Y’all niggas was right

Makes sense, I love how he still need to associate meat-eating to fast food eating to claim that veganism is healthier and all his studies about «meat eaters» are in fact studies about «average american diet» which is shit.
Meat eaters can be way much healthier than vegans if they eat the right things in the correct amount, but he’ll never admit this

Yeah sometimes his brain goes full autismo, see his «pec flies» video, he can’t comprehend isolation exercises, «hurr what matters is volume, so since you need lower weight to perform chest flies than bench press, that means that bench press is better to build chest, because you simply lift more» he couldn’t comprehend that it’s volume PER MUSCLE that matters, not total volume, you can’t compare isolation to compound like they’re the same thing

Pure veganism is idiotic, I have never subscribed to it. Humans did not evolve to be pure vegans and we can't do it.

I mostly eat vegan food but I also eat animal products on occasion. This is objectively the best diet, and the diet we evolved for. We didn't evolve for veganism, nor did we evolve for eating fried chicken or burgers 3 times a day.

Granted vegans are generally a bit healthier and definitely morally superior to obese fatfuck niggers that eat fried chicken every day. But in terms of optimal health, neither are good. One is a skinny weak malnourished gollum freak, the other is an obese fatfuck whose bones and joints are cracking under their weight, and human-sized heart struggling to pump blood through a manatee-sized body.

Bahahahahaha based

lmao u are weak and its audible

I'm going to continue letting the shills pretend that plant based diets are normal and healthy in any sort of way while I continue getting stronger and more healthy. I mean those people that think eggs, meat, animal fats are toxic substances? They're just like those guys who squat 85lbs and never put weight on the bar despite months of lifting. Lost causes.

Fruits are plant phoetuses.

I like how none of you responded to VG's response. Keep talkin shit lol

>Humans did not evolve to be pure vegans
True enough.
>and we can't do it
False. It does require more knowledge about nutrition than just eating an omnivorous diet though.

I said it makes sense, you illiterate retard, it’s him that then goes on rambling for 5 minutes about meat eater and vegetarians that should be true vegans because it’s almost more retarded to be vegetarian

>, the meat eater is an obese fatfuck whose bones and joints
are cracking under their weight, and human-sized heart struggling to pump blood through a manatee-sized body.

Seems you missed the mark again vegan, you need refresher training on how to shill for your cult.

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>eating eggs is bad

how do I know you're a DYEL?

Please be bait.

This. It's a useless study and disenguous.

Besides that my negroes, we don't need a study to prove that Veganism is a starvation cult. This was already well-known.

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Turns out you never read a study

Who would of think it durrr

>eggs bad

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Lmao ur weak and it’s audible >picks out people with mental health problems and anorexia

HEY GOYS LOOK HOW U HEALTHY IT IS CUS OF A HANDFUL OF SICK POL LOLOLOLOL

fuck off you filthy like

I'm going to post a couple of paragraphs from the discussion section of the study, to show that this was not unexpected, and probably not a result of grouping vegetarians and vegans.
>For stroke outcomes, the combined results from two randomised statin trials reported 21% higher risks of haemorrhagic stroke per 1 mmol/L reduction in LDL-C,2938 which are consistent with results of observational studies of cholesterol concentrations and haemorrhagic stroke.394041 A recent study that included observational and genetic evidence from China alongside the trial evidence from western countries has suggested this inverse association between LDL-C and haemorrhagic stroke might be causal.42 These previous studies corroborate the findings of the present study, indicating that vegetarians, who have relatively low LDL-C, had higher risks of haemorrhagic stroke. For ischaemic stroke, previous prospective studies and randomised trials have consistently shown weak positive associations of non-HDL-C or LDL-C levels with risk,26323338 which is supported by recent mendelian randomisation studies.3142 This apparent discordance between previous evidence and those of the present study for LDL-C levels and ischaemic stroke suggests that other dietary factors associated with the lack of animal food consumption could contribute to the observed associations.

>Results of several studies in Japan, showing that individuals with a very low intake of animal products had an increased incidence and mortality from haemorrhagic and total stroke, and also a possibly higher risk of ischaemic stroke mortality,43444546 suggest that some factors associated with animal food consumption might be protective for stroke. Vegetarians and vegans in the EPIC-Oxford cohort have lower circulating levels of several nutrients (eg, vitamin B12,47 vitamin D,48 essential amino acids,49 and long chain n-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids50), and differences in some of these nutritional factors could contribute to the observed associations.4551525354 Serum concentrations of these nutritional factors and non-HDL-C have only been measured in a subset of the EPIC-Oxford cohort, and therefore their role in the observed associations of vegetarian diets with ischaemic heart disease or stroke cannot be accurately determined in the current context, but should be further investigated.

