Dual-Layer LCD beats OLED

>$60,000 USD just to barely match the performance of an OLED.

>Well probably never see it
it's already being made for consumers in large sizes.
flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1562668129

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It has worse colour than tn panels, bravo

You said that 10 years ago too.

it's a reference monitor and vastly surpasses OLED.

cool, hope the tech becomes economically viable. Fuck oled and its burn-in problems.

it had superior colors to OLEDs even

EL-QLEDs are going to be the future anyway though.

I was specifically talking about monitors
There will be no problem in getting it in TVs, we have previously had no problems getting OLED in TVs, but monitors are a different story
Monitors are a much smaller market that demands higher margins and no one is going to bother to implement a dual layer LCD when they are still raping your wallet for a monitor that has something other than a TN screen

will this work for VR?

By the time 4K micro LED is possible we'll have 16K LED for a fraction of the price.

Based Sony.

Panel tech doesn't solve the issue of no room space, wires and no content.

>Toshiba invents a similar idea
>chinks copy and improve it
>sony just fucking steals it

We've come full circle, not long now before the nips are 3rd worlders

>16K
that'd be the biggest waste of power and resources.

Higher resolution means you can have bigger screens without washing out the image. Screen resolution is increasing because screen size is increasing, not because of content meme like most of Jow Forums seems to think.

Yes, we will see mainstream 120" TV being sold in less than a decade.

Try five or fewer. A bunch of faggot Canadians are actually going to beat the gooks to the punch and almost no one is paying any attention because the very notion is absurd, yet here we are.

Diminishing returns.

have an upvote
OLED fags BTFO

>worse viewing angles
>terrible power consumption

For $35K. Meanwhile OLED is

>can't play games at 16k
>have to upscale games to 16k making it look ugly
>ugly colors
>ugly response time
Ugly inceLEDs

>still no FED or SED
im good, thanks

What is this, basically RGBK?

Maybe, maybe not. Innolux has a 31.5" panel planned using dual-cell: tftcentral.co.uk/blog/innolux-latest-panel-development-plans-june-2019/

(doesn't specifically say dual-cell in the article, but if you search up "Megazone" it's clear that's what it is)

FUCKING THIS

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Light blocking layer seems like really simple concept to improve the blacks/contrast.
What was the technical hurdle to get over that it wasnt implemented 10y ago?

i clicked on this thread becuase i saw an icream sandwich.

What about dual-layer oled?

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who is she

>she

High quality LCDs like the ones on the iPad Pro are already almost as good as OLED panels, just with worse blacks, no one is going to pay thousands more for that when OLED is dirt cheap as is.

>she

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Panasonic tried a few years ago with IPS. Claimed they'd ship it in 2017 but it turned into vapor. Probably just too expensive to justify. I can think of some reasons why. Driving two LCDs in sync with different pixel responses. Bonding the two LCDs, since they would have to be near seamlessly stacked so light doesn't diffuse too much across the top LCD layer. Probably the emission of IPS being weak, I mean how much of a light source a LCD panel allows to pass through it. VA is the best IIRC, and it's why VAs have higher contrast and no glow or haze and are used for all the HDR TVs that go up to like 2000cdm2

We'll see if Hisense can make their version take off. But judging by the LG 2017 OLED TV burn in test by RTings OLED is already very accessible and might drop further in the next two years. And LG apparently already increased subpixel sizes for their 2018 and 2019 models to mitigate stuff like the extreme red burn-in.

Sue ligthing

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>true 4k resolution
Was it false all these years!?

Thanks for the insight.
As for cost, if it outperforms oled it should justify everything, I mean how much is microled gonna cost to rnd and put out? And OLED is forever ruled out from gaming, high nit + high hz market so it's never the end all be all solution.

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um... you know gaming and consoles forced tv manufactures to get their input lag down, and for the most part passed what most monitors have, and many gaming monitors?

im personally using a tv as a display because I just can't be fucking asked to pay that much for a shit monitor.

MicroLED won't be viable for minimum 4 years. Samsung said last year they're going to spend the next 5 years trying to get the size and price down. Aka bring it into their top end TV line up, which is as much as like $10-80k.

>outperforms oled it should justify everything
OLED's problems right now are burn-in (sort of solved for normal users), size (no monitors, and low brightness over large surface area. Although the latter, IIRC, this is just a software thing to protect the panel from overpowering or something, so highlights (small zones) still go up to ~1000cdm2. Which is fine for virtually any HDR content since it's not meant to actually hit 2000cdm2 across the whole screen, you would actually damage your eyes, like staring directly at one of those super bright LED spotlights for flood zones.

