Linux: Post Your Unpopular Opinions

I'll use FOSS software when it proves to be just as good as the proprietary alternative, or at least good enough that any drawbacks are no issue.

Claiming that going FOSS-only is an obligation is the software equivalent of being a vegan - one that never shuts the fuck up about it.

>at least good enough that any drawbacks are no issue
Being datamined to fuck ain't a drawback enough for you?

>Arch is a waste of time
Say that to my face.

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>Its just Linux. GNU/Linux sounds retarded, and no one in the real world will take you or your OS seriously if you call it that.
Thank you for being a man of reason.

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Can you fuck off?

>software minimalim is masochism
You are part of the problem. I bet you're a pajeet webdev loading 4 MB of jQuery so your banners have transparency.
>vim is a complete waste of time
Vim has saved me more hours than I can count.
>systemd is not botnet
infosecurity-magazine.com/news/linux-systemd-vulnerability-dns
>arch is a waste of time
Arch is easy to set up and use. No idea what you're talking about.
>only incels use tiling window managers
Says the incel.

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Arch IS a waste of time.

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If the FOSS alternative is shit then I'll put up with a bit of mining. Or just not bother at all with either one.

I'd go FOSS-only if the options across the board were of a high enough quality. Not the case everywhere.

>a bit of mining
kek

>You are part of the problem. I bet you're a pajeet webdev loading 4 MB of jQuery so your banners have transparency.
Theres a difference between being lightweight and being minimal. Did you never see the masochism that was the software minimalism generals here? Those retards will waste days of their life just to shave down kilobytes of ram usage.

100% this my dude

Calm down, JC Denton

Is android just linux?

>>Its just Linux. GNU/Linux sounds retarded, and no one in the real world will take you or your OS seriously if you call it that.
>>Package count does not matter.
True, not unpopular opinion
>>"Software Minimalism" is nothing short of thinly veiled masochism.
Stop using anything similar to unix and never complain about security or confusing tools.
>>Vim and Emacs are a complete waste of time, and you all make way too much fuss over your text editors. Its the artist, not the brush that counts.
Mostly true. You cannot use a nail as a hammer. But there are other good tools.
>>Systemd is not botnet. Prove me and wrong and audit the code. Oh wait, you aren't a programmer and don't know how an init works. You likely can't even tell me why you don't like it without copy-pasting someone elses opinion.
We don't know is isn't botnet. We don't know it is either. For something so popular, it should be properly audited though.
>>Arch and Gentoo are a waste of time, and have no place in the professional world or home computer.
Not entirely true for the same reasons you might want to work on your own car.
>>Desktop/Screenfetch threads are what give Windows/Mac users the impression that our OS is a useless toy.
I don't care what they think
>>Only Incels use tiling window managers. You also waste so much time ricing and customizing that you forgot the point was to make you more productive.
Not even an "opinion". You're just making shit up and generalizing.

Android is Android you drooling idiot. It's a product name, not a scientific specification.

I'm never be able to take Linux seriously as an OS for personal computing into they realize that not every person wants to fuck around with their OS and have to start from scratch every three or four years when they change the repositories and none of the update or upgrade commands work anymore.

The only capable Linux product for personal computing is ChromeOS.

Definitely not. The kernel is very different. For example, there's actually a lot of kernel hardening in Android that isn't present in Linux because Linus doesn't believe in attack mitigations.

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>infosecurity-magazine.com/news/linux-systemd-vulnerability-dns
>Debian responded to the CVE-2017-9445 report by explaining that their distributions use the vulnerable versions of systemd, but it's not a concern for them because the affected systemd-resolved service is disabled by default.
based and debpilled

>Not entirely true for the same reasons you might want to work on your own car.
I would liken it more building your own car, rather than working on an assembled car. And maybe now you get 2-3 better mpg at the expense of all that time you invested into building a car.

>It's just Linux

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>I would liken it more building your own car, rather than working on an assembled car.
You're a dumbass. When I install Gentoo or Arch Linux I'm not creating my own distro. As much as you hate it, my analogy BTFOs your autistic rant.

Arch is indeed a waste of time.
semi-correct, synaptic is really fucking nice.
>might as well add in my own
Gnome 3 sucks so many dicks, but is a huge popular opinion.
I don't understand the hate that fedora gets.
People who complain about "bloat" in mbs deserve a firing squad, can you not afford 8gbs of ram? Hell, even 4gb in a laptop is still amazing for 99% of linux distros.

