How do we determine if somebody is truly good or bad?

>hurr durr le rick and morty
Like I said, prove good and evil exists. If you're so sure, you must have some good evidence so it can't be that hard right?

anything with a permanent negative effect on others or yourself is evil , it isnt that hard you fake woke nigger

do you have some good evidence? yes good and evil is a human concept, so what? it still does exist, just because humans made human language, does that mean language doesnt exist? Just stop being so EDGY! God. Since I presume you're a human being, good and evil does apply to you. Gray areas do exist but black and white evil exists too. Killing someone for no reason is evil because it's spiteful and uneeded. this is big brain time.

Why do you think humans are the center of the universe? Why would what happens to a very young race of primates on a single planet matter at all to the universe? And if scale doesn't matter, as I'm sure you are about to argue, then why are you arguing for a universal good and evil in the first place? If good and evil isn't objective on a universal scale, then it IS relative good and evil. And if something is relative, it is not absolute and merely exists alongside other equally relative viewpoints.

if we lived under your logic, you'd be crying like a baby for things to go back to normal. I can see you haven't see evil, the things people are capable of. If someone murders your family will you go "evil doesnt exist so it's ok for them to do that".

If I kill someone and get away with it, the act being "evil" will never affect me, so it being "evil" would not exist as far as I am concerned. Sure, maybe good and evil do exist but if they have no power, why bother?

Yes, true we live in a society.

I may not like my family being murdered, but if I can't stop them, it doesn't matter how much I cry. And if some metaphysical force of "good" can't stop them, then it doesn't matter either. Things exist the way they are because a majority of humans benefit from it. Many things that are evil are still permitted.

Well you've just proved my point, there's a force of evil that means there is a force of good too.

Where exactly did you see proof of evil in my argument? What the fuck?

Don't even waste your time replying to the human trash that still believes in good and evil, you're far more patient than I am actually explaining shit to these retards. I'd never lower myself to that anymore. I used to, but not anymore. Let them remain perplexed and misguided, like anything noteworthy was ever going to come from them anyways...

Dood, all I know you need to stop being le joker guy. There is a force of evil that can come and take away something from you so there's a force of good. Now stop being such a edgy 12 year old and grow up please before yo end up in the news paper for a mass shooting and have the same edgy believes as those before you. You're showing Rick and Morty symptons.

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I'm just bored. I wanna see how much the arguments for objective morality have degraded or whether they might have some compelling ideas.

There's no good or evil, so there's no truth or logic so there's no something something. Do you see how retarded your nihlistic views are. If nothing matters, then fuck off god. Why do you even need to explain anything if nothing mattters.

>There is a force of evil that can come and take away something from you so there's a force of good.
Why would the existence of something I call evil prove the existence of some force of good? Do you really think some invincible force of justice is just gonna make things right? Are you trolling me?

Kid, arguing shitty views gets you nowhere. It's you pic related.

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Good people treat others like human beings. Bad people see them as puppets or obstacles

Because I am bored, and you are very easy to get a response out of :^)
Also, you can enjoy doing things without thinking them objectively good. If I jack off, I still get dopamine and feel pleasure despite the fact that the act has no meaning. It satisfies my animal side either way.

If nothing matters, then go do heroin and fuck every prostitute you see. Nothing matters right, do whatever the fuck you want and see first hand how retarded your believes are.

Prove me wrong. No seriously, prove me wrong. Prove that there exists a tangible force of good and evil outside of the likes and dislikes of human beings.

You have to be a troll. No one so stupid should exist. Go back to watching men throw ball on tv, you don't belong in the real world.

But I am doing what I want. I could fuck hookers and do heroin, and I have considered it, but I don't feel like it.

Find what stands against this world we live in and there you will find the good of this world. For even a single soul being tormented by the rules of this existence proves without any hindrance that we live in a truly evil world. A truly good world is possible. It starts with erasing wealth and those who claim control over it.

>neither good nor bad, humans just tend not to like it
pss! you, yes you! i will tell you a secret. the word "bad" is for describing what humans dont like. weird, ey?

Well yes, I just said that moron. But if I do something bad and get away with it, it won't affect me that it was "bad". So it therefore exists only in the perception of those who dislile it.

>Rape is neither good or bad, humans just tend no not like it.

Good bait. Looks like a lot of retard fell for it.

