How come women don't really understand the disparity between how much men desire them...

I feel like it would factor into how they comport themselves toward other human beings. For example, if you realize you're getting phony praise and phony niceness a lot of the time, you should be more suspicious toward the people who do that, because they're bad people. Also, you should reevaluate how much of your social success might have been a result of sycophants making things systemically easier by subtly kissing your ass all the time. If I were a woman and I realized how men generally treat women, I would be shocked and devastated, like I'd been lied to my whole life. To take a similar example, if I were some minority, and after getting an award I found out the committee had been staffed by kiss-ass liberals who were patting themselves on the back for awarding a poor downtrodden minority, the accomplishment would be cheapened.

Women either don't seem to really understand it, or they don't care.

Please refer to this post:

Goodnightmoon is great

Well I'm ugly and women just say "good riddance" when I show no interest. No woman ever approaches or goes after me. Not even ugly girls

>Women either don't seem to really understand it, or they don't care.
99% really don't care as long as they keep getting the minority awards

They do understand the disparity, but most of them don't exploit it, because there are risks involved with doing that, and because some of them actually have a moral conscience.

>90% of the men they interact with are borderline in love with them
Just you, dude.

You have autism and you are a incel virgin.
Kys you worthless pos

That is fucked up. I am no looker but even I have managed to have a relationship usually a month after the last one. I am not even hung or ripped.

I do not know. I wish I could help you out. Wingman or have some solid advice but I do not. I basically just skim by on being lazy and not picky.
You could try the personality thing. I dated 2 or 3 girls from online but never once had me as my profile picture. I just got lucky.

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Nothing wrong with being a virgin or an incel (as long as you don't identify as that). Being an orbiter, on the other hand, deserves the death penalty.

Quite a few men act desperate and like they love them when the woman is good looking. I talk to a few and they show me their messages and texts. I always thought guys acting so clingy and sending dick pics so much as being a meme. Makes sense why attractive chicks do not want to give most average guys the time of day. If they gotta deal with that shit he mine as well be worth it.

That makes me really sad. It's such a bad thing for a person's agency. There's a good quote, "the soft prejudice of low expectations."

>Just you, dude.

This is a good example of the systemic sycophancy I mean. Everyone is so obsessed with "the ability to get women," "being cool enough to get women," as the major source of value as a man. So whenever men criticize women, other men jump on it as an opportunity to show how pro-woman they are and how they'd NEVER say anything like that, milady! Or if you candidly disclose how men fixate on women, some man will go "Heh, not me. I'm cool. That's just you, bud. You seem real immature. (Implicitly, I'm not immature. I'm very mature. Please, if any women read this, please date me.)"

This constant peacocking and preening is, partly at least, exactly what I mean. Men are bending over backwards to show how acceptable they are to women, if only a woman would design grace them with her divine presence. They aren't even doing it consciously, either. They INSTINCTIVELY want to propitiate women, and push aside "rival suitors" who criticize women. It's pathetic. Same basic thing in this post: but was a more interesting and subtle example of the sycophancy behavior.

Yeah I kinda thought those were welcomed traits to R9K. This board has become baby /b/

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You probably are attractive and interesting and just have low self-esteem as having gfs practically on tap is not something most men experience. I personally have high self-esteem and am delusional, but I still know reality because of what happens to me.

Your assertion is stupid, 90% of men arent borderline in love with every average women they encounter, thats just desperate robots at the bottom of the social foods chain. Sure a lot of men want to fuck physically attractive women but to say that they fall in love with every attractive woman is an exaggeration, its probably one you dont understand because you would probably settle for anything at this point. Women know they have a sexual advantage in the dating game, but most look for ltr opportunities. They don't just wanna be used for sex, although they may fall in that trap a lot. So it's not as easy as you may think for women to just "exploit" their advantage.

these last couple years really have taken a massive toll on the board climate here.

Maybe, I do not know what the normal is. I stay mostly shut in aside from internet social interactions. Helps me not go insane.

The joys of being a kid raised by video games. Totally out of touch with society.

>Your assertion is stupid,
I was going to explain hyperbole to you but you got it a few sentences later:
>... is an exaggeration,

I should add, "for rhetorical or comic effect." The rest of your post is rambling garbage so I ignored it.

Yeah, I've seen guys act clingy and desperately. I myself used to be one of them. However, there is a difference between that and "being in love with a woman you've just seen, just because she is hot". Maybe OP is just confusing sexual attraction with love.

