No adonis belt

>no adonis belt
>abs stick out like a pouch

What did I do to deserve this nightmare, fit?

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lose more weight

Will losing weight somehow pull my ab muscles in a bit more?

Of course it would. You will continue to lose visceral fat.

is this physique achievable natty?

What this guy said, plus do your fucking vacuums and ab work, especially obliques.

Check yourself for APT (anterior pelvic tilt) dude

No, your transverse abdominus will. If you have visible, shredded abs, you've done damage to your transverse. You should never, ever, do ab-isolating exercises that cause the spine to bend. Your TA is a sheath that spreads over your entire gut, connects to your back, and keeps your gut tight and in form. Most retards ignore this and do their crunches and situps because they want the fast route to having a six pack. You need to work on your TA now and hope that you haven't done permanent damage.

What about hanging leg raise, ab wheels and planks?

Considering that my lower back is pretty arched I think this might be an issue as well

Leg raises, when you curl the entire spine, remove the focus from hip flexors. Planks naturally do it too and the ab wheel, with proper form, could do it too. Most people believe they're training abs when in fact is the hip flexors.
Do some of those tests for APT (thomas test, how much room to have for anterior/posterior hip tilting, etc) and take corrective measures.

I'm confused about the TA isolation. Isn't that the one below everything? I mean, yes, it can help to get everything tight but unsure how that be seen from outside.

How do you fix Apt. I've tried all the meme suggestions online but none work

No, the TA is over your entire abdominal region, and this is the problem with modern fitness programs. Ya didn't even know where it was, and I'm not taking a jab at you, but it's a sign of how bad the understanding of anatomy is in fitness forums. The TA keeps everything in place for the most part, in terms of developing a paunch gut and lower back problems, it's one of the most important muscles. You need your TA to be strong while maintaining a solid oblique build to actually use your AR's at all. The majority of weight being moved during "ab-isolating" exercises, are, as you said, done by the hip flexors, but also supported by the TA and back. Focusing on building your AR's is one of the dumbest fucking things for overall health and fitness. Literally an ego routine.
Nope, the previous poster made a case against those. You shouldn't be doing any ab-isolating exercises, at all. Your AR's will develop through proper posture and form, because that's what they were made to do. Just by doing compound lifts while maintaining a wide and tall form will activate them enough. You can and should work on your obliques, and I advise planks and side-planks with proper form just for isometric and balance reasons, but the majority of good abdominal presence is pronounced by a strong back, a strong TA, and healthy, long obliques. Side note: NEVER flex in with your abs. You should never, ever flex your abs inward or upward, you're cramping your ribcage doing that and putting way too much tilt in your hips/lumbar region with that flex.

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There are tons of videos on youtube on the topic and mostly are the same but i liked what scott herman and jeff cavaliere posted.
Focus on abs (like i said before) and glutes with hip thrusts and glute bridges.
Then, it's a posture change, you'll have to re train yourself to push your hips forward and engage your abs. All the time. Will take time and patience.

>dont do ab exercises
Is this bait ?
Also , wtf do you even mean by "You should never, ever flex your abs inward or upward, you're cramping your ribcage doing that and putting way too much tilt in your hips/lumbar region with that flex." ?

Are you retarded?
Ok let's put this in a simple way.

Do not overdo any exercise that causes a total muscular imbalance or your entire body.
People actually go out of their way to do ab exercises every week or multiple times a week.

This causes your posture to shift, it's mechanically and logically sound because the abs control very specific functions for controlling your posture.
If you're going to do this, you need to understand muscular-skeletal balancing better and compensate for overexercising.

You think you can just do some fucking squats, abs, and chest and not end up looking like a fucking freak?
The gyno dino body type is not a meme.

Ok . But what If I exercise Chest/Shoulders as much as back and do back extensions 3 times a week . Should I not incorporate hanging leg raises and dragon flag practice ? Bcz my abs are week and I want to be able to front lever . Also , you still didnt explain the "flex your abs inwards or upwards " thing

Weak *

So what exercises should be done with sit ups?

