Is the Russian aviation industry destined for obscurity...

China undercut their industry. Also, Russian equipment is generally technologically primitive, but compensates by being priced for third world Asians, Africans, and Eastern European shitholes.

is it tho? i mean is is damn cheap as russian tend to not include DCS tier (literally illegal copy ) simulators with them, hell bmw could have something to learn from them

>China undercut their industry
I don't see anybody buying J-10's or J-11's. Only recent success I can think of is the JF-17.

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>MiG 21
>Holding it's own against American planes

This isn't the 60's anymore, user

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>here i effortlessly spammed a picture, it explains everything! EVERYTHING!!!!!
Vatnik bullshit bingo at its finest.

Whatever floats your boat user
That's a funny way of saying China

not mine. feel free to point out errors.

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>user shows that subhumans hate guns and love big government
>REEEEEE VATNIK, SUPPORT BIG GOVERNMENT
>take the guns and then due process

>Tripfag talking shit
Back to plebbit

>saying anything against big government and gun control is "talking shit
Do you think that shit will fly here

>Is the Russian aviation industry destined for obscurity?

It has ever since the Pooviet Poonion collapsed. When all you can supply the rest of the world is a variation of a variation of a variation of the same exact airframe, people tire of your nonsense quickly. It also doesn't help that China has turned Russia into their economic servant and is quickly muscling into what was once Russia's exclusive export market.

>bigger government
so this graph, if true, shows that only white people are smart in the US

>Someone says something about Russia in a thread about something russian
>REEEEEEEEEEEEE THATS NOT ALLOWED! WE. MUST. TALK. ABOUT. OTHERS. INSTEAD!!!!!!!!!!
By now no one can tell if you people are literal just bots going down a script or total idiots that just parrot other vatniks.

You think you are the first vatnik i see throwing desprate discraction baits? You are rather the norm.

>vatnik
I'm not a vatnik. And please provide corrections if anything in that chart is false.

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>let me ignore the fact that you've bashed Russia for a lot of things
>let me spin around what you said
>let's defend gun control because muh vatniks n shiet
Also
>total idiots that just parrot other vatniks.
>does the exact same thing but calls everyone that disagrees a vatnik

It doesnt matter if the charts are correct, you dont see people spamming such pictures about Russia constantly, even if it would be easy as hell, considering the corruption, drug abuse, goverment ass licking media, aids ridden, muslim over run, resource export dependent economy country as Russia. You know why? Because they are not some insecure russians (in disguise) or their little useful idiots, that instantly need to deflect on another country the second someone mentions something about their country.

It is almost like a proverb by now:
Ask a russian about something bad about Russia and he will tell you something about the USA.

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I'm not sure you read the post you're replying to.

>>let me spin around what you said
>>let's defend gun control because muh vatniks n shiet
kek
>parrots vatniks rant
>Reeee dont you dare to call me a vatnik

What the matter, when people call you an asshole, you go and say that you are not an literal asshole and it aint technically possible that an asshole could respond? This nitpicky, naggy answer alone shows how much you are absorbed in their logic and bias.

>It doesnt matter if the charts are correct
the absolute state of mutts in 2018.

It is a proverb among emigrated russians, that visit their relatives in Russia. Also prepare yourself for getting called mad, butthurt or obsessed in the next answers, while they demand that you explain yourself futher and further. It is just the way it goes with em.

I don't think so, they ordered shitload of aircraft for their own air force in the last 10 years or so, and they still sell a lot of shit.
You can't really expect them to sell as much as they did in Cold War, when they mostly sold to affiliated communist/socialist regimes. Politics play a huge role in weapon exports.
Still, they export a lot, they are literally second after Americans.

>when your pathetic attempts have been exposed and your only move is to miss the point and insult
Nothing changed for the vatniks for years.

>missing the point of the post this badly
not even him, but come on nigga

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>I don't see anybody buying J-10's or J-11's
Not that user, but that's kind of the point. Russians have always sold on the axiom of "this is the AK-47 of [thing you are buying]." Most of the countries who make up their potential customers would honestly prefer to keep flying updated MiG-21s, and the Chinese have been successful in selling exactly that. Nobody wants to buy Flankers for large amounts of money, spend way more than they need to operating them in mundane peacetime air defense roles that they could just use a MiG-21 for, and then see them lose to American planes if they get into a real war. It's the same reason nobody buys their "look it's an AK with black furniture and a rail" rifles- they're either content to keep using AKMs or else they want to move on to some sexy European space gun.

The advent of the combat-capable lead-in fighter trainer has definitely undercut that market as well.

>Flanker
>a worse F-15
Lol, mutt delusion.

Stay mad Jose.
There is no point, Tyrone.

The real crux of the issue is that Russia is in a "boy who cried wolf" situation. Even if the Flanker really was the greatest plane on the planet and could take 12 F-15s at once, everybody has seen American planes wipe the floor with their Russian counterparts for the past 6 decades, and they do not want to risk putting their trust in those aircraft when both their national security and huge amounts of money are on the line.

1) The third world customer they formerly served isn't purchasing their newer stock
2) Countries that used to purchase slavshit are now looking for European sources
3) Russian technology has fallen behind of our Western European equivalents so there is lessening interest in buying anything Russian.

