You spend years distro hopping, wondering between point releases vs rolling release...

i spent one year on mint and have stayed on debian ever since

>stable
servers
>testing
desktops
>unstable
if you live on the edge

Kek. Based "lolistation"!!!

It is bloated, slow, uses lots of ram and is the most unstable of all the init daemons.

SystenD takes what used to be a bunch of individual processes and puts them under one umbrella. Apparently this is against '''''''The Unix Philosophy'''''' (whatever the fuck that is.) But, it works fairy well, so only uber-autists actually get butt-hurt about it.

Well... thank you both for insight.

Took me ~10 years of occasional ubuntu installs to realise this. To my defense I've used linux as my main os for only about 1-2 years now. Before that I was really just checking how things were on linux from time to time, using it for couple of weeks and then crawling back to windows because muh games and such.

Major piece of system software that replaced 500 shitty disparate tools written 20 years ago and is now adopted by every distro that matters, whose main dev is rather idiosyncratic and brash. Some unironical boomers started autistically screeching about unwilling to adapt, and local underages adopted their stance to show how true oldfag they are.

*Breaks on the stable branch*
Whoops!

I used Debian on a server and it broke on upgrading to a new major stable release.

Systemd is 80 different software projects under one name. The project is so high quality that every distro that matters has adopted it.

>I used Debian on a server and it broke on upgrading to a new major stable release.
This happened to me too. I started using CentOS for my servers and realized CentOS doesn't even have an in-place upgrade.
Finally figured out that fresh install is the only way to go for major version server upgrades.

I've literally been using gentoo for 2 years straight and I finally have no thoughts of using something else. everybody has their own distro of choice so let them find it out themselves

Debian is too complicated. I use Ubuntu.

>it took me two years to develop Stockholm syndrome
Based.

Too old software for me. And no, backports don't have everything so I can't just get it from there. And testing / unstable aren't the best choices for a PC.

So I just use Kubuntu, and if I was very smart I'd probably use Fedora.

You can run OpenSUSE and use Snapper to roll back bad upgrades. There's the meme declarative distro Nix. And recently, using OSTree in a distro like Fedora lets you roll back updates atomically so you never really have to worry about a stable base distro again. I stopped running a server and use OSTree for my workstation so I can at least verify it works well.

sure then. I especially like it because it's incredibly stable without being fucking ancient

im doing just fine without CoCk and systemdicks thank you very much.
unironically debian is pretty good for stability and it will always be my fallback distro

casuals like you should be shot in the head.
glowies as well

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I don't think I've actually ever heard a good explanation why systemd is bad. Everyone always just say something like "its bloated and stupid". I could look into this myself but frankly, I don't really care that much.

bloated, stupid, against the unix philosophy, a large blob of unaudited code that glowies collaborated on. The fact that you are too stupid to see this as a bad thing means you should either educate yourself or go install windows

>I could look into this myself
You wouldn't be asking if you could.

Nice LARP. I admin a 1000 node RHEL cluster, and I honestly can't remember the last time we dropped a node due to systemd.
Get on board with the future or GTFO.

I didn't even ask though.

There's some antisystemd copypastas that are often posted. I bothered to research each point they make and they are mostly debunked or fear mongering. The only thing I found of concern was Google's DNS being used as a fallback in the network tool unless you or the distro maintainer changes it.

Replace the "bi" with a "vu" and you've got yourself a winner.

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>i just read some reddit comments trust me
read the actual debian wiki, anything that is not stable is not meant to be used by non debian developers

this, no OS can truly have in-place upgrades for servers. It's a clusterfuck with the configs even if everything works.
There's nothing like having a long term support OS

>perform OSTree upgrade
>just werks 99% of the time
What about that 1% where my super fancy config file that uses a bunch of decrepit functions!
>roll back and diff the configs and make the changes
>perform upgrade
>done

Pretty much agree with OP.
I used to build kernel and stuff on Gentoo and I loved it (and still love). But I have a job now, so I use Debian, because it just werks.

Can anyone tell me what's good about Debian?

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>against the unix philosophy
So is Xorg and Emacs, but I don't see a lot people here complaining about those.

Less bloat, stable and even easier compared to Ubuntu -- if you don't mind using the terminal.

Is that the new windows?

> >testing
> desktops
Shit breaks, yo. If you even need something newer than stable, use backports, or you'll be fixing it at least once a year before it releases. If you don't mind, then OK, use testing.

thistbhfam
Anything besides Debian, Redhat, Gentoo, Slackware, and Arch are literal cancer.

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> it broke on upgrading to a new major stable release
No Linux system can irreparably break.
> realized CentOS doesn't even have an in-place upgrade
6 to 7 and 7 to 8 should be possible. 5 to 6 is impossible.

you forgot Void

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only correct use of debian

>Slackware
how do you do fellow 45yo

Hot take: people only pick debian over Ubuntu because they’re afraid of the Ubuntu stigma on Jow Forums
Ubuntu is clearly superior to debian

nice 12 year logic my man

got any arguments to back that claim up, chief?

Ubuntu can't not break after the dist-upgrade.

Debian is too hard to install

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he's right. not him and not using arch. Debian "stable" has a lot of packages with bugs upstream fixed years ago. Debian "testing" (buster) is better but it'll be outdated by the time it's released.

systemd solves some real problems and needs which were not solved before. there is a real need for something which does more than start some processes at boot and terminates (the traditional init-system). you may want to restart services based on events when the system is up and running, that's a valid example of why systemd (or something like it) is useful.

