.44 Magnum or .357

44 is a def man stopper. You can kill a fucking elephant with 44mag.

I will recommend 357, just for cost, and variability of ammunition. Plus you can get ones for longer range hunting(well you can shoot further than 44mag). Also 38spc is good. And if shtf just gotta raid any 40+ year old persons house and the will have 38spc.

well you shouldn't be using soft point on people, load some 240 or 300gr XTP's for maximum fuck.

just make sure you shoot for the heart Ramone

Get a real rifle, not a pistol cartridge one.

I want a level gun as well as I'm firmly in the .357 camp. Not only can you swap out for .38 special for cheaper plinking, you can also get a cowboy revolver like a Ruger Vaquero in the same caliber to complete the look.

357 Probably better and then even in Cali you can get a 357 pistol to pair with it. I have a 44 as well but I don't think 44 mag makes as good of a first gun. You should also definitely look into getting a proper rifle caliber too though. 30-30 is a good caliber.

>is .44 effective
>out of a rifle
are you a fucking retard

Ok, thanks for the answer. I prefere to stay with .44 mag because of the bigger diameter of the bullet and also because it develops more energy than .357 - I guess that all of that makes the .44 a better man stopper.

Advice noted - thx.

>no loading gate

Why do we let liberals dictate firearms design?

When you read about terminal ballistic, it is often said that the speed is what fucks people up. .44 mag is not a high velocity round, nor particularly powerful round when compared to "slow" full size cartridges like .45/70, which is known for its lethality. Finally, .44 bullets are small when compared to slugs which are the reference in terms of stopping power. And I also know that pistol cartridges are not that great at stopping people. So the answer isn't that obvious.

If it's for hd the extra capacity is worth it and .357 has plenty of power for anything on two legs.

What about a trail gun, would getting a 4 or 6 in revolver in .357 or .44 be better for bears/cougars?

How would .30-30 perform against 2 legged ?

Get the .44 because bigger booms are more fun.

I have no idea why people are debating the ballistics of .357 vs .44, capacity, and home defense applications ITT. It's a fucking lever gun. It's just supposed to be fun, not "tactical."

.44 is always the better option when you want something big and hairy to fuck off. However, .357 is a lot easier to handle, cheaper to buy, and a far easier round to find.

Yes. Much more so than out of a pistol, a category in which 357 and 44 dominate for one shot stopping power, iirc from FBI crime stats. The extra barrel length allows for longer powder burn, so you're generally getting higher velocities

44 magnum rifles are legit deer rifles used a lot

I agree. I really want one, from what I've read, 357/38 rifles are great at a lot of different roles

Where I live 44 magnum and 44 special are both legal for deer hunting.
357 is also legal but 38 special is not.

I went with 44 magnum
If I want just want to shoot 44 special is easy on the shoulder and the pocket book.

Giggle at the no gunz posting here telling you to shoot 38 special and ignoring the fact that you will also be able to shoot 44 special from a 44magnum rifle.

Also
>>man stopper
WTF is wrong with you new fags?
Random picture not related.

Attached: A61595E6-22B8-453A-A873-A7FAACA19FE1.jpg (600x332, 267K)

In a realistic self defense range (ie up to maybe 30 yards) just about anything is going to wreck a human with good center mass placement. Especially a rifle. 30-30 has probably harvested more deer ethically within one hundred yards than any other rifle round (not sure about other countries only speaking for USA)

If you shoot someone center mass in the chest with a 30-30 within 30 yards, they're toast. I wouldn't overthink this one.

However 30-30 is relatively expensive

>Giggle at the no gunz posting here telling you to shoot 38 special and ignoring the fact that you will also be able to shoot 44 special from a 44magnum rifle.
The problem is the pricing. You can get 357 for ~29 cents and 38spc for ~19 cents. Meanwhile 44mag is ~40 cents and 44spc is also ~40 cents. Sure 10 cents a round more hardly matters when you have a nice job, but some people like to keep it cheap with under 20 cents a round per shot.

WOW new fag.
Did you just mention

>>one shot stoppan powwar?
From under which fucking rock did you crawl, Mr Sanow?
This is not 1990, one shot stops was debunked years ago.

