Determinism is fucking with my mind and making me depressed...

Determinism is fucking with my mind and making me depressed, it was determined that I'd learn about it and struggle to care about my life as a result but it still fucking sucks.

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determinism is what exists without any sort of notion of the divinity in your life
there actually is a God though

I actually feel better now due to a sense of superiority enveloping me after reading your post. Thanks, user, your mindless sheep-like devotion to your fictional sky papa made me a little happy. Truly the work of Jayzuz.

Your words are powerless because you have no proper moral foundation. It is not on me to judge you, but life itself will find it's way to you, and you will suffer until you yield. You are what we call an energy vampire, and this is a well-known behaviour affliction that feeds off of somebody's reaction. When one can see the truth, one knows it to be something that only broken people use as a strategy for survival. It is you who is unconscious, whether you admit it or not.

It's not just life that will find a way with me, it's all preceding events. Looking back, this state of depression I'm in, even being a fucking asshole to you, isn't new. When I was 6 I cried and became dejected pretty often, when I was 10 I tried to kill myself with a butterknife(lol) and when I was 5 I punched a girl for trying to use the same computer I was. I'm a depressive and I'm an asshole, it isn't just determinism, or life or my lack of a moral foundation, it's just how I am.

Energy vampire is also a good description but that trait probably manifested when I started connecting the anonymity of the internet with the freedom to be an asshole.

>When one can see the truth, one knows it to be something that only broken people use as a strategy for survival. It is you who is unconscious, whether you admit it or not.
You're not wrong, this is probably a way of coping, as well as a manifestation of my nature. I'm pretty conscious though, and honestly, so are you, you've just found a different strategy, probably a better one.

Define determinism, I'm not familiar with the concept

no. the strategy i adopt is seeing the truth. yours is nothing but groundless falsehood.

Events in the past determine the present and the future, it's pretty tame until you realize it means that your actions too are determined and that there is no will.

If you took seriously after reading the post you just replied to then your methods of obtaining the truth need reexamining.

hahaha no his post is a bunch of self-conscious garbage. it's so fucking obvious and if you can't see that then that's due to your inability to do so

You have a knack for saying a lot of nothing, yourself, user.

I don't believe that. I think "life always finds a way" and that you can easily change the future with a few steps. I regularly have a choice to do something that will benefit my future or something that will stunt it, when I make that conscious choice I believe change is made whether it's short term or long term

i don't care what you think at all and nobody in this thread has shown me that they know anything. you try to prove me wrong when i make no claims, so everything you are saying is based on a fallacious premise. i have no respect for your opinion so any continued contact is pointless so you should stop

At this late hour you're unlikely to get much good discussion on such a complex philosophical topic. Try doing this like 12 hours from now and I bet you'd get much better results.

I find that when I want to talk about deep stuff on Jow Forums, the late afternoon on weekends works well. Late nights...eh. You get a very low level of discussion usually. There are exceptions; I'm just talking generally.

>you try to prove me wrong when i make no claims
How is "You have a knack for saying a lot of nothing, yourself, user." not an appropriate response then?

look up solipsism

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How do you know that you're changing the future and not just acting in the way you were determined to act and thus cause the events that were determined to take place as a result?

i have nothing to prove to you. my existence is better served ignoring you entirely. you are not entitled to my attention nor to my energy. go away.

you guys are so retarded.

Before you go, what did you mean by "determinism is what exists without any sort of notion of the divinity in your life"?

How can X -> Y not exist in my life if I incorporate divinity in it? I should've asked that instead of being shitpost-y but again, I'm still the energy vampire you've labeled me as.

>Determinism

You control what you can

The rest you learn to embrace it

Listen to life and it will guide you to the right place

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it is pretty stupid not to believe in freewill, the science on a quantum lvl supports it anyways. and it is so absurd to think otherwise

What can you control?

is that professor Isaac Kleiner ?

A probabilistic universe leaves as little room for free will as a deterministic one would.

divinity is what gives you free choice to rise above determinism. then life becomes infinite. you can choose the better path

A modern Mona Lisa

It's the best picture I have saved.

Your argument is stupid. Just because random stuff happens at a subatomic level doesnt mean you have any more control.

Spirituality is interesting because it introduces a different kind of essence into the mix. If a bowling ball is headed toward pins and you live in a material monistic universe, the ball will hit assuming some material force doesnt stop it. However, if you live in a universe with a different kind of essence like soul or mind-power wackiness then you can have an influence that is outside of the normal causal chain and make the ball stop even if no material object stops it.

Can people make choices outside of causal chains? Well if they have a spirit than hypothetically they would at least have the possibility, but they still probably couldnt because their choices would still be influenced by preceding events.

Of all the shit Ive read trying to convince myself free will is real the only arguments Ive found is that determinism makes things morally confusing and free will is a much better practical belief. Thats all your going to get. People will appeal to science(or religion) they dont understand or make things emotional to appeal to some feeling but its all smoke and mirrors. Wether you give up logical continuity for moral relief is up to you.

youre insufferable but essentially correct

I still keep fighting against my fate and I keep losing every time. This one fucking girl I knew and was going for, the very day of her birthday when I bought her flowers, has met a guy. Shortly after they're in a relationship. The guy is a fucking basedboy too and much less attractive than me.

You're an unoriginal brainlet

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>and much less attractive than me.
Clearly not.

Objectively less attractive. She found him more attractive I suppose.

>Determinism
hello friend where is the evidence

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You chose to believe in determinism.

Nuh uh, it's muh chemicals

This man showed me the glaringly simple flaw in determinism. Everything that exists by definition exists in the universe. Ergo, there is nothing outside the universe that determines it. Free will exists.

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Alright pham let me choose not to, whoops I still believe in it. Really makes me think.
Everything in the universe is subject to either deterministic or probabilistic forces(depending on your interpretation of quantum physics). I could give examples of consciousness being affected through prior causes but you can do that yourself.

I don't see how this proves that free will exists but it does change things, will have to look more into it.

Every action has a reaction. We are all the results of other actions. Free will? I did not choose this brain or what its been exposed to. If I went back in time and had no new knowledge I would makevthe exact same decisions. How could I ever decide otherwise?

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I don't think Determinism says there's a conscious external factor that determines everything, it's just the descriptor of unconscious actions that are causally influenced which leads to the fact our minds are part of this chain. Though as far as I'm aware, Langan is a Christian that believes evolution was guided by God, so he obviously does believe in a prime mover anyway.

Determinism is the truth, sure. But if you do your best then you're "fulfilling your destiny". Doing your best would effectively be confirming, "nice! my prescribed story line is a good one!" it's a mind fuck and i can't get into it further without getting a migraine.

Antidepressants work

if this is about free will, they can easily coexist

to take the definition of free will from wikipedia "Free will is the ability to choose between different possible courses of action unimpeded."

look at your "free will" as an algorithm, it (you) chooses what to do but it does that based upon information that it gets and its internal variables (emotions). it will allways produce the same output with the same imputs, but it chooses to produce that result.

>there actually is a God though

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DETERMINISM SIMPLY MEANS CAUSE AND EFFECT. IT DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE INCAPABLE OF SEEING THE EFFECT OF YOUR OWN ACTIONS AND CHANGING.

Langan is a genius. Even though he's not exactly the best at formulating what he thinks, the essences are philosophically perfect.