The hero we need

>the industrial revolution and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race.
>population is 100 times the size
doesn't seem that way

>t. Never read uncle Ted.

>quantity > quality
That's how I look at life too.

why would I read the work of a serial killer? I'm not an edgy 16 year old

Quality of life has also improved, you can be a useless neet and shitpost on the internet all day on welfare

someone tell me who this bloatnigger is and why i should care

That's what they do in Brazil.

He was right to some extent. We shouldn't always have our heads buried into screens, but that doesn't necessarily mean we should go innawoods either.

Quality of life according to whom, some disconnected UN thinktank nobody takes seriously?

>some disconnected UN thinktank
lol
I think not dying of disease, everyone being able to afford food, not being drafted into a war, and not having to work on a farm or in a factory are fairly universal indicators of quality of life

People do die of disease, aren't able to afford food, get drafted into war, and have to farm or work in a factory.
What are you even talking about?

>can't understand measures of degree
I guess this is the level of discourse you can expect from someone who idolizes a serial killer

Who is idolizing anyone?
This is a discussion about the fact that quality of life hasn't improved objectively, and it is in fact worse on many levels.

It has, and I just told you how

No.
You provided a lot of hearsay and subjective viewpoints.

All of those things can be objectively proven to have gotten better since the industrial revolution, you'd be about as delusional as a flat earther to deny it

He was like a lefty.
Great at pointing at everything wrong, but absolutely awful solutions to fix it.

Oh, look, a thread from some "red pilled" doomer worshipping another mass murder.

Get a therapist and don't shoot up the school, Joe J. Johnson.

Nothing but a demented murderer. Fuck him

Ted kascinsky the unabomber.He wrote Industrial society and its future.Google it it's well worth the read.

You don't have an argument; do you?

This 100%

I do, I've already told you what it is. A simple Google search can prove all of the things I said. True, the of the second industrial revolution caused the worst wars in history, but the aftermath of that is large scale wars are now too terrible to even consider and most of the civilized world lives in peace. You have absolutely nothing to say to that apparent from pretending it isn't true.

>20th century is the bloodiest century ever
>1 million people died annually on average
>21st century is worse than 20th century
Huh? How is that peace?

st century is worse than 20th century
It's not. We live in the most peaceful time in recorded history iirc. After WW2 war deaths in the civilized world basically stopped

I take it that you are eurotrash.

Did I expose the seething American?

thank you kanye, very cool!!!

Good luck defending yourself in the next big one without guns.

>the next big one
yeah you wish

Can't see the forest for the trees; huh?

>t. Fukuyamist
>he still believes the history has ended
>in 2018

The "forest" is the USA are currently the biggest warmongers on the planet, considering I live in the first world which is aligned with the US I won't be needing to defend myself

not even close

Don't even know what that means; huh?

I can interpret it to mean anything from your vague implications and lack of any substance

>when you have absolutely no argument

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Sure you can measure it like that, indicate that the Chinese are happy and prosperous despite having detergents used in their regular food supply, and suicide prevention nets installed at the bases of their manufacturing facilities, disease rates are astronomical, and hospitals are running at critical mass while their government attempts to push coverups to satisfy local and international news syndicates. And rest assured their freedom is wholly unmitigated, they even have access to the world wide web unrestricted, right?

Their population is massive.

In fact growth rates in all the worlds most wonderful places are booming. Surely we'rd more prosperous now than ever.

Let's not forget in a substantial portion of the first world suicide rates and chronic substance abuse is at an all time high. Self-reported depression and loneliness to match. Workplaces relegated to highly sanitary depersonalized grindboxes, while the economy spirals out of the control of the masses that create and drive it. Meanwhile the 1% and the .01% cluelessly steer us into their own divined oblivion.

Huge improvement. Give me my fucking cholera and plowshare faggot.

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China isn't a developed country. They're basically having their industrial revolution right now.
Substance abuse isn't a new problem. Depression is a new problem, but this depression exists in absense of all other problems like poverty and war. Any sane person would agree depression is preferable to real, physical problems. As a whole, workplaces are better than they were before, because as I already pointed out most people were farmers or factory workers. Sure there's less artisans, but you're crying about minor problems while ignoring the all the major problems that no longer exist

>no true scotsman

False. You're complaining about the industrial revolution. China is literally undergoing their equivalent right now. First world countries are post-industrial revoultion and their living standards are better in almost every respect

>no true scotsman

>no real arguments

t. never watched father ted

Excellent logic, my dude

underrated

>China
>a nation capable of moving a city overnight
>not developed
I'm not going to pretend like the whole country is 10/10 100% developed, but outside of [most of] Europe nothing would meet my standards of development. China has the worlds 1st or 2nd largest economy by GDP (admittedly a shitty metric) they have paved roads, indoor plumbing, electricity, food availability, medicine, education. It has also been evidenced they can cause ripples in the international economy with their internal consumer base.

