>tfw overheard chad from marketing brag to a client "just send over the data to us, our code monkeys will take care of it yesterday!"
Why is there so much disdain and contempt for programmers Jow Forums? It seems that wherever you work, the attitude is the same
There might be, but he might also be right. I think certain programming jobs can be described well with the term "code monkey".
When "programmers" started acting like animals and working unpaid overtime for extra vegan snacks and ping-pong tables, that is when the profession as a whole lost all respect from other professions.
It's just that marketing and development have a natural disdain for each other.
Developers hate marketers because they upsell absolutely everything with buzzwords and hype (despite the developers telling them their demands are unreasonable) and get swamped with work, overtime and disciplinary action when they inevitably fail to deliver the impossible.
Marketers hate developers because they often fail to deliver (even with simple tasks, if your development team is especially weak) and will put the marketer in bad light when the client asks why feature X that the marketed hyped up so badly is broken or why feature Y is completely absent.
Why does that cat look like Ron Perlman?
We get called "artists" and "rockstars" at work. I guess because we are a tech company and our clients are very grateful for our work.
CODE
ARTISAN
Seems to me like the only problem here is the marketer then.
(Protip: that's exactly how it is).
The competent ones get respected and promoted
And what are you going to do about it? Nothing?
Bring it up with your superiors. Threaten to quit if nothing is done about it.
This is why people step all over you, because you allow it.
In a perfect world. In the real world, its the ones who can shoot the shit the best with upper management while still performing their basic job function adequately (aka chad)
Marketing is a dirty job and you should feel good about actually producing something.
Because programming is easy.
Anyone with half a brain can do it.
Have you even tried doing stuff like marketing and PR?
It is fucking torture.
I half huge respect for these people.
They take shit day and night from clients.
Imagine that. Their job literally is eating shit every day and smiling while they do it.
I've tried it and I quit ASAP and am now studying to become a programmer.
It was impossible to do it. Clients are fucking animals.
You have to restrain yourself 24/7 from punching their disgusting faces.
I do not have that kind of self-control.
Hahahahahahahahhaahhahahahahahahahhahahaha!!
My sides.
How to spot the underageb&.jpg
Programming is exactly the same except "clients" becomes sales and management, AND you are expected to work 70 hours workweeks while only being paid 40 hours, or you get shitcanned for "being lazy". Also, if you work too well, you get shitcanned for being a threat to your manager's position. 90% of the job of a programmer is marketing and PR, except it's not toward a client, which is even worse. Moreover, performance is not evaluated on the basis of sales made-equivalent metrics (such as bugs fixed or lines of code written or commits accepted), but purely on how much your manager likes you, which of course can change at any time for any reason (i.e. there is no point in time where you can add a mark to your performance billboard and move on to the next goal). Unlike in marketing, you have to simultaneously please management and marketing which have radically different goals, yet both of them are able to fuck you up permanently equally well.
Trust me, you'll be infinitely more happy going back to marketing.
Based and true
Imagine living in whatever third world country you live in. Move somewhere with a proper labour market retard.
Fuck, forgot perhaps the more important aspects:
- you get paid fuckall by comparison
- there is NO chance you're ever getting promoted (sales gets promoted very easily, both sales and management get to be promoted to management positions and go up all the way to (local) CEO, engineers can be junior and senior but that's it, after that you have to change track, i.e. reapply as a new recruit but in either sales or management, and you will almost never be accepted because you don't have an MBA or sales degree).
That is what competence means.
I don't want to be promoted or become a manager.
I just wanna stare at my screen all day and be left alone.
Because the perception society has of programming stopped being grown men in work clothes in cubicles, and started being white and asian youngsters fresh out of college with their pijamas on
>be left alone
In programming? Fucking never ever my dude. You get daily meetings where you have to PR the shit out of the work you've been doing. You're not allowed to ever say things like "shit won't work dude your ideas violate the very laws of fucking physics". The fact you have marketing experience will greatly help you here because believe you me, you'll make complete use of your acquired skills there.
You're not going to be staring at your screen all day because that's how you get to live hell. Instead, you're going to go out for drinks with coworkers, and you better accept you little shit, or else! And behave while there. Not social enough? Get fucked.
You want to stare at your screen all day (featuring Jow Forums, not actual work shit), be left alone, and get paid for it? Become a manager. That's literally what they do for a living.
I'll just say I'm an alcoholic in recovery and not allowed to go to bars.