Random picture not related

Attached: 367494BA-BA81-43BC-B55C-7F94CC563330.jpg (564x423, 62K)

In what sense? I'm genuinely curious. I'm just going off of sources material I've seen posted online. The idea seems intuitive enough - how many shootings, including police shootings, were resolved in someone being incapacitated via one round. What are we missing?

With the exceptions of hits to the brain or upper spinal cord, the concept of reliable and
reproducible immediate incapacitation of the human target by gunshot wounds to the torso is a myth.
The human target is a complex and durable one. A wide variety of psychological, physical, and
physiological factors exist, all of them pertinent to the probability of incapacitation.

Physiologically, a determined adversary can be stopped reliably and immediately only by a shot
that disrupts the brain or upper spinal cord. Failing a hit to the central nervous system, massive bleeding from holes in the heart or major blood vessels of the torso causing circulatory collapse is the only other way to force incapacitation upon an adversary, and this takes time. For example, there is sufficient
oxygen within the brain to support full, voluntary action for 10-15 seconds after the heart has been
destroyed.

archive.org/stream/fbi-handgun-wounding-factors-and-effectiveness/fbi-handgun-wounding-factors-and-effectiveness_djvu.txt

From the same source
>>stoppan powwar
Is a myth.
Psychological factors such as energy deposit, momentum transfer, size of temporary cavity or
calculations such as the Rll are irrelevant or erroneous. The impact of the bullet upon the body is no more
than the recoil of the weapon. The ratio of bullet mass to target mass is too extreme.

The often referred to "knock-down power" implies the ability of a bullet to move its target. This is
nothing more than momentum of the bullet. It is the transfer of momentum that will cause a target to
move in response to the blow received. "Isaac Newton proved this to be the case mathematically in the
17 th Century, and Benjamin Robins verified it experimentally through the invention and use of the
ballistic pendulum to determine muzzle velocity by measurement of the pendulum motion." 29

Goddard amply proves the fallacy of "knock-down power" by calculating the heights (and
resultant velocities) from which a one pound weight and a ten pound weight must be dropped to equal the
momentum of 9mm and .45ACP projectiles at muzzle velocities, respectively. The results are revealing.

In order to equal the impact of a 9mm bullet at its muzzle velocity, a one pound weight must be dropped
from a height of 5.96 feet, achieving a velocity of 19.6 fps. To equal the impact of a .45ACP bullet, the
one pound weight needs a velocity of 27. 1 fps and must be dropped from a height of 1 1 .4 feet. A ten
pound weight equals the impact of a 9mm bullet when dropped from a height of 0.72 inches (velocity
attained is 1.96 fps), and equals the impact of a .45 when dropped from 1.37 inches (achieving a velocity
of 2.71 fps). 30

A bullet simply cannot knock a man down. If it had the energy to do so, then equal energy would
be applied against the shooter and he too would be knocked down.

.357 is cheaper to shoot and more versatile.

>I wanna get a big boy
>chooses pistol rounds
Get a .45-70

45-70 or bust

retard

i came here to post this

i have that rifle in 44magnum
it was my first lever gun
its very fun to shoot
ammo isnt the cheapest
44special is still more than 357
recoil is much less than youd expect

ver·sa·tile
adjective
1.
able to adapt or be adapted to many different functions or activities.

Ok child,
I know you are just puking back whatever bubba at the LGS told you.

Please explain how 357 is more versatile than 44 magnum.
When can you use a 357 but not 44 magnum?

Dont listen to the haters OP. Get the 357/38 first. Then you can get a matching revolver. Once you are sure they work perfect, give them to your mother and sister.
Then buy a real one in 45-70.

special recoil more than 357
My kids shoot 44 special from my rifle.

Attached: E21D412F-408E-4BD4-8362-E261E4F6BD1E.jpg (2592x1936, 1.9M)

Why?
Because they don’t make revolvers in 44 ?

If I might be so bold, you might want to try a rifle cartridge for your rifle.
If a lever gun is your flavor ( I like them quite a bit) try a 45-70. Hits like a man.

I don't mind the lack of a loading gate, it gives the Henry a bit of charm compared to the others

Yup. You’re a retard.

