America is such a kind country

Give me an AMERICA FUCK YEAH everybody

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Half-viet here. My grandpa use to literally hunt American soldiers during the Vietnam War and told me really terrifying stories of it.

His Opinion: American soldiers are garbage, get frightened easily and calls in everything if they see a handful of guys. They are easy to ambush and kill, make alot of noise, are awful at shooting, and usually end up killing mostly civilians rather than the enemy.

He has personally killed 13 Americans, and has visible PTSD from having to mutilate and booby-trap their bodies so that they can prepare ambushes when other americans come in to "recover" them. Truly the fucked up stuff of ages. They would literally be ordered to pile in more guys, straight into a well-fortified ambush until him and his soldiers got tired/run out of ammo and left. Americans afterwards would just kill a bunch of nearby civilians, claim they are VC/NVA and declare victory.

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noice

Yeah i honestly doubt that

Lebanon, God's country

That sounds incredibly believable actually

You don't need to. He doesn't hate americans at all, mostly just pitied them since they didn't have a reason to die for.

lol. the thing is, he hates "communism" since its basically just party leaders turning the country into a business. the only time the government was liked was when it was fighting a war and for a few years after winning, but it just turned into a pseudo-oligarchy capitalist dictatorship.

trips of god's truth

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>hurr ameriga lies therefore i will believe any ricefarmer

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No need, I already saw this troll before and he's not even actually Vietnamese, he's (surprise) Yet Another CCPbot Chink Living In Vancouver On Welfare (TM).

yup, people still think the war was literally rambo.

his units ambushed americans almost 100% of the time and would lose more men to malaria or shit like a jungle infection than from fighting. it was literally a 4 month walk from north vietnam to south vietnam, and they all had to do it on foot, so when a guy was dying on the trail from exhaustion/disease (happened all the time) they'd just mark it and move on and bury him afterwards.

the parts talking about killing civilians and claiming them as enemies is plausible

t. knower of iraq and afganistan war vets

>it thinks conscript 18 year olds are effective soldiers
Jaysus Chroist, m8tey. There be a reason the US military has no desire to ever use a draft army again.

Far from the truth you moron. he hates china because they destroyed his hometown in 79 and killed alot of people he knew.

i literally saw the medal he was given, which they gave for people who killed 3 or more Americans, literally called the "heroic american killer" badge.

yeah its weird, he has met americans he fought but doesn't hate them. most are sort of sad.

he hates "puppet troops" e.g. saigon/arvn people more for siding with a country bombing the north. doesn't really hate them that much, since modern communism he realized is shit.

America does lie, alot, they are no better than Russian oppressors

Keep in mind mutts were using prisoners as soldiers too, might have a lot of unrecorded deaths as well.

It was a bad idea in WWII when they lowered the draft age from 21 to 18 in 1944. They were taking kids fresh out of high school graduation three months earlier and throwing them onto the front line. Many of them got killed in their first 30 minutes of combat.

I believe it. 30 years later we're still doing that
t. soldier

>eight years of the Vietnam War
>50,000 casualties

>eight years occupying Iraq
>3000 casualties

Training, professionalism, and combat medicine improved a _lot_ in 40 years.

If all north vietnam were such effective killing machines why did so many die (860,00) compared to the 50,000 americans

Not really, Iraq was very bad for any sort of large scale conventional guerilla resistance, American tech really made it more like a boxer fighting a grade schooler

Not sure if the story of his grandpa is credible, but the basic facts that these young, inexperienced soldiers sucked in this environment and mostly killed civilians is widely known.

yo, americans fought for like, 4 and a half years though. after 1970 he was mostly just fighting ARVN guys since americans went to the coast or were kept in cities away from the frontline.

they had a 'unacknowledged deal' with the arvn rangers e.g. the arvn convict regiment to avoid each other since they couldn't fight two armies at once. the arvn guys hated communists but also didn't like the americans.

when the americans were ordered to just guard bases after 1969, they proceeded to maul each other, most of the arvn rangers literally fought to the last bullet and got wiped out in 75. it was a big waste because vietnam literally resembles south vietnam more than "north vietnam" during the war, e.g. government is kept minimal, laws are barely followed, barely any rules but the government just cares about making money and making sure you don't talk shit about them.