When, exactly, did I defend a woman or women in general in this thread? When exactly did OP attack women in general? Do you have some sort of psychosis or something?

It has been a smack in the face. I come back to Jow Forums every couple years and it is weird watching the boards all change. /o/ has basically stayed the same but everyone else went further into the shit. Even /soc/ has went down and it was never good to begin with. I also notice most the women who posted left and men have become way more common place.

>i have no response to the rest of your post because i lack social intelligence

Oh sorry I didn't know you were "baiting" me there with your superior intellect. Clarify to me what exactly you are arguing without the sarcastic hyperbole so a simpleton like myself can understand.

If you have that many gfs you aren't out of touch with society at all dude. If people actually want to get to know you and go out of their way to be around you. You got no idea what being a social misfit is like. You're like a woman.

Normification kills everything. Normies' primary social instinct is to go around finding things that are "less normal," people that stand out because of difference or weirdness, and then assert and prove their own normalcy by smashing those people down. It's the main function their brain runs on. They poison communities by burdening them with that boundary-policing, normalcy-policing impulse in aggregate.

Why are you responding to an explanation of x with "What is x?"

You just worded it badly. Its not that most men fall in love with every attractive girl, its that we would fuck most woman who are anywhere from average to hot.

The disparity is that most men would fuck most woman, while most woman would only fuck a minority of men.

That's not what I am doing, and you know it.
Kill yourself.

>/o/ has basically stayed the same
seriously best board on the site by far, as it has been for years. so comfy.

I agree that it is a smack in the face though. I remember coming here 5 years ago and it was so different that I wouldn't even be able to explain it to a newfag. Most people here probably simply think of this board as what some use to think of /b/ as. Ridiculous. I mean hell I haven't been able to go on /b/ in like 10 years because the cancer got so cancerous that it wasn't even ironic anymore just sad.

You should have expressed yourself better. The disparity can get solved if guys can rise above their impulses and stop orbiting.

Well, the underlying point (that everyone but you seems to have gotten) is that many men act like pathetic little bitches when they are attracted to a woman.

For example, my girlfriend works at a mall kiosk store frequented by commuters. She is constantly hit on, talked up, propositioned, and generally harassed by men of all ages. She says these men are not trying to fuck her, generally, but that they just get like a deer in headlights when they talk to a pretty girl. She said it's fairly common for men to linger and think they should just keep talking to her for half an hour because she's nice to them. Men are dumb when it comes to women. As you say in this post, men "orbit." That was the entire point. I'm glad we agree.

>mobileposting
>bothering to post "Nuh-uh!"

Well, there's one hypothesis confirmed. Hope you enjoy your brief vacation on this board before heading back to watch more Youtube fashion vlogs or whatever.

>The disparity can get solved if guys can rise above their impulses and stop orbiting.

Not necessarily. Woman have innate higher sexual market value than men, woman will always have the advantage in a sexually liberated society. Betas not orbiting would only cut into the free attention and money woman get for having vaginas.

why haven't you stopped giving a fuck? women don't care about you, stop caring about them.

I'm not even mobileposting, so actually my hypothesis has been proven. You're a fucking schizo.

>If you're ugly and ignore women you'll just be alone
This. Your life isnt anime where one day some girl will be interested in you.

The direct consequence of men not orbiting would be the lowering of women's internally perceived value. This would equalize things, and make men worry much less about getting into relationships or having sex. They would just live their lives until they find someone they actually like.

Which is why orbiters should be genocided.

I am not a schizo, your shitposting just normally goes unnoticed and this is the first time someone has bothered to persistently explain to you why your contentless posts are bad. You are actually agitated over it.

There is a high threshold for white noise on this website by necessity. Your "I'll just say whatever floats into my normie brain and is vaguely kinda-sorta related to the thing I'm replying to"-level posts normally coast well below that threshold, as people see them while scrolling, think "???" for a split second, and pass over you in order to reply to someone with actual content who is on-topic. I'm just trying to help you out here. Imagine what life could be like if you stayed persistently above the threshold, and you were actually communicating with your fellow human beings instead of shouting semi-related solipsistic normie platitudes into a void. All it requires on your part is real effort and engagement.

Or you can stay on Facebook where posting "Haha" gets you a "thumbs-up" from some guy you knew in high school.