It's not bait, it's basic fitness. Your abs will pop if you have a strong lower back and low bodyfat, but you will hurt your lower back if you focus on your abs.
Like said, but I actually recommend avoiding any kind of ab-isolating exercise that requires forward-curve of the spine. That's a motion for stretching, not bearing weight. If you have popping abs, yet no Adonis belt, a sharp curve in your lower back, and garbage obliques, you've no doubt done your TA a massive damage and your posture will suffer in the long run. You might think you look super shredded because you have visible abs, but it's the equivalent of being a curl bro with no shoulders; you will snap your shit up. I'm waiting on a response from my gf as to whether or not I can post a picture of the improper an flex for you gay fags but it's pretty basic. Imagine a classic stomach vacuum, your entire gut, from your pelvis to your diaphragm, is sucked in, but the pressure is equally distributed through your back and you stand perfectly straight. This is a healthy flex "in", and is actually a sign of a healthy TA if your ribs are flared without pain. The bad flex "in", is where you tighten up the base of your ribcage, flex solely your abs up and away from your pelvis, and have to put pressure on your spine. The latter is the most common flex you see people using, and it's absolutely terrible for your posture and general alignments. It's also a good sign that you're more focused on LOOKING ripped, than you are BEING ripped.

Not that guy, I'm I'll name fag for 2 posts to straighten the line here. Dragon flags are great, I'm not a fan of hanging leg raises because they tilt your pelvis and again, cause you to flex in and up as I mentioned in the linked post. Stop asking if I think it's cool to do any kind of ab isolation that requires curving the spine dude, the answer is no. Squats, deadlifts, lateral raises, strict OHP, pushups, pullups, planks/side-planks, dragonflags, even jumping rope, are all exercises that are healthy for your ab development because they do not require you to bend your fucking spine. You need to work on your posture and form first. Your abs are critical in posture. Healthy posture is not based on holding weight in curved positions. You destroy your TA doing so, and your TA is 10x more important to a strong core than your AR's ever will be. There's no going around this dude, I'm not trying to be a dick but come the fuck on and just stop trying to bear weight in positions your body isn't meant to just because you want to fast-track yourself to an 8pack. You will have developed abs when the rest of your core is strong and you cut BF below 16%

Ok , I m not denying anything you are saying but , where do You get this information from ? Its the first time I hear it , thats why I thought it was bait . I know You shouldn be assymetrical and that you shouldnt do crunches but , leg raises ? Even people like athlean x , a well know and respected guy in the fitness community that says everything is bad for you , wouldnt say that about ab exercises like leg raises . Also asking bcz from what I see , leg raises are a progression for dragonflags .
Also , I think you have mistaken me for op

what the fuck is going on in this thread? adonis belts are mostly genetic and your abs sticking out just means you need to work on posture gains

Do you have anything to back that science up, bro?

This is just based on years of working in rehab and fitness centers. The number one cause to lower back issues in weightlifters are an obsession with working AR's and lack of proper posture development based on the neglect of their more important abdominal muscles. AR's are legitimately the weakest muscle group in your core, there's no real reason to work them outside of isometrics other than to boost your ego. They have a function, and that function is not to lift off the ground with your legs straight forward. If you want to practice that motion for general nervous response and flexible strength, do running high jumps. Repeatedly using them for reps and sets in that same position is only going to do damage, it should be a casual and reflexive movement supported by the rest of your body. That's literally what every other muscle in your core is for, and it's insane to me that even people like Jeff still haven't touched on this. Jeff is a healthy dude, and he knows what he's talking about for the most part, but that's one of the things that he's blatantly been wrong about and it's based in the belief that because you have abs, you should work them hard til they pop. I don't see people doing 400lb adductor splits even though it would give you massive quads, because it's generally accepted that your hips are not meant to bear weight in that direction. Yet, if enough people were obsessed with having massive outer quads, I bet there would be people arguing for it, and ignoring the fact that their hips are on the verge of collapsing. Same thing with your spine and abs.

How do I know if I have an interior pelvic tilt?

