Why Niko hated Dimitri Rascalov so much again?

Don't be so fucking dense, it's betrayal if Dimitri sets up a fucking meeting with an ambush in mind.

I forgot how good this game was, might have to go back and replay it

uh he sold him out to bulgarin? and kidnapped and i think tortured roman

>blames Niko for the death of the man he loved even though he didn't seem to have tried too hard to save him

What Dimitri could have done?
Mikhail killed the SON of another Russian mobster.
It was the mob decision to get rid of Mikhail.

You might want to try to argue that Dimitri could have called Niko and ordered him to ignore Mikhail's order.
But Mikhail explosive behavior and recklessness could very well made him get shot or be the aim of some paranoia delusion.
Basically Dimitri understood that Mikhail was out of control and that nothing could be done.
They were under police surveillance, and Milkhail wanted everyone and everything to be killed.

>>hates Niko so much for pulling the trigger (even though Dimitri himself said it had to be done) that he eats Niko out to the man that wants him dead

I don't think this is the case.
At the 35:15 mark dialogue, you can sense that it was a political decision.
Dimitri talks all the time about playing the game by its rules.
It makes no sense for him to side with Niko when he is a nobody, while Bulgarin is a mob boss.
It can be argued that protecting Niko could put Dimitri on trouble with Bulgarin, since its implied that Dimitri and Bulgarin are partners in criminal businesses.
We don't know if Bulgarin was part of the council that decided to get rid of Mikhail.
He probably was. And Dimitri could do nothing. We even listen him say that he defended Niko by arguing that he was a hired gun.

So either, Bulgarin was part of the council.
OR
Dimitri only learned about Bulgarin feud with Niko after the death of Mikhail.

>>if you take the deal at the end of the game, Dimitri sends some retarded hitman to take you out
>if you take the deal at the end of the game, Dimitri executes the mobster on the stairwell for zero reason

We are examining why they hate each other so much. The end of the game doesn't concern us.
If anything, we want to understand the end of the game actions. Are all of these justified?

Fuck man, I think its my autism.
In my mind it only makes sense to hate Bulgarin from Niko perspective

And from Dimitri perspective, I think he should feel neutral to Niko, since its Bulgarin that has a problem with him. It doens't make sense for Dimitri to hate Niko.

I don't know if makes sense for Niko to want Dimitri dead.

@13:00 - More on Mikhail's temper

Interesting dialogue at 13:40

About Vlad's death.

>Dimitri says he persuaded Mikhail to not kill Niko.

When you are about to kill Mikhail at the caberet club, Mikhail says that Dimitri wanted Niko dead.

One of them is lying.
From what we know about them both, its more likely that Dimitri was telling the truth.

If someone set you up to get killed, even if it wasn't personal then you'd still be pissed If that's not enough he then kidnaps your cousin and tries to kill you several more times, I think after that it's become a little personal no?

I don't really remember anything about Mikhail and how he plays into the story unforuntately becasue I played this game in like 2008 or whenever it came out

which is the cannon ending deal or revenge?

>even if it wasn't personal then you'd still be pissed If that's not enough he then kidnaps your cousin and tries to kill you several more times,

I want to examine if it makes sense for Dimitri to act like this. Its basically Bulgarin that has a problem with Niko.

Revenge 100%.
There is no deal after this text message.

Attached: asas.png (912x671, 405K)

>I want to examine if it makes sense for Dimitri to act like this. Its basically Bulgarin that has a problem with Niko.

Just to add a little bit on this

Mikhail made Dimitri terrified.
They were antitheses of one another.
Dimitri was calm and Mikhail agitated, he urged Mikhail to stop killing people so much all the time. Why he wants to get rid of Niko so much?

Niko is all about loyalty. That's brought up time and time again in the game. He never betrays anyone, and gets into all this trouble because he expects the same from others but they all end up betraying him eventually. That's like the central theme of the game.
With Torres, Bulgarin, Dmitri, Faustin, Roman, basically everyone I can think of, Niko loses his temper every time when he is even implied to be disloyal because he knows he isn't.

