Xfce 4.14 will be released on August 11

>tearing

that's fixed in 4.14

>Emacs is my DE

Oh fuck yeah then. That's been the main reason why I haven't been using it.

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YES!
>Dependencies
>consolekit / systemd
what?...noooooo

oh nvm. it won't have a hard dependency on systemd like gnome, it will only use it if it's installed. also fuck off Kfags with your bloated desktop. I swear to god you are all the worst people in the community

enjoy your shit compositor, xfeces mouse-fuckers

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>what is compton?

sorry I'm not too retarded to add tearfree in my xorg.conf.d and not use nvidia. enjoy your 1000+ packages for a single DE idiot. burn konqifags

no wm/default text-based terminal
vim
links2
alpine

so no DE

A FUCKING SCREEN TEARING

Debian stable + xfce is maximum comfy.

Congratulations to your peak autism. People like you really don't need a DE.

I like rpwm better

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Can I get a QR on what's new/changed/fixed?

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Can I use it writh i3 or sway?

Lewd! You're supposed to ride sidesaddle.

Long live the Maus.

>a fucking rat

For what it's worth, I'm pretty sure they're finally fixing screentearing in xfwm4.

nvidia does not have screen tearing if you enable FFCP.

>don't even know what a DE is
>"huehue xfce best de"

Good taste, OP. XFCE all the way.

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did they fix the goddamn screen tearing

>X11
Why the hell would you use deprecated software?

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Isn't Xfce just a primitive version of MATE?

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Will it finally support proper scaling / hidpi without some unreliable hackjob of a workaround?

>Compton is a city in southern Los Angeles County, California, United States, situated south of downtown Los Angeles. Compton is one of the oldest cities in the county and on May 11, 1888, was the eighth city to incorporate. As of the 2010 United States Census, the city had a total population of 96,456.

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Does Thunar have per-directory listing yet instead of just global setting? Does Thunar default highlight search use regex yet instead of fixed string?

It was fixed on xfwm4.13. I'm using it right now and works on my machine.

Too much screen tearing
It didn't work on my machine.

Why the hell would you use memebotnet wayland?

Just look at how many people in this thread are complaining about tearing.
>memebotnet
Boy, you're stupid.

>GTK2 in current year

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>I'd rather use a 34 year old standard riddled with problems impossible to fix

Why the hell are you shilling X like a regressive retard?

>impossible to fix
t. front end developer who switches to a new meme framework every month because the old one got "unmaintainable" but actually is just stupid

We're talking about something 30+ years of legacy and broken cruft, not 6 months.

>Why the hell would you use memebotnet wayland?
Do you find pleasure in applying meaningless buzzwords to random things?
There are literally only a handful of people alive who understand the inner workings of X, and they agree it's time for it to go. Plus, this:

Just because you cunts can't understand why x forwarding is a good thing doesn't make x11 bad.

also get better graphics cards if you have tearing, lol.

also even the wayland devs say it isn't ready for production, and they've managed to accumulate more techdebt in 30.

>even people who support wayland call it a random thing.

I'm a Wayland compositor developer. Where did anybody say that which is from the last 5 years?
>and they've managed to accumulate more techdebt in 30
Like what? You obviously don't know the first thing about what you're talking about, but I'll humour you.

The way X11 forwarding works is pure dogshit. However, Wayland doesn't work over the network because people think it's useless, but because it was a technical trade-off. Wayland uses zero-copy methods for buffer sharing, which is shitloads more efficient, but means it cannot work over the network.
It still doesn't mean that you can't have things working over the network, it just wouldn't be using the Wayland protocol itself end-to-end.

Please explain to me how Wayland is a "memebotnet".

My guess is that you have a very vague, Jow Forums-meme conception of what a botnet actually is, and you just apply it to things you don't like rather than as any sort of genuine descriptor, hence, "random things".

>I'm a Wayland compositor developer
sorry that your piece of software is underperformant dogshit?

>from the past five years
Nice goalpoast moving.

mad pajeet is mad that somebody called his hobby project dogshit

Try again.

