This guy made me start thinking. I'm renting 6 VPS' from digitalocean right now, so my costs are $30 per website / game server / testing shit.
I've found a website where you can get 16 extra IP's on your home-connection for 26EU. Would running a VPS at home with rented IP's be better cost-efficient if I start making more and more VPS'?
DO is very easy and relaxing to use, but I feel that it's limiting me sometimes.
Other urls found in this thread:
extraip.com
ripe.net
twitter.com
Running your own is always cheaper, but you will need to do more work maintaining it.
What else do you need other than IP addresses? I feel like I just don't know enough about this. Companies are making this shit feel a bit secretive on how we get ripped off.
I remember when I was an idiot, I just got DNS + hosting bundles for 15EU with no terminal access. Once I started asking questions to why I don't have terminal access to not even the MySQL server, they sounded like they had no idea wtf I was talking about. Little did I know I could just LAMP-stack on DO to get the same deal for only $5 + 1,99EU DNS...
Now I'm coming to the point in which I want full flexibility in how many VPS' I can run with preferably unlimited IP's, so I'm only limited by the amount of servers I can just run at home.
How do companies do this shit? I'm sure you can get 100 IPs for next to nothing somewhere...?
Depends on your electricity costs and whether you have the hardware or not
An ipv4 is about a dollar a month to rent for the best deals (usually attached to something else so they make a profit). But it varies. What did you find?
I found this website, which just adds the IP's to your current ISP with a router.
However, I think that when you buy 8 IP's, you get only 5, because there's something with the beginning IP and the end and also something about connecting it to your ISP.
Keep in mind that this works like a proxy. The traffic is forwarded across a tunnel to your home internet.
So it will heavily affect latency?
I couldn't find an ISP without an IP limit in the Netherlands though... Everything is 5 max, no exceptions. Which is exactly why I'm asking myself how VPS companies do this.
Yeah. It's a bad idea. You may be able to do the same thing with a DO droplet running FreeBSD/pf/jails, depending on ports.
You probably can talk with ISP and justify having more IPs. Also, you know you can host many many websites on a single IP right? Use an nginx to split traffic to different containers if you need things isolated. Sounds like you could be easily running on a single machine.
I had no idea you could do that. I'll do some research on this.
Exactly this stuff is what I'm talking about, because consumers mostly have access to the advertisements instead of people that know the game, as a noob, you're constantly unaware of all the shit you pay extra for, but get less.
One of my buddies has a 500k per year company running a few websites, and he still pays a seperate webhosting package per website. Even medium companies don't know the best deal, because of all the misleading ads on running a website.
He probably pays 400EU per month for 10 websites, while he prolly can get away with 40.
Yes, in the http header clients specify what domain they are are trying to go to in plain text (this is true even over https so your ISP does know when you're on pornhub) along with the IP to route the packets. This way, a single IP can host many websites. domain is in plain text to help with load balancing and probably some other things. Without this, things like cloudflare wouldn't be possible.
Finding the best deal is hard. Sometimes people pay more just so that they don't have to search. Others don't know any better. It's just life I guess.
Most residential ISP's have a clause in their TOS that prohibits you from running servers.
Heh good luck proving it.
Oh, they can figure it out pretty quickly. Got dinged for running a server way back in 2009.
The bottleneck if you roll your own servers at home with the rented IPs is your connection speed.
If you live on one of those fancy cities with gigabit internet, go for it. If you have crappy speeds like in the rest of the world you will need to outsource the VPSs.
Networking noob here, does your ISP needs to do anything specific if you buy a public IP from a third party?
You just need to add the additional IP to your router right and that's pretty much it or is there something I'm missing?
The marketing makes you think it works with your ISP. It actually is just an IP proxy.
Yeah OP here, after knowing this, you can just as well grab some IP's from digitalocean. At this moment, it just seems outsourcing VPS' to digitalocean for only $5 seems to be the way to go.
Don't be a retard like me and make 6 droplets, run as much as you can on 1 VPS as you've read in this thread. Apache can do this too. I think I'm going to only run gameservers on seperate VPS'. With websites, if the cpu + memory can handle it right now, you don't need a seperate one. Espescially if you're not getting a lot of traffic.
