What's the best home defense gun and why is it the AR15?

It is...just not that one.

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AR pistol in .300 memeout, suppressed

mawp

Are you worried about overpenetration?

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Nope, 12 gauge semi-auto running #4 buckshot.

I want to shoot one of these next to my sleeping dog to see if he wakes up.

MEEEEEEOOOOOOW

That’s a weird way to spell “Glock 19”.

>lol just always have an expensive rifle next to you when something unexpected happens, like seriously
Yeah kinda

>and your neighbor
>What is 5.56
>What is frangibility
You're obviously a no-gunz. Kys fag

A pistol is objectively worse in a fight. WHY would you want to put yourself at a disadvantage when you need it most?

>you can't hunt a deer with an AR15, you'll blow it in half

No.

thinking about buying this gun but someone was telling me youre only supposed to shoot .223 out of it

gunbuyer.com/smith-and-wesson-m-p-15-sport-ii-5-56mm-16-barrel-30-1-10202-10202-gb.html

Its not a fucking pokemon battle where you throw your guns at each other and the bigger, more expensive one wins.

Suppressed 9mm PCC.

If shotgun suppressors were more available I'd say shotgun, but alas.

9mm PC, 9mm full size handgun, fuddy five acp etc. Etc.

>A pistol is objectively worse in a fight.
Noguns detected. Life isn’t vidya. In a real home defense encounter, none of the advantages a rifle has really mean anything. You don’t *want* more power unless you really hate your neighbors, accuracy at long distances isn’t a factor (How many 100-yard-long hallways do you have in your house?), and home invaders don’t wear body armor despite Jow Forums‘s paranoid fantasies to the contrary. A pistol’s maneuverability in tight quarters, simple manual of arms, easy storage and retrieval, and even the fact that it’ll look better to a jury than a scary black rifle all make it superior to any long gun for home defense.

30-06 > .223

Stupid nigger ar 15 owners are the blandest niggers

>t. noguns

>bigger, more expensive one
AR15s are cheaper than Glocks.

Motherfucker people MISS their targets at 6 yards from stress. Lethality of ammunition DOES matter because you don't want an assailant to fucking kill you after you shot him. Pistols are harder to aim, shoot, have lower capacity, and are less lethal. Any military rifle is better for close quarters combat. You're worried about a jury? Fine, that's on you. But nobody is going to choose a handgun over a modern military rifle for clearing a house if given the choice. Choose what the pros use.

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I kind of agree with this. Of course an AR or AK is better for fighting, but I’ll still choose a pistol until they are more normalized. A jury could paint you crazy on sight.

5.56 has less of a potential to over penetrate than 9mm Parabellum.

You spelled AKM wrong.

If you cant hit a human sized target with a pistol at 7 yards or less you deserve to die. Its as easy as pointing a remote at a tv.

Unironically this

Related.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aBhtbrecAE

>Motherfucker people MISS their targets at 6 yards from stress.
Good thing the Glock 19 carries more than one round.
>Lethality of ammunition DOES matter because you don't want an assailant to fucking kill you after you shot him.
9mm is plenty lethal.
>Pistols are harder to aim
No
>shoot
No
>have lower capacity
The average number of rounds fired in a home defense encounter is 2-3. 5+ rounds is rare and 10+ is basically unheard of. That means the difference between having 15 rounds available and 30 rounds available is meaningless for home defense purposes.
>and are less lethal.
See above.
>5.56 has less of a potential to over penetrate than 9mm Parabellum.
Gosh, I guess the military better get rid of their M4s and buy a bunch of 9mm carbines if 9mm can punch through more than 5.56 can. I wonder why they don't?

Counterpoint, some motherfucker just blew away 5 spics with an AK the other day, tomorrow's home invasions are getting weird

imagine posting this without irony
> elcan
> 210db

what if i want to use a light switch?
what if i want to open the door and keep my weapon ready?
what if i discover it's my dumb teenager or i otherwise decide not to shoot and i'd rather tuck the weapon behind my back?

or
> be invader
> get in house
> go to bedroom
oh shit an AR beside the bed. this is a fight now i gotta kill people
> be me, wake up dead

I can put a handgun someplace not immediately visible.
I don't wanna try dragging a rifle out in the middle of the night and bang it on everything.
a pistol will get me armed faster. And it's comfier to cuddle with in bed anyway

they don't because body armor happens to be a thing. and rifles tend to be more accurate. also it's easier to aim with a rifle instead of a pistol.

