Hey Jow Forums, real talk here. NEETs need not apply.
Do any of you deal with imposter syndrome?
I was recently hired at a company, Ive only got some experience with web-dev, self taught no degree or anything. They had me do a little coding challenge to try and build something in Angular-MeteorJS as part of the interview. I was able to get the job, but I've mostly been assigned issues in Java and stuff. Ive done some paired programming with soe of our other devs (all of whom have much m ore experience than me) and honestly I just feel like more of a burden than blessing to the team. I mean the way they just speak code like they speak English blows me away and makes me feel like I'm just a poser who's ticking the time away until I get fired.
Anybody else ever dealt with this kid of thing? How do you handle it? How do you distinguish between genuine criticism of your capacities vs. needless and overly critical self-attack.
>Do any of you deal with imposter syndrome? Fake it till you make it Have friends to talk to Understand that job is just for making a living, career is not your life Social relations make anything easier
Don't be afraid to go to a psychologist, talking really helps
Joseph Adams
Immersion is the fastest way to learn anything.
If you embrace this environment you were put in you'll be a whiz programmer in no time. Just don't give up, ask questions, and show you're willing to learn.
you need to go over your company's public financial statements and find out if everybody is about to retire.
If so then you have nothing to feel guilty about, they're raising you to the level of the senior devs so you can replace them, because without people of the skill level of the senior devs, they would make no money.
You're the person they're gonna hand down the torch to. You belong to the tribe now.
Lucas Ortiz
I felt like I was worse than everyone else before I got a job.
Then I got a job and realised the majority of people where I work are worse than me and they've been there for years! They write horrible code with no thought. I understand they have deadlines, but it's incredibly bad, easy to break, and basically everything is interconnected in ways that it shouldn't be. My confidence has gone up immensely simply because of how bad a lot of the code I read is. I thought "professional" programmers would be these godlike programmers, nope. They don't really care about the code quality. Get a request from a client? Make it happen as quick as possible and ship it.
I sort of understand it, it is an app that probably won't be used by anyone, so why bother. At the same time, makes me feel better.
Evan Thompson
>real talk tyrone, how did you get in?
Elijah Stewart
Read this, begins books above average java developer.
Usually another thing self taught didn’t learn is computer networks and operative systems both lack prerequisites math or advance programming and begin enormous important for real world developers.
This is as technical competence but in most case discipline and learn than company needs is one more important things about developer.
Learn about company and thing make more money or make life easy to mananger or end users.
Bentley Lee
>Fake it till you make it That helped me with learning driving a car. Since day one I focused on looking like a Chad behind a wheel as I knew "virgin walk" drivers are the ones who get honked at or cut off. Actuall skill and experience came later but imposting made progress somehow easier. It's not encouraging when your passenger expects you to stall or crash into car ahead. Once he believes you know what you're doing, you'll believe in yourself aswell.
Joseph Carter
people who say they have impostor syndrome are actually experiencing the Dunning–Kruger effect
Christian Edwards
It's a startup
Colton Wood
>Dunning–Kruger
Ryan Cruz
Try again in English
Dominic Morgan
This
Isaac Kelly
I still kinda feel this way, but if you're younger, just think of it this way: you wouldn't be hired if they didn't see something in you. If you weren't sharp they wouldn't have picked you above the other candidates. You're here because they see the beginnings of greatness and they want to be the ones to mold you into who you will become. It's hard to get over, but imagine yourself as an investment for them.
Gabriel Fisher
don't worry you'll still get paid less than them
Logan Carter
I am an actual impostor so I don't
Easton Sanchez
Last question first. >How do you distinguish between genuine criticism of your capacities vs. needless and overly critical self-attack. A second opinion is helpful, either from a more senior dev (if they exist) or a boss. If there's nobody who can help you then you might be the most senior person there and that sort of speaks for itself.