Digitalocean also does not get cheaper with more memory. This is actually a GOOD thing, it just means that this is the cheapest you can go with a fair deal for both.
If a VPS gets cheaper for more features, it means that they're getting a way better deal than your ass is.
Oh don't worry I know how to host setup NameVirtualHosts and/or ReverseProxy on apache and all but I still need multiple IP addresses for some lucrative activities >this is true even over https so your ISP does know when you're on pornhub
Actually they know you're on pornhub from the IP address of their server streaming to your IP address, they just don't know that you're looking at dolphin porn.
Gotcha, I was just looking over at DO for some more features. You can assign floating IP's to your droplets, if you just need extra IPs, you could use this.
If you were going for renting IPs from the type of websites i reasearched like: extraip.com, like one user said: the latency would suck, but you would still have extra dedicated IPs.
If you're going for anonimity and latency just doesn't matter, you can probably get deals like this for dynamic IPs. You can probably rent 8 and keep refreshing them for loads of IPs.
>Would running a VPS at home with rented IP's be better cost-efficient if I start making more and more VPS'?
Depends, renting a VPS is pretty cheap and can cover backup and security, if you run it at home you need to deal with electricity cost, a way to deal with electricity outages, doing backups on your own, having a machine that can handle being on for weeks, making sure you internet connection is stable and have a good speed, setting up firewalls and shit to deal with DDOS and whatnot...
You can also use a Raspberry Pi and the like to make it cheaper and easy to maintain, just don't expect a good performance.
That's actually not a bad idea.
The important part would be the memory though, so if future raspberry pi zero's would have 1GB ram, this would be perfect.
But if you're getting a raspberry pi 3, you got so much unused power with the quad core CPU. But running it would be hell of a lot cheaper than a dell optiplex or something.
I just use a shitty netbook. Backup to an external drive.
Of course data corruption remains a threat.
If you want to go nuts regarding IPs then do the following:
- become RIPE NCC member
- get a fiber connection with a BGP session or vultr VM and tunnel the traffic
- enjoy your /22 IPv4 and /32 IPv6
Estimated costs: 150 EUR monthly up to only God knows
How does one become a RIPE NCC member?
ripe.net
Ah that wasn't hard to find. Is it possible to quit and rejoin whenever you want to? Do you have to pay the entrance fee again if you quit and rejoin?
How many IPs would you get for 150EU per month? What is the lowest membership fee?
Why would you even need another IP? Just host whatever service you want on a vacant port. It's just you who uses this shit anyway.
I'm not sure if you can take a break. I wouldn't bet on it though.
Sign up fee must be paid upfront.
Right now you are eligible for an /22 IPv4 allocation. That's 1024 addresses. You won't get more unless you open up another LIR account. But as IPv4 depletion progresses, this will cease eventually.
This. Why the fuck would you need a whole ip for a game server, just reserve one port for it
That's sick, if you can rent out at least 30 of them as private servers, you have 990 free IP's to do whatever you want with them.
You can also rent out your IP space even more. Right now, /24 IPv4 are offered for 100 EUR net a month by LIRs like snapserv.ch. (/24 is the smallest possible unit to be routed on the Internet. Smaller networks either get filtered or aggregated.)
Basically, if you find 3 customers who take one of your /24, you are already break even with your RIPE NCC membership.
Because it's not common sense for most plebs that started out making our own webservers or gameservers like me. (I started 2 years ago with programming and just 6 months ago with networking / running servers for shit)
Like I said, I didn't even know you could point multiple DNS' to a single apache / nginx server.
If I work on a new project, run a server for a game I like, or just screw around learning new stuff, I just make a new droplet.
Why isn't everyone doing this? Like you said, if ip4's are running out, isn't the value just gonna rise?
Most hosters and ISPs have plenty of IPv4 left. ISPs can even go further by deploying CGN.
As a corporate entity you would also go for the LIR account as you don't want to rely on some person renting out their IP space to you.
