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Bloated
Slow
Package manager is shit
Way too hard for what you get, other than that, it's flawless.
So just use Parabola.
Use sourcemage.
Lack of maintainers and the few of them are circlejerkers. Bugfixes are sitting in the bugzilla for months with multiple bumps for a push request. They don't give a fuck.
Package manager uses python, init system is bloated openrc. At least they're just starting to move from rsync to git, something other distros have been doing for years.
Gentoo with runit would already be much better
Bloated
Slow
Package manager is shit
Takes too much time to install.
Bloated
Slow
Package manager is shit
all it needs is SJWs and it would be a microcosmic epitome of everything wrong with linux.
Has its flaws, but still is far better than any other distro
has plenty of flaws that are being worked on, as with any other distro.
still the best distro, objectively. compiling from source is a pain but portage makes it a walk in the park. Retards from arch who have to deal with the aur aren't well accustomed to something like portage, or source based package management in general. god forbid they try to use something like source mage or slackware without use of slackbuilds, they'd probably cry and give up. if you've used linux long enough to experience slackware, or have ever once even tried to make use of source mage's sorcery package manager, portage is a fucking blessing - literally. and you'd realize that if your scope of knowledge wasn't limited to pacman.
the brainlets in here criticizing portage for being too difficult to learn are probably too stupid to use it, portage is literally perfect except for being written in python. it's simple, featureful, and one of gentoo's greatest accomplishments. if figuring out how to use overlays and local repos is difficult for you, don't use linux. if memorizing emerge flags is too difficult for you... you REALLY shouldn't be using linux.
The logo is dumb. Otherwise I like Gentoo.
I would use it but the system is bloated, the thing is slow, and the package manager is utter shite.
everything i dont like is bloated slow and has a bad package manager
install arch
Is there any recovery for gentards after this?
Yeah, it's all wrong.
All three points are a lie
no deterministic builds
binary package system is a feature light aftertought
Bloated. Wastes too much time compiling (some people actually have jobs). Shit package manager.
I'm stuck with arch which is: Bloated and has a less shitty package manager but doesn't take hours compiling after each sysupdate.
>Bloated
>>Bloated
>system is bloated
>Bloated
What the hell are you fags on about? I gave up on Gentoo because it was too damned minimal, rather than too bloated.
>openrc
>python based package manager
>compiling from source = bloat
Nigga, minimal is not "doesn't have too much shit when installed".
It would be the perfect system for "forgotten" archs like SPARC or PowerPC.
That is, if their live isos for those architectures could even decompress the stage3 tarballs, which they can't.
Main problem for me is the package manager and the time it takes to compile everything. Other than that it's fine by me and I do run it on my W510
nonces who don't know how to use portage
anyone who parrots these brainless quotes is a complete and utter retard
>muh python
doesn't matter
anyone who lists package manager as a complain is stupid, and anyone who complains about bloat doesn't know how to use useflags and gcc optimization. (what is a make.conf, gcc-config, et cetera...)
The average compile time on a crappy Ryzen 2400G is around one minute per package, and that's with the remaining system load (usage continues) and a very 'nice' portage.
Only a few packages take a long time and you can use them as -bin package, AppImage or just have them installed beforehand.
Muh jobs argument can go fuck itself.
ARCHLETS TOTALLY AND UTTERLY BTFO
>openrc
You can change it to whatever you want, anyway much lighter than systemd.
>python based package manager
You can use something else, and it doesn't matter since what you install with it will be way lighter than any binary distro especially arch.
>compiling from source = bloat
You can use binary packages. Anyway wtf how is it bloat to have the choice to remove what you don't need?
Builds are determinustic unless compilers make them not so?
Binary package management is close to as complete as on most binary focused distros, and if you want more, you're better off on Sabayon.
What about compiling on a 10 year old i7?
>Bloated
opposite
>Slow
compiling is yes
>Package manager is shit
its one of the best
No systemd means it will become incompatible with most software
logo is the best
Install Gentoo
Too hard for filthy casuals. *buntu forever!
My unoverclocked 920 took about 25-30 minutes for genkernel all.
This.
Not at all true. Actually, Gentoo has ripped many of the few things that are good about systemd and made them fully functional in an openrc environment. (see gentoo's fork of udev, among others)
Insofar as source repos go, Arch users only have the AUR to work with, they aren't accustomed to the applicability of USE flags, let alone something like Gentoo's make.conf. The AUR, being a repository for frankenstein package builds, is probably why they haven't got a favorable opinion of compiling from source.