So it just says having low D b12, shit amino acids and low omegas may be associated with a higher risk of stroke

Ok, so what does that have to do with vegetarians or vegans? Meat eaters can lack these also

It’s also not hard to get these things

Only brainlet normies fail at eating

The study is bad but it’s weird how a bunch of you jump of this OBSERVATIONAL study but then will DENY the China study

The Jewish kosher meat industry fuels the carnist delusion.

No, it doesn't just say that. Don't skim read. Frankly the lower circulating levels of nutrients was the least important part of what was written. But I'll clarify your misunderstanding first.
>Ok, so what does that have to do with vegetarians or vegans? Meat eaters can lack these also
So the goal of this section is to look at potential reasons why we're seeing these trends in the data. It was noticed that in the cohort (that is the 48,000 people being studied), those following vegan or vegetarian diets tended to have lower levels of these nutrients versus the meat eaters; and so it was mentioned that these deficiencies could be a contributing factor to the stroke risk.

Anorexia and Veganism are basically the same thing, thank God it only inflicts libtards like you. Now kill yourself slowly like the rest of your cult...

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>reaches the summit
>gracefully passes away into the healing embrace of God at Earth's highest point
OK, this is based.

>Results of several studies in Japan, showing that individuals with a very low intake of animal products had an increased incidence and mortality from haemorrhagic and total stroke, and also a possibly higher risk of ischaemic stroke mortality,43444546 suggest that some factors associated with animal food consumption might be protective for stroke

tl;dr vegans will stroke out early (and that might mean before age 3)

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The China fraud? lol why don't you go all the way back to the Incel Keys 21 country study lol?

All pro-vegan "science" is just open fraud to support a starvation cult.

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If dying as soon as possible is your goal, then Veganism is for you.

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Is there a point to these headlines? You may as well post the rise of childhood obesity amongst the general population and blame their omnivorous, meat heavy diets. Headlines are retarded and reddit bait, post studies.

The basis for that claim being both the difference in the levels of these nutrients between diets in the study, and several Japanese studies demonstrating an increased risk of stroke with a very low intake of animal products (which are particularly good sources of the nutrients vegetarians and vegans were lacking, some of which are just not available from dietary sources).
The previous paragraph, discusses previously reported inverse associations with LDL cholesterol levels and hemorrhagic stroke (that is, the type where the association with a vegetarian/vegan diet and risk was most pronounced). That is, LDL-C ("bad" cholesterol), which a vegan/vegetarian diet is associated with lower levels of, has a protective effect against hemorrhagic stroke. Which is consistent with the results of this study, and makes them less surprising.

So why do accept the same standard of proof on a much smaller scale in regards to OP study

You didn’t even acknowledge what I wrote

You have a Jew vibe about you

You’re dissing someone climbing the hardest mountain and you probably couldn’t even complete a 10km run
You’re also implying only this vegan has died trying to climb it and that no vegan has ever climbed it

They are far from the same thing

I’m also not a libtard
You are a Jew or using Jew tact’s

Both shameful

How many vegans were in the sample size again? And why were the grouped in with another sample of people

Do you not see how that corrupts data?

You must know this

You don’t seem stupid

>if you try and live off onions milk and apple juice you will die or become sick

Yeah no shit you fucking weirdo

Why do you keep posting the same shit

Anyone with ape IQ can see what you’re doing

Are you honestly this dense ?

And they have a 99.99% chance of being dyel as well

>You may as well post the rise of childhood obesity amongst the general population and blame their omnivorous, meat heavy diets.
Except that's not why childhood obesity is a thing, you idiot. It's the massive amounts of sugar that is fed to children, not meat, that got us to where we are today, and your fad diet wouldn't help with it one bit.

Yep deffo nothing to do with the fact of fat

Sugar is deffo a thing as well

Wow it’s almost like many factors are at play woooow

It’s not a fad it’s a movement and it’s growing

You’re actually mentally ill

And I won’t do delusional logic like you and say it must be something in animal products that make you mentally ill.

I feel sorry for you

There have been studies that it has nothing to do with fat or cholesterol. It's 100% sugar and all the foods that are packed with it.

