So there's all this news about Argentina going to hell but can any Argentinians talk about what that means for their...

>but why do South American nations like Argentina experience these things much more than English speaking countries which have been hitherto quite stable?
we have mongs that have established social democracy before industrialization, it's difficult to get investors in when there's nearly no benefit for them to invest here.
>Why would multinational corporations feel the need to intentionally lower the value of the peso?
because then they (and/or their "friends) can come buy land and means of production or raw material for virtually nothing.
>Haven't modern governments since Peron been pretty liberal?
all of our governments have been social democratic, except for the current one which is neoliberal and has been ruling for 3 years, and obviously the right wing dictatorships imposed on us by the US.
>By socialism do you mean nationalization of the means of production?
yes.
>If so, how do you feel about Venezuela?
Venezuela might have socialist leaders but they live under capitalism, there's private property of the means of production, and it makes up the majority of their economy.
I don't like Venezuela nor its leaders, they're fucking retarded, they call themselves socialists but they've had the army under their command for 20 years now and they haven't seized the means of production.

>What is negative about fiat currency? I mean, why in your opinion is a currency based on some tangible thing a better option?
impossible for foreign factors to have an effect on its value.
gold standard was alright.
>but these are just quite common things that I've heard unfortunately.
we're very racist towards the rest of latin america, where do you think the "argentina is white" meme came from?

>we have mongs that have established social democracy before industrialization, it's difficult to get investors in when there's nearly no benefit for them to invest here.

Yes, from my understanding this is one of the major issues with African nations who after colonialism, attempted to establish somewhat socialist governments which crumbled under the feet in very short time. Marx was quite specific that history is a process whereby capitalism is a necessary stage for socialism to develop. That being said, we can also look at situations like the Soviet Union which industrialized lands of millions of people. How did they do that? I'm not exactly sure, but I understand what you're saying.

>because then they (and/or their "friends) can come buy land and means of production or raw material for virtually nothing.

A rational answer. What happened to people for us to become so neutered that the prospect of putting these people to the guillotines is so alien. We know it's all a rich man's game, yet we just sit and watch the world burn before us. Strange times.

>but they've (Venezuela) had the army under their command for 20 years now and they haven't seized the means of production.

What has stopped them? It seems very strange to me that Venezuela has so much oil that they should be Norway deep in wealth yet it's the way it is today.

>impossible for foreign factors to have an effect on its value.

That's reasonable. I think I'll look more into this. Why do you believe almost (all?) currencies today are fiat? Keynes was quite fond of fiat currency and his ideas are the governing ones in most stable social democracies today.

>we're very racist towards the rest of latin america, where do you think the "argentina is white" meme came from?

Why are people in Argentina this way towards other SA countries do you think? I don't want to make a bold claim that all SA countries are so similar but there is a common shared history so why is Argentina different?

>argentina going to hell

lol

no bro....theyre just preparing for the Malvinas reconquista.

they are now certain no angloid will come to cuck them.

MALVINAS LOS ARGENTINAS!!!

Attached: malvinas-argentinas-012.jpg (1272x748, 64K)

>How did they do that?
Leninism.
socialism =/= social democracy
you can have socialism in backwards shitholes with economies based in agriculture, but social democracy not so much.
>What happened to people for us to become so neutered that the prospect of putting these people to the guillotines is so alien
this is a bourgeois world m8, it's essentially feudalism but with some slight movement of people between classes, very little movement.
>What has stopped them?
their retarded ideology, they call it "socialism of the 21st century", they're fucking idiots.
>It seems very strange to me that Venezuela has so much oil that they should be Norway deep in wealth yet it's the way it is today.
USA and its minions can manipulate the value of the oil, Venezuela's economy is based on a single commodity, oil, so even if very slightly, devaluation of oil destroys their economy.
>Why do you believe almost (all?) currencies today are fiat?
I really don't know, it must be some rich people scheme that I don't understand, but it doesn't make sense to me, it's just fucking paper, nothing is giving it value other than the retarded and mystical invisible hand of the free market.
>Why are people in Argentina this way towards other SA countries do you think?
european ancestry, most of latin america is brown and indians look like fucking goblinos m8, they're hideous, we make fun of them because of this, it's like your abos.
>I don't want to make a bold claim that all SA countries are so similar but there is a common shared history so why is Argentina different?
no, there's a shared history between groups of countries, not all of us though.
Argentina, Uruguay and Brazil share history and culture, but we have very little to do with rest of latin america other than for the fact that we speak the same language, it'd be like claiming you and Nigerians are the same.