The guys who orbit and bend themselves backwards for women don't usually succeed, at least not with attractive or secure women. My current gf broke up with her last two exs because they always kissed her ass and she saw it as non-genuine behavior.

Not that guy, but I think you were intended as an example of the other phenomenon - the guy who has to broadcast, at every possible opportunity, that he's too cool to ever get a crush.

>NAH BRAH. BITCHES, I TAKE 'EM OR LEAVE 'EM. THAT'S JUST ME THO, BRAH!
>(tee hee I just made sure everyone knows I'm on top of the principle of least interest tee hee)

Fucking PLEASE, nigger.

>insuslts user
>gets surprised when user gets mad

It was a bad example, and is delusional.

I'm below average and have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. Girls don't show any signs of wanting to know me, no matter what they look like.

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Exactly. Not only does it increase women's internally perceived value, but it doesn't even work out for them. It's an activity that only has negative consequences for all men, and should be erradicated.

If I ever had a kid, I would teach him not to orbit. but I would need to reproduce in order to have a kid, and that's not gonna happen

Yup, dead on.

Now that it's 2 to 1, and you're just repeating yourself, I will give you the last repetition of "Yeah whatever man, you're delusional dude" out of courtesy and otherwise stop replying to you until you post something with content.

>She is constantly hit on, talked up, propositioned, and generally harassed by men of all ages.

>She says these men are not trying to fuck her, generally, but that they just get like a deer in headlights when they talk to a pretty girl. She said it's fairly common for men to linger and think they should just keep talking to her for half an hour because she's nice to them.

This is kind of a disturbing post, dude. Because you seem to think that the second block I quoted is a mere repetition of the first block, and it really isn't.

"Talking to a pretty girl like you're a deer in the headlights" is not equal to, or even anything like, propositioning or harassment.

If you act dellusional, inventing big conspiracies and accusing people of doing things without any basis, do you expect a different response?

>200,000 BC
>beta male stops "orbiting"
>alpha male bashes his head in for not taking care of his harem for him
And now you know why orbiting exists and realize how retarded you sound by saying 80% of men should be genocided.

IF you look unfriendly, most people won't want to talk to you. Trust me, I look very unfriendly, so I end up having to be the one to approach. It suits me well, because I find the whole affair of interacting with people I don't get along with to be a torturous thing.

It's true. Jow Forums has become over run with redditors and Normies who want to "be different" but really just normalize everything. I wonder where the real outsiders have congregated to.

Do you actually believe the shit you say, or do you just shitpost for the kicks?

The ones who explicitly proposition and harass her (often married men in town on business) are not in the group of men who are generally just annoying. Though the annoying behaviour can lapse into harassment easily, and that's part of the overall orbiting behaviour as well, the fuzzy boundary between "gee golly you sure are nice ma'am I'd like to just stand here telling you you're nice some more" and being "creepy." Overall, shitty behaviour from men seems to be on a gradient, and to have in common that men fundamentally just worship women, as a baseline.

But yeah, I should have better distinguished the two.

Well, the important thing you've posted in a thread for a few minutes short of an hour and you've said precisely nothing other than "nah!" the entire time. I bet you're real popular with the ladies. Get out much?

The problem with this incel bullshit is that its a lie. A lie weak men use to explain away their cowardice. Just be honest with yourself. If the waifu you wanna bang doesnt have any interest in you then just move the fuck on. You are not in a damn prison. I bet most of that incel crowd hasnt given a moments thought to what they would do with a QT3.14 after having sex. More than likely they would ask her to leave and then return to scouring the deep web for video game nude patches. Nothing can help these guys. I know a few.

>bruh just move on brah! be alpha like me, your problem is you're WEAK and uncool, I bet if you even got laid like me you would download a video game or something LOL like FROGGER

peak normie, good satire post

I was thinking of posting a grug meme but realized I didn't have any so I made an evo psych post, it sounded like a good idea in my mind.
I'm not the dude you were replying to, that was my first post in the thread.

I agree, it is the white knights and orbiters that contribute to the value of pussy being much higher than dick. But at the same time I'm kinda glad these guys exist because you can learn from it and become better than them. You can raise your own value as a man significantly by just not being one of these guys and women respond to it well.

He's right though. You just sounded asshurt in that post.

He's right tho. I'm 21 and never had sex or had a gf. Can you tell me what he said that was wrong?