>gaming, high nit + high hz market
Being a LCD solution this is going to be inherently worse than OLED no matter what for gaming. OLED has a literal CRT response time for most transitions. 0.5ms. The only weakness is from black (0% aka off) IIRC, which is around 8ms, so on par with IPS. So OLED is hypothetically capable of >1000hz, although TVs cap out at 120hz.

Basically, if you're looking for a gaming TV, the new 2019 OLEDs are probably close to perfect. It's unlikely any LCD solution will outperform OLED in anything other than mass area brightness and longevity.

why now? because there needs to be an intermediary generation between current and the true self omission tech that's good

most companies don't want to start an oled line because its a dead end, and will be bargan consumer shit when the real good stuff comes along, the only people who would make money back on their oleds at that point are people who already have the production lines, so they are willing to do this dual screen tech, shit that has been around for the better part of 20 years but everyone sat on their dicks not doing it for some reason.

>oled line because its a dead end
Samsung and JOLED just started manufacturing OLEDs for laptop sizes and some laptops already ship with them. Samsung has also expressed desire to manufacture monitor sized OLEDs and eventually TVs, but that might have been dashed because of the Japanese export embargoes

This is the single technology that I have some hope for. OLED looks nice but burn-in is incredibly shitty and a huge, huge flaw. Other shit like microLED doesn't seem to manage to get sufficient pixel density (yet) and FALD LCDs suffer from horrible bloom. Something like this has amazing contrast, pixel density and uses technology which already exists and is quite mature, so it's not some pipe dream which may never come to pass. I only hope it trickles down to the consumer level.

Yes, no reason not to that I can think of. It's going to be less energy efficient at the same brightness level due to having 2 LCD layers, which also means the headset would get warmer (and it would suck for battery powered shit) but other than that it should work fine and would actually be a better option than OLED, since it won't suffer from black smear.

Wouldnt it be impossible to have 144hz high HDR gaming monitor for pc?
It'd get burn in fast.

The HUD is the biggest concern in games but people have been using OLEDs just fine for TV, movies, and games for years with few issues except red, but the latest TVs have taken steps to mitigate that like I said before. Someone posted a picture of the subpixels before and they physically increased the size to reduce the rate of degradation, which is the cause of burn-in.

A 144hz HDR monitor would be possible but no one's going to make it right now and Samsung's OLED venture might be dead in the water so I wouldn't get your hopes up.

>Being a LCD solution this is going to be inherently worse than OLED no matter what for gaming.
Eh, Valve somehow managed to use LCDs in their latest VR headset and has outperformed all available OLED options in terms of refresh rate, image persistence and motion blur. This is also in a device which is much, much, much more sensitive to latency and blur since those can make the user physically ill. If LCD is good enough for 144Hz VR, then it's more than good enough for a monitor.

Plus game HUDs and static computer UIs displayed all day would assrape OLED into oblivion real quick. Computer UIs would be even worse than games, since parts of those are almost entirely static.

>A 144hz HDR monitor would be possible but no one's going to make it right now a
Right so in that space we might see this double layer lcd be the best until microled rolls out, if it ever comes.

>refresh rate, image persistence and motion blur
Persistence and blur are the same thing. It's a result of your brain holding information, which is why moving objects also blur even though, you know, they don't actually blur, there's nothing in the physical world that makes them blur. Blanking or black frame insertion actually helps with that, so does a high-refresh rate coupled with high frame rate so each frame is distinct enough to get your brain to respond immediately.

As for refresh rate, it's a mystery why smartphone displays are still on 60hz, maybe battery life?

The TVs have been 120hz native, as in you can run 1080p 120hz on older OLED TVs and 4k 120hz over HDMI 2.1 (if you have a HDMI 2.1 source) on the 2019 models. And they also have black frame insertion if you want to reduce persistence. It's not a matter of the technology being lacking, they're just phoning things in for small screens.

It's possible. Although reference monitors isn't exactly a sign of things to come. OLED reference monitors have been a thing for half a decade as well, like 20" or 22" monitors, but it never came to the mainstream monitor market while it did go to TV. Hisense, a chinese company, already proposed this idea for TVs and claimed they'll be launching them in china first within a few years. So I'm betting this sort of dual LCD technology will be on TVs first for mainstream consumers, like OLED

>maybe battery life?
Definitely. Why waste battery life on refresh rate for a fucking phone, which most of the time is going to display static images, 24-30FPS video and text-based applications?

>which most of the time is going to display static images
ProMotion is a thing.

>So I'm betting this sort of dual LCD technology will be on TVs first for mainstream consumers, like OLED
Do tvs benefit that much? 1k 55" oled are already sufficient since burn in is managed.