And yeah, it is a fad, if you can't survive on your shitty diet outside of a 1st world country, then it's a fad.

>How many vegans were in the sample size again?
It's not available in the article, but the supplementary data gives just short of 2000 vegans.
>And why were the grouped in with another sample of people
Because strokes and heart attacks don't happen with such frequency that you can make reasonable inferences from such a small sample. (for instance there were only 8 hemorrhagic strokes among the vegans)
>Do you not see how that corrupts data?
It doesn't corrupt the data per se. What it means is that we can only really make inferences about diets without meat, of which vegan diets are a subset.
Of course you could argue that there is a pronounced difference between the diets, which there certainly is, according to the supplementary information. However, when it comes to the potential causal factors mentioned before (LDL-C, nutrients), the vegan diet is a more severe instance, and so is subject to the same consequences.

This study is pretty much garbage. It is an observational study where vegans are lumped into vegetarians.

Also vegetarians where healthier in general to the meat eaters, they just adjusted factors to compare say healthy meat eater to a healthy vegetarian. Vegetarians in general had less diabetes, less heart disease, less high blood pressure.

So you compare a meat eater with normal blood pressure and low cholesterol to say a vegetarian, then the meat eater is probably healthier due to having better genetics even through they have a worse diet.

Fat is responsible as well, but not animal fats.

Sugar and vegetable oils that are in everything are responsible

Milk is in everything. Its pretty hard to find something that doesn't have milk in it.

How does anything you say make the study garbage? It's bloody good science, looking at relative risks for specific diseases based on dietary pattern. You clearly either haven't read it, or don't have the background to understand what it's about.

Americans don’t realize that shit you buy at the grocery store and eat at restaurants isn’t “meat,” in this age. its hormone-pumped, genetically modified garbage from livestock raised on synthetic feed

if you are paying less than $30 for a burger at a restaurant, you are not eating meat

if you want to keep meat in your diet you should limit yourself to lamb, because it isn’t mass produced like chicken, beef, or steak, which at this point, barely resemble meat in terms of their chemical composition. and learn to enjoy fish that isn’t farmed

>good science
>observational study

I hope you realize that the same criteria you used to dismiss the study as garbage applies to other observational studies which show vegetarians are healthier than meat eaters since they don't account vegetarianism/veganism just as a lifestyle marker.

I don’t care what they say about Ed meat, but fuck I get defensive with eggs. 6 whole eggs a day for a decade a,ready and I absolutely love them

>it's pretty hard to find something that doesn't have milk in it
Nigger you what? I can list over a thousand foods off the top of my head that have zero milk in them. You know why? Because I'm not a fucking retard that eats solely processed food. Here's some anectode for ya, I grew up eating 60/30/10 meat/veg/fruit, my parents withheld sugary snacks and plastic garbage food from me, and I have never once in my lifetime been over 17% bodyfat. I even got up to 215lbs one year and just barely broke 15. While aaaallll my neighbors fed their kids frozen premade dinners and soda, and let them eat pizzas on Friday and all the shitty Hostess cakes they could eat. Guess how many of them are fat, and guess which one of this case group can OHP 2pl8?

>nor did we evolve for eating fried chicken or burgers 3 times a day.
Lmao maybe your bitch ass dyel tribe did 't.

I buy hormone-free, grass-fed year round, 3+ yo cattle from a rancher I know personally at 2$ a pound. Suck my dick you faggot Europoor.

>I mostly eat vegan food but I also eat animal products on occasion. This is objectively the best diet, and the diet we evolved for

Uhhhhhhhhh no

We evolved by eating meat, roots, nuts and fruit when available. That's not a "mostly" vegan diet. Meat has always been a staple of the human diet.

i tried 2 days of meat a week and it made me sick depressed and weak. meat erryday is the way.

Meat has always been the main source of nutrition for humans. Do I have to explain to you the structure of your jaw muscles and teeth? Or the function of your appendix?

Holy fuck my aneurysm chance has risen 300% from reading the replies to this thread. Good job OP on informing us, though these fad diet idiots are too dumb to save their lives.

What has milk got to do with what I said?

So you accept the China study right?

That's not what makes bad science. There are no blaring flaws in the collection or analysis, they're not overstepping in their conclusions, it is a big cohort and other studies seem to be in agreement.

What is the China study?

much higher rate of mental illness, on top of the higher risk of stroke, heart disease, diabetes, osteoporosis, tooth decay etc.

