in the event of SHTF, if you have no access to any other kind of ammo, is m193 lethal enough to stop attackers at a range of 100 yards with one shot, or will it ice pick?
You cant always hit vitals like a movie hitman, and all you might get is a single hit with an off placed shot. Is standard ar15 ammo sufficent?
(16 inch barrel)
M193 is gucci, I keep some and some m855. Variety is the spice of life.
If it doesn't work the first time just keep shooting
Why are you using shit ammo?
>or will it ice pick?
keep ice picking then
Yes, M193 works well terminally out of a 16" barrel.
stand in front of even 40 grain 5.56 at 100 yards and tell us how worthless it is
stop fantasizing and trying to find fault in a gun you dont have to support your preference for a different gun you also don't have
>ARlets
Use a shotgun if you're worried, faggot,
>Shitguns
Go shoot a bird Cletus
Try killing a grizzly with your baby ammo.
I would take a rifle capable of killing grizzlies if I was planning on shooting at grizzlies.
But I would never buy a fucking shitgun you hillbilly.
I have a 20 inch barrel, so definitely yes, no issues.
I'm gonna tell you right now, a bullet "only" icepicking will still kill the fuck out of you. A piece of metal flying at outrageous speeds is always going to be very unpleasant for a human.
M193 is a made up term by the US military with no international standard to follow by manufacturers. In order to know if your particular brand of M193 is effective, we have to know what brand it is and what bullet construction they use.
M855 doesn't have the problem since bullet jacket and construction is uniform for anyone adhering to M855's NATO specifications.
>inb4 "M193fag" butthurt.
If you want real M193 buy Federal btw.
M855's problems come from wildly inconsistent fleet yaw, which is where this whole "ice pick" thing comes from.
My point was M855 has a real adherable spec. Every manufacturer makes their own "M193."
>is m193 lethal enough to stop attackers at a range of 100 yards with one shot
Yes, if you hit the brain or the spine. Otherwise there's no guarantee he will stop.This applies to all calibers.
Saged and reported fuck off dumb nigger
It heavily depends. In Iraq it wasn't enough. Honestly if you want a surefire takedown, do a 308 shorty.
Multiple times in Iraq I witnessed enemies taking 1-2 rounds center mass and continue fighting. They were usually drugged up on some ephedrine-like shit.
That photo looks like the most overpriced gunstore in the world.
>overdone lighting
>glass case
>just a plain jane upper inside
>no price posted
If you even asked about it, they'd be like "Oh, that? I don't even really want to sell that, but I might be persuaded for $5,500, firm plus tip."
Yeah, but it's well known that M855 green tip doesn't fragment as consistently as M193. Same issue in Mogadishu, especially against malnourished, thin Somalis. The green tip rounds would usually just poke holes in their bodies and exit before fragmenting.
Is M193 lethal? Yes, absolutely. If you want to maximize lethality of a 55 grain projectile then you should be using a 20 inch barrel.
The biggest issue with M855 is barrel length and the targets makeup.
With a 20" barrel M855 will perform just fine, 14.5 is where problems start, with fragmentation dropping down to less than 100M. With dudes that aren't scarecrows and have gear and body armor M855 excells, which is what it was made for.
Why not a 28 inch barrel?
20 inch barrels help a lot but it doesn't correct the inherent cause of ice picking even well within 100m.
Fucking Manlet, not even using a 36 inch barrel on your ar-15.
Go with a real round like 762x39 or 762 NATO. 556 is only designed to wound which makes sense for an army fighting a war but not a single person in SHTF scenario.
AR-15 foot barrel amirite?
People have killed grizzlies with much less.
>. If you want to maximize lethality of a 55 grain projectile then you should be using a 20 inch barrel.
Stop making dumb blanket statements like this.
Opie is an idiot.
He's the result of all the stupid fuddlore floating around Jow Forums.
55gr out of any barrel length 10.3" and over is 'effective' out to 300m.
I've seen a friend shoot and kill a Grizzly in Alaska with M855. It's all about shot placement. If you shoot them in the leg, of course you're not going to kill them, but a head or a neck shot will ruin their day.
B00mp
Depends on what you are shooting it out of. My 180 was designed to fire m193 and to be able to kill a man wearing light body armor at 500 yards. Ask yourself what is the length and twist rate of the gun you are shooting out of? If it's not 18 inches or better and one in ten or slower twist. M193 might not be you flavor of basketball American remover.