True. No one has to use Gentoo.
Huh, Gentoo was one of the first distros to support systemd. I've long been running it with systemd, and OpenRC is capable of using many systemd components.
>No systemd
so uninformed, yet so opinionated
Takes 12 hours to install because you have to compile everything like an autist
better than spending the whole day fixing X
I've actually also done that with an i7 920. And I still run my laptop on a Core Duo T9400.
It's a bit of energy waste to use either and they could use a SSD. It still works while doing your own stuff, albeit it's ~4-10 times as slow [much of it could be negated with a SSD and picking compile options like O2 rather than Ofast and probably clang instead of gcc].
Or you could just make a modern desktop help them out with distcc. Or get newer hardware. Or run Sabayon/CloverOS binary packages when needed.
i enjoy my life on gentoo with r7 1700. no problem with compiling speeds
Is it a good idea to replace openrc with runit? Does gentoo have a nice support for it?
>Is it a good idea to replace openrc with runit?
Unlike with systemd that has a whole bunch of capabilities that OpenRC doesn't have, you don't really gain anything much.
I figure runit is mainly an option for people who know exactly why they want it. Else it's probably just a more bothersome thing to use.
> Does gentoo have a nice support for it?
AFAIK, it has normal support for it. Haven't tried it recently though.
wiki.gentoo.org
I don't know what people have against openrc but sure if you don't like it gentoo supports runit just fine.
BTW part of the reason is also that OpenRC can use some of the primary additional Runit features:
wiki.gentoo.org
The other way around isn't that great.
please educated yourself on this, compilers by default don't produce deterministic results but with careful tweaks can be made to do so. portage itself also leaves extra timestamps inside pkg's produced that can't be easilly controlled.
binhost and clients basically need to be the same architecture and cflags be set such that they are combatible with all. that all needs to be checked manually as there currently is no mechanism in the binary pkg format to even record how or to what uarch things were build for
Please educate yourself, you got control over your compiler and can use these settings.
Portage does not "leave timestamps" everywhere. The metadata is in its own folders like /var/db/ and /var/log/ . Yes, these have time stamps and other situational (but still generally deterministic) information - why the fuck would they not? It would be stupid to omit typical diagnostic information like that from logs.
Please stop being such a blinded fanboy. It's not practical to do deterministic builds on gentoo at the moment. Neither are pkg a usable solution on anything else than limited local usage where you need to put unreasonable time into making sure it works like it shoulds because that format doesn't store even the basic information about how the pkg was build
Also note that I'm not saying gentoo is terrible and unusable because of these. I'm just saying gentoo is not perfect and has some flaws in it, i.e exactly what op asked for.
Yes, it is practical. Almost nothing is more practical, since the OTHER distros don't intend to give you control over the compiler to make it possible to do your own deterministc builds.
And yes, even binpackages store a lot of information about the build. But they aren't technically specified in detail by the package manager spec.
They are also completely irrelevant to the argument because if you use binaries, you aren't even interested in deterministic compiles. You just extract binaries. Sure, that also is deterministic on Gentoo save for logs about it with the timestamps, but dat tangent we're on here is just silly.
Install Gentoo.
Emerge is slow when it comes to resolving dependencies compared to pacman. Also, it cannot resolve circular dependencies.
Emerge sometimes does not track when a package, which depends on another package needs to be recompiled (because that other package has changed), which can lead to obscure, time consuming issues.
The wiki is incomplete and many parts of it are outdated. The state of non-english versions of the Gentoo wiki is worse. I could only install Gentoo (with systemd), because I know the ins and outs of Arch.
Gentoo's stable software branch is quite old for a rolling release distro.
Having to unmask individual packages for no appearent reason is annoying as fuck aswell as having to make over 200 different entries to package.use, package.unmask, package.accept_lkeywords, package.accept_license for a fully fledged desktop install with multimedia support and productivity software.
>TL;DR: I don't like it because it isn't Arch
>Emerge is slow when it comes to resolving dependencies compared to pacman. Also, it cannot resolve circular dependencies.
It's slow because it has to consider a ton of flags for each package. It can resolve circular dependencies and will recommend a certain action to fix it.
>Emerge sometimes does not track when a package, which depends on another package needs to be recompiled (because that other package has changed), which can lead to obscure, time consuming issues.
I'd say emerge is almost too careful about rebuilds. Not sure what clusterfuck you got yourself into.
