Whats the best sub-machine gun?

Literally any SBR

Based and Czechpilled

By modern metrics, the B&T MP9, because it's a shoulder-fired automatic weapon that's really compact in a way that an assault rifle can't be, combined with the fact that it suppresses very well.

Like 40 years ago.

Before the MP5 caught on (the magazines weren't 100% great at launch), the Uzi was probably the best.

Blowback doesn't suppress as well as delayed blowback or locked breech.
The Scorpion is very good at being cheap, however, it's kind of like the H&K UMP but better.

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+P is kind of a pointless direction to go with a subgun, at least of that size, since a carbine will outperform it.
If you wanted a pistol caliber automatic weapon of that size, with extra power, you'd probably looks towards a Sig MPX in .357 Sig

Not even when it was new. The UMP is the redheaded stepchild of H&Ks subgun line.

For a lot of the roles which the subgun used to fill? Yes, because these days we have a good understanding of how to squeeze an assault rifle down into a pretty compact package, but there's still a few niches which you can put a subgun in, in which you just can't squeeze a carbine into and get a desirable result.
The Sig Rattler is THE smallest you can make a carbine and still have something viable (and it's remarkably compact), but the B&T MP9 is still smaller. It would be the closest competitor in that regard, mind.

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I think the SAAB-Bofors CBJ-MS makes a pretty compelling case.

>6.5mm bottlenecked AP PDW cartridge that can eat kevlar all day.
>uses 9mm as parent case and can be converted back with only a barrel swap
>very short design with wraparound grip that can hold a spare magazine
>available with drums if desired
>knob charging handle at the back can be grabbed from weird angles if need be
>accessory rail for optics

Honestly I think it does the PDW job a little better than the P90 and MP-7, since the projectile is more than an AP spitball and it is backwards compatible for 9mm. The gun is a little goofy, but I dig the cartridge a lot.

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Just looked this up and I like what I see.

Wouldn't it be stupid expensive to shoot?

Swede guns are pretty decent

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If you want to save money or simply can't find any 6.5mm, you just install the 9mm barrel and away you go. Everything else is already set up for it.

Besides which, if you are a military or other government force you buy ammunition in bulk to order so it doesn't matter all that much what kind it is. It wouldn't cost much more per unit to make a bottlenecked 6.5mm than regular 9mm, in FMJ form. The standard go to war cartridge for it is a saboted tungsten penetrator, which would be expensive, but then again they probably aren't expending that much of it and nothing about winning a war is cheap.

You sound like a top rate operator murder machine who has thousands of hours of experience with every gun a basketweaving forum can pretend to know about after seeing it on mac/forgotten weapons

skorpion

If it cant be mass produced by an illiterate peasant in a toy shop its not the best.

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Famas

Too bad Swedes are cucks

I read books too, faggot.

>30 million illegals in the us
Every western nation is fucked

In production? Mp5
In style mp5 or mp40

>one greasy boi

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>open bolt blowback gun made of all steel
>best
>in the 21st century
I mean the M3A1 and PPS43 were excellent examples for their times, but come on.

hol up

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>implying a pistol caliber subgun needs to be anything more than open bolt
Come on mang, subguns are all about cheap and easy

MAT-49

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That thing is exclusively for keyholing at boogeys at near and crazy angles from inside an armored vehicle, I don't really think you can classify them as subguns in any traditional sense, more, they are their own definition; Firing Port Weapon. H&K even made one to compete in the same trial.

Some older manuals would refer to the XM177 as a subgun, but I think that's because people were still in the mindset that subguns were king for CQB.

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based and rising stormpilled

>because people were still in the mindset that subguns were king for CQB
I think rifle-caliber carbines just wasn't a recognized concept yet. HK53s were considered subguns too.

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the 380 version is even cuter, but actually...

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The mp18 was really good for it's time, the mp28 was even better

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the MP5 is the apex of SMGs. anything after that is a waste of time and money.

UMP is pretty aesthetic. If I didn't buy a Mark 23 this year I'd be getting a Gideon Shadow.

The only downfall to the mp5 is the non existant Bolt hold open
that's why the MPX is better imo

these

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SMGs are complete obsolete.

mp7

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How does the Czech boi stand up to competition these days?

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If you can't make the reciever out of plumbing pipe why even continue designing the weapon?

The stanger there among them had an mp7 on his hip

Suomi M31

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For me, it's the PPSH-41

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this

Best stock?
MP5
Best on the civilian market?
Lage'd out M11/9 by a mile

Papasha

SR-2

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I dont know what you guys are talking about. Clearly the best SMG is the American 180

helluva shotgun

Jaminator.

loser

The Kp/31 is kind of like the PPSh41 except that it actually works.

>pseudo-clone of a MAC 10
>straight blowback
There is literally nothing special about the weapon itself beyond managing to bring the ludicrously stupid rat of fire of the Ingram down to only kinda-absurd levels (700-750rpm vs 1100-1200rpm). All the magic happens with the bullet, which due to being based on 9x19 means it will work in literally any other 9x19 SMG.

Also 6.5CBJ really isn't that special
>will penetrate CRISAT armor (NIJ IIIA-equivalent) but only when using the saboted tungsten round from a 300mm (12") barrel
>drastically outperformed by 5.7x28, 4.6x30, or even .22 TCM at all barrel lengths (the TCM will also work in any other 9x19 SMG with just a barrel swap)
>higher felt recoil than 5.7, 4.6, or .22 TCM

>sub
get a dom machine gun ya fag

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Poorly. Especially in its original .32acp offering.

Danuvia VD-01 is the most compact one I've seen. IIRC its 50 rounds in the magazine.

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too uncomfortable for me to hold

I submit that this was the best open-bolt subgun. I think it just came at the the wrong time, too soon after the Uzi and too close to the MP5.

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If this erection doesn't go away soon I'm gonna have to call a doctor.

Swedes have one of the most professional and growing White Nationalist movements in the Western world. The Swedes will take back their country before the US, UK, or Canada.

uzi is ak of smgs so that

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I don't know about professional.

I don't think there's a select-fire one on the planet, kind of doesn't qualify.

fpbp yet again