It's a first rifle, and I'm going to be using it to teach Qts how to shoot

i meant 44 special cost more than 357

Confirmed for subhuman who doesn’t reload his cases. Elmer keith looks down upon you in shame

>Is .44 magnum powerful

Jesus Christ lol

>calls someone a no guns
>cant understand reloading/ammo pricing as a reason why 38/357 is superior

Ask Tom Horn's victims.

Cowboy loads are very gentle on the shoulder

I'd go with the 1892 Winchester.>357/.38 or.44 and you'll love it. About the same $$ as either the Henry or Marlin and a much nicer gun. The new Winchesters are made by Miroku who makes lots of Browning guns too. Browning owns Winchester Repeating Arms, btw. Smoothest action and handles great, plus looks so very nice.

Attached: 1892.jpg (835x166, 19K)

I also live in a cuckstate and was thinking of getting a lever rifle for a first gun, except I'm currently looking at marlins. I was initially looking to get something in .357, but I have to admit that .45 long colt is also somewhat tempting of an option.

Overkill unless he's after game.
Or [spoiler]deathclaws.[/spoiler]

>When can you use a 357 but not 44 magnum?
When you have a .357 rifle fucking duh

paper and home defense = .357 mag

big animal hunting = 44mag

Get the .357. Anyone telling you to get .44 over .357 is an absolute idiot. .357 is capable of doing all the same things as .44, but does it cheaper and is MUCH MORE READILY AVAILABLE. You go to most gun shops they might have one or two different loading of .44 max. For .357 they'll have five or six different loadings at least, not to mention your cross compatibility with .38spcl. Sure you can get .44 Special, but it's going to cost more, still, and not perform any better. Here are some simple numbers to put in your head. .357 can be had for ~30c per round. .44 STARTS at ~.50c and goes up from there. In many cases .44 can cost twice what a similar box of .357 will run you. As for .44 Special, it costs pretty much the same goddamn price as magnum ammo(for no goddamn reason), while .38 special can be purchased for as low as .20c a round when buying cheap ammo like Tula. If you actually want to shoot your gun, buy something you can afford to feed. I see people make this mistake all the time and I did it when I was younger as well. Cheap ammo means you get to shoot more. And as far as ballistic effectiveness goes, both of these cartridges have more than enough energy to stop any two legged predators in your neighborhood.

Attached: 44 vs 357.png (1332x521, 344K)

I have a 357/38 levergun myself. 38 feels like a BB gun and 357 is just mild recoil. Out a 16 inch barrel and at 25 yds you should be fine with .357

Soft points on people are fine.

Agree 100%

Explain your point.

>not handloading
wow

Here's an even better question than OP's: between .44 mag/special and .45lc...I know both can be loaded up with some thermonuclear buffalo bore dino safari rounds that can practically fly all the way around the world one time and still have enough energy to blow completely through a black bear from its head to its asshole and then bury itself halfway into the giant sequoia behind it, but which of these calibers can be more easily loaded SOFT enough to headshot small game animals like cottontail/jackrabbit/squirrel without ruining the meat too much? If that's too much to ask, could either of these be loaded soft enough to shoot coyote without ruining the fur?

Attached: da1.png (540x295, 260K)

One has a .45 cal bullet, the other a .42 cal.
Other than that, I see no reason why you shouldn't be able to load 44 mag with black powder if you wanted to.
I see no reason why you sholdn't be able to load both to Levels that barely push the bullet out of the Barrel.

Winchester leverguns are definitely the prettiest

44 spc is like finding gold here and most of the time online.

Thats what henry calls their lever actions in pistol rounds

I used to own a big boy steel in .357 magnum, the ejector broke after my 2nd trip to the range, so i sent it back for repairs and when i got it back it constantly hung up and ejected like shit so i just sold it

Attached: b62a801d51d0aeff867a0ab8beeb72c50f5c21fc6107cd04b9e19ed72f9959e4_1.gif (108x150, 151K)

>tfw Henry doesn't call their .45-70 the Big Guy

No. Knock-down means the ability to make a man who is shot by it fall down, as in incapacitated.

The guy is buying his *first* rifle and you're expecting him to handload his ammo? He might as well just go buy out Remington, saving them from bankruptcy and start making all of his guns and ammo himself. That'll just cut out all the middle men and OP will have a dramatic savings.

