Alright Jow Forums tell me if there's something to this idea or if I'm big time retard
Imagine a suppressor with a mechanism at the exit that closes when the suppressor is pressurized, allowing the gasses to only vent out holes in the back, lengthening the total time it takes the gasses to escape the suppressor thus decreasing the noise.
pic related is a shitty animation of what I mean. I imagine the mechanism would be something like a camera shutter but a gas seal.
Other urls found in this thread:
m.imgur.com
ar15.com
reddit.com
militarynewbie.com
patft.uspto.gov
twitter.com
That's real fuckin neato, wish I had the equipment to try it out.
Implementing it is totally impractical. I don't know if you've ever fired a supressor or not, but they get very dirty very fast. That will jam up any sort of moving mechanism inside the supressor.
I'm also not sure why you think this would make anything quieter. The way a supressor works is to allow the gases to expand before they are released. The lower the pressure of the gas when it goes to the atmosphere then the quieter the shot. Adding those valves doesn't change what pressure the gases vent at, therefore it wouldn't make any difference regarding noise. If anything it might seem louder to the shooter because the vents are closer to his ears than the muzzle is.
This.
It would also be much heavier than a normal suppressor, having to withstand the higher pressures by the design mechanism.
Still an interesting design OP, keep working at it maybe youll hit a breakthrough and well all be buying suppressors made by some Jow Forumsommando faggit.
Making suppressors quieter is no secret:
-make them bigger
-add wipes
The part I find interesting is this would allow for a shorter suppressor since you can redirect the gas wherever you want.
>-add wipes
Probably a more practical solution than having to properly time some sort of gate on the end of a suppressor while accomplishing the same goal of limiting gas flow outside of the device. Still a cool idea, OP.
OP I like your design. Taking what said into account, you could use that little gate to redirect gas to another port or something to give gas more time to cool down. maybe when the port closes, it opens a different, longer, path for the gas to escape.
I see, perhaps using this to redirect the gasses to more chambers would work then (assuming it could be built/work for multiple shots ofc)
thanks man. I don't really have any (mechanical) engineering experience so I didn't expect this to be taken too seriously
Yes I will go back to mspaint and return with better thing
Duh no shit, but that isnt to say there arent methods nobody has thought of yet.
Dont be so quick to shit on a idea, its usually better to see how someone can make it pan out.
Ok experimental suppressor concept thread? The purpose of the can is to allow gas to expand and cool before being released. Right? Why not flood the can with CO2 to cool and extinguish?
powder has its own oxidiser, you cant extinguish it, it will fire in a vaccuum
In theory you could achieve a similar effect using a plasma window, but with current technology the suppressor would be a lot bigger than the gun. Maybe in a hundred years.
What's a plasma window
Add a wastegate from a turbo charger to redirect gasses, use the vacumn created by the gases propelled early in the suprressor to actuate the valve to redirect to atmosphere vented back towards shooter
In theory if you had a very conductive suppressor body with a water jacket around it then you would cool the gasses while sealed in the can (never mind how impossible sealing the can after the bullet leaves but before the gas does is) and thus lower pressure inside the can.
Come to think of it a supressor with a water jacket wouldn't be the worst idea ever. Those things get toasty fast. It'd be heavy and hard to seal though.
Would need to seal the closing mechanism so it doesn't get fouled too much. Also, wouldn't the gasses immediately behind the bullet be the most pressurized and thus the ones you need to get rid of the most? There's no way it could shut fast enough to let the bullet go but stop the gas.
Cool idea though, user.
CO2 despite being cold is dogshit for cooling. A can filled with a wet sponge with a hole in it will cool the gas better than any off the shelf suppressor will simply because of the heat capacity of water, but it won't capture the escaping gases.
>experimental suppressor concept thread
Please.
I have an idea that I want to form 1 and build. Suppressor is extra long with the muzzle threads in the center, slides over barrel and extends rearwards as far as possible, giving more room for baffles and gas to expand.
