Anyone else work remotely in areas with brown bear populations? Older guys I worked with sometimes carried pump 12 gauges, but they were pretty unwieldly when you had to hike through the backcountry with 50 lbs of tools and instruments.
Some other guys also carried 45 ACP handguns, but they tended to stick closer to the camp and seemed to imply the handguns were more for backcountry weirdos that seem to stumble on the property.
Carried a 44 Mag revolver, as well, and found the recoil was severe enough that quick follow-ups were difficult, as well as the inherent limitations of a pistol.
Can a very short PDW be viable for this job? Something you can strap to your chest and forget about that's still easy to deploy when you really need it? 10mm in particular seems to have the right balance of power vs recoil and has more muzzle energy than 5.56 out of a 6" barrel. Or maybe I'm just overthinking it and should get a 44 revolver.
10mm PCC at the least. You have to take into account that if a bear starts charging you are you confident you'll be able to whip out a revolver and land at least two out of six shots in the heat of the moment? A PCC will at least give you more than six shots so you can at least magdump with less felt recoil.
If you really want a bear dead you could even go down the route of building a .50 Beowulf or .458 SOCOM rifle caliber pistol. An 8" barrel on one of those should be only slightly bulkier than a PCC.
Evan Rivera
I was typing out my post and you basically said what I was thinking, although I was cheaping out and thinking .300 blackout since you can get an upper + pistol lower parts kit for $330 off PSA.
Elijah Clark
saying pistol calibers aren't enough for bear is fuddlore, there was a great article with stats attached that showed bear attacks, what they were shot with, how many times, and whether they were successful in the defense. 9mm did fine. And that certainly is because most people have and use 9mm. If you are shooting hot stuff out of a long barrel with a big mag on a subgun, the bear doesn't have a fucking chance
Landon Scott
I've heard that there are .300 BLK loads that have ballistic performance like .308, though I don't know if that's true or not. Could it be sufficient for bear, or is it like other intermediate rifle cartridges on large game?
I don't live anywhere where bears are a problem and really have no fucking idea what'd be best, but I think I'd just pack an AR10 clone with a good sling and deal with the weight.
I think 10mm has some advantages going for it, namely that it has roughly the same muzzle energy as 44 mag out of a 6" barrel while being available in autoloaders. A Glock 20 is always a good option, but again, a PCC would be slightly preferable if it was small enough not to interfere with work beceause it would give you a longer barrel and a more stable shooting platform.
I'm dubious as to how viable 50 Beowulf or 458 SOCOM are out of barrel lengths under ~10", the other issue being limited capacity.
Christian Davis
>.300blk average energy 1,300 ft/lbs >.308 average energy 2,600 ft/lbs > similar ballistic performance Are you retarded?
Jaxson Smith
No, you faggot, I just don't know shit about some meme cartridge, untwist your panties.
Cooper Wood
last week my dog jumped the fence and ran after a bear... i grabbed my AR and went after them into the woods. thankfully the bear ran up a tree and they didnt get into it... AR was what I had handy so I figured it would be better than nothing... not ideal but a bunch of green tips to the head should at least slow it down.
Jaxon Kelly
Out of a 16" barrel .50 BW is still hitting at 2330ft-lbs with 300gr and at 2878ft-lbs with 400gr.
Even if you cut it to an 8" barrel, Beowulf will still absolutely destroy anything in front of it. It doesn't need much stabilization, as evidenced by the barrel twist. It's something like 1:20.
Interesting. How reliable of a shooter is that going to be, does it malfunction easy? How many rounds can the mag hold? Everyone basically uses pumps with slugs for the bigbois, anything less would really freak me out. This pic is the only thing looking like a possible replacement.
Ryder Morris
Go away faggot
Sebastian Miller
>I have no idea what I'm talking about, and it's your fault when you call me out
Maybe do a bit of research before you run your mouth.
Gavin Gray
It seems it would be a slow draw after you have to move it away from your chest to actually get any work done.
Just get a 10mm glawk as the others in the thread suggest.
Add USW stock if you really think a stock would help.
Samuel Ross
Is .44 mag really that bad or are you just a wristlet? I had no trouble firing several cylinders worth of .44 mag hydro shock (don’t know if FMJ is any worse) very quickly out of a M29-6 when i inherited mine at 15. Maybe it was easier because it had the hogue mono grips on it? I feel like wood grips on .44 would be harder to grip onto Nigger nigger nigger schizo ping pong
Jack Perry
Also should mention that if you do get .44 pls don’t get an older model 29, I rarely shoot mine anymore bc of its value and collectibility. I’m not sure of any other models but try to get something similar, doesn’t ruger make a red hawk or something that shoots .44? Look into that niggy.