I'm not saying that's impossible, but fucking why? Was he fucking around with his AR and a grizz charged him or what? I don't want to think your friend is the kind of dick who would chance maiming an animal just to prove a point in an argument nobody wants to have.
Yeah 5.56 should be fine for most situations. A hit to the pelvic girdle is sure to disable pretty much everything.
Man I want an AR-18 clone so bad. I want so many damn guns.
We had been on his boat and were having a picnic lunch on the shore (Chichagof Island). His brother had a .44 Mag revolver, but had stepped around the corner to take a piss. Said friend was carrying his AR because they were cool back in the '90s and he was proud of it; they weren't nearly as common as today.
M193 ain't as amazing as M855A1, V-Max or Mk.262 Mod 1, but it'll do the job far better than M855 will.
>check out this ammo thats impossible to find or costs two dollars a round!
Fuckoff
I've heard several defensive instructors are teaching a two shot + 1 method now. First shot to the pelvis, second center mass, third is optional but to the head on an as-needed basis.
Not my fault you're a complete poorfag.
>If you use snowflake rounds, 5.56 will be good! Really, guys!
>V-Max
>Snowflake
But hey, Golden Tiger is alright M193 for an alright price, maybe that'll suit your modest budget more.
Its not my fault youre retarded and waste money on meme rounds
More people have killed brown bears with service caliber pistols than shotguns.
I would absolutely take a 5.56 over a 12 ga slug, and so would most people that have ever shot either. Kindly go kys.
Funny, in Afghanistan I saw exactly the opposite. Hell, the 2 dudes that only I shot dropped immediately after the first hit.
One shot not well aimed at a vital organ? Maybe they'll bleed out because you hit a major blood vessel. But you shouldn't be assuming one shot under such circumstances will take anyone out of the fight immediately. OP you need to get a full powered milsurp rifle- I'm planning to get a zastava m48 myself.
Why do people insist on using M193 or M855? Is it because there's no other widely available brass cased ammo? If you used hollow or soft points would expansion be an issue? It seems like you're really limiting yourself if you insist on using FMJ ammo, but on the other hand if it's for the purpose of stocking up ammo than that makes a lot more sense.
Because green tip and 193 are by far the most common ammo you fucking moron.
SP and HP ammo is fucking expensive, and im not paying a dollar per pop for 556.
Paying more than a dollar for that stupid shit defeats the only reason the ar platform is remotely interesting in the first place.
What ammo was it? How long was the barrel? How far away were they?
>Paying more than a dollar for that stupid shit defeats the only reason the ar platform is remotely interesting in the first place.
Light ammunition with a rifle that's easy to control in rapid fire, giving a flat trajectory and good reach?
Intermediate cartridges weren't developed to make them cheap, they were developed to be efficient, first and foremost.
>hits you with a slug
Nothing personal kid.
Ok fine. You got me there.
But still, it just pisses me off that we didnt go the route the russians did with 545.
545 is literally -fucking perfect-.
>its lightweight
>its cheap
>common FMJ loads are just as deadly as vmax 556
Is there any bullet similar to the M855A1's bullet available for reloading?
No. It's a unicorn.
>cheap
It hasn’t been 12 cents per round in 4 years and never will be again. I do miss it though.
Is there currently any reason to believe that will change at any point in the future?
user, 5.45 is literally 5.56 but with inferior potential.
Not really. Plus apparently it's pretty rough on the barrel in the .mil loadings. I've yet to see it in person.
Not what I'd wanted to hear, but fair enough. I was hoping I could take the bullet and load it at a lower pressure so it wouldn't be so rough on the barrels.
They're so fucking close in terms of ballistics that outside of comparing loadings themselves (7n6 vs. M855, for instance), it's kind of pointless.
Assuming you were to create new loads for each of them, you could do pretty much all of the same things with both of them, perhaps with maybe a margin of like ~10% difference.
>inferior potential
Fucking how? It yaws almost immediately, its nicknamed the poison bullet/ pussy bullet. Its so unstable
alaskan killed one with 5.45x39, he shot it 15 times though
5.45x39 is a pussy magnet round user.
7N6 has the odd feature of squirming it's way through trees and probably tissue along with yawing almost immediately and causing a lot of tissue damage.
>Every manufacturer makes their own "M193."
Maybe, but Federal XM193 is literally M193 that didn't pass spec for some (usually stupid) reason.