside bags >put it in a waterproof container >add 100g Oxygenabsorber and Silicagel packs >colose container >seal the outside with silicone (bath) >put it inside 2-3bags >melting the end/close >wrap it in plasicfoil and some tape >Done
I think there's a lot more Jow Forumsiwi bros here than I realized. But that aside, you use electric conduit. Cosmoline, then vacuum sealed. This goes inside an electrical conduit tube, seal both ends. That's your gun. When you bury, make essentially a well casing, to go outside of that. Dig the hole, pipe diameter of hole goes in. Then your gun pipe goes inside of that, and you seal the whole thing. If you just shove your gun pipe in there, thawing/freezing might warp it or crack it, which defeats the whole purpose in the first place. This gives you extra protection. Don't forget to bury ammo and magazines as well.
John James
Op here. I am not a Jow Forumsiwi, but certainly they are in even more trouble than me.
Easton Murphy
You should also disassemble the springs, or bury a new set of springs with the gun. They tend to get weaker over time. It may not really matter for 10 years, but your funs could also stay much longer underground and then you'll be happy not to have to worry about that.
Matthew Morgan
When the springs are not compressed why should they fail just by sitting around?
John Lee
It's a little bit of a misnomer, nothing against the other user. Springs lose strength by compression and decompression. So it's cycles of use, not just sitting. Over an EXTREMELY long time frame, you might be looking at metal fatigue. But springs are not damaged by being left compressed.
Carson Wright
>But springs are not damaged by being left compressed How old are the G3 mags we can buy for 4$? Around 10-20 years?
Asher Torres
Normally I'd agree that it's useless to add additional vapor barriers to a water barrel, but 10 years is a long time for unexpected shit to go wrong, so there's really no harm in putting in a bit of extra effort just in case.
Schedule 40 PVC (this pipe is used for sewage lines, as an example) rigid is what you want, but if you want more thickness you could use Schedule 80 instead.
>russian grease you mean cosmoline? If so, that shit alone will keep your guns and mags, idk ammo about ammo, from going bad. Anyways just buy the pelican case, smear grease all over that bitch and wrap it in a big tarp. Idk if this will work just pitching ideas
Carter Perry
I hadn't even thought of that, but that's a perfect example. Those fuckers are ancient. Also, bakelites mags. I don't think most of those are rebuilds, even now.
Jordan Mitchell
>oxygen absorbers and silica packets in the same container
Got my first G3 mags yesterday and the tape and paper is fucked up like 20year old shit. Pic related is this spring with removed rust and polishing . The rought rust/patina was so thin it was just OK to polish it away with a few wipes (without sandpaper, just Felt).
So storage (20yo) without lubrication is 0 problem. Going with lube, oxygen and water absorber and decompressing should bring a few 100 years or way more
Silica gel = special "sand". Chemical non-reactive
Adrian Hughes
get a garbage bag, a tote, and vaseline from walmart slather the guns in vaseline, put them in the bags, put the bags in the tote, bury tote easy
Elijah Hall
KEK, done the same with chemicals. 4months and a bucket + the bag were full of water. Dont use closing mechanism withot a rubber ring !
Justin Jackson
If you filled the container with oil would that damage the guns in anyway?
Asher Jenkins
Nope. You definitely could. I'd be careful if you're storing ammo in there as well, though. Water isn't much of an issue for that, but oil will fuck them up.
Benjamin Stewart
After greasing the parts, vacuum sealing them, could you stick them in a schedule 40 pipe and fill the pipe with mineral oil and then put it in an even bigger diameter schedule 80 pipe full of descicants? would that work? Also, how do you use nitrogen to purge an already sealed PVC pipe? I'm a brainlet.
Aiden Parker
>fill the pipe with mineral oil You could, but there's not much advantage, and it *might* break down the vacuum sealed bag. I don't know what plastic those use. I think that's why the other user mentions a nitrogen purge, which is actually pretty brilliant, it hadn't occurred to me. Basically you would just use one way valves. As the name implies, you're purging everything else in there. It's used on things like night vision tubes to keep them from fogging up. So you'd stuff your vacuum sealed gun inside the tube, with nothing else in it, seal it up, add your one way valves, and fill with nitrogen or argon. Either should work fine. One way ball valves should be available at any hardware store, and for the other end, maybe a blow off valve for a certain pressure. Smarter anons than I can comment there.
I should have mentioned, argon and nitrogen are heavier than air, so they'll replace the air in said container. But for that to work, you'll want the inlet valve to be low on the container. So a one way valve near the bottom, and a smaller outlet valve up top. Slowly add the argon in from the bottom and let it fill, close the top outlet when you're done.
Nolan Flores
Don't forget a metric shit ton of desiccant.
Brandon Ortiz
It could be bad for some polymer parts over a long period of time. I agree with others about covering it in grease and bagging.
Ryder Young
purge with nitrogen?
Owen Rivera
Rust is the specific oxidation of iron. Aluminum can't rust because aluminum, as I am sure you are shocked to learn, is not iron.
Brody Gutierrez
please op for the love of god remember to scatter coins all over the area where you bury the gun so metal detectors cant accurately find it.
Christian Peterson
This. I fucking hate seeing those metal detecting youtube videos titled "Guns Found! , Police called!"
Easton Mitchell
How will I find it then?
Anthony Brown
Just this
Brayden King
Yeah thats a not an issue since I have lots of land and for the foreseeable future our gun grabbing shitskin loving government wont start grabbing land...