Lincoln Anderson
The durability of bears is extremely overrated. They're not made of unobtanium, they're made of the same materials as every other predator. The main reason for the myths is that bears are extremely large and scoring a lethal one shot is comparatively difficult "in the moment". This is the same reason why bear spray is considered more effective at melee range. A bear's heart is actually not very big compared to its size and it sits much lower on the bear than normal. Especially looking gead on, it is very low on the target. That said, if you hit the bears heart or you get a GOOD brain shot, it will die the same as any ither animal. Theyre not much tougher than boar imo. Ive had a boar that survived 3 shots of .223 into the "vital" area before going down to a head shot. You pretty much need to hit the heart or the brain if you want it to instantly drop. Caliber isnt really that important although you MIGHT scare it away with a bigger gun. I wouldnt stake my life on it though
Caleb Cruz
I should say though to answer OPs question, the 10mm sounds pretty good overall. It could be useful for more than just bears and its adequate for bears if you are accurate enough. But OP, buy some damn bear spray if you're going into bear country. Its more reliable at fuck you distances where their bear is already on your ass.
Ayden Smith
I can tell you from experience that a .50 BW subgun with an 8" barrel using a pistol-length gas system will function flawlessly. Or at least it has so far. It's gone bang every time I've taken it to the range. The current 20rd 5.56 mag I have can hold 7 rounds of .50 Beowulf. Standard 5.56 mags will hold and feed .50 Beowulf, you just have shave off some material on the front of the mag so the round can clear it. 30rd 5.56 mags can hold 10 .50 Beowulf.
Just don't expect to shoot beyond 100 yards. It's an extremely short-range weapon.
Got it. Well, as long as it doesn't jam, and your shots don't miss, that should slap him silly if he's coming at you. Good info thx
Ryder Price
BTW how would you estimate the recoil of the shot is? Compared to other calibers
Charles Jenkins
Bear spray is probably your best choice.
Austin Morris
Have both, and use that first yeah. But sometimes you will be spraying into a headwind, and it won't even reach the bigboi. OFUG.gif
Jaxson Taylor
Memegun
Nicholas Thompson
>doesn't carry tactical salmon steak in sealed bag with ripcord opening to throw at bear while you retreat
Ryder Wood
for when you need something right next to you turned inside out
Carson Rivera
Black bears or grizzly bears? There's plenty of recorded incidents with both being killed by 9x19mm because it's easier to mag dump a Glock 19 until you hit CNS than it is to fire two or three carefully aimed .44 magnum rounds. Personally I think 10mm is the right choice, but this article seems to indicate that .40 S&W or 9x19mm work just fine ammoland.com/2018/02/defense-against-bears-with-pistols-97-success-rate-37-incidents-by-caliber/#axzz5hK1uCi2N
Nathan Lewis
“though I don't know if that's true or not“ he outright told you he had no idea lmao no reason to sperg out.
Recoil is almost negligible. The concussion, on the other hand, is enormous as is the fireball. I can imagine the recoil would become even less if you go with a longer barrel.
.300blk (supersonic) is sufficient to kill a bear. At the ranges that you'd be worried about a bear mauling you, anything 9mm+p and above will be fine. Unless you're talking kodiak/polar, then up it to .357mag.
Jordan Murphy
An AK pistol will shrek any bear any day
Ethan Moore
For when you don't want to wait for your meat to cook after killing it.
It's just as easy, if not easier, to miss with a .454 Cassull or a .44 Magnum as it is with a .40, and your follow up shots are going to be faster and more accurate with the .40 S&W. Look, I wouldn't go out in those woods without a 10mm pistol and a big bore lever gun/12 Gauge with slugs but the article here lists plenty of successful bear kills with 9mm. If a 9x19mm NATO load can go through a PASGT helmet at 15 yards, it can go through Yogi's pic-A-nic basket.
Owen Young
Jesus H!
Ryder Lewis
>The only thing you hear moments before you're slammed across the forest floor is the rapid and heavy thumping of paws on wet dirt as 600lbs of fugg is now in striking distance behind you.
Asher Walker
I'd unironically take a 9mm subgun loaded with hot hardcasts over a .44 mag revolver any day of the week. Mostly because i suck at shooting heavy recoiling revolvers, but those rounds will penetrate enough to reach vitals in all but the heaviest of bone shots on large brown bears. I have no doubt that i could get multiple times more good hits with it, and that's what really matters when it comes to stopping an angry mammal with a pea shooter(.44 mag included) regardless of species.