>Anybody else ever dealt with this kid of thing? Anybody who's good at their job as a degree of it, some have a lot of it.
>How do you handle it? Weaponised Arrogance.
Read that and say it out loud.
Josiah Hughes
Or they just thought he's pitiful so they gave him a job.
Jace Bennett
> Kek
Joseph James
Or he's cheap.
user, keep your mouth shut and listen. Look up shit you don't know. Don't be like me. . . .
>get great job because cheap and affirmative action >everyone light years ahead of me >pretend I know what they're talking about >don't ask anything just fake it >manager idiot so slid through >get promoted repeatedly >now manager not expected to know any tech at all >bored af and sick of wasted time
Quit to be a NEET.
Chase Hall
Don't worry, everyone is an imposter there. Good programmers are way too into this shit to actually do the job.
Yeah, this is a good way to do stuff. It's good to acknowledge when you're bad at something, but to just constantly let it sit over your head all the time makes getting better worse. Acknowledge it, and work at it, but don't dwell on it.
Austin Nguyen
that's me in every Jow Forums and Jow Forums thread
Carson Stewart
>web-dev Here is your problem. All web devs are imposters by definition. Unable to code but in a toy language and unable to do shit without a node package or framework. Eg.: leftPad
You have good reason to feel like that, like all the other million JavaScriptlets out there. Learn yourself a real language and became a real programmer or kys.
Ryan Nelson
coding's easy though just remember to free() up all your mallocs() and JS already does that for you anyway
It's really common in pro environments to feel left out at the beginning. Give it some time and keep listening you will catch on :)
Elijah Reed
I work as a network admin, I was hired originally just a couple hours a week to do dead PC diagnostics and repair and it just kept escalating. Now I'm a full on admin working with people where the requirements were "bachelors degree or equivalent experience" as the ONLY hire ever off the "experience" part. I've been bullshitting for almost a decade learning on the fly and googling everything I don't know, and now that I'm officially an admin I have all these new jobs, some easier than stuff I've been doing I don't know how to do because I've never done it surrounded by people who considered that basic knowledge. HELP
Mason Powell
that feel is all too real, my man.
Caleb Butler
I've been a DBA for 5 years but I honestly think I'm too stupid for tech. Once in a while I'll seem smart but overall I have no idea what the hell is going on. The seniors and leads are all amazing professionals with 10-20 years of experience and they can run circles around me. I've been stuck in this rut of being a shitty employee and not knowing how to fix or change my career for a while now. I know that I'm lacking and I'm shit but I have no motivation or discipline to change anything. Have no idea what to do, just running on fumes until they fire me I guess.
Adam Taylor
OP here, can relate to the lack of discipline and motive. It's like I think I should either find a small formal CS course maybe from a local community college or some online course or something. But I am swamped with the workload already (because I'm incompetent so simple fixes still take me some time) to the point where I'd feel too burnt out to try and add additional time in front of screen looking at code in the little time off I do get.
Camden Ward
That's not imposter syndrome that's called "being inexperienced" You're expected to get better over time
Josiah Cooper
Ugh I CANNOT STAND that fucking spelling.
It's impostOr. NO I don't fucking care about your shitty "modern" dictionary source.
Juan Gray
Hey OP. All you can do is keep going. Do your best and don't be afraid to ask for help or be vulnerable with people you trust.
I was in your exact shoes (in fact I still am). I got a new job 2 years ago and I've doubted myself and my abilities weekly. I even asked my superior on multiple occasions if my position is going to be replaced/obsolete and I've been reassured over and over that it's quite the opposite. I've since changed a lot for the better, gotten more confidence and also a bunch of raises along the way. Just stick with it, keep exposing yourself to situations that make you uncomfortable and they'll slowly lose their power over you.
Colton Davis
I hit 20k in bug bounty money last year and got a great job right out of college.
I still feel like a fucking retard.
Landon Hill
Why are women allowed to post here?