Why do you think Ronnie Coleman has back issues? Is it because he used damn near perfect form on all of his compound lifts, or is it because he isolated abs for aesthetic purposes? Pick one. This has always been general physiology, the only people who argue that ab isolation in flexion is healthy are broscience lifters and middle-aged women who hate their husbands. Sometimes you get the rare Jeff who is willing to ignore basic shit for the sake of what can be equated to "worthless" strength, but that's rare as fuck and sits for the namesake, solely for aesthetic purposes.
Adonis belts are largely influenced by the position of your pelvis and the interior muscles connected to your legs and spine. A strong lower back and healthy obliques will pull an Adonis belt on anybody, regardless of genetics. Unless they're some freak with 10 pyramidalis pairs.

Alright , but still waiting to see your pics on how to flex and not to flex abs

You are actually psychotic I think. Ronnie is fucked because he lifted insane amounts of weight and continued to do so after injuries and operations.

god i wish retards like you never were born, do you think that people just fucking implode their inner core muscles the moment they bend over to pick up something? stop being retarded, if you actually damage something it will hurt, a lot
stop going on r/fitness, stop using pubmed, post body, and start lifting
faggot

Kind of rule of thumb, but lay on your back on a flat surface, rolling your shoulders back but not cramping. You want your head, shoulders/upperback, butt, and arms/legs flat on the ground. If you have a buddy to look, you should see that there is no more than a finger or two's worth of space between your lower back right above you butt and floor. If there is, there are two things that could be a problem. One, you have a poorly developed lumbar region and that is leading to a pelvic tilt by way of weak lumbar, transverse, and interior/leg muscles. Two, you have an overworked lumbar, transverse, or interior/leg muscles that are basically cramped. Both lead to imbalances in the other groups, and both are remedied by proper stretching, proper form in compounds and reflexive actions, and a general switch to a more balanced workout routine. It helps too to not sleep on your stomach, and to place a pillow between your legs if you sleep on your side. Preferably on your back, that can actually speed up fixing the tilt by days.

It's great that rather than read what I posted, or posit a counter, both of you immediately lost your shit because I gave actual health and fitness advice that opposed your shitty lifting routines. Have fun with fighting off that beer gut when you're 40.
Yeah still no word from the old lady but here's a pic of a dude flexing in an unhealthy "in". It's a little harder to see at this weight because the ribcage is mostly obstructed, but you can see that his serratus are almost invisible taking this stance, which is a bad sign, the "bottom" of his ribs actually sit a little above or inside his hips, and his diaphragm is cramped to high hell. He took this picture at a high angle and close to the mirror to make his shoulders and chest look wider, but they're actually barely wider than his waist.

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Ok , now post the unhealty example

Also , you talk a lot about ab isolation being bad , what s the take on vacuums ?

Weak transverse. Gas.

Could you please fucking stop? There are actually going to be newfags taking your words as truth.

Healthy ab flexis. While the vacuum naturally causes your diaphragm to suck up, the flex is balanced between the lower and middle back, the transverse is utilised to maintain an eveness, and the ribs are freely expanded, without being cramped down on in an attempt to look like you have huge abs. Your core muscles are not meant to be blown the fuck outward, they're meant to hold your body up and keep your ribs/spine/hips in a state of float. People who argue otherwise have absolutely no idea why they're doing the workouts they are, because they have absolutely no idea in what direction these muscles exert their peak force and performance.

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That was the unhealthy example. You should never cramp yourself to flex like that, it's fucking terrible for your core, ribs and back. This is a healthy core flex. Evenly distributed, no cramping, no bullshit to make yourself LOOK shredded. Just being shredded.
You're a dumbfuck who has no understanding of what you're doing. Keep shooting for your half-assed aesthetics, but you're going to end up injured someday and probably blame it on something other than your dumbfuck obsession with using the wrong muscles for the wrong motions.
Proper vacuums are a balanced flex of all the core muscles, and your spine is in an upright position with no pressure directly applied. Vacuums, planks, side-planks, and dragonflags/variants are all healthy because they promote a straight and upright spinal column/core.

Neglected your posture or did so many roids you've distended your gut.

Either way, your fault.

Kill yourself anytime, troll.

Still no science or articles to back your shit up.