Device that creates a thin film of plasma across a cylinder. Anything with sufficient mass (like a bullet) can break through easily, but the "window" will instantly reform and block the gas from leaving since plasma is much more viscous than regular air, and can be held by magnets
They're called reflex suppressors
Are radiator fins practical for suppressors? You could combine them with a water jacket.
that's really cool but probably not worth the cost
>but that isnt to say there arent methods nobody has thought of yet.
If you understand the underlying physics you will realize that there are no magic bullets here.
>I have a new idea for this well known and utilized concept
OP back with better concept from thread ideas. This one seems viable if the moving parts could hold up.
The parts in the back would be a single cylinder that slides back against a spring I suppose
Neat, I had no idea. Still want to build my own though, I really want a diy integrally suppressed upper.
>>Expand and cool
Just expand. Temperature doesn't matter; the goal is to allow the gases to expand as much as possible so that the pressure is as low as possible when the bullet exists the supressor.
>>why not add CO2
counterproductive. You want LESS pressure, you don't want to be injecting more gas in there.
That works well, and has been done. The more volume in the supressor the better.
Finally, over 100 years later it is time to combine Hiram Maxim's two greatest inventions to create the silenced water-cooled machine gun.
The biggest problem is what trips the front door to close when the bullet passes it?
You could add radiator fins to a supressor, but what would be the purpose of doing that? It wouldn't make it any quieter, it would just be added bulk for no reason.
For some reason you're hung up on "cooling". Stop that. Worry about lowering pressure, not temperature.
That's basically the working principle of a wipe, except they still leave a bullet sized hole. It's a stupid idea, but maybe if the wipe was scored like the lid of a drink cup there's a chance it will close back up without the bullet punching a hole in it if the wipe is strong/elastic enough.
That's better, some more baffles or a spiral ring in the outer part might help by slowing down the gas from exiting and making it take the longest path possible.
I like the gas piston thing for the vents but you're still better off relying on a wipe or similar at the front rather than trying to have a mechanism that closes behind the bullet.
thats almost exactly what i meant.
I think you'd have better luck with the single gate at the end, but open the secondary channel as the round exits. maybe have it vent out the side, but toward the muzzle to act like a compensator
Just make the whole thing bigger.
The "valves" you have in that design accomplish nothing.
The gas pressure dude. It would need a spring to hold it open I think.
I saw a pretty cool build back when I was looking at different integral designs.
A guy took a bull barrel, drilled large like 1" holes through the barrel, made a sleeve to cover the barrel, and then turned the barrel to make it reflex aswell. It was fucking cool.
m.imgur.com
Are you absolutely sure that heat isn't related to expanding gas user?
>Worry about lowering pressure, not temperature.
>he failed thermodynamics in school
Wipes *do* close back up, at least for the first few shots. Then they lose their effectiveness.
user, you do know the gas is faster than the bullet right? It will seal far before the bullet even leaves the barrel though.
Neat, that's similar to how the mp5sd works. From what I read it's tuned so that you can feed it normal supersonic ammo and it comes out subsonic.
But the idea of the plasma one is that it will re-seal in literally nanoseconds, and then maybe there's some circuit that tells it to turn off when the suppressor has done its job.
I don't think there's a material elastic enough to bounce back after being shot at quite literally point-blank, at least not enough to be considered reusable
Of course they are related, but it seems that everyone here has ignored expansion volume and is concentrated on temperature for some reason. That's silly. Yeah, if you cool gases the pressure decreases, but the effect is minuscule compared to adding volume.
gas pressure
Well a wipe isn't really a gas seal which is what would be most appealing about this I think (+ idk if there would be enough pressure left to open the gates
good idea
gives more time for the gas to cool, no?
It's not a blueprint lol, I think the timing could be worked out in practice
>>An elaborate Liquid CO2 injection system makes more sense than making the can 10% bigger
You can take the hard road if you like, but I'll stick with the easy one.
The concept sounds good in theory but doesn't work as well as you'd think.
ar15.com
Cans do get hot after multiple shots. Sure it won't help with noise level, but it would still be nice if you could just put it back in a box after a mag dump.
>gives more time for the gas to cool, no?
So does making the can bigger. Except that method does so without introducing extra complexity.
If you're just worried about touching the can, why not use an insulating wrap instead of heat sink fins?
