Is it really faster than linux?
Is it really faster than linux?
Tyler Peterson
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Matthew Stewart
No, it sucked, was slower, and had to be scrapped.
Juan Williams
That's what I heard, but I never used it.
Juan Flores
It's a microkernel architecture, and not a particularly recent one. In our post-L4 world, the performance issue from my understanding is pretty much just FUD, but with HURD still being Mach-based, it's probably gonna be completely shit.
It could have actually developed into the dominant OS though. I get that impression from quotes that were made in the early 90s.
Here's Linus Torvalds:
>I'm doing a (free) operating system (just a hobby, won't be big and professional like gnu)
>I can (well, almost) hear you asking yourselves "why?". Hurd will be out in a year (or two, or next month, who knows), and I've already got minix.
Here's Andy Tanenbaum:
>But in all honesty, I would suggest that people who want a modern "free" OS look around for a microkernel-based, portable OS, like maybe GNU or something like that.
But once Linux started developing fast and getting attention, GNU just kinda gave up on HURD and attached their userland to the Linux kernel, creating the OS we have today.
It does kinda make me wonder what HURD could have achieved and developed into had Linux never existed. Maybe it would've been a better world? Maybe we're better off with Linux? you decide
Easton Robinson
>Microkernel
>Faster than monolithic kernel
No.
Connor Mitchell
A microkernel is slower than a monolithic one. It will always be slower, so our machines would probably be slower. There are some situations IRL where you need a system that relies on a microkernel design. For regular PC users and even most web servers, this is not important.
HURD never came out because the FSF hired some academics to build it, and academics are slow as fuck on purpose because for them its all about research. If they finished their research/project the gibs might stop coming in. So they procrastinate. Meanwhile, Torvalds was a hobbyist just trying to build something useful for himself and he was motivated to actually get it working in quick order.
Angel Bennett
I want to try a micro-kernal and being a bit of a GNU fanboy HURD seemed like a natural choice, but with all these bad things I'm hearing about it I'm wondering what alternatives there are for someone who wants to give something like it a try?
Zachary Morgan
There's a debian port why don't you check it out? cdimage.debian.org
If the timestamps are to be believed, the system is updated an on active development.
Michael Miller
Plan 9 achieved what Hurd was trying to be in a more simple way more or less. But we all know what was it's fate, it's always the "good enough" principle
Jaxson Turner
There are no really usable microkernel OSes, but i'll list them if you wanna try em all out or look into them.
Old/going nowhere ones:
>Minix3
download.minix3.org
wiki.minix3.org
>HURD
debian.org
Newer/has a future ones:
>Genode
genode.org
>Redox OS
redox-os.org
>Fuchsia
en.wikipedia.org
Kayden Moore
>kernal
Christopher Lee
Shittiest logo ever
Christopher Phillips
bimp
Tyler King
It's not supposed to be faster. It's supposed to be FREE. The Linux kernel contains non-free binary blobs
Hunter Cruz
It's still in development.
Samuel Murphy
Eli Cruz
>intel GPUs loads binary blob from BIOS, which is ok
>amd loads a small firmware from the os which is a HUGE ISSUE FOR FREEDOM
Jackson Thomas
>implying I use BIOS
Tyler Bailey
also licensing killed plan 9
Justin Butler
>That's what I heard
Brandon Walker
Doesn't guixsd use Hurd?
Jason Roberts
Linux, the kernel*
Tyler Barnes
Nope. GuixSD is a GNU/Linux distro.
Its init system was originally meant for HURD though, and I think there was some work to get the Guix package manager working on HURD.
