Let's talk about spaceflight, space colonies and rocket technology...

>do we know the long term effects of living in lower gravity
Yeah. Loss of bone density and muscle tone.

But that's no big deal if you stay on Mars, because your body will retain sufficient strength to cope with the level of stress its gravity creates.

yea, bone density decreases if I remember right, plus radiation will kill you but it's manageable. they have if figured you'll be dead around 60-70 so regular life span for people born on earth going to mars.

But i mean long term the childrens childrens children? Wont they be skinny elongated freaks?

>Why fucking Mars
Why not Mars? Can you think of a better destination?

Venus is a fiery acidic hellscape, and the moons of Jupiter are tiny, cold, and very far away.

Welcome to future humanity
You think races are bad enough for damaging social cohesion? Might as well triple the sociological issues if we start moving between planets.

Yeah. The children of Martians will be spooky and incapable of living on Earth.

But this is kinda a good thing, since it's basically insurance against a prosperous Martian colony trying to conquer Earth in the future.

What if Martian humans are required to do physical activity regularly to keep bone mass up

Probably won't be enough with the lower g's
>just make gravity plates lol

Isaac Arthur has a handful of of videos about space combat; guy's both a physicist and artillery veteran.

youtube.com/watch?v=xvs_f5MwT04

I'm hoping we get some cool spacelaunch systems in our lifetimes; rocketry's kind of shitty and doesn't make sense to do long term if you're going to put a lot of stuff into space. Here's hoping for an orbital ring.

reusable rockets are nice, but I don't see space travel and colonization really going anywhere till we get a ship yard and port built. would lower that ticket price for sure.

a mars colony will probably develop their own style of weaponry. considering the cost to send up materials, weapons will have to be machined with metals found on mars. they'll probably head to a more non-lethal form like stun guns, seeing as a hole would be catastrophic unless you terraform the planet.

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Mars is the most applicable... it's close, andmore hospitable than venus. We need to make the step anyway.

I just can't get past that antebellum slave master accent he has.

It won't be on any manifest, but the person who is ultimately responsible for the survival of the mission will have some sort of item in their personal locker that will allow them to liquidate any member of their crew with extreme prejudice

Reminds me of belters from The Expanse , lanky legged fuckos

Well one of the main objectives to SpaceXs mars timeline is to create a fuel production plant.

tfw you'll never operate in a futuristic megacity killing humanoid aliens for credits.

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[FLASH GORDON INTENSIFIES]

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If only.

>mfw I realize all those sci-fi plots about Earthling vs Martian wars is going to come true

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>flash gordon
What are you 90?

I'm hoping it's in the 2030s

>2019
>not being 90
Who do you think has enough free time to be on Jow Forums all the time?

yeah they would probably look like the greys....

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SPACENOIDS GET OUT REEEEE

FLASH A-HA! HE'LL SAVE EVERY ONE OF US!

>this thread
>Nobody has mentioned the omegA or the upcoming military contract
Come on guys

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Oh and this

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And even then it may never be more than tasers.

Can we talk about the Soviet meme of the N1-L3?

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Honestly the demand for satellite delivering rockets is getting exciting.

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Wtf is this?

Back when the race for the moon was a thing, the Soviets had their own lunar rocket which is shown in the pic below and my first post mentioning it, basically it was Ivan's idea that "to get enough thrust we must strap more engine to rocket then we get to moon.".

Problem with this is, it might have worked if the fucking rocket didn't end up exploding and killing everyone in the immediate and outer immediate distance. Because somebody fucked up when fuelling.

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Damn, imagine that thing actually taking off. Fucking Russians and their obsession with huge shit

They might have gotten to the moon with it, but they also probably wouldn't have since their good luck charm, Korolev, died. Seems like after that, shit just went down hill for the Soviet space program.

It'll probably just be a cold war though. All tiny proxy wars, sanctions and conferences.

Wrong, the accident you mentioned which killed many engineers wasn't the N1, it was the R-16 which was due to an electrical short that caused the rocket to launch and go boom. The great part is that this particular rocket failed to launch two times and on the third the Soviets elected to figure out what the problem was while it was still on the fucking launch pad. The electrical short caused it to launch and kill every talented engineer the bears had.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nedelin_catastrophe
Back to the Soviet Lunar lander the issue with the N1 was that the Soviets had one talented leader, Sergei Korolev who passed away due to a botched surgery in 1966.The N1 sat without a leader for three years before the the Soviets decided to launch it anyway without testing it in 1969. Due to its complexity it failed four times, but there are no recorded deaths due to the incident. However, on the forth attempt the rocket made it 200 meters off the ground before the engines shutdown and caused the rocket to plummet to and explode its launch pad which left the Soviets down one launch pad for over a year.
quora.com/Why-did-the-N1-rocket-fail-and-could-it-have-been-salvaged-if-the-circumstances-were-different

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Maybe someone set it off on purpose

The better question
>why a planet instead of a spaceship

park a 1000 man self sustaining crew ship/colony in space in the kuiper belt and start directing rare earth elements asteroids into earth orbit for mining.

rotating space station mimicking earths gravity, module built.