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Rape is the main way animals reproduce. Is it evil when they do it? Man is just a linguistic animal after all.

why even bother with replying, senpai?

Because I feel like it. I already told you this.

>objective
Hmmmmmmmmmmm
HMMMMMMM
Excuse me, but can you point to the user who mentioned objective morality?
>inb4 truly evil or good
I think he ws talking about a rought average of human morality. Wait, no.
CAN YOU PROVE HE WASNT TALKING ABOUT A ROUGHT AVERAGE OF HUMAN MORALITY? YOU HAVE SOME PROOF, RIGHT, MATE?

>don't feel like it.
i.e. he doesnt have the balls.

If something is not objective, it isn't relevant.
Yeah i guess so dude

Who said you would get effected, pal? How about you watch a few more debunking jewtube vids, then come back, and try to pay attention what the grown up are actually talking about, ok?

I know it won't effect me. I'm saying that if it doesn't, it might as well not exist.

>If something is not objective, it isn't relevant.
For a machine maybe, but we are humans. We have been given the ability to look beyond logic and reality. We value what we wish to value.

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>We have been given the ability to look beyond logic and reality
That's called delusion. Why yes, I can value what I wish to value, and I value machine-like efficiency.

Good versus Evil is based on personality and how you deal with issues involving other people. Maybe there isn't a God. I'll leave that up to your own views. But here on Earth, people still don't take kindly to evil either way.

>delusion
How so?

>and I value machine-like efficiency
So you don't value hope, happiness? You do not wish your soul to be lifted from despair?

Reading this thread has made me realize how childish the people who spout "Rick and Morty", "edgy", and "nihilistic" at people are. See, the entire reason why liking Rick and Morty and nihilism was supposed to be a bad thing was because they don't think about their opinion, they just say what sounds mature, when in reality it's just overly pessimistic or misanthropic, or otherwise 'edgy'. The same has happened with people who use the insults now; they think they're mature, and anything that sounds remotely negative or pessimistic they label as childish when they can't actual refute it. Either way, good and evil are subjective concepts that depend on your perception. On their own, actions are simply physical processes, but since no one can truly view things 'objectively' (which would still be a subjective point of view considering other points of view will always exist and there is nothing lending more credence towards one point of view than the other), we view each action through a different lens. Someone might view murder as evil because it's taking someone's life. Someone else might think that taking lives is perfectly fine; they don't even need to provide a reason for it, because as long as they feel that way, there is some subconscious reason why. The only reason we view things as evil no matter what, like murder or rape, is because humans have evolved to dislike these things and so the vast majority of humans do dislike them. Obviously, just because a majority of humans view it as evil, it does not make it 'objectively' evil, just as subjective view of murder/rape that is shared by a majority of people.

Unlike animals, there are consequences when humans commit sexual violence against others. Normally animals don't have a court system, a history of lynching mobs, or any other way to organize a vendetta. Why? Because many humans depend on a safe and stable civilization to survive. Otherwise we'd be just like all the other primates.

My phone fell in water months ago but it's still ok

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I believe the term is Socially Harmful, and to what extent the individual act is. Like jaywalking is completely different, compared to stealing money from a government program or institution.

>good and evil are subjective concepts that depend on your perception
>no one can truly view things 'objectively'
So how can you objectively say that good and evil are subjective? I understand that peoples perception of it can be different, but that doesn't mean there is no objective good and evil.

Well, firstly, you're using a concept, objectivity, that doesn't even actually exist. Human perception is inherently influenced by thoughts, feelings, memories, mindset, et cetera. Otherwise there could be no difference between anyone. To even have the ability to give a value to a piece of information, for example let's say rape, to even give that the value of 'bad' we have to employ our human perception, which has evolved to dislike rape, to say that yes, it's bad. There is no such thing as objectivity, as a person with no personal perception would not even have a mind to think about things.

If the very way we interpret the world is subjective, how can there be an objective good and evil?
For example, slavery used to be just normal, now it's considered bad. If the cultural norms and values of the world you where born into dictate your perception of what is right and what is wrong, how is that not subjective?

>objectivity, that doesn't even actually exist
So the distance from earth to the moon in meters is objective?

>to give a value to a piece of information
That implies that it isn't inherently valuable by the structure of existance.

>very way we interpret the world is subjective
The way we interpret it is subjective, but that doesn't mean there aren't objective facts. I can iterpret the world as being flat, but that doesn't make it so. People used to think stars were close by and smaller then the sun, that didn't make it so.