Nathaniel Cox
no my internal monologue is full dunning kruger I just keep people's expectations low then constantly blow them away with my amazing work, mostly by working 8 hours a day not 4 hours and shooting the shit for 4 hours
Luis Sullivan
God damn it I'm in the same boat... but worse.
>fresh highschool grad >work as an instructor that teaches code to children >know java and have no works to show >dad meets ceo at work, he's a mechanic >meet ceo cause they hit it off >ceo tells me to work on something in nodejs >finish working on nodejs chat app, get board and make a type racer clone and a multiplayer pong game >month goes by no response >he emails me asking what I've done so far >ceo is "impressed" at my speed at picking things up >go to work >learn react >be an intern >getting paid $1500 a month
MAKE IT STOP!!!!!! I'M ALREADY A NET DRAIN AS AN INTERN. I GETTING PAID MAKES ME FEEL WORSE!!!!
Worst part of all.. it's a startup made of Standford grads. I'm in community college...
Nathaniel Peterson
I'm constantly worried about automation and h1bs making me obsolete. Also age discrimination when I get to around 40. Tech field fucking sucks honestly and I'm doing it for the money.
Ian Martinez
>women >on Jow Forums
Josiah Clark
This is why I work for myself. Never could get used to being either way better than anyone in the room or way worse. It's disorienting and feels awful. I got into monetizing web and mobile after a few years of normie work and never looked back. Gives me a less reliable income stream but much more control over when and what I learn and how I make money.
this happens to me a lot when I get a new job/go somewhere new, don't worry though, after a while it starts to go away
Jace King
>fresh out of high school >land job as ((sys admin)) working for some guy who does about 20 business, some up to 150 seats (managed with contractors), all on his own >work for $200 a day, 2-3 days a week for a year, barely making salary >finally after a year I'm quite good at what I do >still on $200 a day, even though I'm being ``charged out`` at $160 an hour >boss hates paperwork and never bills for my time >too much work to do to find an accountant and bring them up to speed >still costing the business money, but customers are happier
Feels bad man, boss just wants me doing IT work not paperwork too
>still on $200 a day, even though I'm being ``charged out`` at $160 an hour why do you do this to yourself
Jeremiah Myers
> the way they just speak code like they speak English blows me away
You'll be able to do it too one day. It's pretty easy to tell that someone can't code at a high level, but they gave you the job so they must see something in you. Remain dedicated and keep learning, talk and discuss code with your workmates and don't be afraid to ask question or admit you don't understand something.
Camden Diaz
On the other hand when you work with devs who you are completely on the same page with, it's a joyous experience.
Isaiah Reed
>get hired after struggle >made to do some obscure language so im on the same level as everyone else >actually really good at it >once we migrate on to more ubiquitous languages, imma get exposed sweating bricks
William Parker
Because I don't have direct access to those clients On top of that I feel like I owe a debt to my boss for running me at a loss for all this time
So you're saying you're making ~$600 per week? Where do I sign up? I'd live like a king in my country with only two weeks of work per month (not India or some gypsy country)
Levi Myers
>Dunning–Kruger effect Yeah, this is me basically. Every time I do something, I always think it will be easy then after half of the deadline, I will realise how hard it is. I finish the project so so and think everyone is better than me.
This has got to be bait. Please look up what the Dunning Kruger effect actually is
Jason Bell
He's post-ironically referencing the Dunning Kruger in a way that somebody who's on the initial wave of effect itself would reference it.
Sebastian Lopez
When you first start of course you're not gonna get things right away. They been there for so long that everything is natural for them whereas you're new so they don't know what to expect out of you. Give it a few months and prove you're capable and you'll be like one of them.
Jeremiah Carter
there is no imposter syndrome. you provide no value and you know it.
Aiden Martinez
Literally just above minimum wage, either you’re baiting or stupid
Logan Garcia
I forgot to mention it's $20 per hour and I only work for 3 hours a day