>can you not afford 8gbs of ram? Hell, even 4gb in a laptop is still amazing for 99% of linux distros
Maybe some anons would think it's cool to run more than 2 election apps at a time without going into swap.

??????????

??????????

Linux is a great kernel that's looking for a good OS to be used in. All desktop distros are garbage. Android is the closest Linux came to be truly great.

>Running electron apps
Well you're just asking for it at that point.

>Its just Linux. GNU/Linux sounds retarded, and no one in the real world will take you or your OS seriously if you call it that.
That depends on if you are using GNU userland tools. I wouldn't call my system GNU/Linux, because the GNU tools are not part of the core system.
The Linux kernel *is* more important than GNU, but I'm working on moving away from both GNU *and* Linux.

>Package count does not matter.
Maybe. It's better to have an easy, yet secure & stable package system, than to have a lot of packages.

>"Software Minimalism" is nothing short of thinly veiled masochism.
You aren't being specific enough. If you're talking about projects like "suckless," then yeah, you have a point.

>Vim and Emacs are a complete waste of time, and you all make way too much fuss over your text editors. Its the artist, not the brush that counts.
I wrote this post in neovim, through a firefox plugin. Your second sentence is correct. The beauty of a good editor is that it gets out of the way, so that you can get work done. Massive IDEs can cause more problems than they're worth in many cases.

>Systemd is not botnet. Prove me and wrong and audit the code. Oh wait, you aren't a programmer and don't know how an init works. You likely can't even tell me why you don't like it without copy-pasting someone elses opinion.
SystemD makes my life easier, except for when it doesn't. Sometimes the documentation doesn't match the implementation. I prefer SystemD to init.d/rc.d scripts, but I think an even better solution could be made.

>Arch and Gentoo are a waste of time, and have no place in the professional world or home computer.
Arch is like a lazy version of Gentoo, which is like a patchwork Linux BSD. Either of them are simply a starting point for building something else.

>Desktop/Screenfetch threads are what give Windows/Mac users the impression that our OS is a useless toy.
Windows and Mac users do the same thing. Interesting that Windows/MacOS always looks the same though, while *nix can be very different.

>Only Incels use tiling window managers. You also waste so much time ricing and customizing that you forgot the point was to make you more productive.
I use xmonad and I'm married. It doesn't take much time to get my system to work the way I want, and it saves me way more time in the long run.

>Linux is a great kernel
>All desktop distros are garbage
>Android is the closest Linux came to be truly great
Wew, that's one hot take

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ok you got a slight chuckle, but that still doesn't explain why the fuck people complain about 100mb of ram being used between DEs, I get that the difference between xfce and gnome 3 is astounding, but it just feels like bickering, the same can be said when people complain about storage problems, 700mbs of OS and 900mbs of OS is super small, astronomically small, yet some still bitch, what are you dying over that 200mb for? Maybe I'm just bitching because I have lots of excess to use, but 1TB hard drives are cheap.

I'm not talking about storage. Just RAM. Storage is pretty cheap and very expandable.

So then what do you use for a daily?

agreed

agreed

agreed

idk im not a programmer

"botnet" is not the complaint people have about sysd

arch seem pointless gentoo definitely has a use. the devs themselves refer to it as a meta distro.

kinda

stock tiling WMs work perfectly fine. I use stock i3 and spent mayb3 15 minutes creating a few custom shortcuts. I would've had to do the same thing with a full DE anyway. stock i3 is fucking goat.

>>Vim and Emacs are a complete waste of time, and you all make way too much fuss over your text editors. Its the artist, not the brush that counts.

vi is good to know. I spent some time working in a SOC for an MSSP and had to support 10-15 different types of device platforms. Every single one of them with a shell had vi as part of the POSIX standard. Most of them ran really stripped down environments. Couldn't just slap your favorite text editor on these. It was vi or nothing.

>agree
>agree
>depends
>agree for most of Jow Forums, it does however use google dns by default, this is indisputable
>no for home, anyone using those professionally is retarded
>agree
>i kinda doubt people ricing would be doing anything productive anyway

>games are important for getting people to use linux
>microsoft can piss users off, and as long as apple is attractive, linux wont grow
>as long as prebuilt computers come with windows, there is no money saved by using linux for most users
>if autodesk ported their products to apple, proprietary file formats could easily consolidate, take over and permanently box out linux users
>as long as adobe autodesk and microsoft refuse to support linux, most people cant switch
>until major funding is put to wine, virtualization, and passthrough, the workarounds will be unreliable and slow.
>refusing to force users to pay for software is bad for developers and for users, because developers need cash to maintain a viable alternative and a lack of viable alternatives leads to extreme monopoly prices
>adobe microsoft and autodesk sell overpriced software, but gnu is too underpric3d to compete
>releasing source code is bad and leads to permanent underfunding, defacto gratis forks, abandoned projects, and directly benefits closed source competitors immitations
>even the open source maker community knows this and uses google sketchup to design practical models, a free nonlinux closed source tool, the problem was always dollar cost, not source code or freedom.