This is rather a niche market. For some nerds or start-ups who need proper IP space and do not mind renumbering when their IP supplier goes dark.
Even when you think further, who could need space, Tor exit node hosters or VPN hosters won't become your customer, because after them your IP space will be tainted due to malicious activities like spamming and hacking.
Also hording of IP space won't work either. RIPE NCC prohibits hording of address space. You cannot transfer it easily.
You seem to really know your shit man. See these are the questions I was asking myself for 6 months. Is there somewhere where I can find all this info you already know?
Also, since you're amazingly answering all the questions i've been having for 6 months can you answer these:
-Is RIPE NCC the top most entity that holds all the IPs? Or are they just the place where private nerds can get their fix from?
-If one would have a /22 ip4, is renting out VPS' a probable way to get back your membership fee so you can screw around with the other IPs with non-malicious intent? And also: how many VPS' can a 500 / 500 mbit connection support?
-What else fun stuff can you do with a lot of IPs in a profitable way?
>You seem to really know your shit man. See these are the questions I was asking myself for 6 months. Is there somewhere where I can find all this info you already know?
Unfortunately there is no starter guide how to become an ISP or something like that. But in Germany there are communities like the Freifunk who are non profit organizations who try to setup free and open wifi. Those guys also hold lectures about all this stuff. They are also open to anyone interested in networking. You can learn a lot from them there.
>Also, since you're amazingly answering all the questions i've been having for 6 months can you answer these:
Glad I could help!
>-Is RIPE NCC the top most entity that holds all the IPs? Or are they just the place where private nerds can get their fix from?
The top organization is ICANN which organizes top level domains by itself and Internet numbers through the IANA. The IANA allocated all IP address blocks to regional internet registries (RIR) like RIPE, ARIN, APNIC, LACNIC and AfriNIC. Those then allocate their assets to their members (LIR). They also try to maintain whois information and educate about IPv6 developments and such things.
>-If one would have a /22 ip4, is renting out VPS' a probable way to get back your membership fee so you can screw around with the other IPs with non-malicious intent? And also: how many VPS' can a 500 / 500 mbit connection support?
Totally depends on what stuff the VPS are doing. I rarely see more than 10 MBit/s on average per 2k requests a minute hosting websites.
But this is up to your content you are serving and how much traffic you or your customers will attract.
>-What else fun stuff can you do with a lot of IPs in a profitable way?
I remember the IPv6 Christmas three where LEDs lighted up according to the destination address for pings.
But besides that. You could set up crawler to index websites, mine some data from social media sites. If one IP got rate limited, use the next one.
>Totally depends on what stuff the VPS are doing. I rarely see more than 10 MBit/s on average per 2k requests a minute hosting websites. But this is up to your content you are serving and how much traffic you or your customers will attract.
Can you get multiple connections to a private residence? So like double 500 / 500 mbit connections from the ISP (where you ofcourse pay double). Or are all houses / offices limited to 1 connection? How do companies raise their speed if they have a lot of users?
>You could set up crawler to index websites, mine some data from social media sites. If one IP got rate limited, use the next one.
Would this blacklist the IPs or something like you said before?
>>Totally depends on what stuff the VPS are doing. I rarely see more than 10 MBit/s on average per 2k requests a minute hosting websites. But this is up to your content you are serving and how much traffic you or your customers will attract.
>Can you get multiple connections to a private residence? So like double 500 / 500 mbit connections from the ISP (where you ofcourse pay double). Or are all houses / offices limited to 1 connection?
Depends on your ISP.
> How do companies raise their speed if they have a lot of users?
You get multiple uplinks. For example 2x 10GE to different ISPs (or transit providers). Hosting companies usually are connect to Internet exchanges and have connections to multiple transit providers like Cogent, he.net or telia.
Even if you start small, you want to have at least two independent transits. Otherwise if your only uplink has a downtime, you and your customers are screwed.
>>You could set up crawler to index websites, mine some data from social media sites. If one IP got rate limited, use the next one.
>Would this blacklist the IPs or something like you said before?
If you are not too aggressive, it is mostly temporary.