*offers no tangible benefits over a cheap SATA SSD*

*offers no tangible benefits over a cheap SATA SSD*

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Nvme is faster than sata

false but even if it were true, it offers benefits in terms of packaging

they need to ship these things with screws. I had to dig one out of a laptop

This is a good thread to ask.
What's the speed difference between these samsung/micron things and those new cheap SSDs without DRAM?

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I have one very similar to ops pic and yes it is definitely faster than a sata SSD. If you are on a tight budget maybe it's not worth it, but I use my computer for work and I can get measurable productivity boosts from using top of the line hardware. For example, being able to cache an entire virtual machine disk can make a huge difference from the old days of using rotational storage and needing to constantly swap memory

Take a look at the drives in question on User Benchmark. In terms of longevity, I'm returning my Kingston A400 240 GB because its health is degrading after only 8 months and 5.5 TB written (of 80 TB specification).

How do you even measure its degradation

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Yeah this was figured out 3 years ago when they first came out if you actually bothered to look up the real world benchmarks. In real word situations they are about 10% faster than SATA. However, their price point has come down a lot. I ended up buying a 128GB Gen3 NVME for $50 canadian, (Transcend 110s) and put my arch install on it.

You BOTH negroes have it wrong
MLC NAND (good stuff): up to 3K P/E cycles
TLC NAMD (cheap stuff): up to 1K P/E cycles

So a 240GB SSD can endure up to 720TB if MLC and 240TB of TLC

Of course this is the maximum and a very conservative safe estimate is about half that. All assuming wear leveling algos are in place.

I used Hard Disk Sentinel, but any utility that can read the drive's SMART data will do.

B-b-but they help with cable management!

>this is what computer illiterate retards actually believe

The funny thing is none of that shit matters
Any SSD you buy that's not defective will provide years if not decades of desktop service before the NAND becomes an issue.

So Jow Forums should I buy those cheap SATA SSDs?
I heard that they lack DRAM and stuff...

some of them do. I got an SU800 and it has DRAM

shouldn't your motherboard have one already screwed in on it for the slot or in the box?

I don't remember ever removing one and I went through all the screw packages in the mobo box I kept and couldn't find one. not a big deal regardless

NVME is just a formfactor.
Speed is dependent on the hardware itself.

M.2 is the form factor

>NonVolatile Memory Express
>form factor

I got one even though I have perfectly usable and fast SATA SSDs for the cable management

Wait for pcie 4.0 nvme drives

holy fuck, is this bait? m.2 is a form factor. nvme is a specification for accessing flash memory over pci-e. it is going to be inherently faster than ahci because it doesn't have the bottlenecks that ahci does.

>5x the speeds
>sold by intel as a sort of "RAM extension", under the name "Optane"
>smaller

>"no tangible benefits over a cheap SATA SSD"

>NVME is just a formfactor.
you are thinking of m.2

takes up less space in a laptop

calm down sperg

And if there's no DRAM cache, as on the A400?

>weight (grams)
>size (mm^2)
>power usage (Watt hour)
>speed (Mb/s)
>no cables
these are all tangible (i.e. factual) benefits of nvme ssds over "cheap SATA SSD" (i.e. not m.2). Is "tangible" the new "literally"?

>buying SSDs

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dumb meme loving fuck

Gr8 b8 m8

why are you kids like this? why do you assume it was bait and not a simple mistake?

>weight, size
irrelevant in all but the smallest and most niche form factors.
>power usage
SSDs already use barely any power.
>speed
tradeoffs unless you get a high end one and then you're at a price premium
>wire autism
that's your hangup/opinion and doesn't mesh with your other complaints that mainly apply to laptops where you're just going to use whatever hardware came with it like a good little sissy bitch.

You mean the packaging it ships with?

It should, but more often than not, it doesn't. Especially on pre builts that don't come with an m.2 SSD already installed.

no

In most cases I think it's like double speed difference?

But in practice it doesn't actually matter because most programs can't actually do IO that fast.

Why can't the limited write problem of SSDs be fixed entirely?

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everything is destined to turn into dust, user. everything.

it's smaller, how is that literally not tangible?

fucking die retard

NVMe is always going to be more expensive that SATA regardless of the size and tier. It's always going to be faster, no exceptions.