Absolutely this. Pistols are also known to be shit at incapacitating people compared to rifles, e.g. your assailant may die 15 minutes later of blood loss but not after stabbing you to death. An AR will put em down right there, go watch the Christchurch shooting if you doubt it.

>Counterpoint, some motherfucker just blew away 5 spics with an AK the other day, tomorrow's home invasions are getting weird
He did that because an AK is what he had handy. Yes, in one sense, the best gun for home defense is always the gun you actually have when someone breaks in. All that proves is that any gun is better than no gun.

20 Gauge with buck shot. I don't want overpen and I want my tiny goth wife to be able to use it if need be.

but not before* stabbing you to death

>they don't because body armor happens to be a thing.
Which is only a factor in home invasions if your home is located in Kandahar. Otherwise, the idea that some dudes are going to break into your house with body armor on is a paranoid fantasy that has nothing to do with reality.
>and rifles tend to be more accurate.
I've addressed this. The difference in accuracy is only relevant at distances far beyond home defense ranges. So unless you live in an airplane hangar in Kandahar, the rifles's advantages are 0-2 as far as being relevant for home defense.
>also it's easier to aim with a rifle instead of a pistol.
No.

>Pistols are also known to be shit at incapacitating people compared to rifles
Not enough to matter, really - pistols over .32ACP work fine. Besides which, if first-shot incapacitation is the #1 thing that matters to you, you want neither a pistol or a handgun, but a shotgun - basically nothing beats the first-shot incapacitation capability of 12 gauge buckshot.
>your assailant may die 15 minutes later of blood loss but not after stabbing you to death.
This is not supported by relevant data. Note: Anecdotes about a small number of edge cases does not constitute "relevant data".

Being able to shoot 30 fuggin times sure helped him man. Not that this in any way affects the argument that a glock would be superior because lolsticks but I do take contention with the idea that you theoretically only need a 1911 because statistically you won't use half the mag

If you don't have earpro next to your go to HD gun and your home is so easily penetrated you wouldn't have time to get it on, you should reevaluate your mistake of a life.

Dbl barrel #4 buck. Cut a man in half.

That’s not the American 180

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best?
>its an alexander arms or equivalent 12" grendel off the shelf with a 25 round asc mags and a holosun 510c reflex
or
>10mm kriss braced pistol with extended 30 rnd glock mag

556 is for poor people

Rifles are 100% easier to shoot and be quick and accurate with. In a Norma. shooting position a pistol is about as long as a 14.5” rifle, the only difference is I now have a rifle caliber with 4 points of contact and near nothing recoil. Rifles are infinitely better then pistols

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I hate this gun with at least 16KG of passion
> be me
> lardo cuck youtuber
> wanna eat
> fuck muh weight, woman
> how do i get snacks without thes bitch riding my fat ass
> i know, i'll tell her it's for a video

> buy tub of snacks
uh, yeah, hunny, i'll shoot it and put the video on youtube
> go out there
> load all those rounds
> wind the mag
> shoot at the UTZ cheezballs
> miss every single shot
> mag winds down
try again. Move up, too
> miss for another 125 rounds
> eat them cheese
yeah honey, great day

i still hate that video

Pap m92 or mini draco

Jesus Christ no. Shooting this thing indoors with double ear pro still left my ears ringing and it’s just a regular draco

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Shot it in my house last night. 200gr 300blk. Loudest part is the action working

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>What's the best home defense gun
AR-15

>and why is it the AR15?
Lightweight, good ergonomics, low recoil, good terminal ballistics with appropriate ammunition, incredible value-for-money compared to nearly anything else on the market, extremely modular so you can fit it to your exact specifications, inexpensive ammunition so you can train more, a wide selection of very reliable magazines available at very low prices.

>>also it's easier to aim with a rifle instead of a pistol.
>No.
Everyone else in the thread has brought this up and you keep saying "no," like that's an argument. If you find it easy to aim pistols then good for you, but I and plenty of other people find it easier to aim, handle, and control rifles under recoil.