Get lost retard.

Attached: 1474075526656.png (635x457, 258K)

.357 is much cheaper to feed

Excuse you I started handloading before I owned firearms, it's not some arcane art from

I see you have not mastered reading comprehension

>>A bullet simply cannot knock a man down. If it had the energy to do so, then equal energy would be applied against the shooter and he too would be knocked down.

ITT

Poor fags
>>buy 357 because cheaper, and mom will only give me $20 allowance per week.
>>buy 357 so you can spend $750 on reloading equipment and spend your weekend making bullets instead of shooting.

Dumb fags
>>Buy 357 because you can also get a pistol in 357, the same is not true for 44 Magnum
>>Buy 357 because I have no other reason why, than just to say, "its versatile"
>>buy 357 because I cannot find 44 in a store, therefore it does not exist in the known universe.

whats the gun in the picture?

Sorry, not everyone has your level of Autism.

Attached: 1492830939066.jpg (764x720, 69K)

wut...?
wtf did you do, throw handfuls of bullets at squirrels and sheeit?
>quiet forest morning.
>the sun's rays crest over the horizon
>birds begin chirping, welcoming the new day
>a squirrel's head emerge's from the crook of a tree
> the squirrel looks around and then slowly leaves the safety of it's nest
>it makes it's way down the arm of a it's tree.
> the squirrel stops, tail twitching, as if it senses something.
>suddenly a mass of small metal projectiles hit the limb all around the squirrel.
> frantically it dashes off into the trees upper foliage.
>a keening "REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE" is heard, breaking the calmness of the silent forest morning.
> from the shadow of the tree a small hunched figure emerges.
>under a misshapen helmet two beady eyes can be seen.
>spittle congeals at the corner of a slackened mouth as the creature chews upon it's bottom lip.
>clutched in it's hand are a mass of what appears to be 22 long rifle bullets.

Attached: 165196163151658.jpg (175x288, 6K)

Imagine living your entire life being this fucking pedantic

>Is .44 Mag with soft point ammo a reliable man stopper when fired out of a rifle ?
That's a whole can of worms, the long story short of it is "it depends", like it does with just about any firearm.
>As the bullet remains at an intermediate velocity, will it still do a decent cavity?
Not nearly so much as a comparable projectile going north of 2000fps. The thing about causing wounding by TSC is that while the size of the cavity is largely determined by energy deposition, the rate at which it forms is limited by the bullets forward velocity. The exact point at which velocity is sufficient for TSC to result in wounding depends on the energy of the round, the design of the bullet, and the tissue being hit. 1800-2000fps is usually where effects become apparent though, there are some .44 mag loads that reach this velocity range but not a whole lot.
> How would a wound made by .44 be compared to one made by .30-30 at close range ?
Much deeper and narrower comparing apples to apples, typically speaking. .44mag often doesn't have enough velocity to cause damage through TSC, but 30-30 almost always does. The extra energy and mass of the .44 will aid quite a bit in penetration, but that doesn't matter for your use as the 30-30 has plenty for two legged varmints.
>I'm speaking of HD...
Then go with the 30-30 or .357. Personally I'd go with the .357 if you can own handguns JIC you decide to at some point, cheaper practice ammo in .38 is nice too. .44 spec is hella expensive in comparison. With proper bullet selection in the .357 there isn't a massive difference between it and common 30-30 loadings, and both would be a much better choice than the .44 for most situations.
Brownies or blacks? If you can handle the .44 then it's better for dangerous game, but nothing living in north america is going to shrug off a properly placed 180gr .357 hardcast.
About the same as it does on deer...

Failed to clarify that it isn't the raw size of the temporary stretch cavity(TSC) that causes damage, but rather the speed at which it develops being more than the stress limits of the tissue in question that does so. A big TSC from a bullet going 1000fps won't damage tissue, but a much smaller TSC from a bullet going 2000fps will.

Just stop while you're ahead, get a 1950s marlin 336 chambered in .30-30, its expensive but cheaper than the other lever action rounds (also just start reloading it would be cheaper to make 500 rounds than to buy 500 rounds)

But what about 45lc

Attached: 1510552419432.gif (250x250, 32K)