With gaming monitors you have the biggest benefit of no burn in and better than black levels than any of the alternative tech.
Then theres the VR, high end phones/tablets/watches. That apple monitor that costs 5k isn't like a sony 30k (who buys those?), it should scale down to a consumer version.

based Chinese will make it affordable

>burn in is managed
"Managed" burn-in still gives you a product which you have to babysit and probably still won't last as long as a display which fundamentally doesn't suffer from the issue. You can display the same image on an LCD for 12h each day and it won't give much of a fuck, what would happen to an OLED with 'managed' burn-in?

>Do tvs benefit that much? 1k 55" oled are already sufficient since burn in is managed.
TVs is where all the hot developments happen first for consumer grade stuff, you'd have to ask the manufacturers why they dump so much money into it. Maybe it's because home cinema guys are dangerously autistic about their image quality

>Panasonic tried a few years ago with IPS. Claimed they'd ship it in 2017 but it turned into vapor
Did you watch the OP video? That's almost certainly using a Panasonic-made panel. You can also find displays from EIZO (CG3145) and Flanders Scientific (XM311K) that use the same one.

>ou can display the same image on an LCD for 12h each day and it won't give much of a fuck, what would happen to an OLED with 'managed' burn-in?
Depends on the image. A dim, monochrome gray picture depicting life in the 1800s? Could take ten years to show any burn in. A bright orange/red sunset against a dark background? Maybe a couple months.

>costs less than microled (half the price per inch)
>doesn't suffer from black banding artifacts (LED flicker)
Dual layer LCD is your god now.

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try 20

The reason oled hasn't made it to monitors is because oled sucks and PC monitor manufacturers have higher standards than TV makers.

Does dual-layer oled beat dual-layer lcd?

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Sweet 244hz ultra wides with this tech WEN

no

are you retarded?
>hurr now I have two entire layers of OLED to burn-in

Come back when I can buy it.

flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1562668129

>Other shit like microLED doesn't seem to manage to get sufficient pixel density (yet)
Is 14000 ppi not enough for you? If some literally who company (Mojo Vision) can make screens that dense, then a 4K or 8K MicroLED seems like it should be a piece of piss to make in comparison.

How is the response time in this shit?
Oh yea.

he shows it in the video, it's very low

wait a goddamn second. what if you combine dual cell LCD...........with mini/micro LEDs?

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Yea it's a pure coincidence evey year when new models of TVs are releasing the tech that changes TV in a major way is invented.

are you retarded? microLED don't need anything else. the only issue with microLEDs are that manufacturing is expensive and getting them small enough is an issue.

4K micro LED will look better than 16K placebo resolution on LED shit.

k what about mini then as a stopgap?

>not using plasma

you're all gay lmao

I too like my TV to double as a space heater because it's using 600w.

nice FUD peasant. they range from 200-500w at best depending on the model.

>Is 14000 ppi not enough for you?
Show me a 14000 PPI microLED display, I'll believe it when I see it. Until then it's worthless to talk about and if they're not already making prototypes and POC displays there is probably a reason for it. There's no guarantee you'll be able to buy that shit as a consumer in anything like the near future. This dual LCD technology exists right now and consumer TVs using it are being made right now, though they're not yet sold in the US or EU.

wearable-technologies.com/2019/06/mojo-vision-reveals-tiny-microled-display-with-highest-yet-pixel-density/
Literally 5 seconds in Google. It's only a prototype, but it shows that it's possible.

>people are still memeing about OLED and LCD
Just use plasma retards

When does it get too big?
I remember when 42" were huge.
Hell, I remember when 29" CRT were pretty big already.

>The reason oled hasn't made it to monitors is because oled sucks and PC monitor manufacturers have higher standards than TV makers.
>higher standards
oh am I laffin

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>1200 nits
>1152 local dimming zones
>99% dci p3
take the miniled pill
asus.com/us/Monitors/ProArt-PA32UCX/

>True 4K
So UHD?

True 4k in this instance just means DCI 4k
DCI 4k is an older standard compared to UHD
You are not missing much as both standards are the same vertical resolution but it triggers some autists that UHD isn't "true" 4K because the horizontal resolution doesn't quite get to 4k

OLED can do rolling scan (similar to how a CRT works) to give perfect temporal resolution.
LCD cannot.

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SED and FED both suffer from burn in thanks to the fact they use phosphors. Among other FATAL issues, such as the fact it's dim as fuck and would be impossible to view in any bright light.

If you see MicroLED it'll likely be in the form of backlighting for LCDs first. You only have to make each cell a third of the size, since the subpixels are quantum dot based.

>suffers from burn-in
and you would know this how? based on what happens to old CRT screens which contained one big ass cathode ray tube and only happened if you were a dipshit and left the tv on for months/years at a time with the same static image on it? OLED fucks up far faster when it comes to ghost images than CRT ever did

Lol