Theres so much corporate propaganda floating around against traditional animal diets that many people arent aware of basic nutritional facts.

>heart disease
That would be in direct contradiction of both this study and the general scientific consensus

Observational study on china.

It shows that as China reduced sugar consumption and increased meat consumption, the rate of diabetes, cancer, heart disease went way up.

A good example is diabetes in China is much more of a problem now, than in the US.

Much higher rate of mental illness because vegetarians tend to have a higher IQ.

The study shows that they have a lower risk of diabetes and heart disease.

That doesn't necessarily mean it can be attributed to meat consumption, since that plausibly paralleled with modernisation of their diet in other ways.
I know which study you're talking about now though. This en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China–Cornell–Oxford_Project , right?
I don't doubt that the results (or rather the data) are informative albeit in a limited sense.

>Much higher rate of mental illness because vegetarians tend to have a higher IQ.
wat

Having a big cohort or other (observational) studies agreeing with them don't turn the statistical association into a cause-and-effect relation. Whatever this and other studies have shown can be used only for coming up with hypotheses. A single well-done randomized controlled trial contradicting these results would be more than enough to invalidate them.

That's not to say I don't agree with you. It's obvious to me that a diet rich in meat (and poor in highly processed foods) is far healthier than any vegetarian/vegan diet, but we have to be fair when faced with poor-quality evidence even if it backs up our beliefs.

Which is pretty much irrelevant because general scientific consensus is built up mostly upon crap observational studies such as this one.

Meat is typically associated with heart disease because the general consensus says so. People who consume meat typically smoke more, drink more, engage into risky behaviours, exercise less, lead more stressful lives, eat more junk food (with lots of sugar) etc. because these are all markers of not following health advice.

>vegetarians tend to have higher IQ
Lol I'm mostly a meat eater and tested out of my first year of college courses after dropping out of highschool at 16. 172 IQ faggots and it's only getting higher.

> Jade Sanders
> Lamont Thomas
> their son Crown Shakur
Something just does not add up.

> Antivegans on Jow Forums routinely ignore/dismiss every study that says veganism may be healthier than eating meat because the studies are observational
> This high standard of evidence is dropped when an observational study indicates vegans are at a higher risk of stroke
> Whilst at the same time ignoring the other conclusion from this very study that claims those who eat meat are at an increased risk of heart disease
We got some olympic tier mental gymnastics going on today

> He doesn't know the adventist studies adjusted for such confounding factors

As China acquired its chubby middle class rather.

>Having a big cohort or other (observational) studies agreeing with them don't turn the statistical association into a cause-and-effect relation.
I don't disagree. Although I will say that observational studies can certainly lend support to hypotheses when combined with auxiliary information (as in ) albeit without the same weight as a large RCT. So I certainly wouldn't fully agree with your statement
>Whatever this and other studies have shown can be used only for coming up with hypotheses.
>Which is pretty much irrelevant because general scientific consensus is built up mostly upon crap observational studies such as this one.
What do you mean by crap observational studies? To me a crap observational study is an observational study with obvious flaws, or a sample size which is insufficient to derive anything meaningful from. I don't think this study, nor many others, can be lumped into that. For instance, in good observational studies there is at least an attempt at adjusting for confounding factors such as
>People who consume meat typically smoke more, drink more, engage into risky behaviours, exercise less, lead more stressful lives, eat more junk food (with lots of sugar) etc. because these are all markers of not following health advice.
in the analysis.

Post body

fuck off

That's what I thought you fucking dyel

Eat some eggs and get big like a real adult male

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so, every study that he cites to say veg-x is better is irrelevant by his own logic, because they're all observational or epidemiological.
if he denies this study then he denies every study saying veg-x is healthy.

uric acid, isn't that a byproduct of protein/meat metabolism, and what people think causes gout? so he's admitting that meat increases uric acid and reduces stroke risk...

data was inaccurately recorded in the china study, and then cherry picked.
sorry you're so dense. maybe some B12 and D supplements will help.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4691673/
here's a study showing how veg-x can't even outlive the general population.
Dave Feldman is also filtering NHANES data and showing that lower cholesterol increases your all-cause mortality.

all the pro veg-x studies say they die less often of heart disease, but they omit the part where they die more often and younger than even general population.
all the pro veg-x studies say there's a mechanism that was tested in a petri dish or a rodent therefore it's relevant to human diets.