Eventually or as a priority assembled in space by an even larger or similar sized manufacturing colony turning fuckloads of metioric iron into module components.

Mars also for similar mining operations, but in all honesty you could grow food in space just as easily on another planet.
>martian economy of lanklets with gravity deficient bones unironically dirt farming for their spacebound masters and their speiss cities.

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A giant ship would be kinda cool.

bump

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>The children of Martians will be spooky and incapable of living on Earth.

They'll learn to cast off the weakness that is flesh and become the strongest humans yet.

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>They'll learn to cast off the weakness that is flesh and become the strongest humans yet
They will be some of our most intelligent, with their bodies deteriorating they will withdrawal inwards and in their depression will slip away from us never to return,.

HMMM

C.M.Kosemen called it!

FUCKING ZEEKS AND THEIR FUCKING CONSTANT WHINING AND WAR CRIMES FUCKING GODDAMN

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Consider watching Gundam then come back to me. Also colonies in Lagrange points when?

Unless you're talking literally full body replacement, gravity would still be an important factor to your internal organs. Although now that I think about it, if we were advanced enough to make full body prostheses, maybe there's a way to encapsulate your irreplaceable organs (probably just the brain) in an optimal environment within it. The thing I would worry about for martians would be not just their body's ability to tolerate stronger gravity from large structures, but g forces from acceleration and deceleration, probably most significantly related to spaceflight.

What is the point outside of a missile shield and defense against celestial bodies?

I don't know, maybe ensuring the survival of the human species? Once we escape earth, our cosmic fate isn't tethered to it. Earth could die and humans could theoretically live on.

The real space age will really take off when we get our first space elevator. Until then, 95% to 99% of energy (and cost) are all about getting something out of the atmosphere. I mean, the energy required to get X spacecraft injected into lunar orbit and the same spacecraft injected into martian orbit is almost the same.
Either that or somehow get an industrial foothold set up on the moon via current tech and work our way up the tech ladder outside of earth. That's still way-out-there stuff, since we're still nowhere near enough with automation.

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>The first aliens we encounter will be our own colonists that have been isolated for thousands of years on low gravity planet

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>mfw none of the ayys we encounter are deathworlders

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Anybody mention the fact that fucking mars DUST is gonna fuck up any human exploration there?

It's razor sharp, toxic to lungs, gets everywhere, static clings, and royally fucks up and destroys/erodes everything

Calm down, Anakin.
Also, forcefields!

Only if we start tracking dust into open habitation areas, which can easily be avoided by the same methods we'd use for a lunar colony.

It does mean that long term however, we'd need to develop a method of softening the surface if we want open air colonies or anything of the sort but that is a problem for people 200 odd years after landing.

Once Mars babies are born, they will be significantly weaker than earth born people.

Implying that we have any coherent definition of race in the first place

>Martian colony
Not going to happen

It literally will though you retarded faggot. Granted it will probably be a century or two, but it's going to happen.

No

There is nothing of value on mars. It makes Antarctica look like a tropical paradise. Everything of practical value you could get in space could be accessed much easier through asteroid mining.

You don't know what you're talking about.

Have to figure out how to get humans past the Van Allen radiation belt if we want a moon base. Something we "forgot" how to do. Along with "losing" all the plans for building a Saturn V as well as all "accidentally writing over" the telemetry data and video footage from the single most important events in human history. We used to be able to get to the moon in 3 days, hang out, hit some golf balls, jump around like a retard, and call the president on the phone. Then blast off again to mate up with an orbiting spacecraft going a
bajillion miles an hour and head home for the next work week like it's nothing with computers slower than a TI-83+ calculator and some bad ass seat of the pants piloting while in a lander made of mylar with less fuel than a large model rocket. Five times out of six except that one time when Tom Hanks had some trouble amiright? Can't be too perfect. Even though the Soviets had beat us in every other space achievement and we only just previously barely managed to get a man into low orbit and failed the spacewalk we pulled off what is impossible today like nothing. Only during the Nixon presidency too, not before or after. Nowadays the best technology we have takes a month to get a robot with holocaust propaganda to the moon and then crashes.