>*offers no tangible benefits over a cheap SATA SSD*
Besides about 5 times its speed.

except it is 10 times faster than your kingston grabage ssd

> faster
> lasts longer
heh, nothing personal, kiddo.

>no difference with SATA
Because it's being bottlenecked by fucking everything.
The tech is far ahead than other components.
For example the reason you don't see a significant faster boot times is because it's waiting the CPU to do all kinds of shit, when OC'd the CPU the boot is faster.

Also we're talking about how OSes are generally optimized, PCIE, etc etc
Their actual hardware capabilities are much stronger.

I respect all the baiters, but...
>all those actual unironic poorfags seething and coping
NVMe SSDs are the same price per GB these days or even cheaper. Just because you bought a SATA SSD two years ago and now can't afford a NVMe one, does not mean everyone is wrong.
You get slightly better speed and much deeper queue depth, giving a lot more IOPS even on the same NAND between SATA and NVMe.

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>Especially on pre builts that don't come with an m.2 SSD already installed.
>they keep the psu box
>they keep the extra cables that come with the psu
>find they keep the screw for themselves aswell
These fuckers.

Are you mad?

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Where did you buy your SSD that you have to cover the serial? Do you actually buy via credit card and not hard cash? What a sheepie, you're part of the botnet, you're part of the problem.

>look at me, I have a shitty consumer SSD
983 DCT or go home

I'm pretty happy with mine desu

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Does MLC really amke much of a difference? I;m buying a new SSD soon and I'm not sure whether to get a Crucial MX500(TLC) or a ADATA SU900(MLC).

I'd said MX500, just because they have gotten a lot of positive feedback lately, while Adata always fails short on their promises.
Good TLC can be better than shit MLC. Unless you can afford something like , I wouldn't bother with MLC.

Every single potential usecase I think of in my head would be better served by throwing more ram at the box.

>1tb m.2 ssd costs about 100€ ion 2019
Its getting to the point where its so cheap no matter what you do people wont even mention it in pc building guides, you just buy whatever and its marginal cost to the overall build price.

Wanna know how I can tell all you do is play games?

NVME is getting really cheap now though.
I bought a 970 evo just because I couldn't be bothered with cables and drive bays.

M.2 is a very comfy form factor, and if you get one you may as well get an NVME.

it is true for the most part

funny thing is, games, namely the shit bethesda makes because they can't compress a fucking texture, are some of the few things where the full speed of nvme is seen.

not really, ssds bottleneck somewhere around 350-450mb read where programs and shit wont launch faster no matter what you do, as long as your ssd saturates sata, it will match an nvme in nearly every real world benchmark

However there are edge cases where nvme kicks satas shit in, one of them being recording video or working with video or using the ssd as a disk cache.

with sata that saturate sata and nvme costing nearly the same, may as well just get the nvme

as for how much faster, you get closer to 4 times then the rated speed with most non real world benchmarks.

wrong

>funny thing is, games, namely the shit bethesda makes because they can't compress a fucking texture, are some of the few things where the full speed of nvme is seen.
this is so true, I play TESO, sure it's not a direct Bethesda games but the developers are just as bad and the average load time off a SATA SSD is 1 min 42 sec while it's 1 min 17 sec off a NVMe
both high end Samsung SSDs

Every time you write to a cell, a huge voltage is used to push charge across an insulating layer. That insulating layer gets absolutely hammered by this, and eventually it fails. It's kinda like firing a gun through some plywood into a steel box to store a bit (writing a zero is also firing the gun, but with an anti-bullet that cancels out the first one. Okay, the analogy is shit, but just roll with it). It'll work for a lot of write operations, but eventually there won't be much plywood left to hold the stored bullet in. When bullets start to fall out, the storage controller marks the cell as failed. Since data is stored with error correcting codes, a single cell failure isn't a big deal.

cringe harder faggot

cringe what? literally every single benchmark that isn't an artificial load, or a web server load shows near 0 tangible benefits from nvme over a saturated sata ssd

If you get garbage that doesn't even saturate sata, then yea, nvme is a boost all round,

it's way faster and costs almost the same
so shut the fuck up and stop being cringe memer

read my words faggot
>with sata that saturate sata and nvme costing nearly the same, may as well just get the nvme

that's really the only reason to get nvme, the sata drives that saturate sata are nearly the same cost as an nvme, so for

>However there are edge cases where nvme kicks satas shit in

its worth it to get the nvme over sata, at least as a boot drive or if you are giving up nothing for a second nvme, I think mine either diables one of the slots or a few sata ports, I don't remember which if I got a second drive.

