/pcbg/ - PC Building General

>over a lot more generations
>will change in a year

>telling lies on the internet makes it factual

why not RX 580? Performance is basically identical (RX580 is often found to be slightly faster), but has freesync

I'm thinking of getting 2600x/2700x. I would like to use them for as many years as possible.

What mobo would you take for a 2600/2700x? Was thinking of getting taichi but maybe it's overkill

Budget less than Asus crosshair costs (290 euro/300$)

Upgrading from fx-8350/gigabyte 990fxa-ud3 rev1.0

Asus or msi x470

Do not skimp on the mobo. Get a noctua NHD15 SEAM4 they are fucking amazing

Depends if you're overclocking or not. If not, I assume you'll leave the PBO to do its thing

Avoid the X470 Tuf board. Garbage

Definitely overclocking, but internet says ryzen is a waste of time to overclock

Because AMD will keep the AM4 socket on their mobos until DDR5 is feasible for the consumer space, which is still beyond 2020, meaning at least Ryzen 4 will be on the AM4 platform. On the other hand, Intel changes sockets every couple of years, LGA 1151v2 will probably only be good up to the next 14nm CPUs they release.

Because I'm buying it off of a friend of mine. Prices are still pretty high in my country.

Second gen Ryzen is pretty pointless to overclock. Mainly because the XFR2 can push 2 cores beyond the highest you'll ever overclock it to. Most second gen Ryzen chips hit an overclocking cieling at 4.2 or 4.3 Ghz. XFR2 can push beyond that to 4.4 or 4.5 on I think 2 cores. Doesn't sound like much but just leaving the overclocking to the stock PBO feature actually does provide slightly better performance than overclocking.

Anyways, if you're deadset on overclocking, look at an X470-F Strix, Taichi, or Crosshair 7 board.

Your friend's a dumbass who doesn't know about fine wine then

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Well, at least op doesn't hide his shill nature anymore

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The AM4 socket already supports two generations and is poised to support at least two more. Nice job making shit up on the internet though.

>msi
don't listen to this dumbfuck, guys

The OP is based on price to performance.
Show me a good price to performance Intel chip that deserves to be mentioned
>inb4 8400
already tapped out in some games

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AMD doesn't need shilling anymore because Intel is systematically dismantling itself

What's up with i3 8300 benchmarks and comparisons?
My friend just bought one over a cheaper 1600 after reading that it's much better for single thread applications, but that's totally untrue in real world gaming performance. I know Tom's HW is bought and sold but this shit is all over.

AMD marketing was so cringy that year.

>bought an h100i against everyone's recommendation
Probably a shit build overall, too.

Only reason to get one with the blower is to replace with a Morpheus 2, obviously.

2000/frequency*latency

Freesync unless the later option is significantly cheaper and all you play are games that easily stay near 144fps.
Though it also depends a bit whether you care about IPS vs TN. Freesync is more of a must with an IPS.

Because 7nm next year.

It's hard to say, not knowing the prices in your country. I'd assume you couldn't get more than $100 for the cpu+mobo+ram in that crappy FX PC.

Why are you blatantly lying?

You mean... use that CPU for many years, or have the platform to upgrade to a 3700X or 4700X in the future on?
If the former, just get cheapest MSI really.
If the later, get one that updates their BIOS more often and has safer BIOS updating, so ASRock or ASUS, but doesn't have to be the most expensive just get what has the features you want.
Avoid Gigabyte, either way, and don't get expensive MSI boards.

It is. Turning on PBO gives you better results than a manual OC in many cases and is more stable, easier, and just plain better in day to day usage.

>but that's totally untrue in real world gaming performance.
I FUCKING KNOW, THAT'S WHAT I SAY EVERY THREAD AND THE SHILLS TRY TO DENY.
Benchmarks aren't representative of real world performance, especially when it comes to CPUs with 6 or less threads.

I can understand "tech analysts" testing the way to do, because it's near impossible to emulate real world usage in a reliable way because things like browsers aren't reliable (websites change with async push updates and browsers auto updaters. Spotify and Twitch ads change. etc).
But I don't fucking understand how they completely ignore how completely unrepresentative their benchmarks are as when it comes to an actual recommendation they actually fucking pretend that games will perform the same on those low thread count CPUs the same in the real world for people when they've been proven they won't.

Attached: 3770k vs 2600x real world.png (1024x1200, 163K)

>avoid gigabyte
>buy cheap MSI
I may have been out of PC building for 5 years but wut.

youtube.com/watch?v=4FeMLXFenjE
This is the cheapest MSI X470 board

>already tapped out in some games
if that's the case they should add proof to the OP so people don't ask
>where's muh 8400

Yes, a lot has changed in 5 years.
Gigabyte is complete garbage for the past 2 years at least. They were going down hill before then, though.