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Mars is not that great of a choice for colonization. Not to mention that terraforming is still only a vague concept on paper, Mars doesn't have enough mass to retain enough atmosphere (thus, atmospheric pressure) for people to live there in the open, even with respirators. For all intents and purposes, surface suits have to be designed to about the same specifications as current space-suits. Also, Mars lacks a good magnetophere which make it even worse to live on for various reasons.

No, if you're looking for a place to settle down, you might as well skip mars entirely. Belt planetoids, and then Jovian moons (like Europa) are much, much more interesting. If there is ever a lasting presence on Mars, it will not be a colony proper. Heck, the Mars satellites are even better spots to stake a claim on than Mars itself. You're losing nothing, and you're keeping your access-cost to space null.

>a robot with holocaust propaganda
The what?

>what is funding
>what is the cold war
we can't rebuild the Saturn V because it took thousands of highly skilled and experienced engineers and technicians and an assload of money to build. most of them are now dead, their expertise went with them, and nasa on a shoestring budget isn't to keen on paying 1bn per rocket just to collect some moon pebbles and stick it to the ruskies. the whole thing was vastly inefficient because it was ahead of its time, werner von braun's aspirations were a pipe dream with the technology then effectively unfundable

You didn't see Israel's space program?
mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/israeli-robot-spacecraft-crash-lands-14287108
Makes the moon the 110th country to kick them out I guess, those poor oppressed people just can't catch a break.

I also like how we always landed on the moon just in time to annoy everyone by taking over their primetime Sunday TV spot. They sure planned that well didn't they. Screw you if you want photos of the landing sites today too. We may be able to see the hair off a gnat's ass on Earth with our spy satellites but even though the moon has no atmosphere for some reason nobody ever wants to take a nice high res photo of that sweet sweet moon buggy. The best we get is a smudge that could be a jpg artifact.

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Ahh yes, those wonderful moon pebbles that when gifted to other countries turn out to be petrified wood. Honest mistake. nbcnews.com/id/32581790/ns/technology_and_science-space/t/moon-rock-museum-just-petrified-wood/

Can you please fuck off you autistic sperg fat retarded mongoloid faggot? Actually, just kill yourself

Just don't give him the (you)s he craves and he'll fuck off.

Why not post some counterpoints? I'm sure there's plenty of quality evidence. Like all that video footage that was streamed in real time with no delay to NASA even though even modern reporters have a significant delay back to their headquarters here on Earth. Maybe we "forgot" how to make that technology too.

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>"Apparently no one thought to doubt it, since it came from the prime minister's collection," Van Gelder said.
Yeah, 100% didn't get switched out anywhere else but at the source. Absolutely. Totally.

>The first weapons on mars will be pistols with frangible ammo for security forces on the main spaceport and any major cities.
This is a decently well thought out idea. Hull punctures aren't the huge risk they are in the movies, but they're still a problem. More importantly you always live in a high population density area so overpenetration is a thing and you are reliant on the machines around you to live.
Though I'd limit it to "first firearm" - TAZERs, batons, knives etc. will probably be on Mars first.
>There would also possibly be rail/gauss cannons to protect against meteors due to the much thinner atmosphere and maybe the occasional aloha snackbar attempt.
This not so much. The chances of getting hit by anything are astronomical. Theres something like 200 strikes per year and Mars has a land area about equal to that of Earth (no oceans). And given the difficulty of hitting such targets and sufficiently disrupting them, the cost of building, maintaining and manning the weapon, the chances of getting hit, the chances of it actually doing real damage given everything will probably be Earth sheltered and redundant, I really doubt big honking space guns are likely.
He did say city.

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>It was on show in 2006, and a space expert informed the museum it was unlikely NASA would have given away any moon rocks three months after Apollo returned to Earth.
>Van Gelder said one important unanswered question is why Drees was given the stone. He was 83 years old in 1969 and had been out of office for 11 years
the us ambassador gave a geriatric dutchie a fake stone, big deal

Quite possible yes. But man are there a lot of questions that can be explained with "stolen" "forgot" and "accidentally wrote over".

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>41374129
There's zero point in countering any of your "points" because you'll just keep spouting even more illogical shit until you reach the point that your arguments are unfalsifiable. All of the retarded shit you spew has been debunked hundreds of times if you cared enough to look it up.

I did look it up. The only things that get debunked are retard tier things like "muh rock totally has a hollywood set number on it." They never talk about where the fucking telemetry data went or why we can't go past the Van Allen belt today.