Dmitri uses that. He uses Niko to get rid of Faustin who's became impossible for him to control anymore, pretends to be his friend for as long as Niko is useful, and then sells him down the creek as soon as Niko has fulfilled his purpose. You're right in that it's Bulgarin who has a personal grudge (even if unfounded) with Niko, but Dmitri betrays Niko all the same just as he betrayed Faustin. He has absolutely no sense of loyalty, and that's the problem Niko has with him.
To Niko, loyalty is everything. To Dmitri, it means nothing. So to Dmitri, his betrayal of Niko was just business but to Niko it was personal. Niko is entirely right to want him dead.

>Niko is all about loyalty.
>That's brought up time and time again in the game. He never betrays anyone, and gets into all this trouble because he expects the same from others but they all end up betraying him eventually. That's like the central theme of the game.
With Torres, Bulgarin, Dmitri, Faustin, Roman, basically everyone I can think of, Niko loses his temper every time when he is even implied to be disloyal because he knows he isn't.

This is new information for me, I will to check it out.

>Dmitri uses that.

I think there is some controversy on Dimitri's character.

>Dmitri betrays Niko all the same just as he betrayed Faustin.

Its like Chess.
Dimitri doesn't have an option when it comes to not 'betraying' Faustin. Faustin own behavior has got him a bad reputation and other Russian mobsters want him dead because of the killing of Petrovic's son. You can even take into account the mission where he orders Niko to blow up a shop with a truck because the guy over there owed him money. Its this recklessness that Dimitri can't do anything about and the line of 'betraying' gets blurred.
Like Dimitri says at the bench, before sending Niko to kill Faustin.
"What do you do, when your only options are killing your best friend(The will of the other Russian mobsters) or getting killed (going against the will of the other mobsters and 'not betrying faustin').

He basically has no option.

This is very conspiracy theory, and I am almost positive this is not how people work. But could it be possible that Dimitri fucked with Faustin paranoia from time to time to take over the business?
Basically, keeps him paranoid until he gets the other mobsters to agree to get rid of him and legitimize his take over, like it happaned with the Petrovic's son deal.
This makes sense because then it justifies why Dimitri wanted him dead so bad after Mikhail's death. It would be because he was always like that, if it makes sense.

Man, I am not even finished

I feel like I could play this game again and scrutinize all lines of dialogue in the cutscenes uploaded to youtube.

I am convinced that either Dimitri was a 4d chess psychopath from the beginning

Or he was a more rational guy that makes sense until Rockstar fucks his motivations midway through, and it makes no sense for him to want Niko dead. For two reasons: Its not his personality, and not his fight.

FUCK
I am not even fishined.

yeah, Dmitri was clearly the more ruthless and intelligent of the duo with Faustin and played him from the shadows while pretending to be weak and indecisive. That's definitely my impression too.
It was all a game to him.

But Niko doesn't play these games and that's the source of the conflict he has with Dmitri and others. He refuses to play the 4d chess, and then takes it personally when the others always end up betraying him when the winds turn. Their characters are the opposites and neither can see the other's point of view, and that's why they don't get along.
If Dmitri was in Niko's shoes, he'd understand that it was only business and would readjust his dealings accordingly, adapt to the chaning situation. If Niko was in Dmitri's shoes, he'd have never betrayed himself in the first place. If Niko was in Dmitri's position, he would have found an option where Dmitri couldn't see one.
Both men are "in the right" if you look at it from their respective perspectives.

That's why I don't really think you can really say that either one was absolutely in the right. It isn't just a conflict of opinion but of their fundamental worldview and personalities, and there's no reconciling that.

Honestly, Dmitri is one of my all time favorite villains in video games. GTAIV as a whole is probably my favorite game of all time just because the characters are so good. That's why,
I think Rockstar didn't change his character midway or make him unrealistic at all. Pretty much the opposite: Dmitri is a complicated character, and the game doesn't explicitly reveal his true motivations or capabilities to you. You have to read into it. It's subtle, and that's good.

man, I don't even know what I'm replying to anymore.