>Not enough to matter, really
So rifles having double the one-shot incapacitation probability of 9mm is "not enough to matter"? It's your life, I guess.

>basically nothing beats the first-shot incapacitation capability of 12 gauge buckshot
Whereas rifles are only slightly worse, and ARs have far lower recoil and higher capacity.

As far as I can tell, the only valid point you've brought up in this thread is that using an AR will look worse in court.

>suppressed sbr

this tbqh
tfw cuck state

oh no you wouldn't want to lose a small amount of high frequency hearing just to save your own life and the lives of your loved ones

>Everyone else in the thread has brought this up and you keep saying "no," like that's an argument.
If hitting something with a handgun at under seven yards is in the tiniest bit hard for you, then all I have to say is that I thought you were great in Back to the Future and Spin City.
>So rifles having double the one-shot incapacitation probability of 9mm is "not enough to matter"?
This statement is too vague to be useful. Which rifles with which ammo at which distances under which conditions, versus which 9mm out of which pistol at which distances under which conditions? All relevant data says that when a proper self-defense load is selected, 9mm is perfectly adequate to the task.
>Whereas rifles are only slightly worse
Supporting data needed, which seems to be a consistent problem with your arguments.
>and ARs have far lower recoil
Irrelevant if you aren't literally made of soi.
>and higher capacity.
I already addressed why this isn't very relevant.

>ARs have far lower recoil
LOL my literal trap gf(male) who literally goes to bed wearing lace thongs uses a 12 gauge for home defense. If its recoil not too much for him, what's your excuse?

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This is why this board attracts autism like moths to a flame. There's a million tiny factors that you can AKSHUALEE about when the reality of the matter is that 2 or 3 whatever the fuck you can hit shit withs will be perfectly adequate

Rifles are many times more lethal than handguns.

youtube.com/watch?v=wXwPtP-KDNk

youtube.com/watch?v=T6kUvi72s0Y

>There's a million tiny factors that you can AKSHUALEE about when the reality of the matter is that 2 or 3 whatever the fuck you can hit shit withs will be perfectly adequate
Yup. I'm surprised there wasn't more of a spergout about the Lucky Gunner video where he showed that, as many have said for years, the difference between any two commonly-compared calibers really is too small to be meaningful in the real world. Fanboys and autists can debate them all they want - it basically doesn't matter a bit.

youtube.com/watch?v=T6kUvi72s0Y

I have a g19 in a fast open safe.

I would prefer a shotgun but I have no way to secure it from little ones or If I were to get burgled during the day.

Do they make quick release safes for shotguns? That sounds like a potential business model desu.

KSG-25 loaded with dragon's breath.

LOL two posts using the same video to make opposite points against each other. Pure Jow Forums autism.

bam

they make an AR one too

hornady.com/security/rapid-safes/shotgun-wall-lock

>Rifles are many times more lethal than handguns.
Which rifles with which ammo at which distances under which conditions, versus which 9mm out of which pistol at which distances under which conditions? All relevant data says that when a proper self-defense load is selected, 9mm is perfectly adequate to the task.

Go ahead and post that data.

You're a retard. The Lucky Gunner video states that pistol calibers are all pretty much the same AND rifle calibers are dramatically more lethal.

You hate the gun because a fat guy used it in a video?

The best HD gun is a PPC with a suppressor

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That's great. All of the limitations of size and weight from a long gun and we can give up lethality from the round.

he used 246 rounds and missed all but 2.
That's why

You sound really jealous.

PDW

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

IT HAS THE WHAT OF A GONG GUN?

>
It's loud? That's the reason you won't pick one gun over another gun? It's a gun folks. They are loud as fuck indoors.

>Go ahead and post that data.
Google is your friend, and ballistic data on 9mm is not hard to find.

One thing to keep in mind is that data on incapacitation has endless factors behind it that aren't easy to quantify. For example, one-shot incapacitation rates spike for both 9mm and .40S&W in a way that doesn't match the expected values if cartridge power was the only factor involved. The only logical explanation for this is that 9mm and .40 are such popular rounds that they're used by many more inexperienced shooters than other rounds, and these shooters tend to manage to hit the target somewhere, but without hitting a vital organ. Whereas the sort of person who shoots .357 Magnum is much more likely to be a more experienced shooter who practices more, and thus will be more likely to hit a vital area while shooting at a bad guy. In fact, if you really want to incapacitate in one shot, the data suggests that your best choices would be a shotgun, then a .22lr pistol, then a rifle, then .32ACP, then a tie between .44 and .357 Magnum, then .380ACP, a curve that obviously must be explained by factors other than power alone.