Jose Cox
PVC pipe with thread sealer slathered on the the threads. Rifle goes inside pipe in a multiple layers of vacuum sealed plastic and metal parts coated in oil. If you seal everything right, it will be 100% even 20 years later.
Juan Martin
Right, place red herrings like bolts or coins around and place it standing up to have the smallest detector profile
Also bury them under a tree of shed. This will prevent it from going through freeze-thaw cycles
Jaxson Anderson
Hey all you queers, aluminum does oxidize but the Al2O3 microlayer that forms is non-porous which means the reaction doesn't continue...which means it doesn't degrade
James Stewart
on an ar15 you can cut right through the magwell and it will be still 100% functional
Jaxon Parker
Oxygen is an electron Phillic whore. Yeah, rust is specific to iron just as ferrous is an iron related term as well, but my point is that the metal is gonna corrode over time. So yeah, I should have used correct terminology, but that wasn’t my original point.
If I wanted to confuse you I would point out that oil and water do actually mix. Albeit, 10,000 parts water to 1 part oil, but they do mix. >inb4 lies Physical chemistry was created to confuse the shit out of people. The reasoning for why they mix is due to entropy and that being stable for it. Imagine a parapolicial function starting from some large negative y value inbetween a certain range on the x line of the graph. Basically the small part that made above the x axis and within the x value range is where that shit is stable....fucking entropy. Also, don’t take the second part of physical chemistry as an elective unless you wanna die or really like it. Given our prof is the type who would just care about his research more than the class, I wouldn’t go near part 2
Jason Foster
Fun course. The theory we have covered in the first half of the semester was responsible for 26 Noble prizes. You need to know it all for the midterm. 6 questions, choose any 2. You have three hours. Extra exam books are available at the front. One question was "Why is gold gold colored?", another was "Explain radioactivity"
John Miller
Dessicant packets are good, but you also want some anticorrosion materials. Zerust makes all kinds of shit, kraft paper, packets, films. Use some of that too.
"Zerust offers VCI Diffusers (also known as VCI emitters) that provide targeted corrosion protection in hard-to-reach enclosed spaces or can be used as added protection to Zerust VCI packaging products. VCI Diffusers emit powerful Zerust corrosion inhibiting molecules into an enclosure that settle on metal surfaces and protect them from corrosion. They are safe for electronics, odorless*, non-toxic*, residue-free, and are designed to work in restricted spaces."
nice nerd, youre not the only person whit shit inmside the brain. Lets talk about solutions. >the oil: White Vaseline is the most chemical inactive oil i know. The chemistry joint grease is to expensive with impurity. Heating it up and adding Na for some hours under Vak is to autistic. What do you think about Mixing activated and atomic Al or Mg inside the Vaselin and than oil the Parts ? BTW, were talking about storage 1000yo +
Jordan Reyes
Took my C- and passed the course. Did not take the ones after. Have since forgot ~90%
I would skip the oils and greases and go straight to wax. Parrafin lasts forever as well and does double duty block oxy and water. We still find usable wax in arch sites from 2k+ years ago so know beeswax is also a decent preservative.
Owen Wood
>Parrafin lasts forever as well and does double duty block oxy and water Nope, look at the VdWs for alkanes. Its just solide but thats it. Its possible better for blocking water than lower alkans but being fluid is more important for adhere to the steel. Lubing and vakuuming the single parts is very important but it needs a 2nd seal like a plastic box without vakuum to keep water and air away. Adding oxygenabsorber and silica should kill most problems. Next stage is a protection for this systhem by giving it some more water barriers like plasic bags and than a mechanical protection agains stones, trees and other shit (just some layer plastic foil). BTW, its cheaper than 70$ to make this for a AR15 to bury it safe for some 100s years
Jaxon Martinez
If it's a solid block it does not have to adhere tot he steel. Parrafin does exceleent work as a rust preventer. I stripped the oils from my parked shotgun and dipped it in hot wax. Have not oiled it now for 12 or so years and no rust. When shooting i nthe rain it gets a wipedown before being put up.
Jace Wood
Dood, im speaking about a way longer autism time :) I like Parrafin too. Sometimes for HCS knifes with Ethyl acetate solution spay.
Brayden Diaz
Waxes are stable aon a far longer timescale than oil or grease. Dumpt he rifle in a conatainer and top with hot wax. Chip it out when needed in a thousand years.
Jeremiah Stewart
Storing any metal for prolonged periods will rwsult in rust, ARs and HKs specifically. If you are going to store this weapon for a signed time frame of ten years, i would suggest used motor oil (free) and keeping it in a plastic (PVC or ABS)... pics or it didnt happen OP.
William Bell
Air tight PVC pipe with cosmoline
Jack Gutierrez
Waxes can decay and dry out over time. Best bet used motor oil.
Samuel Wood
Locate a spot with several landmarks near it that you could recognize after 10 years, trees for example, and take a picture of the exact spot on the ground (center it in the picture). Mark your landmarks in ways subtle enough for them to be overlooked by anyone who doesn't know they're there. Use a cheap GPS or something to take the coordinates of your burial sites and save the coordinates on a disposable hard drive, and a notebook or piece of paper, memorize them too if possible and make sure to keep them near at hand.
Asher Gomez
>Best bet used motor oil. No, motor oil has some activ chemical impuritys. If you need a filler go with this en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_paraffin_(drug) and just for a thin cover just the same product but with a solid part (solid paraffine) to make it non liquid en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaseline Both are the most scientific solutions for this job
Eli Hall
I agree with >disassemble and grease/cosmoline >use sealant on pvc threads
But I would also put the thing in a sealed bag before sealing the pvc. I’d also throw in some rust blox.