A big problem with systemd which is a valid argument against it is that it tries to too much which you quite frankly didn't ask it to do. as a silly example, in fedora 30 (not released) networkmanager suddenly begun to somehow start systemd-resolved even if you mask the service file and by default it listens to 127.0.0.1 for DNS - which means that unbound can't start if you configured it to 0.0.0.0. That's one example of systemd trying to do a lot more than "just an init system" should resulting in various configurations breaking (not the first time).

Wow, didn't know you can make xfce look decent.

Ah yes because if my copy of gedit isn't up to date IMMEDIATELY, that's such a deal breaker...

Ubuntu, RedHat/Fedora, and maybe Debian are the only relevant distros.
>Gentoo
>Arch
>Slackware
lol

> has a lot of packages
Doesn't matter, it only matters for the packages _you_ use. If there are no maintainers who can backport bugfixes, it is reasonable to use other releases provided by the dev team. Just like it happened with FreeRDP, for example: apparently devs have no interest to pack anything for Debian, so I'm OK with grabbing the latest nightly and putting it in /opt.

Wallpaper?

underrated

>Debian
Funny way to misspell Fedora KDE.

>apparently devs have no interest to pack anything for Debian
rightfully so, packaging debs in a nightmare, which makes me wonder how they managed to fuck up their own format so much and introduce so much low-quality overlapping tools.
the only reason debian is stable is because nothing ever updates. trying doing dist-upgrade and it will just break

All three of those distros at least bring unique ecosystems and tooling to the table, instead of just being derivatives.

Gentoo in particular is the base for ChromeOS, so arguing that it's irrelevant is laughable.

Stable has old as fuck packages. Are you fucking serious?

exactly, that's why you shouldn't use debian at all.
Probably for servers, but that's it

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I never once touched fedora ever. It looks like a commerical OS when you compare it to debian.

you can rollback upgrades.
removing packages deletes exactly what you installed.
it's reasonably up to date, it uses great default configurations that will also be used in RHEL.
What do you mean "commercial"? If you mean professional then you are right

Debian is literally the Linkin Park, Papa Roach, System of a Down, Smile Empty Soul, Hoobastank, post 2000-Sum 41, AFI, 3 Doors Down, Staind, Godsmack, etc of operating systems. It smells like axe body spray and wears a chain wallet. Literally only fat greasy angsty outcasts from the early 2000s still care or like that dumb shit.

>no selinux

which WM is that?

dwm with lxde applications. I tried to use LXDE but there were visual bugs in the bar. Though their apps are rock solid

You have ten guys in their own cubicle. Each is assigned one job, and there is a security camera watching each of them. One guy dies and the other nine continue on with their work. Another guy screws up badly, but doesn't say anything. He gets caught because someone reviewed the security footage.

Now replace those ten guys with ten tentacles on a giant ugly kraken. Each tentacle has a will of its own, but is still connected to the main body. One retarded tentacle accidentally sticks itself into an electrical socket and electrocutes itself, and the body, and all the other tentacles as well. It keeps doing it too, but you can't figure out which one it is or why it keeps doing it, because the kraken destroyed all the security cameras.

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>but you can't figure out which one it is or why it keeps doing it
systemd provides plenty of information in situations like this. You simply don't know how to use it. Yet.

how much acid do I eat before that makes any sort of sense

I only use stable on my laptop, tho the non-free version that has firmware included.

>non-free packages
>sane
I'll stick with parabola

Anybody has anything to say about Solus?

Haven't switched from mint. Been using it solidly for 4+ years. Debian based ofc. Just werks

i wanted to use debian testing and everything worked really well EXCEPT fucking cuda and the nvidia-docker shit, which is made to work only on ubuntu basically as far as i can tell. wish i could get that shit working right, or that the debian nvidia and cuda packages were updated often

fucking gpus on linux still so fucking bad. and fuck cuda and the nigger scientists who decided to rely on it

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>but you can't figure out which tentacle
journalctl

>oh this? yea i need to use an ethernet cable now, my operating system blacklisted my wifi card.
>oh this? yea its a fork of firefox called gnu/icecat tehehe get it? anyways yea my operating system wont let me install firefox on my computer. what? no im not running chromeos!

>having a proprietary wifi card
>using a firefox

systemd is the biggest attack surface on a modern linux system by far, even bigger than the kernel itself. its so huge and massive that its impossible to even audit its security in a reasonable amount of time aka you cant fix it fast enough before another vulnerability is discovered.

experimental

>using icecat, a browser that literally cucks you and doesnt let you browse certain sites because muh nonfree javascript

>wanting to order non-free pizza

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If your hardware is even remotely new then Debian sucks. They dicked around with the Nvidia driver several times which caused problems with Maxwell cards several years ago. I haven't gone back to Debian since then because it showed how incompetent their package management was.

>but you could have installed the package from unstable
Nope, they fucked it up so badly that they rolled back the driver version in unstable too. Some twat on the Debian team decided that the driver with Maxwell support irreparably broke something else and therefore they couldn't even have it in unstable, despite Mint and Ubuntu not having any issues.

Debian stable for the servers, Debian Sid for desktops/laptops. Use nonfree ISO and this is just perfect setup with no issues. Even for new hardware.

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Debian stable with flatpak for up to date software is the only right choice.

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good luck finding gvim or llvm or really anything as flatpaks

Thanks

>Devuan
b a s e d

Must be why I'm a Debian user. I loved half of those bands in the early 2000's(and late 90's) I was an angst teen back then. Now i'm a 31 year old chuuni faggot using Debian and happy with it.

> trying doing dist-upgrade and it will just break
Pure bullshit here. While Ubuntu and Mint tend to break on large upgrades, Debian 99% of the time upgrades without a single hiccup. Been using it since wheezy and never broke when upgrading.

that's why i always recommend Debian and that's why whenever you see someone recommending Debian to you, you should just listen to that person

Truth hurt, debfags?

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