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all pajeet post alike

That other "pajeet" and I are still waiting to hear your technical critique of Wayland.

It's a shitty, non-performant re-implementation of a crusty technology with a massive case of "Not invented here". The project promised the fucking world, and delivered nothing than a piss poor re-implementation of about 1/10th of what X can do on a good day. It's quite literally the systemD of display servers, except you don't have Potternig on the project.

Also, considering that most applications that are going to run on Wayland are run via Xwayland - it's kind of hilarious. So you spent however years making a display server... to then build an X shim layer on top.

It's the definition of the programmer "I don't like something, gonna build my own and be the LEADER". And then you have two standards. Except one is now fully of shitty backwards compatibility shims.

So basically, a classic redhat project, much in the vein of systemd and pulseaudio.

See, if Wayland was sane it would break compatibility and actually try something new. Like say... IDK, bring back that pdfeverywhere thing that Sun had in the early 90s and that apple fucked up with Quartz. Do something other than yet another backend for raster window drawing that we've had forever.

Instead of being literaly just X... except gimped.

>I'm a Wayland compositor developer.
Which distro handles Wayland the best? Also is Wayland going to be a better solution for GNU+Linux gaming than X? Is it already?

Glad to see the project is still going. Still the comfiest full DE out there.

>most
No, most programs are built with toolkits rather than using raw X protocol themselves. If you use a toolkit, you get native wayland support for free.
>to then build an X shim layer on top
There was absolutely no way it would succeed if it was not backwards compatible in some way. It's also a completely optional backwards compatibility.
It's actually building Wayland support into the X server than ramming X into the Wayland protocol. But the compositor is still required to act like an X11 window manager to get everything working right.
Xwayland is a fucking pain to work with (as a developer), but that's not because it's Xwayland, it's because it's X.
>redhat
Lots of different groups of people are involved, and Red hat is not the most prominent.

Wayland was designed with the way real programs are actually written in mind. Everybody does client side rendering, so Wayland has absolutely no drawing operations. You COULD extend it to do that (or anything), but nobody in their right mind would want to.
>except gimped
Accidental features that exist in X because of its piss-poor design and security model are not real features. Although, if there is something missing, you can always add it back with an extension protocol. The core wayland protocol is actually extremely stripped down on purpose.

The distro makes little difference.
>Also is Wayland going to be a better solution for GNU+Linux gaming than X?
If the game is running Wayland native, it'll probably run perfectly well. Things like SDL do have Wayland backends.
If it's running through Xwayland, it will run somewhat slower (usually only a few percent slower) than native X, because of the slight overhead of the Wayland protocol combined with the normal use of the X protocol.

See, it's just like you say. Wayland offers nothing over X11 except supposedly less cruft, which is a really tenuous value proposition at best.
>Lots of different groups of people are involved, and Red hat is not the most prominent.
It started as a side hobby of a redhat dev. Nice way to not even know about the project you supposedly work on.

Wayland offers frame-perfect rendering, better security (i.e. sandboxing that actually works), better performance, and allows for shitloads more flexibility and other types of window managers/compositors to exist.
There are also several unfixable flaws in X which aren't a problem in Wayland.
Ever wonder why you can't use your volume keys or why your screensaver doesn't work when you have a context menu open? Because X.
>side hobby of a redhat dev
I forgot he was at Redhat at the time. He was at Intel a lot longer. Also, there was far more than just a single person working on this.
But now, I hardly see many Redhat people involved outside of Gnome stuff.
Not to mention it's completely irrelevant.

I also shouldn't talk like I was around back then. I only really started Wayland-related development in 2017 or so.

>non-performant
This is laughably incorrect. X is terribly non-performant and inefficient, which leads to a lot of the gross artifacting and shit you see with X. A popular use case of Wayland has been for low-power/embedded devices, where X runs like complete garbage.

I recommend you watch this video, specifically the section linked, but also the entire thing as well if you want to evolve from being a dumbfuck troglodyte.
youtu.be/Zsz7Shbnb9c?t=824

This is an ancient video, but it does demonstrate the difference on lower power devices:
collabora.com/videos/rpi-wayland-demo-720p.webm

what the fuck is the point of crippling a PC like this?