And MSI got a heck of a lot better this year, especially for low end X470 boards which are roughly the same as their $200 Z370 boards.

2000 character limit, user. I know. It sucks having to repeat the same shit every thread and having people still not read the OP.

It's better value than 2600

you could always divide it into two posts or something

So what's your guys take on getting 1 x 8gb ram for a i5-8400?
OP says enough for most games but some games are recommending 16gb ram. So is that just the budget advise?

What does Jow Forums look for in motherboards for their builds? I'm not sure if I'm retarded or not:
I just look for a motherboard with the size profile of my case, appropriate I/O, RAM speed support and that's it since I'm not looking to overclock. Is there any advantage to buying higher end motherboards over lower end if both meet your requirements? Do motherboards fail easily provided you cool and clean your computer with compressed air every 6 months?
Sorry if this belongs in stupid questions thread

no it isn't

Attached: 2600 vs 8400.png (1338x1181, 70K)

I really don't understand marketing. I just upgraded from a 2500k I bought on launch and the amount of retards on PC hardware forum was amazing. How has Jow Forums become an example of unbiased ANYTHING, let alone PC hardware.

rate btw (CPU is 2600 and 960 nvme on the way)

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Im tired of explaining again so im redirecting you to this

>more expensive
>worse performance

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>more expensive
I think you should go back to elementary school to learn addition again

>Even going with cheaper 3000 or 3200mhz ram, the 2600 is a better value.
Windows does shit in the background all the fucking time as well. The 8400 has no headroom for that

I should note though, which I already hinted at in my post, that BIOS updating on cheap MSI boards is sketchy.
They have no recovery for a power outage during BIOS update.
No BIOS reset or anything.
If you brick during BIOS, you have to RMA it.

I think all ASRock boards have the same crashless BIOS update feature, and not just the Taichi, but I'm not 100% sure either.

I was considering making a pastebin.
There's things that should be pointed out ie:

Issues that only affect certain vendors:
Nvidia:
No dithering support at all
Using mismatched refresh rate monitors (ie one 60hz and one 144hz) causes stuttering even during web browsing
No Freesync support; Gsync is arbitrarily more expensive

AMD:
Lacks software voltage control for better efficiency and requires more tweaking to get the best performance

1 DIMM contributes to stuttering.
Do 2x4gb and add another 2x4gb later.
No, the 2600/X is an objectively more powerful CPU. See Yep. I got duped into getting a 2500k as well. Every fucking retard was telling me the $100 more for a 2600k was a waste of money.
My build was like $1200 total with a 7970. Turns out that 4 years later or so, my 2500k was very noticeably bottlenecking my 7970 even overclocked a bit.
It became very obvious that those extra threads really did matter to keep things smooth, and that benchmarks are completely unrepresentative of real world performance because no one actually games on a fresh install of Windows with internet and half of the services disabled and nothing else running except a single game at a time.

It's the same story with the 8400. Looks nice in a lot of benchmarks, but the real world performance is going to suffer over the years, and already suffers in some cases today.

>rate
NVMeme is a complete waste of money except as a scratch disk or working disk for large video files and such.

Just look if it has all the ports and ram slots you plan on using. All the higher priced mobo's have a ton of shit thrown in for shit the average user doesn't use. Besides that the cheaper boards have cheaper vrm and heatsinks. If you plan on over clocking you'll want the more pricer ones. On a mobo manufacturer site like MSI you can compare their most budget mobo and most expensive and the only differences you'll probably see is shit you'll never use like 8 USB ports or flashy lights etc...

>1 DIMM contributes to stuttering.
>Do 2x4gb and add another 2x4gb later.
I thought as much but 4 ram slots is an issue if I'm buying a budget mobo as well :P

pcpartpicker.com/list/LBjnLJ
pcpartpicker.com/list/2CPphy
>intel fags will defend this

Nigga he uses cl14 which adds 10+% perfomance. If he used shittier ram it would run like shit. Theres literally no arguement that the 8400 is worse value than 2600 for GAMING. If you want to run winzip faster go ahead and take 2600

>Theres literally no arguement that the 8400 is worse value than 2600 for GAMING.
see:

>3770k is slower than a 2600x
>that's proof that the 8400 is worse

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Currently building my first custom PC. When I power it up, the GPU light turns on, but its fan doesn't budge and there's no display. What should I do?

pcpartpicker.com/user/Kuroro/saved/8gnsJx

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>8 threads vs 6 vs 12
If 8 threads can't handle it, what makes you think 6 will?

maybe you forgot to plug in the power connectors to the gpu?

