Ubuntu is bloat

already obsolete

install non-free debian

I installed clover os on a virtual machine to try out the so called gentoo and I got to say I'm not impressed.
For starters its ui is ugly asf and I tried clicking on the terminal and it wouldn't open.

teach me more, person who can't pick an iso and read installer prompts, for this is truly the first thread we've ever had about wifi on debian

A typical "normie" would feel that "it's bullshit because a bunch of autists don't want me to use my wifi because they can't know what it does", more or less.

Attached: linusguy.jpg (675x900, 165K)

> for this is truly the first thread we've ever had about wifi on debian

maybe... but that problem is well known, and if you cant connect to the fucking internet while your just setup your machine, its kind of stupid to just add the non free mirror.
if its a possibility it needs to be available on the fucking setup, because i dont have a phone or a cable

by this logic they supposed to block any ISP
they cant know what programs they use on there servers and routers.

> 2.6.39
> bpo, i. e. from backports
> baiting this hard
Fock off m8

fedora with KDE Plasma is GOAT.

I totally agree. This bullshit of jumping through hoops to enable this stuff is nonsense. All to appease who? Just make the shit available during install if the user wants it. Fuck Debian. And, fuck Fedora.

>fedora GOAT
youtube.com/watch?v=i2lhwb_OckQ

It's not just a pointless exercise though, it does do 2 things:

1. It makes people conscious of what software is free and what is not. I never thought about whether my printer drivers were open source and what printer companies offer open source before installing Debian

2. More importantly, it helps with stability. Just letting people installing anything anytime from anywhere is what made windows so buggy and prone to crashing. Taking care of your machine means being thoughtful about what you install on your system and thinking about what you really need before jumping on proprietary software just because it offers some feature that's trending

Software doesn't always interact well with other software and some software is filled with things like bugs and memory leaks. Encouraging limitations on software is not a bad thing.

3. Debian doesn't force you to keep free software. The shit is available if the user wants it. They have documentation showing you how to install it and even packages that help you install non-free software. If you want it you can have it. But there's nothing wrong with being commuted enough to free software that you don't load your system with proprietary software right on install and try to discourage it.

Try to print something, lol

>can't connect to the dhcp
>dhclient -v enp0s25

>use xubuntu for years
>never a single regret

Attached: dunno.png (560x407, 13K)

>you really need before jumping on proprietary software just because it offers some feature that's trending
What's there to think about when it becomes a matter of having a working network or none at all? It's not like people are going to get all thoughtful when Debian leaves them with a useless computer. This is the type of shit that gives Linux a bad name. Especially when Debian gets memed as being so solid and reliable.Using something like a proprietary network driver is not going to hurt anyone in the slightest. Using data-mining software is a valid concern, but refusing to use something that doesn't harm you, simply because the name belongs to someone, is fucking ridiculous.

>ubuntu is bloat
If you're retarded

adding contrib non-free to a text file is easier than shitposting on Jow Forums, so is downloading the non-free netinst if you know that you have hardware that uses proprietary blobs.

>dhclient
dhcp request wont work if your OS wont support your network card component firmware from the first place

>This bullshit of jumping through hoops to enable this stuff is nonsense.
Use Ubuntu if you don't want it.
Its 1 minute of editing a text file to change it.

>Especially when Debian gets memed as being so solid and reliable.
I NEVER heard someone say that Debian wasn't for advanced users who know what they are doing, you are confusing reliability and stability with comfort features.
It isn't meant for people who just want things to work and do not care about free software.

>What's there to think about when it becomes a matter of having a working network or none at all?
You might have a Network that is working perfectly fine without proprietary drivers and if you really need them use an ISO with proprietary drivers.
You are pretending as if there were some great hurdle, when it is literally just downloading a different ISO or editing a text file.

Try using a non meme distro?

protipp: leave politics out of your computing. you will be much happier and stuff will work

>i am all about free software ideology but this is a joke.
Then you’re obviously not into the free software ideology. You choose convenience over freedom, and now you get nothing. If you had half a brain cell you could easily solve this problem, but you don’t. Oh well.

Fedora is much better as a dev distro than ubuntu. Just because you’re too stupid to use it doesn’t mean it’s bad. Always notice how it’s novice users who have all the problems? Yeah, the problem is you.

>systemdickerinos
Botnet my man, true chads use devuan

I love reading this. I get a massive erection every time some normalnigger like you doesn’t understand the free software ideology and gets fucked over. I don’t want nor use proprietary software, if you don’t like it then go back to windows faggot. And guess what, debian is solid and reliable, and you can complain until the end of the universe but debian will never change. I bet you use chrome and discord too.

