How is θ different from φ? Sound completely the same to me, please explain with examples between letters of latin alphabet if possible. English th is not similar to f that way for my ear.
Greeks response please
Easton Torres
Brody Bailey
Oh, come on davarisch,
One is Zh
The other is Fh
Connor Ramirez
They sound completely the same, F:
youtube.com
It makes sense, because theo- in theology is of the word θεά (θεια?) which means Goddess, and in russian there's a word which sounds as θεα and it means Fairy, russian alphabet used θ for F, historically they never used F, but θ or Ф depending on periods of reforms. Today we only use Ф.
Dominic Collins
They don't. Historycally speaking, Russian language has taken a lot form Greek, yet certain kind of "aspiration" sound (Zh and others) was clearly not passed to your language. Otherwise I don't know, this is what I have been studying here in the italian lyceum. Greek and Latin.
Yet, even Hebrew has that sound if I remember correctly. Slavic languages as well as English and German can't deal with certain particular sounds, native speakers don't notice them and can't even pronounce them.
Strangely enough, we pronounce "Goddes" =Dea in italian. So, for us, Theta has become D.
But, hey, pick an historical grammar if you like this stuff.
Angel Thompson
>Zh
What Zh are you talking about? Listen to the video I embedded above.
>certain kind of "aspiration" sound (Zh and others) was clearly not passed to your language. Otherwise I don't know, this is what I have been studying here in the italian lyceum
They teach us this as well. Only not zh (ж?) but th, when I asked why I was told that because θ was transliterated this way in latin texts. I wonder doest it relate to t looking like f upside down
> even Hebrew has that sound
Hebrew have this letter, only it sounds completely different (as T) but Hebrew used to be considered dead and was restored a century ago, so no way to be sure how it was supposed to be pronounced. But it's quite another topic, let's not diverge.
> we pronounce "Goddes" =Dea in italian. So, for us, Theta has become D.
Zeus is Δίας in greek (and Δ sounds as voiced Th, they don't teach it in universities here, they gave me Δ as D, youtube taught me better) God is θεός, so we shouldn't trust orthography, it's arbitrary, determined by clerks, who were mostly christian, thus not very bright.
> pick an historical grammar if you like this stuff.
I will, though I think those books are not reliable (even modern biology is in Replication Crisis today, imagine how bad it was before internet)
Nicholas Jackson
please ignore that image, I'm not a commie, I put it there ironicly
Hunter Williams
Ok, I see that you are seriously interested in this topic. To be honest, I don't know this field well enough to give you a better answer than the one I wrote you before.
Yes, most scientific research is in replication crisis, that does not mean every single piece of valuable research has disappeared from the Web; I suggest you to invest some time in this and you will eventually get to the bottom of it.
I found a forum where a, somewhat, similar conversation had been happening textkit.com
Search papers on Ebsco, Jstor etc. and compare them, I am sure you can get a personal insight into the topic.
Tl.dr
Research is in replication crisis, but our knowledge is still a good tool to discern valuable sources from unreliable ones. And where that fails, you can still ask other people.
>Yet, I stand on my original position: Russian has lost the original aspiration that was present in (ancient?) greek, thus identifying the two sounds as one.
Modern greek has been heavily influenced by Turkish so, as you know, many letters and phonemes have changed.
Angel Sullivan
On a side note, you seem to be a fun pal.
If you were to come to Turin, my city, I would happily discuss stuff with you in front of a proper Vermut, or beer or Fernet, whatever.
If you ever come in those part of the world, go to Largo Saluzzo, it is a place where you get all the drunk students of linguistics and philosophy. And a few russophiles too.
Alexander Nguyen
θ sounds like (Th)or while
φ sounds like (Ph)ysics
Aaron Davis
So you say "Theta" just sound like "Th", basically a dental hiss?
Dylan Murphy
>θ sounds like (Th)or
Does it actually sound as (Th)or or is it just pronounced similarly to (Th)or? Because it doesn't sound like (Th)or to me when sang in here: youtube.com
another question: why his Δ sounds more like D in Dog then as Th as in The it sounds in other sources?
Cooper Fisher
>Does it actually sound as (Th)or or is it just pronounced similarly to (Th)or?
I had to say "articulated", not pronounced. It's also tounge upfront, only in the greek case it's lip which seem to resonate, not teeth.
Easton Brooks
Ditch that song, it has an english accent: It is just going to get you confused.
Luis Cruz
Yes, I've already into that link, thank you. Though I prefer not to disturb my brains with alcohol, I will save this thread in case I will find myself in Italy soon.
Tyler Myers
The song doesn't pronounce the letters accurately. Here's a chart I made a while back. You might find it useful
Angel Perry
>Ditch that song, it has an english accent
Fair enough, here are more sources:
youtube.com
youtube.com
youtube.com
William Jackson
You shouldn't use graphics for phonetics in the aeon of multimedia. Pronounce "θor" and compare it to how some Varg pronounces Thor, and I'm sure you'll see those sounds are different. What is even less known is that vowels are also different in different languages, so english a is not the same russian a, and when some russians speak with perfect english grammar, you often still see their accent especially because they use russian vowels, because they don't teach their vowels in schools down here.
Blake Clark
Then this guy might help you. The letters are pronounced correctly in those videos
Jayden Clark
I just realised that I posted bullshit
Joseph Powell
It happens, don't feel bad about that