Since size is a major constraint for you and you want to go with 10mm likely the best choice is going to be one of those roni glock conversions and a g20. There are also some similar but lower profile products on the market if you want to cut weight like the endotactical brace. An extended barrel might be worth looking into as well. As an added bonus with this set up if you ever decide that a PDW is too cumbersome as well you'll still have the option of carrying the glock in a holster or chest rig. >10mm... has roughly the same muzzle energy as 44 mag out of a 6" barrel No. >ammoland.com/2019/03/pistols-or-handguns-used-to-defend-against-bear-attack-95-effective-63-cases New version.
Logan Adams
Yeah, read that article a while ago before the update. Shits weird. All that said I would not touch my boots to that fucking island up there or anywhere around there without slugs in my shotgun, a .45 tactical with 17rd mags, and whatever the fuck else I can bring. Couple dogs to distract would help. Fuck a bear, they freak me out
Carter Brooks
Yep. I cant handle this shit, one of the few things that legit terrifies me. drowning in murky water does it.. or stuck wedged in a pitch black cave.. great white shark attack.. fucking giant brown bear foaming at the mouth and coming to eat my flesh makes me nearly faint picturing it fuck this thread lol
Christian Sanchez
At least you'll set the bear on fire if you completely miss it...
Mason Russell
10mm loads in 6" barrels seem to fall between 500-800 ft-lbs. In the same barrel 44 mag loads are anywhere from 600-1000 ft-lbs, so he's not entirely wrong. There's definitely a decent overlap.
>white sharks The worst. You're already at an extreme disadvantage in terms of mobility, and visibility, forget about hearing. It's an ambush predator that strikes from below at speeds humans can't even reach on land. 2000lb at 35mph, strikes you with kinetic energy of 122405 J, jaws first loaded with hundreds of teeth that move in a saw like motion after the initial bite to separate flesh.
Now imagine if they actually liked eating humans.
Leo Sanchez
Pretty handy. Some people carry 10mm pistols and they work just fine. A small PCC in 10mm would work too. Just keep in mind, it’s a lot more work to lug around a rifle then a pistol, esp with a pack and hiking up a mountain.
jfc. this post made me switch from shopping ars to browsing scarH
Elijah Gonzalez
The one quality I will give a revolver, and this is especially good in the case of a bear attack, is that it won't jam if you have the muzzle in contact with the bear when you fire. If a bear is on top of you and your pistol jams on the second shot because it was pressed up against the bears torso you are absolutely fucked.
Grayson Martinez
Thank God that Great White's don't have the same aggressiveness and ability to breathe in fresh water that bull sharks have. A hybrid of those two sharks would have me afraid to jump in a fucking swimming pool.
Aaron Collins
There's some footage from The Battle of Hue of Ontos's lighting up a machine gun nest across the river that is some of the coolest combat footage from 'Nam that I've ever seen.
Nathaniel Hughes
>in the same barrel 44 mag loads are anywhere from 600-1000 ft-lbs The only reasonable approach here is comparing top of the line ammo to top of the line ammo. The hottest 10mm ammo on the market may very well overlap with the absolute weakest .44 magnum, but that doesn't really mean anything when comparing the two calibers in terms of capabilities. Looking at the same manufacturers .44 mag loads as what you listed for 10mm shows 800ftlbs as being a reasonable approximate upper bound for 10mm out of a 6" bbl. Meanwhile their least energetic low recoil .44 magnum comes in at 970ftlbs from a 5.5" barrel, their most comes in at a whopping 1533ftlbs, and the vast majority of their standard loads come in at 1100-1200ftlbs. When compared reasonably there really isn't any overlap at all, the .44 magnum is anywhere between moderately more powerful to nearly twice as powerful out of a slightly shorter barrel.
Evan Howard
Always thought the same thing, TBQH, one of the most common reasons for a failure to stop a bear is simply not having enough time to properly employ a firearm before its on top of you. You might like this story i came across while reading through the handgun involved bear attack list, because a struggle induced jam is exactly what happened in it.
>10mm PCC at the least. I see you're an internet expert at the least.
Dylan Martinez
Yeah, I wouldn't want to use hollow points but I'd feel comfortable with 124gr NATO based on penetration, especially from a longer barrel
Kayden Anderson
collapsing tac stock imo. one does need to aim for the chest
Brandon Price
It was on TheTruthAboutGuns. 9mm has killed more bears in self defense situations than any other pistol caliber. This is in part due to it's popularity. It is popular and effective. If I was hunting them I'd pack a larger round, but for backpacking/hiking in bear country your sub/compact 9mm is sufficient.