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the same was said in USSR, unironically

>when the americans were ordered to just guard bases after 1969, they proceeded to maul each other, most of the arvn rangers literally fought to the last bullet and got wiped out in 75. it was a big waste because vietnam literally resembles south vietnam more than "north vietnam" during the war, e.g. government is kept minimal, laws are barely followed, barely any rules but the government just cares about making money and making sure you don't talk shit about them.
Whereas one could contrast China where the government still imposes Orwellian thought control on the population. It's not enough that you don't oppose the government, they also strictly regulate all media and Internet to have "correct, patriotic, and socially harmonious" content.

his troops were half the time starving to death given they were given rice and salt and had to survive off the jungle or find c-rations off of americans, and the other half of the time literally dying of malaria or some jungle disease. they didn't have comfy bases to go to and had literal jungle bases.

the army he fought with was super-primitive for a few years since you had to literally walk 1000kms over four months through hills and mountains in laos to go and fight. they had nice weapons but made impossible demands on soldiers. it kinda worked because only the toughest survived, really. if you refused to fight, you were shot, if you were dying you were left.

after a few years they paved the roads, built railways and it took them 2 weeks to get to travel from hanoi to around saigon lmao.

thanks

Because the vast majority of their fighting was against South Vietnamese.

I'm also Vietnamese. My grandpa didn't fight in it though because he was wealthy nobility (got screwed by the commies though). He towered above other Vietnamese people at the time though at just 5'8, so he could've probably been a killing machine.

The CCP was always terribly totalitarian and tried to completely reshape Chinese society and obliterate all vestiges of pre-communist times in a way that Hanoi never did. The end result was entire Chinese cities being turned into nothing but gray commie cement slabs with all traditional/old buildings being knocked down..

I think being short served an advantage because of all the hiding and tunnel warfare

also if you abandoned post and go back home, you were either ordered back or shot if you refuse. its a shit situation, but most people seeing american jets all over north vietnam were motivated to fight even harder.

half the country would have probably just mutiny if america didn't decide to start bombing north vietnam lmao and they saw first-hand what they were fighting for. most north vietnamese didn't give a fuck about following rules and a few places were close to revolt until american bombers literally rallied people to fight.

yup. its fucked up. they are trying the same shit today in vietnam but the country has been on strike for a week now. the communists wanted to open up land to be purchasable by foreigners like here in canada and put in internet censorship and it literally woke people, now china is warning its citizens to leave vietnam.

the communists have a hard time containing nationalism imo, after using it for many years to strengthen themselves.

shut the fuck up you faggot, my grandpa was literally 5'11 and descended from northern battle-hardened tibetan hill tribes.

he would have been happy to re-educate your coward grandpa.

That's true, heard stories about short American soldiers being valued for that kind of stuff.

>the communists wanted to open up land to be purchasable by foreigners like here in canada

>and then China buys up the entirety of Vietnam
Genius.

>tibetan
So not even real kinh Vietnamese you krypto-chink

How do commies so consistently manage to ruin everything thy touch?

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They touch I mean.

>half the country would have probably just mutiny if america didn't decide to start bombing north vietnam lmao and they saw first-hand what they were fighting for. most north vietnamese didn't give a fuck about following rules and a few places were close to revolt until american bombers literally rallied people to fight.

When they entered Saigon in 1975, they found how rich and prosperous the place was and that stores were full of goods and realized how they'd been lied to all these years,

the country is literally in revolt. people were pissed about the latest wave of communism.

the communists are pretty terrified and get paranoid pretty easily since they failed to "fix" the southern problem after conquering them. now the northerners are turning on them.

>tibetan hill tribes
nah all vietnamese are from the Himalayas regions. you were vietnamese if you start speaking the language. most vietnamese are pretty diverse-looking imo especially from different regions.

let's just say they are 'aware' of the east asian they see as aliens from far up north.

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Yeah I'm just joking.If you like Vietnam and the people you're Vietnamese to me.

Most Viets hate China; that's well established. The government however tends to nutlick Beijing either out of fear of their giant neighbor or to get business/trade deals, or out of a misguided and antiquated notion of China being a brother socialist country.

**Assuming you're at least somewhat ethnically related of course.

>stupid shit

nah, they saw the handful of rich saigonese and proceeded to nationalise it. good times.

half the country cheered reunification lmao because the PAVN were disciplined as hell, didn't loot shit, didn't fucking cause troubles like the VC/ARVN and were orderly and peaceful since they all thought the PAVN would start looting and burning. then they rounded up all the "traitors" lmao a few months later and you get an eternally butthurt diaspora.

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>the communists are pretty terrified and get paranoid pretty easily since they failed to "fix" the southern problem after conquering them. now the northerners are turning on them.

While some old people still admire the VCP for "winning" the war and unifying the country, the younger generation (and Vietnam is a young country with 41% of the population under 25 and only 3-4% over 65) does not have so much affection towards them.