Compare that to say, oh, Zimbabwe or Brazil (one of their economic cohorts) and they pale in comparison.

No, substance abuse is not a novel problem, it is on the other hand accelerating proportionately with the inclination of "developed" people to form depression and loneliness. You've not worked a day in your life if you think workplaces are better now than ever. Beyond the panopticon level micromanagement most suffer, the deliberately constructed employer-employee insecurity serves to enforce the new paradigm. Top that off with weakened unions (due in large part to machinations like MSHA/OSHA) workers have zero leverage while being constantly watched by middle management hired out of business school with zero OTJ training in their given industry. They're illiquid so they're stuck as a Sandwich Artist with whatever degree they've accumulated a massive debt for.

>>some disconnected UN thinktank
>lol
>I think not dying of disease.
cities allow diseases to spread and a lot of diseases we have now did not and could not exist if we lived in smaller communities like people did before agriculture and in more rural communities after.
>everyone being able to afford food
t. Obviously doesn't realize how 1) this only applies to most 1st world countries and 2) isn't actually a good thing.
>not being drafted into a war
This happened after the industrial revolution too and war on the scale of WWI and WWII and modern conflicts would be impossible before agriculture for many reasons.
>and not having to work on a farm or in a factory are fairly universal indicators of quality of life
>farm
Agriculture
>factory
Industrial revolution
Are you brain damaged? None of these issues exist in the life style that Ted suggested. You are more likely die from trauma or old age, not heart disease or cancer.

>his first several sections of his manifesto are on why leftism is retarded.
You don't get freedom from society and technology with out mailing a few bombs.

t. Someone who didn't read the manifesto

>life literally has no purpose anymore and the majority of the "civilized" is on one or several drugs just to keep their body from killing them or prevent them from killing themselves
>but we don't have to produce our own food and can just be useless neets masturbating all day long so everything is great

Are you arguing against the industrial revolution or all forms of technology period? Because the latter is so fucking stupid it isn't even worth discussing, turn off your computer and put on your loincloth and go live in the woods
Cities existed before industrialization, when the black death wiped out a huge proporition of the world population
Wars happened all the time before industrialization, industrial war made war so terrible humanity had to stop doing it lest everyone be destroyed

You haven't opened a history book if you think workplaces aren't better, for the most part jobs weren't even physically safe. All the complaints you have a completely minor compared to the reality of being a labourer

Because the rights current solutions to everything are working so well right?

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>no u
something tells me left can't meme

I bet you look like this

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The truth is there were no solutions. The best he could do is warn. What do you think Prophets were trying to do and kept getting persecuted?

The human race has been a disaster for the industrial revolution. It's the humans that are shit.
Prove me wrong.

Sure, it's a very health society we have.
People are cutting off their dicks and call themselves girls and when someone thinks otherwise they screech out and want the abolishment of free speech. The best thing is that government actually does this. See Canada and Sweden.
>inb4 I'm not swedish
Just wait a bit,
Cancer rates are exploding since the 80 because unknown reasons.
If I had to guess it's a mix of sleep deprivation, shitty food(too much carbs and chemicals) plastic, and otheriwise unhealthy lifestyle. Testo levels are fucking dying => men are becoming wimps which reinforces point 1.
Government surveillance is increasing. See UK, NSA, China. And people fucking want it because they need "protection" from the bad guys.
Companies think you're their property. Everything you do will be recorded and will be used against you when the next chimpout happens. I don't see how this could ever change to the better again. When times are good, people become weak faggots. What are we gonna do? Keeping this cycle up forever?

You'd have lost at least 4 siblings to diarrhea and then gotten drafted to war. Every tiny infection could be lethal.

>Any sane person would agree depression is preferable to real, physical problems.
Don't make stupid assumptions.
I'd gladly change my depression for physical problems. I think this is actually the problem. People don't have a stuggle anymore. Everything is mundane, boring. There is no purpose anymore. No objective. Everything you do is not for survival but for social wankery. All people worry about is
>ehh this one's car is better than mine
>He touched bussy I want bussy too.