RedHat

>can't understand that being able to do something doesn't mean one should to be forced to do it (in this case fiddling with hardware support) and how this is against freedom
the kind of autism that keeps linux down

Fat fuck

>Just because you’re too stupid to use it doesn’t mean it’s bad.

ubuntu is very similar to red hat distros
but it have support and working drivers.
im not gonna code my own driver

Lmao retard fedora is not for you, go install Hannah Montana Linux or something

These are the people that increase the sales of Ms daily. Are you anons getting paid by this evil proprietary software company?

watch fagot

It's not Debian's problem that the firmware is nonfree, it's the hardware manufacturers' fault. They're the ones forcing you to put up with bullshit to get your hardware to work. And if you continue to buy their hardware knowing full well that they do this then it's your fault.

Says the guy defending nonfree drivers.

I disagree with the other people who responded to you, you have a legitimate qualm when things as simple as a wireless driver or printer driver won't work with Debian. I don't think having to tinker and struggle to fix that is a good solution.

The question is - is this the fault of Linux and Debian or is this the fault of companies that release drivers under closed proprietary licenses. I would say it's the later given that there are many companies that do right now release free and open source drivers.

Yes it sucks for now and it's painful for now. However, things are changing. When linux first started using only open source software was only possible for hardcore techies. That's not the case anymore, most people with a reasonably IQ and do it with just a little learning and reading up. And that's not because of improvements in technology, it's because linux has had a real and meaningful influence on software and device manufacturers that many changed how they do things.

It's painful for now but I think there will be greater improvements as linux's market share increases and things will get easier. This is just the growing pains of a much bigger fight.

As for turning people away from linux. I don't know how meaningful it is to get people onto a distro like Ubuntu if it doesn't really get them to care about open source. Might as well leave them with windows. In any case what is undeniable is that the number and quality of open source is growing and with it more and more companies are releasing open source compatible tools.

It's just growing pains

Your complaints are nonsense, there are tons of distros that do ship with the blob drivers. OP just doesn't want to use them because in his view they are "bloat and gay"

>Then you’re obviously not into the free software ideology.

i am.. but without a proper hardware support i dont see any reason to install it on any machine as desktop.
it can be a good tutorial machine like LFS
but for everyday use, is fucking pointless.

Is that a good thing though? In terms of what is achieved - what's the real difference between someone using Microsoft or linux if they're both ruining proprietary software?

It is if you go about not doing anything difference,

however if you make changes as a result start looking and only buying from companies that release open source drivers it's a win for everyone.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_open-source_wireless_drivers
Educate yourself for next time

I wouldn't recommend that, but that is their freedom to install proprietary software if they want. Debian isn't going to force downstream distros to stop doing that.

>It's not Debian's problem that the firmware is nonfree, it's the hardware manufacturers' fault. They're the ones forcing you to put up with bullshit to get your hardware to work.
No, the firmware works perfectly fine, it's Debian's autistic handling of the firmware that is the issue. This whole deal with handling these packages like they're cigarettes or booze, is completely overboard.There's nothing malicious or harmful about these drivers.

>this massive thread with all these replies when you just click a checkbox to install the nonfree drivers

there is no checkbox you fucking retard you need to download the code from a separate device and put it in the boot folder

I did. Had the best Debian desktop 15 years ago.

Now regret not installing Arch. Missing lots of Software, don't compile features into their packages.

Debian offers an OS.
OS = interface between hardware and user programs
Hardware manufacturers don't need to cater to the whims of OS developers. It's the OS developers who are building this interface called OS, it's their job to make sure their OS werks on top of hardware.
Simply put: OS developers don't get to choose what hardware you're using, you do, and if you're a sane person, you decide based on performance/price, minimum performance required and budget available. You also get to choose what OS to use on top of that hardware. If some OS producer decides not to support your hardware, they lose you as a customer, the hardware manufacturers don't lose anything. Because sane people buy hardware as described above.

>customer
Not only you're not a target customer, you never even were a potential customer.

Just use Ubuntu ffs

Use OpenSUSE. They care about shit working, not being stallmann compliant.

