Seriously though, what are we doing about this?

Missiles would always be cheaper if defense contractors weren't greasy profiteers.

China needs good anti-ship missiles because the US has powerful ships and good anti-missile systems.

The thing to do when China gets good anti-ship missiles is to improve anti-missile systems and ship-based standoff weapons - which is what the US is doing.

no the right answer to is build more Zumwalt with superior capacity and stealth to beat chinks' ships

Yeah no, that carrier is gonna be at the bottom of the ocean within the first 15 minutes of an actual war.

Missile and sub spam will make short work of it and it’s carrier group.

Missiles are only useful for naval warfare. Carriers are infinitely more versatile and can be used for power projection. While a CVN is more expensive than a DDG, you’ll actually use a carrier a whole lot more.

SM-6
ESSM
Laser cannons

Making sure that China can't take advantage of private platforms (Google, StarLink) to pinpoint CVBGs hiding at sea is also kinda important.

Back to your hive, insect.

Stealth is definitely a good counter. Next Tico replacements will probably be Zumwalt-based.

That, and so far, missiles haven’t proven themselves to be effective. The USS Mason was attacked with 9 low-tier Chinese anti-ship missiles, and between interceptor missiles and decoys, not a single middle got in CIWS range.

Russian anti-shipping missiles have been better than American ones for decades now. Hell, there's probably some shitty Euro country that has better missiles than the US.

The Harpoon is the Brown Bess of AShMs.

Yeah, cause the US is just going to sail a CVN into areas with a known PLAN missile presence.

Eh, that’s true to some extent, but it’s mainly because the US has never needed to invest in anti ship missiles at a huge level. They’re already developing the LRASM to fill that gap now that we’re facing a foe with a real navy instead of Russia.

Probably something highly classified that the public is unaware of.

>plarf

Good, Carriers are only used for "nation building, not defending America

Attached: 272tof.jpg (476x319, 51K)

Because the US never really invested in ship launched ashm capability. Their advantage is huge naval air power, so naturally all their ashms were developed to carried by aircraft.

Plus, most of these Russian and Chinese super shipkiller missiles are gigantic because they're being launched from the ship instead of a plane, and have to cover far more distance. Bigger missiles means you can't fit as many on a ship, or you need specialized ships to carry them. For example, the P-700 Shipwreck on paper outclasses every ashm the US has, but it's so gigantic that only Oscars (of which they only have 6 acive now), Kirovs (Only 2 active ones), and the Kuznetsov (indefinitely out of action) could actually mount them.

Harpoons, and the LRASM and NSM that are replacing them, are smaller but can be bolted on to literally anything.

Once the Type 055 gets its ASBM/HGV weapon as claimed by leakers for years, it will only get more dangerous.

Attached: 055 AShBM.jpg (746x900, 99K)

But carriers are ALREADY totally useless. How many caravans have these carriers stopped?

“Nation Building” is what places America in its current position of global preeminence. This has been a generally good thing if you’re a westerner, and if you’re not, it’s not like your opinion matters to anyone.

>can be used for power projection
... against countries with shit defenses. CVNs already have to stay away from China and Russia because those countries can sink them from a range that's farther than the effective range that F-35s can operate.

>being too dumb to realize that a sacrificial navy is a tried-and-true, dual-purpose tactic to draw the US into a global war while providing a "real" reason to update the entire fleet to more modern vessels

If Chinese missiles are as good as their aircraft and Dollar store goods, I'm not too concerned.

You can't strike a CVG when you don't know where it is. It wasn't uncommon for the USN to sail carriers right up to Russia's coast during the Cold War with Russia never realizing they were there. Proper EWAR tactics can a go a very long way.

>“Nation Building” is what places America in its current position of global preeminence.

Someone should tell our negotiators then because we're about to abandon Afghanistan to the Taliban wholesale.

You mean Chinese missiles, right? Because missiles in general have obviously proven themselves to be effective in naval situations. Also, real life examples and experience are a key no doubt but let's keep the ball low. 5 missiles for AEGIS is like scratching your head.

>during the cold war
you do realize that we're almost 1/3rd of a century past the end of the cold war?