>Leninism

What about Leninism allowed socialism develop from a predominately agricultural economy?

>their retarded ideology, they call it "socialism of the 21st century", they're fucking idiots.

I think you're aware that just calling them retards is just a shortcut to a complex issue but why do you think they shoot themselves in the foot with their unique ideology if it's proven to fail in practice? It doesn't sound like they'd benefit in any way by continuing with it.

>most of latin america is brown and indians look like fucking goblinos m8, they're hideous, we make fun of them because of this, it's like your abos.

Well, attractiveness is generally relative but I do understand what you mean. I don't understand however how that would lead to discrimination. Is it something left over from the casta system days?

>USA and its minions can manipulate the value of the oil

Also how does this happen? Isn't the value of oil determined by the market (i.e. supply and demand)?

>What about Leninism allowed socialism develop from a predominately agricultural economy?
I meant Stalinism
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Soviet_Union_(1927–1953)#Industrialisation_in_practice

>why do you think they shoot themselves in the foot with their unique ideology if it's proven to fail in practice?
they expropriate companies and run them to the ground.
they haven't seized the means of production, but they're socialists so the owners of the means of production know that they're gonna get fucked, and purposefuly stop supplying (and hence empty shelves on markets) and hoard their goods, only to get it out of the Venezuelan market into colombia and other countries, and their money as well, generating unbelievable hyperinflation and shitting up the Venezuelan economy and ultimately the population since they have no toilet paper or whatever.
and let's not even begin with their retarded social programs that hemorrage money.
again, they're fucking retarded.
>It doesn't sound like they'd benefit in any way by continuing with it.
I mean the very poor are having a blast since the government gives them free everything, but those who weren't destitute in the past 2 decades have fled because they can't buy shit, there are no jobs, they can't save money because of the hyperinflation, crime is through the roof, etc.
surprisingly the majority keep voting for them (not really since the majority are really poor).
>I don't understand however how that would lead to discrimination. Is it something left over from the casta system days?
no, they're just fucking goblins m8.
also for most of the past 100 years Argentina was the only country with universal healthcare and free universities in latin america, so everyone in South America came here to study and leave, our people didn't like that very much.

USA and its minions essentially have monopoly on oil, they extract more, there's more supply, less demand, oil price goes down.

>MALVINAS LOS ARGENTINAS!!!

>Well, attractiveness is generally relative but I do understand what you mean. I don't understand however how that would lead to discrimination. Is it something left over from the casta system days?
We are more classists and xenophobes than racists

>I meant Stalinism

Are you sympathetic to Stalinsm? If so, why? Stalin seemed to run contrary to the anti-nationalist and humanist ideas of Marxism from my rudimentary understanding, for example instead of attempting to expand socialism, it became inward like a turtle. I suppose this becomes the old Stalin-Trotsky issue though.

>they expropriate companies and run them to the ground.

How do they manage to do that? Logically speaking, you'd install educated people into management positions and compensate them well enough but many self-proclaimed socialist states seem to do the exact opposite for whatever reason. Thanks for the explanation about Venezuela though, che :-D

>also for most of the past 100 years Argentina was the only country with universal healthcare and free universities in latin america, so everyone in South America came here to study and leave, our people didn't like that very much.

Why did Argentina continue to offer free education for even non-citizens? It seems counter-intuitive to stability and progress as humanitarian as it may be.