What happened then was that there was an extremely harsh decade of "war" communism and nonstop battles with China and Cambodia that did not end until the late 80s when the fighting stopped and the aged VCP leadership of Le Duan and Pham Van Dong were forced out in favor of younger men.

let's just say the "communists" didn't win. 95% of the people had no idea what communism was or who marx was but fought to remove burgers and foreigners who were bombing them but just struck an alliance with the real communists.

unironically the southerners thought they were fighting to prevent china/international communism. both were probably happy the foreigners got the fuck out including china.

america had no business being there and the moment they deployed troops meant the war was over. their friends would let them die enough until they left and let them take over again, while the north wouldn't stop trying to kill them until they left. possibly the dumbest thing america has done was to jump right into the middle of a civil war that has been going on for 2-3 decades.

Le Duan died I think and they abandoned communism fully.

they mostly conscripted arvn/southerners to fight in cambodia and kept guarding the border with china. the khmer rouge were pretty shitty, were conquered in less than a week but retreated into thailand to wage guerrilla war and was backed by thai troops. a truly perfidious, shit country was thailand.

>canadian flags all over the thread

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>unironically the southerners thought they were fighting to prevent china/international communism. both were probably happy the foreigners got the fuck out including china.

>america had no business being there and the moment they deployed troops meant the war was over. their friends would let them die enough until they left and let them take over again, while the north wouldn't stop trying to kill them until they left. possibly the dumbest thing america has done was to jump right into the middle of a civil war that has been going on for 2-3 decades.

That's not really what was going on; it was a proxy conflict between the US and Soviet Union and Hanoi depended on massive Soviet assistance. China was involved as well, because they did not want Vietnam to be unified, but to stay divided and not potentially become a regional power.

Were the first part true, the Soviet military advisers would have also left in 1975. But they didn't, not until the USSR collapsed.

literally just me. i'm not even full asian.

>inb4 eliott rodgers or whatever the fuck

>Le Duan died I think and they abandoned communism fully.

He died first and then PVD retired. The new leadership immediately denounced their elderly predecessors for pursing doctrinaire Stalinism, allowing massive corruption, and for allowing the population to be totally impoverished.

Then they just copied China's "market" socialism.

american ground troops is a different story mate. they used to release propaganda to tell the people they were "fighting colonialism again", but that literally didn't work until they started seeing americans patrolling everywhere in 1965. then the VC literally ballooned.

when american ground troops were kept to doing nothing around 1970 and 1971 half the VC went and joined south vietnam and signed up for the arvn lmao.

it was literally American Education: War Edition

This varies with the administration however to our credit I will say we are one of few, or perhaps the only, country that has turned to it's former wartime enemies and extended a hand of friendship. Given the scale of WWII extending the olive branch of friendship to both Germany and Japan almost immediately after the end of the war was amazingly altruistic. I'll grant there were some ulterior motives with regards to containing Communism that drove those actions but even still.

>China was involved as well, because they did not want Vietnam to be unified, but to stay divided and not potentially become a regional power
About 130,000 PLA troops were in North Vietnam, mostly to perform infrastructure projects and relieve the burden from Hanoi's hard pressed manpower. Although China supplied light weapons to North Vietnam, they had nothing to offer in heavy equipment all of which came from the Soviets.

based as fuck. is he still alive?

yo the funny thing is, hanoi was just as corrupt as saigon and you had a huge black-market.

the difference is, americans pretty much "shot" their own ally on the way out. they gave them every kind of weapon but didn't train people to maintain them and half the planes didn't work and half the tanks didn't move. then they stopped giving them bullets and artillery. the north literally predicted another decade of war until they realized the south was collapsing.

this is after spending 1 trillion dollars on a war and losing 58k people and nearly 2 decades of its time, the americans just handed over equipment to the south without training them, and ran away, afterwards forgetting to even give them bullets. its so comical, i laugh every time.

Because he's making shit up.

nah. died 5 years back. had ptsd but was happy , kept busy growing bonsai trees and raising random song birds and shit.

Early 80s pic of Pham, Le, and president Truong Chinh. All in their 70s and looking it too. This pic also may have been taken in the Soviet Union because I don't think you'd wear clothing like that in Vietnam's climate. In 1982, Le complained how aged the party leadership were and how corruption was out of control. Even before he died, he was talking of the need for economic reforms, but at his age didn't have the energy to implement them, so that was left to his younger successors.

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yup i'm sorry if all the men you knew are the kind that surrenders their own country to foreigners without a fight.

How bad was agent orange?

northerners all wore these. they dressed very differently. southerners all had weird 70s american aesthetic and haircuts.

the first thing my grandpa did was literally being ordered to round up all the people with "foreign looks" and give them proper communist clothes and haircuts.

>this is after spending 1 trillion dollars on a war and losing 58k people and nearly 2 decades of its time, the americans just handed over equipment to the south without training them, and ran away, afterwards forgetting to even give them bullets. its so comical, i laugh every time.