>minuscule compared to adding volume
Not really compare running a can wet vs a slightly larger can. Unless you add a large amount of volume, which adds weight and obviously size.
Just something to consider, as the air in the barrel being pushed in front of the bullet will activate your gate in this design. If you could figure out how to time it, it would be significantly quieter.
>>wet can
Water is a different story. It has an unusually high specific heat capacity so it is very effective in this regard. Even then it only gives you a few dB. Adding that external "jacket" with valves will be nowhere close to as effective as running a can wet.
>Unless you add a large amount of volume, which adds weight and obviously size.
I'm saying that OP's can will work better if he deletes the valves and the external jacket and simply makes a normal can of the same exterior dimensions.
Who said anything about practicality?
OP asked if there was something to his idea or if he was being a retard. The answer is that he's being a retard.
Thank u finally
>finally
I told you the problems with your idea in the 2nd reply in the thread.
Yeah and you were right so I sorta figured we were talking about impractical but cool shit now.
are you telling me there's no difference between a suppressor that lets all the gasses escape immediately vs one that reroutes them and forces them to stay contained longer?
You have to add roughly 2 inches behind the muzzle to get the reduction of a 1 inch longer suppressor in front of the muzzle.
Even if they're about as easy to aim because the weight of the 2 inches is closer to your body, you've made the whole gun heavier for slung carry.
Plus you're restricted in barrel profile and handguard length.
Reflex suppressors are obsolete.
patent panting
It's been done.
German article, partial translation at: reddit.com
Wow nice, thanks!
>I don't really have any (mechanical) engineering experience
that much was obvious
why would you need a gate why wouldn’t you just have a larger volume always
>Temperature doesn't matter
>what is the ideal gas law
where the hell is all that built up pressure going to go
If you have the time and are bored, go to your nearest patent search site and look up suppressors. There is a lot of stuff on there, most of it is variations of the standard k and m baffle designs, but there is some wacky stuff.
>The way a supressor works is to allow the gases to expand
The important thing is spreading the release of gas, and therefore the sound, over a longer period of time. An expansion chamber is just the most practical way to achieve that.
That's some good advice, I'll search and post anything neato I see.
A device that removes the "first round pop" from suppressors by flooding the interior with an inert gas.
I'm not completely sure, but I think this is describing a suppressor that is, aside from the central bore, filled with a porous material, like expanded metal foam.
Fuck I'm retarded. Not metal foam, that isn't really very porous. You guys get what I mean though, something with many small holes and cavities for the gas to flow through, spongelike.
This is similar to what I want to DIY and form1. Integrated barrel/reflex suppressor.
This is interesting. A suppressor that attaches directly to the rails instead of the barrel, so you can keep whatever muzzle device you want attached.
Frankford Arsenal tested an interesting suppressor made from a sort of metal foam way back in the '60s. See page 31 in this report:
militarynewbie.com
The gas pressure is the same on every face of that seal.
would you mind posting whatever document you're reading this from?
I want that schematic.
Try this link
patft.uspto.gov
It's a mess but it should work.
For the .pdf (with the image) you click on the button on the top that says images.
Thanks brother
Then why do modern -86 C freezers have setups for dispensing liquid C02 into them in the event of a power outage?
How2makegudsuppress
1. Use a bullpup
2. With the extra free length use a really huge suppressor
different guy, but wouldn't a stupid amount of surface area help with heat distribution and "wicking" for lack of the proper word.
But why not just fill the extra space taken up by the fins with more suppressor at that point?
Because water doesn't work at that temperature and they would have to add a shit ton of it to even have a cooling effect you dumb nigger. Your other choices are liquid nitrogen and helium, which are even worse at cooling but are the only fluids that can even get to cryogenic temperatures.
Different functions. More suppressor will help with the noise level, but more fins will help prevent the suppressor from becoming red hot. It's not very practical, which is why you don't really see fins on the market.
>For some reason you're hung up on "cooling".
Have you ever used a suppressor?
How about a suppressor with small thin compartments for water or some kind of liquid to keep the suppressor wet? The containers are watertight but not airtight, so as the suppressor heats up the liquid turns to gas and spreads about.