>if they're only as good as their low end products

What if they're as good as their Norincos and their OnePlus phones?

So, you're wrong on the range thing. Also, just because we can't beat up Russia and China like we can do to the rest of the world doesn't make the weapon system useless. Carriers are incredibly useful.

Russia has only gotten less militarily capable since the end of the Cold War. If the US could do it then, it absolutely can now.

>You can't strike a CVG when you don't know where it is.
LMFAO

maps.southfront.org/conflict/us-carrier-strike-groups-locations/

it's not even a fucking secret. And do you honestly think you can hide CVNs from satellites?!?!

>So, you're wrong on the range thing
No I'm not. Even the Congress says so. Just look at the ranges of some of the missiles from China and Russia... they exceed the effective range of F-35s. So you would need to refuel them mid-air to reach enemy territory. But those refueling planes are an easy target.

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Why do Pajeets never link their articles to a real source?

The basics of how satellites and radar work hasn't exactly changed in those decades. Unless the Russians and Chinese have ground based radars that can curve over the horizon or an AEW capability that outclasses the US, I don't see how basic EWAR tactics still can't be effective.

How come Chinese missiles work so well?

Attached: 45756879789.jpg (550x515, 44K)

>The ‘U.S. Carrier Strike Groups Locations Map’ is exclusive series showing the approximate locations of U.S. Carrier Strike Groups on a weekly basis. SouthFront: Analysis & Intelligence tracks locations of U.S. aircraft carriers using the available open-source information.

>approximate locations
>available open source information

It's almost as if the the US publicly announces where its carriers are going during peacetime or something.

>Unless the Russians and Chinese have ground based radars that can curve over the horizon or an AEW capability that outclasses the US

And that's exactly what they have. OTH is old news, China also has a large satellite constellation of ocean surveillance birds now.

I can’t wait till we get to target satellites as part of a greater naval conflict in the Pacific. It’s gonna be awesome.

>yeah but muh cool new experimental drones that arent deployed can carry our missiles and BTFO Cyna
>no they cant just carry their missiles on drones as well you dumb Chink shill China has nothing just talk reee Tinananmen butthurt seething

>And that's exactly what they have

I'd like to know what kind of quantum magic you're referring to.

>their aircraft
>low-end product
That sounds promising.

What a stupid post.
Satellites need to be in the correct position in order to actually have the ability to find the the carrier group, which is not guaranteed either way. Assuming a general location is known you still need active eyes either via ground or airborne radar, otherwise the coordinates are going to be highly inaccurate. In the case of AEW that's going to announce itself, not to mention that Chinese AWACS are utter trash.

>Unless the Russians and Chinese have ground based radars that can curve over the horizon or an AEW capability that outclasses the US
Do you know what a quantum radar is, user?

The second something crosses into the 'bubble' of a quantum radar, it is fully detected, down to the individual flecks of snot that the lowliest seaman might pick from their nostrils, down to the atomic level itself. The radar reaches through hull, water, and rock. Nothing escapes detection once it enters the range of a quantum radar.
The only limitations are signal range and power generation.

Impressive

Well, I'm not sure if we can know whether the attack failed due to poor Chinese missile design, or effective American defenses. Either way, China has yet to prove that its missiles can endanger an American surface combatant. On paper, they're obviously a huge threat, but no navy has experienced near-peer naval warfare since 1945, so there will always be some inherent uncertainty.

You can't hide a battle group from satellite surveillance conducted at low level, but that sort of surveillance only passes over a given area of the planet about once every 15 hours.

At 30 knots after one hour a carrier can be anywhere in a circle with an area of 3600 square miles.

This is again one of the serious problems with killing a carrier: They are, for something that weighs more then 100,000 tons, really goddamn fast and if you lose track of it for any time at all it's in the wind and you've got no goddamn idea where it is.

Lol no. The amount of money that goes to research and development of missiles is so staggering it dwarfs the money that is needed to train the thousands of sailors in a carrier.