I was told not to bother going with these things for gaymen, picked up a BASED EVO 860 2TB instead. I'll never need another SSD AGAIN

Each manufacturer will generally provide their own disk health and management software des

Check an actual review or two online. Don't just go by the comments section. And no, don't settle for one without DRAM, you'll be sorry...

based is this bait?poster

h o u s e f i r e

>literally faster
I hate grapes too user

I have a 960 and 850, the nvme drive IS faster in terms of load times (in games like PUBG) but the difference is within +- 10 seconds.

your SATA meme would do the same but the interface is literally too slow.

>in games like PUBG
Don't play shit user.

If its for OS and gayms you will throw it away before the write limit kicks in
>200TB write action is a lot for the average user.
If you care about that you should go for slc

>SSDs already use barely any power.

Ackchually, faster NVMe drives can use up to 15W ad require heatsinks in order to not throttle under sustained load.

Depends on the board. Mine has a M.2 NVMe slot on the back side, so I'd rather do a bit of cable management than dismantle fucking everything to get to the drive.

>sustained load
>on an nvme ssd
>where you can write the entire thing to full in under a minute

k

>costs almost the same
I wanna see the receipts.

It does, but controller and exact type of flash chips make just as much difference.

You are also unlikely to exhaust the writes even on a shitty SSD in regular home use.

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>you can write the entire thing to full in under a minute
No, with random access you can't. And it takes less than a minute to overheat.

FYI the A400 doesn't come with DRAM and shits itself faster than UV500 or anything else with onboard DRAM.

source : my previous job project sold nearly 1000 units SSD and i7 7700 per quarter and the results is surpprising.

I thought that the form factor WAS the tangible benefit, I can tack three of these on my board without any cables and it looks clean as fuck

desu the form factor is why I'm using sata m.2 ssd's for my game storage, in the place of one 3.5 inch hdd I can put four m.2 ssd's and raid them together if I want.

Could have said carving data on woods and then using a smoothing plane or sander to sand off the data and then write new ones. You burgers should keep using the food analogy instead.

Can't wait until all I need to do is plug in a cheap 10tb nvme ssd into the motherboard.

>UnrealEngine
Epicgames been shit since 2k4. Only a few notable games uses it right, mirror's edge for example. The engine is a fucking botched humongo nvidia mess.

what normal application could put the thing under heavy load for more than 10-15 seconds? Especially if there's the only one in your system? Caching? Are you trying to tell me you're going to use a 250gb+ ssd for caching?

I own three NVMe drives in multiple computers and even when I'm flashing them with macrium reflect I don't get any throttling out of them, they barely heat up at all. My sata ssd on the other hand, cooks like crazy.

No normal application would do that, that's why the drives don't come with stock heatsinks.

I'm American which means I should soon learn Russian and, but until then what the fuck does this say?

so why are you worried about them overheating if normally they won't be close to overheating?

wow this is great

Yep and DRAMless SSDs are apparently set to become more prevalent because of the cost savings and reduced supply dependencies. The A400 was part of my first PC build and I thought I did my due diligence by checking reviews, but I didn't notice any of them discussing this 'feature'. It was only later when I saw a friend discussing the topic that I realised DRAMless SSDs were a thing, and that I might have one

I'm not, I'm just pointing out that SSDs can consume as much power as HDDs under certain conditions.

It's a SSD endurance test. X-axis is terabytes written before the drive died.

Why can't we have car tires that never need replacement?

Wrong, it is much faster at I/O throughput and if you need to move GB/s of data quickly, granted both cases are overkill outside of the professional world.

Literally has more speed than a SATA Drive and no one of the issues that you get from apply AHCI to solid state memory.
>be me
>replace my old SSD that I use as a caché drive for my tiered storage drive with a NVME
>load times reduce like crazy

where?

That's less physically accurate to what's really happening. Nothing is physically removed on each write, it's just that the insulation layer becomes less effective as it's broken down. When the insulation layer is no longer effective you can still store data in the cell, just don't expect the charge to stay put for long.

Size.