>The wiki is incomplete and many parts of it are outdated. The state of non-english versions of the Gentoo wiki is worse. I could only install Gentoo (with systemd), because I know the ins and outs of Arch.
I managed to install Gentoo with the handbook literally coming from Windows. The translations are in a sad state, though, yes.
>Gentoo's stable software branch is quite old for a rolling release distro.
Yeah, that's the point of stable. Testing is more up-to-date but also very stable.
>Having to unmask individual packages for no appearent reason is annoying as fuck aswell as having to make over 200 different entries to package.use, package.unmask, package.accept_lkeywords, package.accept_license for a fully fledged desktop install with multimedia support and productivity software.
dispatch-conf
All of these faults are forgiven when one is reminded Gentoo respects your freedoms.
too delicate trying to build a desktop system without systemd. funtoo just werks
>Way too hard
what's hard about it?
it's like any other distro, but instead of "apt install" or whatever, you run emerge
Linux kernel is bloat
logo is too bloated
Openssl
>Gentoo is bloated
... what?
Gentoo is flawless, so use a distro derived from Arch?
>some people actually have jobs
People with * actual * jobs just use Windows, so no.
I have an actual job and I primarily develop on Arch Linux.
That's the canned response when criticising any distro. It gurantees free (You)s.
it's a toy for cumputing enthusiasts, not a real OS
>People with * actual * jobs just use Windows
Says the faggot who never stepped into a tech firm. Nowadays it's either Ubuntu or OSX, Windows is only predominant on pajeet enterprises or common offices were tech shit is almost like wizardry.
Are you retarded ? Never had an issue building Gentoo without Systemd.
Can't run basic programs such as photoshop.
you can use libressl
I literally can't.
Can you sort files by date created?
The benefits of portage are not worth the time and effort it takes to learn and get used to what's happening. Especially the kernel options.
With modern hardware you literally have no reason not to have literally everything on. Your system might be 0.1% faster, but saving that hour per year is pointless unless you actually enjoy learning and want to know how stuff works.
If you know all those things and have the free time and enjoy configuring your system then Gentoo is your distro of choice.
Otherwise Ubuntu is literally the best distro thanks to the support.
>time and effort it takes to learn and get used to what's happening
you're making it sound as if it takes more than an insignificant amount of time and effort
I installed gentoo, learned to use it and got pretty much used to it in an afternoon
takes less than 30 min to go through the whole handbook
>Especially the kernel options
With modern hardware you literally have no reason not to have literally everything on
>Your system might be 0.1% faster, but saving that hour per year is pointless
literally who cares about the kernel lmao
>If you know all those things and have the free time and enjoy configuring your system then Gentoo is your distro of choice
>Otherwise Ubuntu is literally the best distro
lol no
>thanks to the support
also, even if it took the time and effort you imagine it takes, it would be well worth it
You just need study a little more...
>takes less than 30 min to go through the whole handbook
Pretty sure it takes more than that
I should've phrased it differently: it takes less than 30 min to carefully skim through the relevant parts of the handbook
Maintainers sticking around and keeping things up to date is sometimes a hassel. Honestly it's mostly other things that are shitty like initramfs setups for microcode patching both a CPU and GPU, luks, etc.
> It's bad because it's not windows.
What is a "real" OS then?
The only problems are having a few missing or outdated packages (see pandoc), and being understaffed.
Apart from this, it's pretty much the best Linux distribution overall.
You try compiling things on a single core atom
Libreoffice takes over an hour to compile.
Launches faster than any other install of it that ive used though.
It took a while but you can now. Since version 4.11 of the Linux kernel (April 2017), there's a new statx() system call to retrieve it.
find . -printf "%T@ %Tc %p\n" | sort -n
Doesn't work.
$ find . -printf "%T@ %Tc %p\n" | sort -n
1548054960.5587284080 Mon 21 Jan 2019 08:16:00 AM CET ./file1
1548054973.0707285790 Mon 21 Jan 2019 08:16:13 AM CET ./file3
1548054973.2377285810 Mon 21 Jan 2019 08:16:13 AM CET .
1548054986.9697287690 Mon 21 Jan 2019 08:16:26 AM CET ./file2
I created . first, then file1, then file2 and file3 last.
>I created . first, then file1, then file2 and file3 last.
lol what? did? you? do?
I created the files in order, then I touched them in disorder.
>I created the files in order, then I touched them....
YOU BROKE LINUX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CUUUUUUUUNT!
This but unironically