>USA and its minions essentially have monopoly on oil, they extract more, there's more supply, less demand, oil price goes down.

yeah, I'm well aware of this. It's all a rich man's game and we're just swine caught up in it all

>We are more classists and xenophobes than racists

Why would Argentinian culture be classist if it has such a history of social democracy/egalitarianism? This seems contradictory

>Are you sympathetic to Stalinsm?
no.
>anti-nationalist and humanist ideas of Marxism
you shouldn't listen to Jordan Peterson that much.
Marxism has nothing to do with nationalism/anti-nationalism.
>for example instead of attempting to expand socialism, it became inward like a turtle.
yes, this is called "socialism in one country", Stalin was fucking retarded lmao
>I suppose this becomes the old Stalin-Trotsky issue though
one of the, yes.
I'm a trotskyist, if Stalinist USSR was a thing today, I would still support it, just because it's a socialist country, but I don't like it.
>How do they manage to do that?
I don't know how, but the fact that pretty much all of them if not literally all of them are in red numbers is public knowledge.
>Thanks for the explanation about Venezuela though
you're welcome
>Why did Argentina continue to offer free education for even non-citizens? It seems counter-intuitive to stability and progress as humanitarian as it may be.
don't know, this is a much debated hot topic even to this day.

People associates crime with poverty, violent cases are repeated by the media nonstop

>you shouldn't listen to Jordan Peterson that much.

I don't. I feel that Jordan Peterson is effectively a crypto-fascist and find his ideas deeply unsettling.

>Marxism has nothing to do with nationalism/anti-nationalism.

Well, from my learnings, the nation-state is a modern bourgeois creation which is destined for the ash heap of history. To build socialism around is is destined for failure at least according to my understandings of Marxist theory.

>I'm a trotskyist, if Stalinist USSR was a thing today, I would still support it, just because it's a socialist country, but I don't like it.

I feel the same way. Why do you believe the USSR collapsed in any case? Almost 20 years on and we live in world where we feel paralyzed without hope. The "socialist" movement worldwide is a joke infiltrated by all sorts of poisonous ideas and people. Nobody knows what to do or where to go and we're just waiting for it to all finally collapse into a great inferno just so we can say "I told you so." How ominous are these days

Shit almost *30 years I mean

Fuck I'm getting old

>Well, from my learnings, the nation-state is a modern bourgeois creation which is destined for the ash heap of history.
correct, a nation has nothing to do with the state, this doesn't mean that the ideology supports nationalism or anti-nationalism, it doesn't care about it, you can have several nations under a single state, which happens today in some countries already.
nation states are a retarded meme.
>To build socialism around is is destined for failure at least according to my understandings of Marxist theory.
also correct, you shouldn't build socialism based on a nation state.
this doesn't mean that you should get rid of nationalities or anything like that.

>Why do you believe the USSR collapsed in any case?
Paul Cockshott has a good video on this:
youtube.com/watch?v=EE-kCZnlGZU

>Nobody knows what to do or where to go and we're just waiting for it to all finally collapse into a great inferno just so we can say "I told you so."
well, capitalism can only go so far, it will unironically and inevitably collapse at some point.
the idea is to have something to turn to when this happens.
ofcourse that having revolutions or reforms before it collapses would be better, but it doesn't look probable.

Kek

>this doesn't mean that you should get rid of nationalities or anything like that.

But nationalities without nation-states, especially in our time of global homogeneity will ultimately fade into obscurity. We're becoming human beings with a global human culture. It's happening and nationalists cannot stop it.

>Paul Cockshott has a good video on this:

Thanks so much. I'll give it a good watch as it's a question that has played on my mind a lot through the years. It feels surreal that there used to be not that long ago a real humanitarian alternative (theoretically at the very least) to global capitalism but now there is nothing except the almighty dollar.

>well, capitalism can only go so far, it will unironically and inevitably collapse at some point.

Yes, of course. It's just this process is slow and painful like a cancer slowly destroying you from the inside. It hurts and you can't do anything about it. A really awful experience but what more can you do than wait and hope the ecosystem isn't destroyed before capitalism collapses.

Anyway, I've really enjoyed my discussion with you. Thanks so much for taking the time to answer my questions and discuss these things. I hope you have a nice evening and wish you all the best in life, user.

>Well, attractiveness is generally relative
Imagine being so sheltered in 2018

thanks, you too m8

so this is how threads about our country are without mexicans huh?