What is Jow Forumsternet? mesh.gentoo.today/wiki/Purpose Jow Forumsternet would be our own decentralized p2p network running on our own infrastructure, totally disconnected from the clearnet. It will be a combination of DIY meshnets on a city wide basis, and a platform for interconnecting these city wide meshnets over p2p openvpn bridges and high powered wireless dishes for City to City relays. The Inter-Meshnet part of the project will allow any existing DIY meshnets to join our network by adding a bridge node or a city to city relay. The short term goal is to have a few anons set up their own local meshnet and link them together using the bridges as a proof of concept. A long term goal is gain a large enough user density that we can disable the brige nodes and have our own decentralized network idependent of the internet. >tl;dr we're gonna connect city meshes through the internet until we have enough people to disconnect from the internet entirely
Talk about: >Finding friends to link with >Linking meshes over VPN >Decentralization/distribution of all layers of protocol, from network itself to end-user applications Please try to keep names/logos to a minimum.
hey i'd love to contribute but i am no where near the houston area
i think i much more feasible option would be a Jow Forums GSM network
OpenBMC is promising af
Angel Fisher
This They should add donations via crypto,paypal,patreon and liberapay.
Liam Foster
Would it be possible to setup VPN servers inside the mesh network? To act as a gateway to the Jow Forumsternet for people outside the mesh network?
Jayden Bailey
interesting idea. I advice you to make a good guide on how to set up a node: the easier it is, the more people will spread it.
Jason Johnson
Does this relate to the guy, who I don't recall his name, was doing and the feds killed him in his own house under odd circumstances? I remember that he was very close to making a completely decentralized network and he even had the email service up and running. Anyone knows what I'm talking about?
Liam Parker
That was Aaron Schwartz and you're thinking of reddit
Adrian King
Don't worry guys, I'm sure it will work this time!
Anthony Green
lol no, what does reddit have to do with decentralization? Definitely not the guy, he was not famous, he had a family and I think he was living in Europe, either ireland or england if I'm not mistaken.
Ethan Gutierrez
nice botnet neets
Jack Clark
>openvpn Didn't you guys switch to tinc?
Luis Myers
I thought this project died?
Caleb Bennett
Not at all. In fact we've got 3 logos in development as we speak
Henry Torres
how do i add my possition in the map? it dosnt let me
Nicholas Sanders
Made a git account. I'm on mobile atm and the map isn't working. Is there a way to get into it from minneapolis?
Could we potentially attach a Jow Forumssm network and Jow Forumsternet together
I sure hope they just use b.a.t.m.a.n. with other vpn.
Parker Rodriguez
yo I want to get into it from minneapolis as well. Does anyone have advice?
Jason Martinez
Kek
Cooper Howard
Bump
Dominic Hernandez
Yes, bridges are in the workings to link nodes over the internet.
>switch Tinc is being tested
nah, there was just a break in the generals, but we keep in touch on irc.
>add my possition in the map new map is being worked. If you are impatient to add yourself, come to irc, we'll add it manually.
>leak my ip if you don't want to give your ip to bridge with others over the internet, we'll soon test onioncat.
Cooper James
Saved
Landon Mitchell
Ill be back this weekend. For anyone who wants to contribute but dont know how: JOIN THE IRC. Keep in mind it can be slow certain times of day because of timezones. Just ask you question and afk until someone else sees it.
Evan Ramirez
hi zhetic, enjoy your trip. We're discussing racoon encounters on irc right now.
how do i get involved if i live in the middle of bumfuck west virginia
Jason Rodriguez
>download gternet-cli >set up a couple of nodes >join irc and test intermeshing via VPN >make local groups/college/neighborhood interested in this
Jonathan Sanders
Are there any Firefox add-on VPNs worth getting? Here in the UK we might need to give up credit card details to view porn and I want to dodge that shit.
Chase James
This. Kali a cute.
Tyler Allen
What about konqi and katie?
David Wright
my closest neighbor is a little under a mile away so no chance of local group lol also what are the technical differences between this and cjdns? the wiki states some simplified pros and cons to each but im more curious about why that is
Austin Roberts
fuck as meant for
Samuel Sanchez
Until it can replace my 1gbps fiber I have no interest.