I know this is bait but i posted you the iddentical builds he used to measure the fps in the video. You just make yourself look stupid
yeah im gonna listen to one fucktard shill instead of proved graphs.
>b-b-but in real life world you have spotify and facebook open so you need more cores
Lmao

>like $1200 total with a 7970
Were you me?
I ordered the NVMe drive yesterday and today there's a sale on 1TB 3D NAND m.2 drives...
Only wanted it for the form factor desu~

is the monitor plugged into the motherboard or the graphics card?

>so you need more cores
>6 cores vs 6 cores
:thinking:

>I know this is bait, but i'll still give him a (You)
Thanks goy.

I just bought a 580 and the fans don't spin up until it's actually under load. Check both power connectors on your board.
Try booting without memory and see if there's any change.

>4 cores with HT is faster than 6 cores no HT
the i5-7400 is faster in some scenarios than a i7-3770k, and you say that the i5-8400 is slower somehow despite having 2 extra cores?

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Solitaire doesn't count as a game, threadlet

Lol

I've got it connected to the PSU with pic related. 8p is in the PSU, the card has one 6+2 and one 6, and I've reseated it once already.

Tried both, unfortunately.

No change.

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>Tried both, unfortunately
Ryzen has no integrated graphics, so it HAS to be plugged into the graphics card.

The point is that lots of benchmarks showed a 3700 beating Ryzen, did they not?

But in the real world that's not true. In the real world gets about HALF the 1% minimums and worse averages.
It's so bad that some games were unplayable on the 3770 with background tasks running.

It's the same story with the 8400. Looks fine in benchmarks, but real world is different. More threads help a lot in the real world and 12 is the sweet spot currently.

>the i5-7400 is faster [AVERAGE framerate in a sterile benchmarking environment that doesn't represent the real world] in some scenarios than a i7-3770k
But the 7400 still stutters worse than a 3770 in the real world. Are you not reading, or are you just stupid?
Benchmarks are benchmarks. They don't represent actual computer usage.
6c/6t is pretty equivolant on average to a high end 4c/8t like the 7700k. It's give or take, depending on the game. Both are decent for now, but it's 7 years ago that the 4c/4t seemed good enough or better compared to the 4c/8t but over a few years that turned out to obviously not be true. It's going to be the same a few years from now, and you can already see a bit today, comparing 6c/6t to 6c/12t. How is that not plain to see? Are you one of those history revisionists, or do you just plain ignore history among other things?

Don't understand why we have to have this argument so much when you'd have to be retarded to not agree with my sensible argument. Oh well.
Some people will listen to you and the 8400 shill and get a shitty PC. Others will listen to me and others and get a good PC. That's just how it is I guess.

Why are you comparing an ancient CPU to a latest gen CPU?
That CPU is crap

>history revisionists
you mean Trump supporters

Most likely issue is BIOS. Many motherboards produced before Raven Ridge/Pinnacle Ridge need an update before they'll work. That or the CPU/RAM is faulty (unlikely) or you fucked up during the build (no idea how likely).

Enjoy your stay biggot!

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Welp, I finally figured out why my 2nd 390 wasn't showing up anywhere in my system. Card gets power, but I guess the PCIe part of it isn't working. 1st 390 worked in 2nd PCie slot while the other was plugged in as well as the top slot.

Not sure how I could have broke it between swapping cases, but I guess I should have bought a better single GPU in the first place. A single 390 shouldn't have any problem at 1080p/60hz right? I really don't want to buy a new card now unless I'm going to 1440p/144hz.

>dont look at the current perfomance, just think about the potential! I know what the future holds

Just checked your motherboard support list and you do need an update. If you haven't already updated the BIOS and don't have a Summit Ridge CPU, you're shit out of luck onii.

3770 beating Ryzen*

Like some benchmarks even showed a 2500k beating Ryzen in some cases on launch. When the 1600 or 1700 overclocked were clearly better gaming CPUs that gave a smoother experience overall and in the real world. But people still cherry picked some results where the 2500k got better average FPS.

Tons of us upgraded from a 2500k to Ryzen, having felt duped in addition to that in not getting a 2600k at the time with all the retards like memeing and straight up lying that more threads didn't matter. And none of us are unsatisfied with that upgrade. The performance is clearly better in the real world.
Even if average FPS aren't always that much higher, it's incomparably smoother and subjectively night and day.

Because that's the only Intel CPU the person had. Go badger "tech analysts" to do proper benchmarks for more comparisons.
People have been demanding it for a while. Gamer's Nexus said they were trying to figure out how to, but a year later still haven't done it.

It's still a reasonable test and comparison, since some benchmarks were showing the 2500k or 3770 as better than Ryzen when they're not in the real world.

If a 2600X is getting DOUBLE the 1% minimums of the 3770, do you really think the 7700k is going to do better than double the 3770? It'll probably fall somewhere in between. You can use your brain and extrapolate.