>the only one that actually make sense
the install x,y meme stuff.. i dont have time, my CCNA had already started and i need to install cisco software, so i dont want to take risks and get unnecessary headache.
fuck that i already install noobuntu again and it makes me feel ok i guess

that's why linux desktop is not even a meme

>10 year old version of debian
sage

There seems to be a flatpak of it, containing your shitware that way is probably better anyway. Not in official repos, not in COPR, likes to install to /opt, therefore invalid for Silverblue. Discarded.
>gpu drivers
Intel just works, for proprietary NVIDIA there's RPMFusion. Workstation Edition ships with the option of enabling it with the press of a button. Never been a problem.
I have printed many documents with many wildly different applications in Fedora, it always worked fine.
Red Hat is not a bad company. It is a large if not the primary contributor to many parts of Linux.
How does that target Fedora?
>ubuntu is similar to red hat distros
It isn't
>has support
In no way is it better than Fedora/RHEL support
>and working drivers
What drivers do not work on Fedora?

here it is, why year of the linux desktop will never happen

fuck off NSA stop shilling your faggot spyware

why do i need to do extra modification for something that have full support in another OS, that offer almost the same functionality regard the Amazon shit, its a well operating system in 0 price that give 80% freedom
>It isn't
it is
they just not completely the same
but they more similar to each other than many other systems
like windows to ubuntu
or mac os
or Arch

yes goy leave ideology out of this. Now remember to pay for your annual license fee.

based retard

Not him, but I'm curious, do you live in Zimbabwe?
Because windows license is extremely cheap compared to the time you waste managing things that break in Linux. Unless you earn something like $0.01 per hour, windows could rise their price 2-3 times and it would still be cheaper.

nigger just use an ethernet cable and apt-get that shit from a nonfree repo

>Because windows license is extremely cheap compared to the time you waste managing things that break in Linux

begone kike shill

i did all the process and setup my network with my phone and USB tethering i downloaded the firmware and unpack it in the boot folder.
it work...
but the KDE looks so fucking shit.
and i hate all the notification about free software updates and news.
so i just decided to fuck off from all of that and install the needful functional OS

I'm not shilling for windows, just making a simple computation. I value my money (because I work for it) and my time. Time is usually more valuable than money, because you can't get it back.
Do you buy your clothes? Or weave all the materials that you need and sew them together to make clothes because it's 'free". Opportunity cost is a real thing. You'd only make your own clothes if it's you're hobby. Same with Linux. I use it because I like tinkering with it, but it's way more expensive to use Linux for your desktop than to use Windows.

>yes goy leave ideology out of this
>remember to pay for your annual license fee.
>begone kike shill
why are you doing this?

>I am all about free software
The problem is you're a stupid faggot. All software is free.

>All software is free
you sound like a cult member.

Honestly this is what you deserve if you use anything other than Slackware.

fpbp, nothing to see here
/thread

this hostility in the linux community is exactly why no one uses it on desktop

The drivers are harmful to the user's freedom because they can't be legally studied modified.

You people always bring this up like it's a threat or something. We don't care. Use Ubuntu if it bothers you so much. You are complaining about a non-issue.

Free software means freedom not price. You can spend a lot of time setting up your computer how you like it, or you can pay someone else to do it, or pay a company for support, etc. A windows license, by comparison, no matter the price point, will never offer freedom for the user.

No. I just don't buy shit or let retarded licenses that restrict my rights dictate my life. The Free software movement is a cult.

You simpleton fuck

>announcing sage
you really feel the need to summon the jannies to this thread? enjoy your ban reddit scum,
also
czech 'em

Attached: 1544117245379.jpg (400x400, 30K)

>Proprietary software is a cult
Fixed that up for you.

dont

>ubuntu is bloat
>fedora is gay
not an argument, they are perfectly fine but ubuntu is better for personal use

>These are the people that increase the sales of Ms daily.
Why? I just told him to install a distro which caters to his needs instead of bitching about one which clearly isn't meant for him.

nice qauds user
>also OP is a fag

USE UBUNTU IF YOU DO NOT LIKE DEBIANS HANDLING OF NON-FREE SOFTWARE.

How is this so hard to understand? If you are unwilling to download the non-free iso or spend 1 minute editing a Textfile just fucking install Ubuntu.
Where is the issue?

>this hostility
No hostility here.
Just use fucking Ubuntu instead of complaining that some other distro does things different to your preferences, which are also trivial to change.

It's just some clueless retard screeching DO X, WHY DON'T YOU DO X.

>What's there to think about when it becomes a matter of having a working network or none at all? It's not like people are going to get all thoughtful when Debian leaves them with a useless computer. This is the type of shit that gives Linux a bad name. Especially when Debian gets memed as being so solid and reliable.Using something like a proprietary network driver is not going to hurt anyone in the slightest. Using data-mining software is a valid concern, but refusing to use something that doesn't harm you, simply because the name belongs to someone, is fucking ridiculous.
state of Jow Forums

try download debian ISO non-free faggot.

cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/