Also I'll say I am an autist, so if they complain about me not being social, they are discriminating.
Not a protected class. And they will discriminate against you even harder if you say you're an alcoholic.
Welcome to the real world.
Programmers on average and as a group are weak. You can easily underpay them. Those who studied business shit with the intention of moving up and making money can't be fucked with that easily.
There is such thing as chad programmers, but they generally just create their own corporations and end up turning into bosses.
Because you cry about it on Jow Forums instead of putting sugar on his gas tank, cutting his brakes or following him home and torching his house.
You'll always be a beta faggot
Because tribalism at every level of the stack. Who cares what some marketing cuck thinks anyhow, they're even more replaceable than h1b pajeet.
>Most popular college degree program, business major cucks believe this unironically
Sad.
Basically this.
If you're not a woman, mormon, nor a third worlder you're going to have to up your game in every way.
coders are literally overpayed translators. They will be outsourced and/or automated soon enough.
Being a software developer is such an undignified profession. You are strapped into an agile/scrum/kanban panopticon having to work on bullshit software storypoint by storypoint. There is no joy, no beauty, no quality.
You have to work with tools that could be completely irrelevant in 5 years. You constantly have to keep learning new shit. Currently we still got the devops wave, with Kubernetes washed up on top.
Software developers are usually unwashed big man-children who don't even own a white shirt. Nobody takes the profession serious because of that.
Fret no, there IS a way to make a sidestep and escape to one step above the pits: If you want to go towards management and have no idea how, you can aim for becoming a Scrum Master or Business Analyst / Requirements Engineer / Product Owner or (harder!) project/product manager. Those are essentially low level management roles. Your skills as developer make you the perfect fit for those roles. Become a CPRE or get a Scrum Master certification. Do that before you hit 30. The other route is becoming an architect.
>coders
i write books. i'm a worder
learn your place in this world
>Being a software developer is such an undignified profession. You are strapped into an agile/scrum/kanban panopticon having to work on bullshit software storypoint by storypoint. There is no joy, no beauty, no quality.
for you
>You have to work with tools that could be completely irrelevant in 5 years. You constantly have to keep learning new shit. Currently we still got the devops wave, with Kubernetes washed up on top.
Wrong. So wrong.
>Software developers are usually unwashed big man-children who don't even own a white shirt. Nobody takes the profession serious because of that.
sounds like you're projecting NEET.
>i just sucked this dude off what do you think about that lil donnie
Also people hate programmers because they're hard workers.
because brainlets mostly run corporate america.
They aren't brainlets, they just happen to have skills which tend towards the anticompetitive and lying behavior that's needed to run and sell a product and to sustain a stable income for faceless owners.
For one programmers typically can't socialize well, and tend to overthink shit. So eg client wants a feature, sales describes it to the developers and they either spend ages gold plating the thing because "i need to fix just one more thing!" (even though the feature is only needed for a half-assed demo) or autismo mode breaks out and communications go sideways fast "hurr i didnt know u wanted this!" "why didnt you say x y or z" etc.
Of course theres a sanity limit where sales IS making unreasonable claims, but honestly if youve made your case before then why would you even work with people who don't respect you?
Because programmers can't stand up for themselves.
Because they think of you as magic since they can't understand it. Also, most programmers are betas and can't justify screwups properly.
Similar shit happened to be when I was at a non-tech company. I brought it up to management and they didn't give a shit so I played the long game. It was only me and a handful of other developers at this company so we waited until we were in the middle of a critical project and all left within the span of a month. As you guess, that company is no more, and the I ended up at a tech company where developers arent treated like crap.
>tfw peeked at HR stacey and she's on facebook
Was that many decades ago? Or far away from the states? Quitting during a critical project is considered sabotage and you will be sued for it.
2 years ago in Ameriburger. We're in a right to work state so we can leave at any time for any reason and they can't do shit.
Really cool, and lucky. Well played, user.
>our code monkeys will take care of it
Except code monkeys call themselves this all the time.
>Quitting during a critical project is considered sabotage and you will be sued for it.
I have never heard that before. Source?
Sorry meant to quote
Sounds like the problem is in management of the dev team or the marketing team needs to have realistic expectations and not lie to clients.
Same. What prevents any employer from just calling leaving for any reason sabotage?
Just the legal burden of having to prove that in court. Same way that in theory you're often not allowed to work for another company in the same industry as you for the next 6 months or more, but in practice nobody cares except if you're a high position manager.