>X non-performant
X runs fine on potato hardware.

Most of these "issues" are complete nothingburgers if you don't give bad people root on your box, or do something retarded like run firefox on a VPS without properly securing it first.

>Ever wonder why you can't use your volume keys or why your screensaver doesn't work when you have a context menu open?

No, not really, because who the fuck uses xscreensaver over slock while using a context menu?

>Artifacting with X
Seriously, what artifacting? I haven't seen that shit outside of my graphics hardware being actually broken.

Wayland is a garbage choice for lowpower devices for the same reason that linux in general is a shit choice for lowpower devices. Stop fucking stuffing entire display servers into embedded hardware, cpu cycles aren't free you twisted fucks.

>link a video of it running poorly on potato hardware and artifacting
>"it runs fine on potato hardware, what artifacting?"
Are you dense?

>also link video describing why X is inefficient relative to Wayland
Guess that one's just getting completely ignored.

>OP starts a comfy thread about a DE
>Desperate wayland shills come to shit up the thread
>Wayland dev butthurt enough about people not accepting his shill's shit deanons himself
>Not mad at all, no sirre

>software dev
>runs software on broken hardware
THE SOFTWARE MUST BE BROKEN

Why do you keep harping on about hardware? Artifacting with X is not a result of "broken hardware". If you watch the section of the video I sent, you'll understand that it's an issue inherent to X. I'm not going to sit here and explain the whole thing to you because I've spoonfed you enough already, but the tl;dr of it is that there's a ton of unnecessary and inefficient round-robin communication between the application, compositor/wm, and display server, and the difference in states between those things creates artifacting and other graphical issues aplenty. Just because you're accustomed to seeing shit doesn't mean the shit isn't there.

(As an aside, it's a fucking Raspberry Pi. How is that "broken hardware"?)

>Raspberry pis are bulletproof and never have hardware issues
wow, how autistic are you?

I could find plenty of other examples of X running like shit on an RPi and Wayland running far better by comparison, but at this point there's really no sense in continuing to entertain a barely-functional retard.

>Having to use the rpi as a platform to prove anything
>devs autistically screech on Jow Forums
reasons to never use wayland right here

ssh -x

ssh -y

>I'm a Wayland compositor developer.
Hi Pajeet. Maybe you can answer a question for me. I've been looking forward to using Wayland for what must be 10 years by now, but X11 is still the standard. If Wayland is so good, why hasn't it replaced X yet after all this time? Will it take another 10 years? 20?

>10 years
While technically true, this is extremely disingenuous.
Wayland the _protocol_ was started back then, and even that took several years to get the point of being ready. But that's just the protocol, it doesn't do anything on its own.
You then need actual implementations of this protocol, and that is something that takes fucking ages. Implementing a display server isn't something you just slap together, it takes literally years of effort.
Serious efforts to write desktop-oriented Wayland compositors only really started around 2016-2017 or so. And now we're at a point where they're actually viable to use, but even then, it takes forever to supplant something which is already so engrained.

Wayland is already used shitloads in non-desktop situations. You just don't "see" or think about it.

stop giving you's to this terminally brain damaged Jow Forumstard user, you're embarassing yourself

>MATE
Why should I switch from MATE to Xfce?

less bugs, I like mate visually but usability wise it's clunky and buggy, I always switch de at the end of the year but always come back to xfce because it gave me least headache compare to others.

>He still uses a DE

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I will now buy your game

WM: BSPWM
Terminal: alacritty
Text editor: kakoune
File manager: lf (CLI)
Browser: chromium
Mail: Claws mail

Can't see how that would be a DE.

>I'm a Wayland compositor developer
t. Same sway fag that constantly shells on Jow Forums.

Yes, and?

>Ever wonder why you can't use your volume keys
I just tried and they work.

>Yes, and?
And you have discredited yourself countless times and basically knowing that it's (you) should be enough not to participate in the discussion.
It's not even a thread about some gimped "protocol", but of an actually beautiful DE.