>I think an even better solution could be made
This exists and is called runit

People are fucking retarded for suggesting regular ass people ditch Windows/OSX for a Linux distro. Even Ubuntu requires some terminal work from time to time.

>1st arg about Linux naming
agreed. Although i would use GNU/Linux in a formal enviroment
>3rd arg about minimalism
Software minimalisn is about having everything that you need and nothing else. A 1000 package system can be minimalist as long as its user requires every package.
>Vim and Emacs are a complete waste of time.
Simply false. For one, vim is actually useful when editing smol config files over ssh. And as for using both of them as a full programming enviroment, you said it yourself. It's the artist, not the brush that counts. Both vim and emacs can be configured to serve as a full IDE, it just depends on who wants/likes to use it.
>Systemd is not botnet
While the main argument has some merit, i have to say that systemd is simply too big and sprawling for a desktop enviroment. Unless you have a huge server and have to leverage the full capabilities of systemd, i would see no point in using it over, say, runit or openRC.
>Arch and Gentoo are a waste of time.
Both have their use cases. I like using arch because it offers a huge package library thanks to the AUR. I don't use gentoo because i don't want to waste time compiling every application that i use, but i can see it's usefulness in an enviroment where computing power is a priority
>Desktop/Screenfetch threads are what give Windows/Mac users the impression that our OS is a useless toy.
How does a program meant to display the information of a system give off an impression of it being an useless toy? It's not about the OS, its about it's user. I've seen plenty of autistic anime-filled MacOS and windows rices. The only problem in this case would be the fact that due to linux's current 'complex' nature, more autistic users tend to flock to it.
>only incels use tiling window managers.
again, it's all down to your preference. I've seen people use unriced i3, and i use a very basic config bspwm on my desktop, and openbox on my laptop. I can say with confidence that i am more productive on my desktop.

100% agree.
what I'd add:
Neither Windows, Linux or Mac os are good operating systems. Each has it's ups and downs and you have to know when to know which to have a good computing experience. Shilling for one of them is always bs.

>Gentoo is a waste of time
not if your intention is to learn more about the components of your system and be able to figure out how to modify them.
I think Gentoo gets a lot of hate because they expect to be able to use it for something that it wasn't meant for.
Gentoo is for being able to just learn more about what you're using and get a better feel for how your system works
Gentoo is NOT for developing large applications and being able to use a comprehensive desktop that can run games and train TensorFlow models

If you tell me to use Gentoo for my servers, im gonna tell you to go fuck yourself

if you try telling me that i should use gentoo to get a better perspective for how my software works and what can be done to optimize it, im gonna listen to you

if youre gonna tell me to install it so i can get a cool tiling manager and post on a desktop thread, im gonna tell you to go fuck yourself

>Arch is easy to set up and use. No idea what you're talking about.
yea its so easy having to do almost as much work as you would for a gentoo install without all the benefits of a gentoo install

That's actually a really good perspective on Gentoo. I hadn't thought about it that way, but it makes perfect sense when approached as a leaning tool.
Thanks.

It's just GNU. GNU/Linux is as retarded as Android/Linux, Windows/NT or Mac/XNU and just Linux is as retarded as Linux (instead of android), NT (instead of windows) and XNU (instead of Mac)

I don't think it was their original intention, but after reading their documentation (which is very comprehensive) it definitely seems as though they've pivoted to be more of a learning tool than anything

Are you retarded? You don't have to do even half as much work as a Gentoo install, pacstrap does everything for you.
And what benefit? Taking 30 times longer to install a program?

>don't have to do even half as much work as a Gentoo install
retard alert

>pacstrap /mnt
>genfstab -U > /mnt/etc/fstab
Yeah that looks about as hard as a Gentoo install

i never said it was hard i said it was overly-tedious for a shitty distro

>running two commands is tedious
>runs Gentoo
You got me, well played

Is GNU/Linux even correct? Are really all other defining component used in the distributions of Linux part of GNU?