>man, I don't even know what I'm replying to anymore.

Your post makes sense.
If Dmitri pretends to be weak and indecisive. This does justify a lot.

The line of interpretation where his character gets weird, only makes sense if you don't think he was manipulating Faustin.
Maybe there is some room for debate on this that only a replay of the game and careful examination of dialogue and cutscences can settle. I am not convinced 4d chess is something people do. And If Dimitri did manipulated Faustin, I don't think it was an active and deep manner. Another argument against 'rockstar fucking up his character' was that they put a lot of money and care into this.

About this post.
@1:05:00
Dimitri is running away from Niko and he says that he should have let Faustin kill him.
Which means that from what we know, Dimitri was telling the truth and Faustin was lying.
Just interesting.

I do think Dimitri was the more rational between the two, and for now, I do think it goes against his personality to want Niko dead so much(unless he was playing 4d chess since the beginning but this is controversial and weird to want niko dead), and I think he was afraid of Faustin, and because of this he treads carefully to not be a target of his temper, so the room of manipulation was small if any. If there was any manipulation, it probably was not interfering with the killing of Petrovik and let it happen to take over, because Faustin already had a rep of being short tempered and he risked letting this happen with hopes of taking over.But again, 4chess is conspiracy theory.

If we can trust Dimitri for being truthful, after you kill Lenny Petrovik, Dimitri calls and he seems scared about the consequences.
After you kill Faustin, he calls again, and he talks how we 'hopes that this will smooth things with everyone'. (he isn't sure and was taking a risk idk)
My post is the one not making sense lol

My interpretation was always that Dmitri wanted Faustin to send Niko to kill Petrovic, which would give him the excuse to get rid of Faustin using Niko and then dispose of Niko because he had no connections or real power. Dmitri wanted to get rid of Mikhail for a while now and Niko just happened to show up to take the blame. Everything else including the phone calls or conversations was just an act to get Niko to do his bidding. 4d chess, as you said.

But yeah, it's been a while since I played the game too so I'm not absolutely sure. You can read it either way. Like I said, that's the beauty in it.

GTA V confirmed that the revenge ending is the canon one

>Dimitri wants to get rid of Faustin because his behavior is causing trouble
>He keeps trying to reason with Faustin and fails everytime

In this dialogue
@15:30 - Surveillance dialogue and Petrovik son assassination
He warns Faustin about surveillance, which was caused by Faustin's recklessness.
>He was telling the truth about the surveillance. Faustin comes up with another irrational behavior(kill Lenny Petrovik) and Dimitri reasons that Lenny Petrovik is a useless nobody as he says, then Dimitri takes advantage of the situation by omission because he wants to gamble and get rid of Faustin.

Faustin agrees to kill Lenny Petrovik, because he is indeed a useless moron.
All the talk about him being the son of a figure head is to fuck with Niko's head and manipulate him into killing Faustin.
You are correct, all phone calls and conversations were an act.

>My interpretation was always that Dmitri wanted Faustin to send Niko to kill Petrovic
In conclusion, Dimitri never wanted this.
He only took advantage of the opportunity because Lenny Petrovik, was indeed a useless moron.

So he wants Niko dead because he doesn't want the truth to come out and get exposed for his lies, which would mean his own death if the mob ever thought he was behind Mikhail's death. This is why he wants Niko dead.

Dimitri is so good he even fooled me into creating this thread and I was thinking he was the good guy. He was good. Fuck.

>In conclusion, Dimitri never wanted this.
>He only took advantage of the opportunity because Lenny Petrovik, was indeed a useless moron.

fuck, i am not sure.
all deep does the rabbit hole goes

am retarded.

In other cut scenes, its confirmed that Lenny Petrovik is indeed the son of a figure head.

I am going to sleep desu. I have been awake for awhile. This Dimitri guy is driving me crazy, he is like quantum stuff. He simultaneously makes sense and he doesnt.

>pick deal ending
>kate breaks up with you anyway
i will never not be mad