>Like all that video footage that was streamed in real time with no delay
liar or misinformed
youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=I792XUcLsdI#t=4417
>In this video of the live broadcast (at 1:13:35) you can hear the delay: ground control says "go for depressurization", then you hear the echo of that coming back from the Moon, and the astronauts' response.
1.25 seconds to the moon from earth, another 1.25 seconds back, roundabout

>41374157
No you didn't, because if you did you'd know that the Van Allen belts are, in fact, belts, not the "Van Allen impenetrable radiation death shield".

That's the kerosen-fueled one, right?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Allen_radiation_belt#Implications_for_space_travel
>muh wikipedia
based on your knowledge, I think it's a pretty good start. one step at a time, bucko :^)

So how did we do it? Why can't we send people through them today? Their excuse for is "forgot how." Wikipedia doesn't say anything other than claims of how many rads astronauts got.

>Haven't = Can't in the mind of the retard
Anything else you'd like to share with the class today?

>Why can't we send people through them today?
can you please show where it says that we CAN'T?
NASA and similar organisations currently lack the funding for missions to the moon or beyond, but plans are made for the 2020s. so I guess unless you're the old conspiracy boomer type and in your 60s you'll stand a good chance to see people on moon and mars in your lifetime

> childrens childrens children?
Lamarck wants his genetics back.
If you spend 3/4 of your time inside, you'll be within the limits for radiation workers in the US. And they're already overly cautious even for numbers based on the bullshit LNT model.
Launch costs are the biggest barrier to travel. People say "just use
Space Resources and build things using materials already up there" but you need low launch costs to build the ships to get those materials, to build the refineries to process materials, to build the port to makeuse of them and to provide specialized parts its infeasible to make in space.
>hole would be catastrophic
Not really. Cities are big, bullets are small and holes takes a while to leak.

>They never talk about where the fucking telemetry data went

They lost it, because of a need for high quality magnetic tape which their suppliers were failing to provide. So they recycled old tapes, more than 20000 of them, in order to meet demand.

hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a11/Apollo_11_TV_Tapes_Report.pdf

Read the "Motivation for recycling" section starting on page 12, excluding the front page, or 13 including the front page.

>why we can't go past the Van Allen belt today.
popsci.com/blog-network/vintage-space/apollo-rocketed-through-van-allen-belts#page-4

There is no miracle technology, just people are a bit more cautious these days about exposing their astronauts to higher densities of radiation. We could do it, it's just you'd need to justify risking the crew's lives and most people aren't on board for it in the name of science.

>So how did we do it

The astronauts passed through quickly and accepted the rads; you moon truther.

They "wrote over" the data for the most important events in human history. Seems like a reasonable thing to do, I mean we'll surely just go back to the moon again right?

Rocketing through the van allen belts at crazy speeds makes some sense at least.

>They "wrote over" the data for the most important events in human history.
They wrote over one version of the data which few had seen or really understood the importance of (again, 45 tapes out of more than 20000 were overwritten) for one of the most important events in human history in a era where NASA was still fundamentally a military organisation required to support their observation satellites with the needed magnetic tape.

Not to mention the fact this particular set of data wasn't exactly considered that important. No one was in doubt that, since the cold war wasn't going to end (to them at least) they'd continue to do various space missions meaning any one set of telemetry wasn't important.

The military has backups of everything bro. Backups of backups.

Actually Venus would work 50,000 feet in the air, Except everyone would have to live on floating Hydrogen balloons

We have space war threads all the time, but I do wonder what a Mars or Moon planetary war would be like. Artillery with ridiculous range, perfect terrain for tank warfare, no aircraft and vulnerable as fuck orbital resources and tight enclosed urban areas, but all with modern and technologically dependent forces.
It'd be this weird mix of WW1, Cold War and 4GW.
Because not everything is available in asteroids, and what is there is spread out over huge distances.
On a planet you have more of what asteroids have, plus other resources to be exploited and moving around doesn't require reaction mass.
If it turns out 1/3g is still too little, then it's a tossup. But if it's fine, then planets are the clear winner, even with rotating space habs.
You're conflating Mars dust and Moon dust. Moon dust is the machine destroying silicosis causing, abrasive nightmare.
Mars has erosion and is not nearly that bad.
The toxic thing is also overrated. You'd have to eat or breath a lot of it to be harmed, and it's just mostly an iodine uptake inhibitor. If you're pregnant or a child, don't eat spoonfuls of regolith. If you're not pregnant or a child, stop when you get bored and what few effects you do get will go away.

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