Quantitative data does not need to be distinguished between objective and subjective, as the only 'value' to be spoken of is what number it is. This is clearly different for qualitative data and other such issues that involve concepts of human creation, such as good and evil. It is impossible to disagree with someone about a distance, as that is a universal law or truth, but it is certainly possible to disagree with good and evil.
>That implies that it isn't inherently valuable by the structure of existance.
Well, no, it isn't. Value is what something means to someone. There needs to be an observer for there to be value. Quantitative data requires someone to observe the distance, qualitative data requires that as well as being affected by human perception.

By how much your actions infringe on others, as well as how innocent the others are.

But those interpretations can be contradicted by physical experiences. For example, if you said that the earth is flat, and then did an experiment that would only work if the earth is flat, if it doesn't work then it's not true. But anyone can interpret anything about good and evil and nothing will contradict you.

>universal law or truth
So, an objective truth?

>Value is what something means to someone
I see, I think I understand things better now. I think this implies that even if objective good and evil exists, it does not have value. If good and evil is based on value, then it can't exist. But if it is not based on value, but an fundemental part of reality, then it can exist. I guess good and evil doesn't have a clear definition. In the end it would depend on other factors, like the existance of God.

The concepts of good and evil are social constructs to give humans a reason to reject naturality and life just being life, a serial killer for example what makes him evil? Because he kills indiscriminately for his own satisfaction? Does that really make him evil? What even is evil and how would you ever define something so vague? Is a orphanage home worker a good soul because he works at a orphanage alone?

What user is trying to say, it's a social construct and is made up to demonize the fruit of life and give us the ok to apprehend it.

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Fucking creepy man, what the fuck is this corn of the children pic.

Only a dog wants to know who's a good boy.

I think its from Outlast 2

Other animals don't have babies the same way as we do. A woman needs constant care and a safe and supportive environment to birth a baby unlike animals that can even hunt when pregnant.

it's difficult to find a truly evil person

pic unrelated, not a truly evil person

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Fuck you I am the monster of your butthole :)

>rows of crops at night is creepy
jesus what a little faggot

How well they adhere to their own values

the objective moral standard is to love the lord your god with all your heart, mind, soul and strength, and to love your neighbour as much as you love and take care of yourself

anything short of that standard is evil

Take a leaf out of the Nazarene's book and judge a tree by its fruits.

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Fuck you, Internet tough guy.

There is no good or bad. Things just are.

>There is no good or bad. Things just are.

is that an objectively true statement, regardless of whether anyone observes it ?

if so, then it logically follows that there are objective truths; things that are correct or incorrect no matter if anyone agrees with them or even knows them

and if objective truths exist, then it is a logical necessity that objective morality exists; things that are right or wrong no matter if the whole world disagrees or wholeheartedly embraces the moral insanity your relativism inevitably gives birth to

tl;dr your statement is self-contradictory and intrinsically self-defeating

Read "Beyond Good and Evil"

If I raped your mom would you care. Or would you throw on some sun glasses indoors and be like, "An action has occurred".

It's evil in societies eyes and you will objectively be in prison or put to death if you are evil. If the only thing that matters is casuality then wouldn't socities view matter more than what your own personal view is? And besides society created these terms good and evil. So how is it any different from labeling murder as muder than labeling it as also evil. Since you're just argueing semantics.

>Or would you throw on some sun glasses indoors and be like, "An action has occurred".
That one, obviously. Do I look like a fag to you?

Only if society is stronger than the individual or capable of preventing evil. For some, punishment does not matter and therefore society lacks the power to stop them, rendering the concept of evil irrelevant as no amount of justice will bring those dead people back to life.

>what user wants
violence is evil
>what user needs
violence is useless
>what user wishes
violence is arbitrary
>what user will have
u r gay

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Morality is subjective, only if it serves a greater purpose that benefits the masses.
It's no longer subjective when it serves no purpose but your own desires.

You can cry all you want but you can't un-rape someone. That's all there is to it.

But it's a deterrant so it's not completely irrelevent. People are influenced by society and others though not everyone. Regardless why does someones opinion on punishment effect anything. Whether they like it or not it will still happen. And they will in the case of a mass shooter be dead or imprisoned for life. Ending their threat. They will be labeled evil by society which will hold more weight then every nihilists opinion combined.