Current performance is better in some cases as well, like I said.

then make a comparison between the 8400 and 2600, not between a 6 year old cpu and a 2600
it's like comparing kingston ddr2 memory to corsair ddr4 memory and telling everyone how shitty kingston is

Depends on the game? Probably not?

>2600 is cheaper than 8400 in my country
Feels good.

>implying lefties are the bigots.
Sure thing pal
theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jun/25/citing-trump-woman-in-video-calls-latino-man-rapist-animal-drug-dealer

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>one, probably cherrypicked game
>overclocked cpu and ram
>expensive ddr4-3200 ram

AMD BTFO by taking advantage of better components, please if you keep on shilling do so with more pics from that article

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How about you do it, faggot?
I don't have a 8400 on hand and I'm not going to get one.

I don't need to do the test to know the 2600 is better. The 2600 is objectively a more powerful CPU. Same single threaded. Much better multithreaded. Only the memory latency on the 8400 is a bit better, but you need a more expensive board for fast RAM. And the 2600X is even better still and often on sale for only $10 more than an 8400.
When you have 15% background CPU usage on a 2600X with twitch or youtube on your other monitor, Discord running, all your background shit like Steam, steelseries/razer/corsair etc programs, malwarebytes, you're looking at more like 23% on the 8400 as it's a weaker CPU with less to utilize and that's going to further affect your games.
It's simple.

How is this too complicated for you to understand when it's so simple?

>it's not fair my CPU is locked!!!!
dumb shill

Can you seriously just fuck off? No one buys your shit because what I and others have been saying makes perfect sense, as it's correct, while no one buys your bullshit.

>complaining about overclocking
>compares a locked jewtel chip to an unlocked AMD chip

Thanks. I'm guessing there's no way I could mount a file on a USB and update the BIOS that way, or something?

>I don't need to do the test to know the 2600 is better
so basically amd is a religion to you
>hurr amd is faster, also intel stutters

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How about staying on topic. This is the Technology board, not your blog

>pajeet namefag

You guys are truly laughable

not really. But AMD will send you a boot kit if needed for free. Just send it back when you're finished.
support.amd.com/en-us/warranty/rma
Fill that out, and in the problem description section, type in "boot kit required"

AMD will send you a Bristol Ridge APU to update your bios.

I know user, I'm saying that he's dumb enough to shill for the 8400 while posting accurate benchmarks that show it losing

>no one buys your shit because what I and others have been saying makes perfect sense
>he thinks he controls the whole market when him and his trap poster colleague shill in a bangladeshi banana harvesting forum

Not with your motherboard/pretty much any consumer motherboard. The system would require some sort of processor to write the new firmware to memory.
If you don't know anyone with a Summit Ridge CPU to borrow one, phone local computer repair shops. Shouldn't cost more than $10. Less ethically, you could order a new Summit Ridge CPU from an online retailer that does cash returns.

>a bangladeshi banana harvesting forum
I thought this was an Indonesian basket weaving forum?

Or do this, which is pretty awesome service imo. Assuming it'll take a few weeks to process though.

Do the shots of an 8400 or 8600k using 100% load on all 6 threads on today's games, or even games that are years old, need to be posted EVERY FUCKING THREAD?
I know you've fucking seen them but you ignore them because you're a dumb shill.

111 FPS is perfectly fine for me.
I'd rather have the consistently smooth experience in every game than higher FPS in many games but stuttering in many more. As would most other people. That's probably what the FPS is going to be at 1440p, anyway.

Also
>unlocked CPU isn't overclocked. Not even PBO turned on.
>aftermarket cooler on the 8400
>CPU frequency report is clearly incorrect as they're fixed at 3816 and 3625 respectively on every game at all points

Originally a Malay pictogram sequencing forum.

I know idle doesn't mean much, but I'm what temps should I be expecting and idle/load for a 2600x on water? I'm getting 40-45c on idle when my 4690k was 30-35c. Haven't loaded anything to stress test yet.

Doesn't amd ship an old summit ridge so you can update
pcgamer.com/amd-will-lend-you-an-older-processor-to-update-your-bios-to-support-a-ryzen-apu/
>AMD appears willing to do whatever it takes to get you to upgrade to one of its new Ryzen APUs.
>The only catch is that not all AM4 motherboards support the chips out of the box. To get around this, AMD is offering free 'boot kits' on loan so users can flash their motherboard's BIOS to support the new APUs.

you know what the funny thing is? i'm actually planning to buy a 2600 or even a 2700 because i do a lot of stuff on my pc, but seeing fanboys getting butthurt over a fucking cpu is gold

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mentioned here:

Apparently, but it's Bristol Ridge.