Why?

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This is precisely why phillips is designed to cam out.

HP uses them as a desktop standard for case and drive mounting.

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A better head to question

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Apple does everything weird, that's just expected of them.

Ok that's stupid. But to be fair, you can use a Flat-head on those things just fine.

When you get into the Apples and the Nintendos of the world, I think you know why.

Hex star screws, however ARE fairly standard. The "safety" ones with a hole in the middle are a bit of a bitch, but when you see one of those they're usually saying "you really shouldn't be opening if you aren't specialized enough to have the tool to open these."

it was an intentional move to make repairing your own devices more difficult
just like gluing batteries and soldering memory
apple are authoritarian control freaks who don't want to let people do anything with the devices they own

Good. Ill rather buy a new driver than get stuck with a used screw

Torx are the shit: they stay in the driver, don't wear easily and even a fucked up rusted screw has enought grip to be pulled out.
I can't wait for the patent to end and them to become a international standard. Phillips or linear screws have been a curse in mankin for the last 100 years

sourcing the right tool is easier than matching the right screw size & depth.

This. Torx screws are great.

Someone within the contemporary realm of intellectual property actually has the rights to this shit? I'm no anti-copyright guy, but honestly, how long did it take to say "2... 4........ 6?" And how is it not inevitable discovery?

Jews.

>case and drive
Those screws are big enough to thumb.
if you want to get it tight it can clearly also be driven by a flathead.

The only problem with Phillips is the knock-offs that are falsely advertised as Phillips. Same with Robertson, honestly.
flat heads can get fucked though.

you're going to start seeing shittier torx screws when the patent ends.

dunno, the metal has the typical look of proper Cr-V

This, Phillips screws are fucking awful to deal with.

Nigga, you would be amazed by the amount of engineering developing these things need.

Your mistake is thinking that the only change from flathead to Philips is the move from two to four points, or from Philips to Torx is another two points. There's much, much more to it. In fact a main issue with Philips in modern use is that they're designed to torque out to prevent over-tightening or tool damage, which made sense a century ago but modern power tools are capable of doing that themselves. So you're left with a screw that just actively tries to force out your screwdriver head.

>So you're left with a screw that just actively tries to force out your screwdriver head.
That's why JIS is a thing. A crosshead that bites in rather than cam out.

Itt: Stupid americunts can't comprehend the superiority of torx screws.

It's also commonly used in decking fasteners, and you go at them with an impact driver no problem.
I'm going to take metallurgy for $500, Alex.

They are objectively better. The world would be a better place if no other standards than torx existed.

kek

Looks like you know your shit. Care to answer something? I have always wondered how they can manufacture the hole in the screw with a "flat" bottom, is it by pressure while is still hot?

I think we can't simoly estimate the amount of man/hours lost over the last century because of shitty flat and phillips screws falling while putting them or wearing off while removing them

It's incredible how many people don't own own a torx set.

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I have a T5 that was totally stripped from stiff screws (loose threaded like pic) on a Palm 105. So I took wire cutters and chopped off 2-3mm and filed tip to flatten it. It's able to grip, though I have to press hard.
The whole thing could have been avoided with Phillips screws, which I would have swapped but I couldn't find any with this crappy thread type.

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Those will wear down after a few uses, and the slightest wear makes them useless.

I've been using the same torx driver and drillbit at work every day for years, why are you talking bollocks user

Anons just buy cheap chinshit thinking it makes no difference. It is just a chunk of metal, what couls go wrong

Because even the cheapest Chinese torx bolts made of poorfaginium won't strip and cause you endless butthurt by just thinking about tightening or opening one. I wish all screws and bolts were either torx or hexagonal.

Not the ones in picrelated. Sure, they're expensive, but down buy the cheapest hardware and complain it's cheap also in quality.

Don't buy drivers made out of spray cheese. Seriously get a quality set like from Wiha or Wera or some other well known brand and that shit should not happen.

This guy screws.

fk you

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It's called Pentalobe. HAIL SATAN!

Fuck these things...can't even find deck screws in Phillips at fucking Lowe's. Fuck the Jew screws.

these are much better

The csg is strong in this thread. if you don't want tools that wear out after after two uses, you have to spend for ones that aren't made out of recycled beer cans.

I hate those screws so fucking much. You either turn the ENTIRE case fully sideways and flat, or that little shit refuses to bite and goes flying everywhere. Good luck finding it if you drop it on a carpet.

There's better stuff than torx for better torque transfer, and that doesn't shear off the bit head if you use a powerful impact driver.

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>even find deck screws in Phillips

Because Philips is designed to cam out when you apply high torque.
Very bad idea when putting long screws in wood.
You would end up stripping screws and scratching up the wood.

>not using a 400Nm wrench for a 2.5" disk tray
Very pleb

>thought these were connecting my 212evo fan when it died
>buy replacement
>week later, rip off the heatsink pads
>they were actually just no2 phillips heads
FUCK

>This is precisely why phillips is designed to cam out.

In a way.
It was really designed to cam out because early electric screwdrivers didn't have clutches.

All modern screwdrivers have clutches to prevent that from happening.
The guy who fucked his bit probably locked his clutch because he doesn't know how to use basic tools.

allen head best head

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Sure, there is Torx Plus.

Sure, if you're using a 1000Nm impact driver, maybe Torx size 5 isn't ideal, but it's a solid profile overall.

That's why you don't buy chinkshit tools.

Torx is better though.

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Not too many of my $0.1 a piece chinkshit torx bits have stripped, so I can't really get behind that statement.

Even if certainly the expensive as fuck PB Swiss or Wera bits are better, I don't think your screws will generally match that... and why should they?

that looks like the wrong size allen key lol

Step 1: Use a properly sized bit, not one or two sizes down.

It's a diagram you dumbasses.