>arch totally is easy to setup just run pacstrap!!!
>(((not mentioning all the pre-installation shit you have to do as well as chrooting into your environment, setting up DNS info, having to use an ethernet connection to install wifi drivers)))
youre glowing in the dark pretty hard right now

Based boomer sets it straight youtube.com/watch?v=RNeKYjWx-s4

All of your opinions are popular. You're just posting things Jow Forumsentoomen usually disagree. Your thread is bad and you should feel bad.

debian is SHIT

Nobody actually buys your "more/better drivers" forced meme you've been peddling for a decade.
Nobody buys the "Wine/PlayOnLinux/Proton" crap either, after being burnt, burnt, and burnt again for 10 years.
In fact, a lot of Linux's credibility problems can be traced to claims such as these. If you stopped the steaming BS and played to its strength, FOSS ecosystem's credibility would immediately rebound. This is why Windows and macOS have paid shills - look what happened with the "freedumb!" mob shilling.

I'm utterly terrified by how right you are.

based
GNU/Linux is retarded to no avail. If you are going to name the OS after the utils, shit like Kali would be called BSD/GNU/Debian/Kali/RandomGitHubDeveloper1/RandomGitHubDeveloper2/.../RandomGitHubDeveloperN/Linux

>a lot of Linux's credibility problems can be traced to claims such as these. If you stopped the steaming BS

It's not like they're deceptive on purpose. The typical Linux nerd just can't comprehend why this shit is hard to set up for a non-tech savvy person.

That said, Proton, works very well and without jumping through a dozen hoops. That is, as long as the game is officially supported.

Why can't linux have a standardized executable file format, like windows and mac os have? Why am I forced to use terminal to install everything goddamnit. Am I just retarded that it bothers me, or is it a valid opinion?

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>Its just Linux. GNU/Linux sounds retarded, and no one in the real world will take you or your OS seriously if you call it that.
Linux has a bad name to it. Linux is perceived as nerdy and is seen by many as a command line system (some truth desu). GNU doesn't have a mainstream recognition yet. GNU is the operating system, Linux is the kernel. Linux shouldn't even be in the title as it contributed so little to the development of GNU, and goes against everything GNU stands for. Fuck you.

You're retarded. Linux executables exist, they just dont have filename extensions. When you compile a program on linux, it comes out as a file that you name. typing "./filename" launches it from the terminal. Double clicking it in your file manager loads the program without showing you terminal output. The underlying systems to do these things is there if you so desire, but people use package managers because its better and ensures security updates through repositories.

Now go pick up a book.

>Nobody actually buys your "more/better drivers" forced meme you've been peddling for a decade.
t. AMD user.

>this tripfag

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>You're retarded
>(deliberately) miss entire point is making by ignoring word "standardized"
>so you can try to sound smart by vomiting something barely related
>fail epically

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>i still miss the ease of use of the device manager and would like it in distros
>the screen tearing shit needs to stop
other than that i'm fine

Do you mean a standardized installer?

lsusb and lspci aren't enough of a replacement?

bluetoothctl?
That shit is easier than using Windows.

is a pocket pusy enough of a replacement for a real pusy?

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I told him packagemanagers are the future and are the new standard more secure and just better in general (which, in hindsight i didnt think i had to explain further but if youre not aware is because of the ability to update all applications at once, and less likelyhood of getting malware).

Senor Dickhead

I guess that would be a better wat to say it. It kinda bothers me that in windows all i need is to launch an exe file and click next a couple of times and software is installed while on linux I need to mess with the terminal, look for the correct exec in a bullshit tar.gz archive etc.

Use Antergos. Two click installation of packages from the world's largest set of repositories, thanks to the pacman GUI, and the efforts of Arch which Antergos is derived.

It's literally an app store but with a checklist to install everything you want in one go. 10x better than any other gnu/linux distro, and of course better than win10 (pft, installing one application at a time?)

It is one the intersection point between freetards and iToddlers. I really don't understand why you guys don't get along better, since you're so similar.
>living in a walled garden is better
>insistent my interface is so much better than everything else
>really believe my OS makes my applications superior
>like a faggot, jam your ideological crap down the throat of anyone within earshot
>waste your life (time in case of freetards, money in the case of iToddlers) on pointless shit
>need to emulate/dual boot to Windows to get any actual work done

Linux has the worst fucking userbase and software because everyone who develops for it does it because he is bored.

Vast majority of Linux devs are paid by corporations to develop Linux.

