This is a high level thread where we can discuss the economy. In my opinion (recently validated by GS) is that the fiat-based economy is on its last legs. There is too much debt. This is why I'm bullish on BTC and crypto in general since they are assets which can not be produced out of thin air.
Just look around you. Look at fine art, real estate, student loan debt, FAANG, Tesla, etc.. which are just so full of bullshit. Not to mention our demographic crisis. When is the whole thing gonna collapse?
Let me rephrase. Cryptocurrencies are a potentially unlimited source of wealth creation and, inversely, a way to justify massive amounts of "debt". Because they are a new medium of exchange and their value is not directly related to any particular region of the world or connected to any source of direct revenue the value of Bitcoin, for example, is theoretically unlimited.
Evan Thomas
Fiat on its last legs? I just cant buy it, out of thousands of years, only right now its gonna collapse? Powers have always devalued their coins throughout history. I do believe in cryptocurrency, digital, secure, transparent, not at the whims of govs. Maybe a slow bleed out of more countries but I just cant see outright collapse.
I still don't understand. For instance the dreadnaught arms race in the first world war between UK and GER was a result of fiat money. They left the gold standard which allowed them to print money so that they could finance their armaments industry. If they stayed on Gold standard they never would have had enough "wealth" to buy all of the guns, ships, and ammo. Therefore no arms race.
BTC is the same as gold since there is only a limited amount that can not be created by a central bank. How does this enable a "potentially unlimited source of wealth creation"? By it's very definition it is limited.
also let me remind you that by 2020 the US debt will be growing by over a trillion USD per year. And that debt only increases. Also it costs us money to service that debt so it's like a positive reinforcement cycle. Also oil price is rising which will be yet another headwind towards inflation. What you talking about bro?
Joshua Diaz
If you held BTC from 1k USD to 19k USD did you not create 18k worth of wealth for yourself? BTC specifically and cryptocurrencies in general allow for an unlimited speculation about future network value currently not achievable through stocks/bonds/debt-based derivatives or fiat currencies.
Isaac Sanders
crypto in general is not a debt based currency unlike fiat. there can be no quantitative easing unlike fiat for a start. is this for a high school project?
Dylan Harris
No one can force the US to pay their debt, just like no one can force Japan to pay their debt. You can only force a country to pay debt if they arent able to print their currency.
Owen Thompson
Ok whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa. You have a deep misunderstanding but that's ok.
>If you held BTC from 1k USD to 19k USD No "extra" wealth was created. What happened is that the USD depreciated against the BTC. 1 BTC still equals 1 BTC. Any "money" that you made from selling your BTC was given to you in fiat by someone else. 1 BTC is still worth 1 BTC. As it always will be.
One 1913 USD is not the same as one 2018 USD. One 2009 BTC will always be the same as one 2018 BTC.
William Thompson
>what is inflation
Jack Morris
My purchasing power increased. I don't measure my purchasing power vs the asset I am using as money. Please explain how I am misunderstanding the potentially unlimited increase in the purchasing power of 1 BTC vs a basket of goods/services?
Ethan Hernandez
>This is why I'm bullish on BTC and crypto in general since they are assets which can not be produced out of thin air.
More like assets that cannot be taken away on a government whim. With less and less people working and more and more relying on pensions/government help/market payouts this becomes increasingly more likely
Hudson Gonzalez
>I don't measure my purchasing power vs the asset I am using as money. You do. But that's not the point. Your BTC appreciated against the dollar. USD loses value and BTC gains value. No new wealth was created.
Colton Campbell
>More like assets that cannot be taken away on a government whim. I disagree. What do you think about colored coins?
Austin Wright
Even better than crypto is productive assets, they will always inflate with the currency, although stores of wealth are important
John Gomez
>they will always inflate with the currency That sounds horrible.
Eli Bennett
i'm guessing in about 30 years when the northwest passage opens up more and becomes the largest shipping channel in the world. once that happens the world will basically belong to whomever is in control of that passage
you cannot have capitalism without debt, without a way to create wealth out of "thin air". really it is just as a consequence of the improvement of technology, that is why the fiat system of printing more and more money works, because we can bet on increases in productivity but productivity increases are not constant with increase in money supply, leading to economic cycles of growth and retraction. Sure, maybe someday fiat will collapse, i would not say it is soon. btw you can create crypto out of "thin air", i mean is printing money really more unproductive than using electrical power to mine cryptos? isnt that being produced out of thin air? and you say too much debt, but how do you know how much is too much? just like how one point no body expected this many humans on the planet, you cant be sure what really is "too much"
Bentley Peterson
>Just look around you. Look at fine art, real estate, student loan debt, FAANG, Tesla, etc.. which are just so full of bullshit.
Finally someone who is not a complete retard on this board. Why does everybody have an opinion about the markets if they have no solid understanding of fundamental economics??