Exactly. Who would make such a misleading diagram?

If you can twist a torx bit like that, it sure as hell shows a lack of quality.
Also most other type of head would likely have stripped at that point anyway, given the same materials.

>he doesn't have a secure torx set...

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>powerful impact driver
like my fist

Muh grandad's advice to me (amongst a few homily's)
>don't buy cheap tools

why what? Torx is literally the best screw head.

You can buy torx drivers and bits at literally every hardware store.

This, better to pay for a good expensive tool once than to buy a cheap shitty tool, break it, and have to go out and buy the expensive one anyway.

Ive never had this happen to me, and I literally replace every hex head on everything I own with torx, and I even replace many phillips and flathead screws with them too.

Also, that pic seems to be a non-hardened bit. Was it made in China? You can get quality bits made in other countries like Japan, Germany, etc.

Phillips is not designed to cam out

holly shit

bullshit. Those pentalobe bits are literally only used by Apple. They literally invented the heads they use, they literally have them specially made. They are not standard at all. Wierd is one thing, but designing a proprietary screw is a whole new level of bullshit

Torx is actually a standard and readily available.

theres nothing stupid about it. And this is coming from someone who hates HP with a passion

>butter screwdriver

I say it depends on the tool.

But this doesn't always happen. Often you're just fine with the cheaper Chinese or US or whatever tool, they're not that bad nowadays.

And maybe the more expensive tool wears or breaks too (and if it's only wearing twice as slow at twenty times the cost, that may not be worth it).

bullshit. Ive even used torx bits to remove stuck allen screws and all my torx bits still work fine

Been using them fine for years buddy. Keep your Israel screws to yourself.

i have no idea wtf u r talking about

>There's better stuff than torx for better torque transfer
WOW. why dont you just weld your fucking screwdriver to your screw then you fucking maniac

no, they are one of the worst, and inferior in every way to torx

>what are manufacturing tolerances

MOTHER
FUCKING
TRIPLE
SQUARE

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>I say it depends on the tool.
I disagree - I've paid cents for old second hand tools (sidchrome etc.) that still work today as faithfully as they did when I got them.

I've also paid thousands for gud quality stuff (makita, milwakee and dewalt power tools) and no motors burnt out or brushes needing replacing

muh employees/shitkicker apprentices:
>buy cheap shit at Bunnings,
>fuck it up,
>buy cheap shit at bunnings,
>rinse and repeat.

a cheap tool (unless it's gud quality 2nd hand THAT HASN'T BEEN MISTREATED) is exactly that - a cheap tool. caveat emptor

pic related - cheap tools in the drivers door well from muh car - essentially sacrificial.

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Flat/slotted and Philips are both awful. Flat head screwdrivers easily slip out of the slot because nothing holds them in place. Philips is better in that regard but it can easily cam out even with hand tools. Torx fixes both of those problems and imo should be used everywhere.

If it had been properly hardened, it would have chipped rather than bent.

>I've paid cents for old second hand tools (sidchrome etc.)
Is the lifetime warranty transferable?
I've always liked that about Sidchrome stuff.

If you need to open things with torx screws a lot get a proper set of screwdrivers. Only use chinkshit if you don't expect you'll need to use them again.

I'm pretty sure the patent has expired already, which is why we're starting to see them in all kinds of places already.

>not using superior german engineering

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JIS and Pozidrive are pretty much the exact same, and Pozidrive is used in a lot of places where I live. It's really only very slightly better than Philips for cam-out, Torx still makes a world of difference.

carboot sales etc. - these days I'd say not without the original receipt but it might be worth a try one day - when one of muh spanners or sockets eventually fuck up.... eventually.

>I've also paid thousands for gud quality stuff (makita, milwakee and dewalt power tools) and no motors burnt out or brushes needing replacing
interdastingly - the only power tool I've paid a lot for that did ded was a hilti. Shit itself going thru about 100mm of prefab and riobar - we got one of the cordless makitas to finish the pilot then had to jemmy a larger chuck on a wired hammerdrill to fit the bit.

no rma and had to fight them to cover the warranty - apparently drilling concrete with an industrial hammerdrill doesn't count...

And who is saying that that Chinese wrench of yours will break rather than:
> work faithfully as it did when you got it

And if you break your Chinese torx bit, that's a $0.1 (or less if ordered in larger bulks) loss in most instances. Swap out and continue. Some random torx screw just simply doesn't tend to call for the $5 PB Swiss bits.

That said, of course you can't work as fast or expect a long tool life from some $15 reciprocating saw or $30 rotary hammer as from a Makita. I'm not saying cheap machines are always the solution.

It just depends, and cheap tools got better. At this point I really don't need a Knipex to strip wires, eh.

Why? It's Torx. Even cheap Chinkshit simply doesn't break very often with that.

I actually had far more often a reason to use quality gear on Philips and other screws.

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Well maybe you shouldn't use T15 heads for your wheel bolts. The external T50 on my car sure don't wear out from using an impact driver.

>I don't understand the difference between consumables and tools : The Post

not wanting to get into a pointless argument with you but aside from loss or theft buying the same tool over & over (regardless of how "cheap" it is) is stupid.

>At this point I really don't need a Knipex to strip wires, eh.
But having a gud set of pliers, not losing them or getting them stolen & looking after them means you'll never be without a gud set of pliers.
Having chinkshit that breaks means the job isn't done and you still need a new set of pliers - ie. losses all round. Still -
>a fool and his money are soon parted
another of muh grandads little pearls of wisdom.

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Enjoy your rounded-off screws. Allen bolts suck, and external hex as well.

>And if you break your Chinese torx bit, that's a $0.1 (or less if ordered in larger bulks) loss in most instances. Swap out and continue
>he carries around 17kg of spare bits just to get the job done.