>Every tiny infection could be lethal

and thats a good thing

Sure, statistically you'd be likely to be dead and we'd be free of your posting.

People who think Ted was right either didn't understand his manifesto or doesn't understand how society works. Shilling a neoluddite philosophy on a technology board is something only edgy teenagers or trolls do.

Ted advocates that all scientific progress the last 200 years are bad, because it couldn't have happened without the way society restructured itself after the industrial revolution. He literally advocates that we should revert back to pre-industrial times, where we instead of relying on the system, it's "every man for himself". This means that instead of enjoying free time and being able to shitpost on Jow Forums, you edgy faggots would have to run around cold and starving trying to hunt food for yourself.

Advances in technology and science the last 200 years have literally only been possible because we live in a society that's moved away from bartering, to relying on the system so we can specialize in what we do best. Of course we're fucked if society crumbles, but the point is that we're better off when it doesn't. We enjoy more free time than ever before, we are happier, healthier and live longer. Just look at fucking hunter-gatherers in the African bushes, with an average lifespan of less than 50 years and an IQ less than 85. That's the consequence of living the way Ted wants us to. You don't need to live long and be particularly intelligent to fuck all day and hunt animals.

>live longer
Not true. People just stop dying early.
When tribe people life 80+, their health is usually better than our avg 50 year old. They have clean foods. It's not full of processed shit and chemicals. They also walk a lot. Much sitting is linked to early death.
>we are happier
How would you know that?
>IQ less than 85
because they're africans

>I'd gladly change my depression for physical problems. I think this is actually the problem
You're right
It is the core of the problem
You're such an irresponsible little shit you'd rather the entire world go back to the stone age than you actually deal with your depression

>he needs some Youtube e-celeb to tell him what to think
t. NPC

>Not true. People just stop dying early.
You're autistic if you believe "living longer" and "stopped dying young" are two different things.

>When tribe people life 80+,
They rarely do. Protip: before the industrial revolution, people rarely lived beyond 50.

>their health is usually better than our avg 50 year old.
That's demonstratively wrong.

>They have clean foods.
No they don't.

>It's not full of processed shit and chemicals.
Everything is "chemicals". Faggots complain that processed food is so bad, but there is zero evidence that it is. It has the same quality requirements as unprocessed food, and the reason people buy it is because they can spend less time cooking.

>They also walk a lot. Much sitting is linked to early death.
The only thing you've said that isn't fucking retarded or outright lies.

>How would you know that?
Because recorded history exists, and also who the fuck enjoys spending 18 hours working in the fields or whatever instead of enjoying free time?

>because they're africans
Because evolution doesn't select for it in those environments. But to be a success in modern society, however, you need to have high intelligence to even grasp the complexity of society and ordinary jobs.

>You're such an irresponsible little shit
Did I hurt your feefees?
>go back to the stone age
Never said that

Hunter gatherer tribes have worse health than people in the modern world. They get affected by all sorts of ailments from the food they eat and the livestyle they lead and die early because of it.

>They get affected by all sorts of ailments from the food they eat and the livestyle they lead and die early because of it.
This. Hunter-gatherers usually suffer from all sorts of deficiencies because their diets are limited and they die early. They also frequently lack knowledge about proper sanitation and lack vaccinations, meaning they are prone to drop dead from diseases.

>They also walk a lot. Much sitting is linked to early death.
They actually *run* a lot, which is good in moderation but also linked to skeletal and muscle wear and not good for your body if you do it all day every day.

>You're autistic if you believe "living longer" and "stopped dying young" are two different things.
Of course there's a difference. You're just looking at the mean, which is dumb. Of course the mean goes up when you cut out early death, especially deaths which are very far from the mean(child deaths and so on), but this means nothing when everything beyond the mean goes down again because I don't know something something rising cancer rates.
>They rarely do.
Right, because they first have to dodge all these early death causes we can fix easily by now, but if they do, their cardiovascular system is much better off than ours.
>No they don't.
Sure, if you say that it must be true.
>Faggots complain that processed food is so bad
It is.
>but there is zero evidence that it is
Most of these substances are understudied.