I don't think its lies, they are pretty spot on about female nature and what they like. Incels just need to find something else to pursue other than woman everybody is not cut out to fuck for free.

>people shitting on white knights and orbiters

lol women have you all so brainwashed with their pussys that you default blame other men for the shitty things about women.

Indeed. I just wish this sort of stuff was actually taught. Our fathers never explained this shit to us, and our friends who can get laid don't do it either.

Incels are not wrong at all. "Moving on" isn't going to help when not a single woman on the planet finds you attractive

He's right in critiquing incel defeatism and fixation, but a lot of that comes from lack of experience and from isolation, which obviously retards their perspective and makes their problems ingrown and more fucked up. What's the cause for that isolation and ostracism? Having a hypergamous society in the first place, with a shattered family, no long term stability for over 60%-70% of relationships, no incentives for women to settle down until after they're used up, etc.

It's a larger problem than "MAN UP DUDE." Obviously manning up is good, but something is rotten at a larger scale.

You're a liar. If you knew incels, your social status would plummet, as people who see you with the losers would assume you're a loser yourself.

>Heh, I've proven his anecdote wrong, now it's time to see what he'll come up with!

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The weird people are still here, we're just in boards or threads that are seen as weird or niche.
Just go where there are things you like and find the remaining good parts.

youtube.com/watch?v=KBgcjtE0xrE#t=3m09s

this video covers it well. anything a woman does is somehow secretly a man's fault

Incel defeatism is just them being realistic about the situation. Dating for subpar males is a game best left never played

this post is a good example of some retarded strawmanning and strawgrasping

>He's right in critiquing incel defeatism and fixation, but a lot of that comes from lack of experience and from isolation, which obviously retards their perspective and makes their problems ingrown and more fucked up.
Yeah.

>What's the cause for that isolation and ostracism? Having a hypergamous society in the first place, with a shattered family, no long term stability for over 60%-70% of relationships, no incentives for women to settle down until after they're used up, etc.
Oh shit, nigga, what are you doing? Do you actually buy into the hypergamy meme?

>manning up is good
Depends on what you mean by it. The "stop orbiting" and "focus on yourself" part of MGTOW is good. The "and then fuck lots of chick just to prove that you can" is just infantile.

Shut the fuck up dude. If you are regularly getting real life girlfriends that means you are not some shut in who is out of touch with society. I bet a dollar you have a social circle you regularly associate yourself with.

>Incels are not wrong at all. "Moving on" isn't going to help when not a single woman on the planet finds you attractive

I think that poster is combining two distinct "beta flavors" into one identity.

The beta orbiter who won't pursue any other women because he wants only his oneitis waifu is not the same guy as the incel who has gone into hiding because all women (in his experience) find him disgusting.

They share some traits and will generally both pile on in woman hate threads, but they also have dramatic differences and you can't address both groups with the same advice.

the outside, dingus. places that they don't want to mention because they're tired of getting shoved out, and/or just still here but on the edges.

Holy shit the amount of projection and assumption and
>i'm right because i know i am and you can't convince me otherwise!
schizophrenia in your posts user.
Take your meds and lurk moar please.

>the hypergamy meme?

ftp.iza.org/dp4456.pdf
Genes, Legitimacy and Hypergamy: Another Look at the Economics of Marriage

>literature review, situating the paper within field consensus
This paper is related to the existing literature on marriage markets and on
how this institution affects human capital accumulation. Overall, this literature
has recognized that women are sellers in marriage markets either
because of the sexual division of labor (Becker (1973, 1974)) or because of
the role played by women in reproduction (Aiyagari et al. (2000), Edlund
(2006)).

>Do they at least understand that 90% of the men they interact with are borderline in love with them out of sheer physical attraction?

Nice projection dude

You shouldn't just "move on", you should radically change the way you relate to women and how you perceive them. You need to stop seeing them as possible partners, regardless of who they are. Focus on getting to know them. If you don't enjoy being with them when you have absolutely no second intentions with them, then they are not right for you, and you shouldn't even be their friend.

Don't post until you've been on the site for longer than a year

Hypergamy isn't a meme it's an objective fact about femal sexuality

keep in mind you're talking to a normalfag who probably thinks MGTOW guys are terrorists

Nigga, your paper has 72 pages. Can you honestly say that you don't know any women who have been faithful their entire lives to partners who earn less than them? How the fuck do lesbian relationships work in this model? Do they just cheat on each other all the time?