IOW
>unrelated shit

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My pasta follows.
---

vim is crap. Just check out its built-in scripting "language". Check out its syntax highlighting engine. Check out how its autoindent is implemented. That’s just a horrible and totally broken pile of insane hacks.

*sh is crap. Impossible to return a value from a function, no data structures other than strings, arrays of strings, and hashes from strings to strings. The easiest way to simulate a function returning a value is to fucking fork the interpreter, run the function is the child and then capture its output. Shitload of "pitfalls".

Make is even crappier, but I guess it’s kinda unrelated.

Apparently these "UNIX people", when ignoring the limitations of existing tools becomes impossible, prefer to add more and more dirty mad hacks on top of 40-year-old crap, instead of actually improving the existing tools and/or developing new ones (zsh has fucking EXCEPTIONS and FTP client and whatnot, but still no one thing I’me mentioned for *sh).

mutt is crap. Sometimes I have to use a crappy internet connection, and it fucking freezes. And then says something like "mailbox closed" and simply fucking hangs.

I get 95% of my work done on my gnu/linux laptop, thank you very much. And the stuff I use windows for is actually on a seperate computer I bought for gaymen only but ends up filling the gaps of linux

I win because i have both and use each when it suits me best. Laptop for privacy and travel, desktop for performance and compatability.

Why choose one, when you can choose all?

okay, this is epic

>Package count does not matter
>"Software Minimalism" is masochism
package count and minimalism matters in server settings, if you have a desktop and you have a valid reason to have a lot of software/libraries/services running then stick to what you're doing
>Vim and Emacs are a complete waste of time
there's a reason why literally every text editor and major piece of software supports vim keybindings and it's not because learning vim is a waste of time
>Its the artist, not the brush that counts
vim won't make you a better programmer, sure, but you also don't want to be troubleshooting and second guessing shitty subpar tools because you have a phobia of industry standards
>Systemd is not botnet. Prove me and wrong
there's no proving you wrong because nobody with any authority is saying systemd is a botnet, the complaints are that it's an unnecessary complicated black box of software that is difficult to troubleshoot and audit when things go wrong
>Arch and Gentoo are a waste of time
having to package rpm/deb software is a waste of time, arch/gentoo have their place and they have never pretended to do anything other than fill their niche
>Desktop/Screenfetch threads are what give Windows/Mac users the impression that our OS is a useless toy.
>Only Incels use tiling window managers. You also waste so much time ricing and customizing that you forgot the point was to make you more productive.
if you were to stop projecting for a minute you might realise that not everybody who uses a tiling wm rices it, and the people that don't rice their desktops aren't the type of people that generally post in desktop threads - you won't see many plain windows desktops with a nondescript background for the same reason

Yet day in, day out, the 95%-odd of desktops out there get 100% of their work done on Windows. Let's do the math:
95% of 1% = 0.95%
100% of 95% = 95%
In other words, you can literally do 100x as much with Windows.

THIS IS WHAT YOU NEED TO FIX. Don't PRETEND it can do everything Windows does (or be totally flagrant, and suggest it does more) - actually DO it. 's pasta is also pertinent. While you're at it, ditch the "Your fault (core dumped)" attitude when things break.

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>this tripfag

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>told what's wrong with Linux
>shoots the messenger
>wrings hands uselessly WHY WON'T PEOPLE USE LINUX???!!1!eleven

Linux needs to become a proper, standalone OS to become good. Being just a kernel and relying on others to actually combine various components written by unrelated people into a distro is the wrong way to do it.

I don't expect a brainlet like you knows what argumentum ad populum is. You should take a rhetorics class.

>Why can't linux have a standardized executable file format
because a) pic related, b) nobody has really cared about this up until now, and c) you need the support of developers packaging their software in this format for it to take off, which is by far the biggest issue
things like flatpack and appimage have come along but they're mostly in response to retards packaging standalone software as docker images to get around to having to package software for multiple distros, the biggest problem is that these solutions are inherently biased towards standalone small binary utilities rather than full programs because of the issues of having statically compiled software on an os that has historically been dynamically compiled, to be concise it's a complicated issue with no real 'solved' solution
>Am I just retarded that it bothers me, or is it a valid opinion?
you're a retard for wanting to apply your windows workflow to linux but it's a completely valid and justifiable opinion that the way software is packaged on linux is terrible

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>brainlet
>yet the entire FOSS ideology is based upon doing the same failed shit for quarter-of-a-century
Actually got a chuckle out of this.