The bottom line, however, is that the average number of rounds fired by a rifle before incapacitation is 1.4, while for a handgun it's 1.9 - a difference of .5 rounds, which is not the "double the stopping power" that some here have claimed.

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>tfw absolutely horrified to ever use my 22 magnum
>smallest and easily loudest gun I own
>wear it as a backup gun strung down in my pants
>know lm gonna have to be in some real shit to ever need it
Better than dying. I agree with ya senpai.

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>hurrdurr just aim better
Stress is a thing, and even if a pistol is adequate, the argument in this thread is whether an AR is *better,* which it obviously is.
>This statement is too vague to be useful.
Oh bullshit, we all know that properly selected 5.56 has excellent terminal ballistics even among rifle rounds, and don't pretend Ellifritz's data was all people defending their houses with 338 LM. It's mostly military data, along with police gunfights.
>Supporting data needed, which seems to be a consistent problem with your arguments.
Following your lead, hypocrite. That's from Ellifritz, who says the vast majority of his shotgun data was 12 ga. If you have better data for a comparison then post it; in either case both are at extremely high % for "actually incapacitated by one hit."
>Irrelevant if you aren't literally made of soi.
Regardless of your protein composition, followup shots are way faster with an AR, period.
>I already addressed why this isn't very relevant.
All else being equal, more capacity is better. And the vast majority of 12 gauge shotguns hold only 5 shells or less.

gross

This is retarded.
>get gud fags

We are arguing which is better. Not if one works and the other doesn’t. Rifles are undeniably better
>4 points of contact for more control
>nearly the same length as a pistol extended to proper aiming form
>less trigger jerk issues affecting accuracy during an adrenaline dump due to being much heavier then pistols.

Your best argument is that you don’t know how to use a rifle indoors.

>>hurrdurr just aim better
>Stress is a thing,
No, literally, just aim better. There are a lot of people here who think that gear is an adequate substitute for frequent practice with whatever home defense weapon you choose. No it isn't. The only way to get to the point where you can handle a weapon - any weapon - well under stress is to go practice until using it is second nature. There is no way around that.
>>get gud fags
Yup. unless you literally have Parkinson's Disease, there is no excuse for you not to be able to develop enough skill to competently defense yourself with a pistol. If you can't do that, then the problem is you suck.
>Your best argument is that you don’t know how to use a rifle indoors.
No, my best argument is you don't know how to use a handgun. At all.
>Rifles are undeniably better
Not in important areas like maneuverability in tight spaces, and where they are better it's not enough to matter.

Any gun that consistently goes bang and has more than 5 shots.

we all know nobody is going to use earpro in the middle of the night, but has anybody ever put sound absorbing materiel on the walls and floor?

My favorite part is that you're probably gonna slip in the shower and hit your head on the counter long before needing the gun, but I doubt you have a bath mat.

>but I doubt you have a bath mat.
That's where you're wrong.

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this thread reads like something from Jow Forumsliberalgunowners

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What the fuck is a Jow Forumsliberalgunowners.

anyone else get really bummed by the fact that we live in a world in which you could get into legal trouble for using violence against someone breaking into your own house?

So one guy who can’t aim for shit is good enough to judge a weapons usefulness

Have shot 5.56 indoors from a 10.3" barrel without hearing protection.

I won't say it was a good idea or anything, but it won't deafen you either.
>we all know nobody is going to use earpro in the middle of the night
Protip: Pistol on at your bedside. This gets you to your rifle/SBR. Keep hearing protection there. Now you have superhuman hearing and the other guy goes deaf.

I have a ruger 10/22 pistol (pretty much a sbr version of the 10/22 rifle). I was thinking of putting a red dot and a 50 round mag in it. Have the red dot always on at a low setting, load it with hollowpoints and just fucking magdump center mass with zero recoil. Anyone else do this? How viable would it be compared to a regular handgun or shotgun?

This is an important point that people here are missing. Proportionality is a thing to the court