I'm not saying tribal lifestyle is so much better than ours. It obviously has problems and while we fixed most of these problems we also invented new much more latent problems which influence our health and quality of life more indirectly.

you're free to do cardio and not eat processed food
meanwhile hunter gatherer tribes in papa new guinea need medicine from the white people or else they die off from malnutritional diseases

>You're just looking at the mean, which is dumb.
Fine, look at the 90th or 95th percentile if you want. It tells the same story.

>rising cancer rates.
Oh god, not this meme again.
There are two reasons for why cancer appears to be more predominant:
1) We live longer, and don't die of childhood diseases and infections any longer, which allows cancer to develop. Humans suck at aging, which is why we are at our peak in the early 20s and why most people lose their hair at 30 and teeth at 70.
2) Medical science has improved vastly the last 70 years. We are able to more accurately diagnose cancer than ever before, which contributes to the rise in diagnoses.

>their cardiovascular system is much better off than ours.
Only if you compare it to the mean (which according to you is dumb). Of course fat fucks in the US is going to fuck the health statistics for the western world, but a healthy person living a modern life is way healthier than a person living a stressful and harsh life as a hunter gatherer.

>It is.
Processed food is not any worse than any other food you buy in the supermarket, and it's generally way better than the crap you grow yourself and spray literal tonnes of pesticides and herbicides on. Anti-GMO fags can fuck off.

Also, modern people tend to eat a lot more varied and get all necessary vitamins and nourishment we need, instead of being malnourished and suffering from deficiencies from one-sided diets.

>Most of these substances are understudied.
They really aren't. FDA and similar agencies are extremely strict in what is allowed for consumption.

>obviously has problems and while we fixed most of these problems we also invented new much more latent problems which influence our health and quality of life more indirectly.
Only if you are a lazy fuck to be honest. Normal people who exercise and don't overeat are way, way, way healthier.

U are just retarded.

>who the fuck enjoys spending 18 hours working in the fields or whatever instead of enjoying free time?

You're giving him the reason, he advocates for a meaningful life where you get happy with just the important things like being satisfied for harvest your shitty carrots. And being able to make a life of that is more enjoyful than just seeing your time fly away with what you call "free time".

>he advocates for a meaningful life where you get happy with just the important things like being satisfied for harvest your shitty carrots
That's why Ted is retarded to begin with. I'd be miserable doing this, most people would.

>And being able to make a life of that is more enjoyful than just seeing your time fly away with what you call "free time".
In my free time, I'm able to play music, enjoy art, read books, meet people and interact with them, learn a new skill etc. It's precisely because my existence is not merely a continuing struggle that I enjoy my life and am productive and develop myself.

No, that one was a disaster for the human RICE
Huhuhuh

Well we are turning into a dystopia because of technology just so we can get ads on our screens. Why do we go such lengths for fucking ads.Tech is controlling the world and soon it will control you. Don't conform? here have some pills to fix your ability to think for yourself. Have a different opinion? Your life is destroyed. Say one bad word on the social media? Here you lost everything. Your not happy because of the state of the world and realized you lost your freedom? Just take these pills.
This world is turning into Black mirror.

Ted correctly identified many issues in contemporary society in his manifesto, but was ultimately wrong in identifying their cause.
He makes the distinction between small-scale and large-scale technology, but the example he uses, Roman aqueducts, is an example of how even large scale technology can be used well, while avoiding almost every issue he mentioned in the manifesto.

What many people here don't seem to realize is that reliance on the "system" in order to get something as basic as food has existed since ancient times. It's nothing new. It just seems that it wasn't the case, in comparison, since nowadays we have much better technology.

Trading part of your "freedom" to get something in return has always been the implicit contract of society. That's just how things have always been, and how they will always be, no matter the level of technological development.
No living being has truly been "free", not even in prehistoric times. You can't just choose not to hunt anymore, or you will die. You must still obey your biology.

There is something that he does mention, but most people overlook: leftism. Nearly everyone seems to completely overlook that entire section when discussing the manifesto. And of you look at the way many """tech""" companies behave, it's perfectly accurate.
That's the real problem. Even large-scale technology is a tool after all. A laege, complex tool that needs sustained maintainence by many people in society, but a tool nonetheless.
What a certain society does with technology is ultimately a reflection of its main values and beliefs. The west in particular have pretty much completely lost the notion of the sacred, leading to people finding shelter in vague ideals such as "progress" to replace the gods.
That way, technological progress becomes the goal, and not simply the means to express the values of a healthy society. That's why other countries, despite being technologically advanced as well are still quite different.