Samuel Perez
Wireguard should be used. Only need to share keys. It is very easy to setup and makes the most sense if you want low latency across multiple nodes.
Thomas Flores
In b4 FBI partyvan raid on CP distribution network
Jackson Young
>a little under a mile you can try with a couple cantannas if you have clear line of sight, and he is interested in this. Or a couple panel antennas, if you're willing to spend money on it. cjdns might be included in the project, but eventually there is another better solution in the working: yggdrasil-network.github.io They both deal with addressing and routing. A mesh network also have services running on top of that (irc, tox, apache, ssh..) and gternet-cli will set up everything for the user.
>Wireguard This was mentioned before, it will be tried.
>I have no interest It's a good chance to learn something new.
Eli Roberts
Remind me what the point of the wireless relays are, when you say that between computers, they communicate via VPN along lines?
Or do the computers communicate via wifi or bluetooth
Wyatt Wood
Not that guy but please do try WireGuard and PeerVPN too. I have faith in PeerVPN.
Jayden Roberts
this pic sums it up each nearby nodes communicates via ad-hoc wifi. If nodes have also internet connection, they can bridge via vpn over the internet, and link their mesh networks.
>WireGuard and PeerVPN Already noted, thanks.
Nolan Ortiz
bump
Nathaniel Williams
>learn something new I believe you meant >learn something useless
this sort of network simply doesn't have any real practical use as far as I can see.
It might be an interesting academic project in theory, but I can't see any real reason to actually build something like is being suggested.
Chase Flores
kys
Grayson Ortiz
>t. brainlet who pretends this has relevance
Ayden Anderson
>t. nigger who pretends is not a brainlet
Bentley Reyes
>who pretends is not a brainlet There is no subject
Logan Butler
That is no argument
Gabriel Morales
This thread is gay.
Charles Foster
no u
Brandon Cooper
>this sort of network simply doesn't have any real practical use as far as I can see. It's shared infrastructure that anyone can join and use to communicate with anyone else in the mesh network. It's useful in about the same cases that having a LAN is useful, and most things that are self-hosted or would work over a LAN would work over a mesh network too. I won't try to enumerate them all. There's one that's a complete game changer.
If a node with an internet connection (ideally through an IXP, but an ISP can also work) runs a VPN, then they can effectively become an ISP for anyone they grant access to, but they don't need to deploy or maintain the costly last-mile infrastructure that other ISPs need (their clients just reach them over the mesh). Since the VPN-ISP doesn't own the infrastructure, other people can do the same thing, so you get competition between ISPs, which drives service costs down for the users. The users own the infrastructure, and because they'll generally be able to peer with each easily reachable neighbor, they will often end up with multiple non-overlapping paths to their VPN of choice. This is in contrast to existing broadband ISPs, which almost invariably use a fragile tree topology for the last mile. Nodes can roam anywhere in the network, whether it's across the street or across the ocean, and still connect through their usual VPN-ISP.
If nobody bothered to host any other services in the mesh network, and the only thing anyone uses it for is to get to an internet connection (this has been done before, see: Catalonia's guifi network), then that would already be an improvement over what many of us have right now.
Justin Bailey
This again? I remember when you guys where trying to do this last year and it fell apart after a month Is this run by the same guys as last time?
I'm the guy who got BATMAN-adv working on the Onion Omega. Crazy tiny thing actually worked with the mesh. My idea was to make a premade 10$ quarter sized omega routers for a easy plug and play solution for anyone to join easily to the mesh. But no one couldn't get their shit together and it never went through. Eventually the main git/irc (or something) went down and that's where everything stopped.
It's mostly the same people. Things were derailed for a little while when someone (who also ran the wiki) ragequit by kickbanning the entire channel, and then I think the IRC was down for a while over the holidays, if I'm remembering right.
The animal. Knots was camping and a raccoon broke in to eat his toothpaste and drank his Listerine.
Nathan Foster
>enjoy your trip That is not a trip, you have to put hashtags after your name with a password after that. Preferably two hashtags.