>The basics of how satellites and radar work hasn't exactly changed in those decades.
Yóu can say the basics of computers hasnt exactly changed

Cold war
>ivan we need of photos
>builds rocket
>builds satellite
>shots satellite into space
>wait until in position
>take photos
>wait for satellite to return down
>recover statelites
>transport to lab
>develop pictures manually
>ivan here is feshly developed photo from spy satellite!
>hour laters
>fellow ivans we compare to old of images think these and these blobs could be new American pig disgusting hangars
>repeat like three of four times before collapsing

Today
>Ching chong where is the Ameripig Pacific carrier group?
>Ching chong life feed from satellite peng ping says at l9494949494,l430303.33 50m accuracy, can get target data at 800 till 900 , next flyover of satelite ping pong at 1000

stop samefagging

>Dave where are the DF-21Ds now?
>Got the coordinates, what should we do?
>Send them to one of the SSGNs

DF-21D is on a mobile platform. It wont be on those 'coordinates' of yours.

It's not like they're driving them around constantly.

>“We are adding a seeker capability so that you would have a midcourse and terminal guidance load for the Tomahawk where it would be able to autonomously detect, track and intercept a moving target on either land or sea,” Dave Adams, Tomahawk Program Manager, Raytheon, told Scout Warrior in an interview.
>“You can launch a Tomahawk and make a decision that there is a higher priority target to go after – if troops on the ground are calling for air support, you can communicate with the missile. I can communicate to the missile faster and faster and keep providing the missile with GPS coordinates as the missile is moving. I have to have surveillance assets and determine the target’s position and feed that into the network. That data is then fed to the Tomahawk as a re-target,” Adams said.

Russia has always had RORSATs.
I know less about China.

Hey there Pooh bear.

动态网自由门 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Free Tibet 六四天安門事件 The Tiananmen Square protests of 1989 天安門大屠殺 The Tiananmen Square Massacre 反右派鬥爭 The Anti-Rightist Struggle 大躍進政策 The Great Leap Forward 文化大革命 The Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution 人權 Human Rights 民運 Democratization 自由 Freedom 獨立 Independence 多黨制 Multi-party system 台灣 臺灣 Taiwan Formosa 中華民國 Republic of China 西藏 土伯特 唐古特 Tibet 達賴喇嘛 Dalai Lama 法輪功 Falun Dafa 新疆維吾爾自治區 The Xinjiang Uyghur Autonomous Region 諾貝爾和平獎 Nobel Peace Prize 劉暁波 Liu Xiaobo 民主 言論 思想 反共 反革命 抗議 運動 騷亂 暴亂 騷擾 擾亂 抗暴 平反 維權 示威游行 李洪志 法輪大法 大法弟子 強制斷種 強制堕胎 民族淨化 人體實驗 肅清 胡耀邦 趙紫陽 魏京生 王丹 還政於民 和平演變 激流中國 北京之春 大紀元時報 九評論共産黨 獨裁 專制 壓制 統一 監視 鎮壓 迫害 侵略 掠奪 破壞 拷問 屠殺 活摘器官 誘拐 買賣人口 遊進 走私 毒品 賣淫 春畫 賭博 六合彩 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志 Free Tibet 劉曉波动态网自由门

Attached: China Too Hot for the CCP.gif (548x401, 192K)

youtube.com/watch?v=bUJDMT15oLE
Probably not entirely relevant but I wanted to share this without making a thread for it.

Attached: carriers angry anon.png (1822x846, 978K)

So long as aircraft vastly outperform both missiles and the destroyers that haul them, Carriers will always be relevant. Missiles did dick in the Falklands while even crappy outdated fighters were regularly sinking destroyers comparable in capability to the burke.

>implying we need to do something

Saved

>skips sending and waiting for the U2 to return with the photos and development and research at the lab where tribal houses are confused with missile bases 10 hours later
wow its almost like things changed since the cold war, isnt it?

Nonsense, U-2 photographs were developed in the air and streamed directly back to the President with the power of pure American patriotism.