It's not if you understand how that happened. Basically, after Nixon resigned, the Congressional elections in fall 1974 were swept by leftist Democrats. So soon as the new Congress convened in January 1975, they voted to terminate all US aid to Saigon and forbid any further military involvement in Southeast Asia. Although President Ford opposed this, they had a veto-proof majority. The final NVA drive in spring 1975 could have been stopped with merely air and naval support, not even ground troops.

wasn't affected. americans didn't know where the north vietnamese were otherwise they'd just send b52s or napalm. they mostly just sprayed it on their own troops/bases.

America used to be good. Then neocon took over

Wait they did friendly fire with agent orange?

What the fuck?

Pretty much. My grandfather was affected by it

I was just saying it looked a bit odd to wear a heavy wool coat and a ski cap in the tropics which is why I wondered if they weren't visiting Moscow in that photo. Maybe I'm wrong though.

>final drive

nah. they had mobile AA, a lot more than 1972. it would have taken america's entire airforce because they also started using jets/bombers too. they also recruited spies from the french embassy to basically tell them about america's intentions and realized america wouldn't even intervene (most of the communist party spoke french fluently and tapped into france alot).

yup. it was use to defoliate. they sprayed it everywhere though and alot on both sides were affected because nobody knew about the side effects. americans used actual poison gas/tear gas against opponents though.

Khrushchev once made the unflattering remark that the communist world were like "pigs at the trough". Continually badgering Moscow with requests for more money, more soldiers, more weapons, more military advisers, demanding to send their students/cadres to the USSR to be educated, etc, etc.

Of course he didn't give a shit about Vietnam or most goings on in Asia anyway; that was Brezhnev who decided that it was "owed" to a brother socialist country.

>Continually badgering Moscow with requests for more money, more soldiers, more weapons, more military advisers
Syria is doing exactly the same now. Assad is basically taking advantage of Russia and uses it for his own profits. Unfortunately Russia can't deny him help because Putin can't afford losing Tartus naval base (the ONLY naval base Russia has abroad).
Too bad it may end up like Afghan war eventually.

>No other country consistently sends it's soldiers to die for the freedom of others
Our soldiers mostly die for Israel.

By the early 80s, Soviet aid to Vietnam alone was reaching $2 million a day. Most of Moscow's clients were a total money sink that gave little back for what was spent on them and it was one of the many factors that led to the USSR's ultimate demise.

to be fair, most communist countries were kinda shit and were in random african countries and couldn't really fight wars.

vietnam managed to down over a dozen B-52s, and had destroyed American jets at a 3 to 1 ratio using outdated Migs. russians were VERY HAPPY to field test air force gear and get american planes to analyze/develop weapons for in case of WW3.

its why they were the first country to be given guided anti-tank and manpads. later on they got to use the biggest/best-made base in asia at cam-ranh bay free of charge.

russians get to field test new weapons, destroy american morale and basically watch and laugh as america tears itself apart. meanwhile a few years later repeat the same thing against china. its the biggest win-win for them.

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At least Khrushchev was smart enough to put the brakes on some of that shit (for example, he told Hanoi to seek a settlement at the UN). Brezhnev just went "Come one, come all! Take anything you need."

700 million a year is peanuts though. the afghan war cost way more and america eaily spent 100x that number in the 60s and early 70s.

>Because he's making shit up
There is something fishy about this guy, namely how he manages to put an unnecessary anti-US comment in every other post. That's why I suspected he's a possible chink CCPbot.

>700 million a year is peanuts though. the afghan war cost way more and america eaily spent 100x that number in the 60s and early 70s
Considering the Soviet economy was quite a bit smaller than the US economy, it was a lot more proportionate to total GDP.

There were times though when occasional friction surfaced; for example Hanoi objected to Soviet requests to obtain greater use of Vietnamese military facilities and have a greater role in managing their economy.

dude not every fucking post which is critical of america is "anti-US" and "pro-china".

its not hard to realize americans stumbled into a war and made an endless series of mistakes and fought a war in the most retarded ways.

i could easily talk about him watching chinese soldiers march shoulder-to-shoulder against an AK-47 trench and fighting like its WW1 when he was commanding a regiment but i don't because the thread isn't about that.

that happened because our navy needed to come back because internal issues, damn

He's told the John Woo Rambo story before, back then the alleged kill count was in the 30+ range. I swear I could sell swampland in Florida to Jow Forums because it's like user has to check his credulity in at the door.

Thank you for fighting for my freedum

oh no not anti-us comment, THIS WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A PRO US THREAD

Who the fuck is this clown?