Yes I remember the derailing and ragekicking Project was never the same after, a lot of people left.
Oliver Reyes
I think he meant a trip as in physically travelling somewhere... Because thats exactly what im doing.
Andrew Brooks
Why wasn't the IRC channel on Rizon again?
David Parker
>Eventually the main git/irc (or something) went down and that's where everything stopped. It didn't really stop, people were busy and progress was slow, generals took a break. But we are still in touch on irc, and lately we started threads again.
Tor and I2P (Onioncat and Garlicat) can be used to bridge nodes over the internet, as much as OpenVPN, tinc, wireguard, peervpn could do. We are evaluating different alternatives. If you want to help us find the best solution, set up a node, install your preferred vpn tunnel, join irc and find some user to connect to.
Samuel Reed
>the costly last-mile infrastructure that other ISPs need (their clients just reach them over the mesh) sounds like a great way to turn 5-10ms ping into 100-300ms ping.
Nathaniel Lewis
Is there currently a way to use wireguard only in useerspace? There is a go and a rust implementation but its explicitly said that they are not stable and shouldn't be used in production
Easton Green
I like the idea behind this, but: -How do we get the non-Jow Forums normies to contribute nodes? We can't save the world by ourselves. -How do we keep our network from turning into a chinese botnet?
Gavin Bell
Yeah, each time a node needs to make a routing decision, it adds latency. That's true for ISPs as well. Real world networks tend to take on a small world topology with a diameter around O(log(n)), where this isn't a problem.
Connor Ortiz
why monetize it, you are each contributing to the network. Also people like wifi so you could make a tool that connects to other wifi users who want to be on the network. It would just simply broadcast a special signal to help find each other.
Liam Sullivan
- no idea. I guess we will focus on recruiting other tech-enthusiasts to begin with. - How do you mean?
Justin Ward
>go and a rust implementation dropped
Xavier Hughes
To the anons testing Tinc: If you guys really decide to go down the Tinc route please think and plan this carefully, since tinc mesh mode is basically a big internet LAN with strangers you all will be probably subject to all kinds of broadcast fuckery and other dangers. There is also the issue of managing crypto keys for everyone in the network. I've spoken about this with the Tinc devs before and they themselves agreed that Tinc does a good job on creating private networks and a crap job on creating public ones. Zerotier addresses most of these issues but... there is a fucking huge blocking issue in it for us, it depends on a central server and this central server can establish routing rules for people inside the network. The guys at Freifunk seem to employ a modified Tinc to connect between points but I couldn't find any source and their docs seems to be all in german so I can't understand shit.
To anons considering the use of other stuff besides wireless: Don't. Forget GSM and other shit. In most countries messing with other frequencies than 2400 and 5800 will get you jailed sooner or later.
Gabriel Allen
hnel you are from germany, right? wanna take a look at the freifunk docs? I studied german in college, but ive forgotten most of it.
Brandon Hill
Create a cryptocurrency that's distributed based on traffic forwarded.
Samuel Morales
>yet more bandwidth wasted
Nicholas Edwards
What do you do when a specific point on the network is so overloaded with traffic that it's unusable? Why would anyone have any incentive to expand on existing equipment to resolve that bottleneck?
Nathaniel Rivera
>implying transactions are anything compared to streaming shitty chapo trap house podcasts or whatever you listen to
To the people who want to monetize it, you are doing it wrong. At most you can offer access for the AlterNet™ to outsiders by charging maintenance costs, but do so by each node. Just don't be greedy.
Thomas Morales
I think youre the one whos understanding it wrong. They want to make it connected to some kind of cryptocurrency so that the USER earns money based on how much traffic they forward. Idk if thats the right solution tho.
Alexander Lopez
I understand what they want, that is why I suggested a different solution.
I used to have a meshnetwork on my moms property using OLSR with Byzantium Linux. It worked really well. I was able to stream video from various devices around my moms land. My friends would come over and play games on it. So, the code for old Byzantium Linux still around. Why not use that plus I2P for security+anonymity? I'd buy that. You could make bitchin antennas for it out of junk.