>"we lost contact" Jamal said
>"where?" Sanchez said
>"we dont know all impressive data links are lost" Jamal said
>24 hours later
>"we still cant find the wrecks" Takbir said
>"wtf we are not even fighting a war this was a training mission!?!" Jamal said
>meanwhile at Rayheebon
>"quick send out the shills and distract everyone with dumb jokes and conspiracies like the missiles defected to China" said Goldberg Rosenstein

Meanwhile, in the real world, China still lacks the ability to effectively counter US naval dominance in their own back yard. Maybe in a few more decades, they'll be able to prevent the US from dominating their coastlines and shipping lanes, but it's worth remembering that they're still playing catch up.

I hope we cut taxes for the rich and corporations, that should solve it.

The entire South China Sea?

So Mods, now we're censoring people for offending the Chinese Communist Party?

I'd like a justification for why I can't discuss the brutal crackdown on the 1989 Tienanmen Square protests, the unprovoked conquest of Tibet, or the striking similarity between the President of China and Winnie the Pooh?

And yet these fucking commies continually spam Jow Forums with their shit tier threads about their shit tier army and you don't clean it up?

Why?

>The Chinese army crackdown on the 1989 Tiananmen Square protests killed at least 10,000 people, according to newly released UK documents.

bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-42465516

Attached: Winnie the Pooh is a commie.png (869x913, 972K)

Sure, in the same sense that the entire Western Pacific is within USN missile presence.

Carriers are relevant but not against a defensive regional power like China.

They would be able to kick us out of the South China Sea in weeks.

>So long as aircraft vastly outperform both missiles and the destroyers that haul them, Carriers will always be relevant. Missiles did dick in the Falklands while even crappy outdated fighters were regularly sinking destroyers comparable in capability to the burke.

The exocets were a real threat to the taskforce. The British went absolutely psycho offering one million a piece to buy any that were available internationally and pressuring the French I think on that you are wrong. However that was a fucking taskforce complete with fucking cruise liners as troop carriers. There is no source in the OPs muh chink bait posting. I don't believe that any missile the Chinese have is a palpable threat to a US battle group an the US has a nice way of keeping its latest weapons systems under wraps until it decides to push some ego maniac failed states face in with them. Looking at you China.

The fuck are you talking about. The US is too busy crashing into cargo ships in those shipping lanes and the 7th fleet is basically considered a joke at this point.

Meanwhile China is building area denial islands and cranking out advanced cruisers at an insane rate.

Sit down hang. China can't even take taiwan

Attached: Spooky Skeleton.gif (416x233, 1.83M)

With what, strongly worded letters? They'd have no ships or aircraft after a week.

You can tell this is a twitter account of someone who doesn't know what SM-3 and SM-6 do.

what would we need antiship missiles for?
what ships does china have that are worth shooting missiles at?

It doesn't matter how advanced China gets, as long as we have men who think they are women on our team, victory is guaranteed. According to shitlibs, perverts make the best soldiers.

If there is such a huge gap, if the US Navy would get blasted out of the water in a matter of mintues, why have the Chinese not invaded Taiwan yet?

Because there isn't and they can't.

You mean active homing missiles can intercept a target even if it wiggles around a bit? Must be more American lies.

That and SM-3 is an interceptor for exo-atmospheric targets.

Seriously, I feel like half of the pro-China posts are just Americans who've never had to deal with a country having anything approaching naval parity before. Regardless of how much China advances, the USN is still going to remain top dog for the foreseeable future.

only because they have more ships lmao
and who is zergrushing whom now?

Nobody because China doesn't have the balls to move on Taiwan now or ever.

god damn this is a stupid post

You know nothing about modern warfare

Mil Sats pipe live feed and use on board Ai object tracking and profile suites. You cannot hide surface shipping from developed nations.

>foreseeable future
That's the problem, chinese are developing their navy capabilities aggressively fast.

What? The US navy has more ships, and better ships. The Type-55 is impressive for a country like China, but nothing about it is particularly more effective than a Burke or its Japanese/Korean equivalents. Their sub fleet is a mess compared to its American counterpart, and they have an incredibly limited naval aviation capability. China is definitely on the rise, but you have to be ignorant or arguing in bad faith to claim they outclass the US navy in anything at the moment.

because these mods are pricks