Adam Russell
That's the beauty of it, it doesn't do anything
Chase Lopez
I'd JUST Like to INtERJEct fOr a mOment whaT YOU'RE ReFErrING to as hUrd is IN FACT GNU/hUrD oR as I'Ve recentLY taKeN tO CALLIng iT gNU pLUs HURD hURD IS noT an oPEraTiNg systEM Unto Itself BUT RAthEr aNOthER free cOMpoNENT of A fUllY FunCtiONING GNu SYstEm maDe UsEFUl BY THE gNu cOreliBs SheLl UTILITiEs ANd VITAl SyStEm ComponenTS CoMprISiNg A FULl OS aS dEFiNED by posiX
Carter Howard
GAHNOO/TURD
Carter Brown
They are working on a port
That said, GuixSD is more of a tech demo than a real, usable distro
Ian Ortiz
Much like every other freetard, they have literally zero skill or sense at designing anything aesthetic or usable from a creative or UX standpoint
It's really embarrassing, and Jow Forums has always/probably always will defend this shit just to be hipster
Daniel Gonzalez
GuixSD is a GNU distro. The GNU Linux-libre kernel is under the GNU umbrella and doesn't need special mention.
Samuel Nelson
plan9 license was the worst shit ever
how many changes was it?
and it only got worse and worse
either go fully comercial or fully free
not this back and forth that killed any interest in the product on both sides
Asher Watson
>hating the hurd boxes
Shit taste detected
Hunter Gutierrez
you can use the package manager in pretty much any linux distro.
and it's not even half bad.
wonder where this will go after some more testing
Matthew Gutierrez
"Commerical" is not the opposite of free software. Perhaps you meant proprietary.
Chase Clark
And of those Fuchsia is the only one with a real future due to it being capability based. Of course there's also the possibility of a botnet.
Joshua Ramirez
TURD would be bore appropriate
Elijah Hernandez
I tried it a couple years ago in a VM, I was able to run awesome wm, firefox and emacs. If it had wifi and usb drivers I'd put it on hardware and use it for real.
Brody Rogers
>no mention of QNX
cereally, bro?
Nathan Diaz
No, not at all. But speed isn't really the point. The point is security and stability. Microkernels are great because theoretically you would never have to reboot the system, and the system would be nearly impossible to crash. You also get stuff like driver isolation which can add security. HURD will never get anywhere. It's a dead project.
Try SculptOS. It's pretty damn fast.
>genode.org
Christian Butler
Closed source and has no software. Aside from the embedable UI, there's nothing good about QNX.
Jeremiah Sullivan
>A microkernel is slower than a monolithic one. It will always be slower, so our machines would probably be slower.
This is false. It was true in a traditional Von Neumann uni-processor architecture (or at most 2~4 cores). In a post-Von Neumann world like we live right now it's really sad to see that programming paradigms still make shitty assumptions about code, caches, single threading, non-virtual memory addresses, lack of pre-fetching, etc etc. In a better world, had we evolved into more advanced micro-kernel/service-oriented architecture, maybe even with better programming paradigms (lisp, erlang, 'real' OOP with messaging and agents, etc), performance would be miles ahead on a microkernel setup than the garbage we have now.
Sebastian Foster
Of course it will, but just like with Linux and Android, there will be privacy-respecting forks once it gets big enough.
Also I agree with it definitely having a future. Mainly due to Google being able to sell anything to normies.
Anthony Foster
Stop being autistic, the OP was specifically asking for the kernel (Hurd vs Linux)
Kevin Williams
Microkernels are more thoroughly multithreaded so they could potentially be faster on highly multicore machines.
BTW, anyone who knows x86 assembly, the HURD guys could use your help. GNUMach supports multicore today, but it wasn't written for x86 processors. Anyone who can port the multicore code to x86 would be a great help.
Charles Wood
Every OS that doesn't have to support drivers from millions of devices, and run on anything ever, is "better" than Linux.
The problems aren't in the core of the OS, but with everything related to it.
Christian Hall
T U R D
Nolan Morris
Yeah I'm sure you'll find a lot of help on Jow Forums asking for that.
Personally, I'll stick to working on and contributing to fuchsia. Hurd has run its course.
Luis Richardson
Is Fuschia even posix?
Elijah Green
explan moar