None of that matters either when you're so ugly women don't even want to speak to you. Because women judge all men as potential sexual partners from the moment they see you and mentally girl you into either "alpha male fuck" or "beta male bucks"

Lesbians have the highest rates of domestic abuse and cheating yes. It's double the hypergamy.

>makes factual assertion about something
>gets linked a paper contradicting that assertion
>"Well I mean, I don't READ things about that thing.. But anecdotally, I knew a woman who didn't do that!"

Uhh

>How the fuck do lesbian relationships work in this model?
There are no real lesbians. Women are heteroflexible by nature, and often effectively asexual for various reasons, so they can roleplay that they're lesbians. The vast majority of "lesbians" are asexual straight girls who get more stimulation from the attention they get for identifying as a lesbian than from getting eaten out by their "girlfriend."

jumping straight into appeals of seniority, nice.
is this the one where i tell you how long i've been here then you refuse to believe it and leave me ebin rekt with the standard
>LOL NEWFAG STOP PRETENDING LMAO
cause it's always the same and i've been having that exchange for some time now.
maybe instead you'll switch it up and tell me about how much i'm not a "robot", then i'll ask you for your definition and you'll either project some of what you are as a list or call me a newfag for not knowing your arbitrary list already.
no, wait, since this reply has gone on more than one sentence and i haven't called you a faggot yet you might be interested in telling me to go back to lereddit instead.

any of those sound good or do you want to do a different one? i'm up for whatever, just keep me posted.

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Who cares if they don't want to talk to you. I'm an engineering student. I haven't spoken to a woman besides my family in 2 years, and it hasn't affected my life. You need to stop caring about it. It will consume you. I know what it is like. I was like that too. Although I connected it to my personality, not to my looks.
How old are you, user? Things began to stabilise for me when I hit 20.

>tell someone to "lurk moar"
>get told to "lurk for a year"
>reply with a giant wall of text autistically melting down

Holy fuck, and you're calling other people schizo.

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I agree, the hypergamy meme is exaggerated. To me it seems that anecdotally I know more women who are faithful than "hypergamous" and it is the other side of the argument who are cherry picking examples of gold digging sluts who may actually be the exception.

goodnight moon is pretty much the only asmr youtuber i watch and she is my favourite

Women initiate divorce 70%+ of the time, user. They also let 0.1% of the men who proposition them on dating apps fuck them, while men will fuck anything that moves. OKCupid data shows that women rate 80% of men as "below average."

"Cherry picking" is not relevant when you have basic statistics. Women are selective about partners, and are more likely to be dissatisfied.

Cheating is another thing but hard to measure for obvious reasons. Also, women emotionally cheat FAR more than men.

I'm 23. I'd be okay if there weren't constant reminders of sex and relationships pretty much everywhere you look.

>men will fuck anything that moves.
Wait, let me reply to myself in the fashion of a tryhard cuck:

"Heh, not me. Only YOU do that. I have high standards because I'm alpha as fuck bro. Sounds like you need to man up a little and become cool like me."

Alright, but do you have any evidence that causally links it to hypergamy? Also, give me the sauce for those claims.

You can't expect me to read fucking 72 pages just to respond to you, user. If I did the same to you, would you honestly go out right now and spend at least an hour reading that shit, just to answer me?

>anecdotal
Your position is a generalisation. A single counter-example is enough to refute it.

inb4
>it's just the majority, not all!
Then why are you so concerned? Just be selective, and reject the ones who are hypergamous. You know as well as I do that non-hypergamous women exist. If you don't find any, then, by all means, go your own way. I am 100% in favour of not giving a fuck about women.

>There are no real lesbians
Do you also believe global warming isn't real and that there is a global jewish conspiracy?

cool, thanks for the reply user.

None of this is causal evidence for hypergamy.

>Women initiate divorce 70%+ of the time, user
Could be for literally any reason.

>Women are selective about partners
True, but does not confirm hypergamy. If anything, it confirms orbiting exists.

>do you have any evidence
>You can't expect me to read fucking 72 pages

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Here is an article about lesbian relations
thehomoarchy.com/lesbian-realtionships-are-significantly-less-stable-then-anyone-elses-why/

Orbiting IS PART OF hypergamy. The men orbiting the women want to fuck the women. The women say "no, I will only fuck men I actually want to fuck, not the fifty guys who sent me dick pictures this week."