After all their former powerhouse bureaus and concerns have gone through multiple mergers and restructuring, it's clear that their arms business is a far cry from it's Soviet heyday

The point is that every vatnik and their little pet starts going for a group "what about the other" howling the second someone says something negative about Russia, so Russia aint the topic anymore. This is what is wrong and why it the chart doesnt matter. Talking to people like you always feels like an intervention with a drug addict, it is everyones else fault and everyone else has worse issues according to them.

Way too early on that one, thats when its likely to start feeling significant economic issues as a result of its aging workforce.

Upgraded variants with modern avionics and modern missiles can be a threat to F-16s or F-18s. Keyword: "Can be." At the end of the day, the plane is just the vehicle to deliver the weapons systems, which, if they are modern, will still pose a threat. If you put military grade equipment on a cessna business jet and strapped some amraams to it, it would become a threat.

>everybody has seen American planes wipe the floor with their Russian counterparts for the past 6 decades
Mutt delusion, lol.

The truth is they no longer have the necessary funding, industry, and strong engineering background that the Soviet Union had. They don't have the money or persons to spare for innovation, so they just upgrade existing Soviet hardware to modern standards, often pairing them with third party avionics systems from France or Israel to make them more marketable.

The biggest problem is that if your own air force cannot afford to order your newest jet in anything other than token quantities, you are going to have trouble selling it to anyone else.

What I would do I were them is refocus on a specific technology and pour everything you have into that. Make something that is truly competitive. Downsize everything else. Does Russia truly need a brand new tank or submarine class? What about maintenance on the navy? Cut it down. Retire a few nuclear stations. They should forget any dreams they have of military hegemony in all areas.

Farmer or Fagot, can't tell which one.

You're right, that's entirely unfair and overly Americentric. I should've said American *and* European planes wiping the floor with their Russian counterparts.

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Why not both?
Im pretty sure he enjoys a lot of horse meet up his ass
All russians are browny fags

Indian MiGs faired okay or even well against the the Pakis.

>What are the factors behind this downtrend?

People don't like purchasing underengineered Slavshit. India literally rejected the PAK-FAg for the same reason

rekt

>Russia will likely cease to exist by 2025
I think you meant to say Israel.

Yes, it's actually much cheaper, even if you compare equivalent models. After all, Russian specialized labor is far cheaper than the American equivalent due to the state of each country's economy and all.

People do like purchasing it when it comes with a nice price tag. The problem is they are no longer engineering new simple but robust and cost effective designs and instead using the same old ones.

On a side note, I would love to purchase an An-2 for bush piloting over Alaska. Too bad they no longer produce new ones.

Calm down muttnik. Take a deep breath kid. It's all gonna be just fine.

>erm...errr...shut up already...you m-ad

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Russia being a giant faggot and making people hate them also rampant corruption which is destroying the country

>I would love to purchase an An-2 for bush piloting over Alaska.
Definitely the greatest aircraft the Russians ever produced.

>Too bad they no longer produce new ones.
I've got good news and bad news.

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Damn you are a bitch

the real gay china

>Composite An-2.jpg
Russia should get nuked for that alone.

I kinda like it. Definitely not as aesthetic as the original but there's something nice about seeing the same basic design still around. The paratroopers of central Africa circa 2075 are going to need something to jump out of.

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>Making an ancient design with a new engine and the modern equivalent of plywood and canvas
There's absolutely nothing wrong with it. They deserve recognition for making a modern biplane.

>the modern equivalent of plywood and canvas
Behold, your Hurricane.

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>What are the factors behind this downtrend?
The Russians have been too short of cash to properly compete on the development front since the 90s, and the looming obsolescence of what they have to offer is rapidly coming to outweigh the advantages of buying Russian, namely low cost and not having to deal with the Americans.
For example, in the early 90s a MiG-29 or SU-27 was an extremely good and competitive fighter jet compared to the F-15/16/18 on offer from the US, with high-end versions (not monkey models) available dirt cheap thanks to the fall of the USSR. But now, almost 30 years later, the Russians are offering SU-27+++ (SU-35) and MiG-29+++ (MiG-35), which while carrying greatly improved avionics and weapons over the older counterparts are barely competitive with late-variant teen-series on the market at fairly similar prices, and uncompetitive with the F-35, the prime US export jet. The PAKFA seems to be limited in performance (s-ducts and such), its production is iffy, and the price is steep, and so it hasn't seen many orders.
The Russians are still competitive in IADS and sub sales, which are markets the Americans aren't really in.

>against the the Pakis.
Yes, pakis, which flew chinese mig19 knock offs (f6), f86 sabers and a few star fighters of which everyone knew it was shit when the pilot is trying to turn fight as the pakis did.

Yet, you forgot to mention that the Indians also flew western models.

Yedditionally, the glorious ious mig21 killed 170 Indian Pilots because its such a good airplane and around 500 of then crashed so far

Funny that you dont mention these few darn israel wars...or the iran iraq conflict
Just as if the paki-poo wars are the only area of conflict in which commie shit didnt got completely annihilated

>They should forget any dreams they have of military hegemony in all areas.
That's the problem right there, they (much like Britain) are still under the delusion that they are a global superpower with all the military requirements that entails. They can't just give up on new subs, or else their nuclear deterrent vs. the US evaporates and they can't have that. (They still operate a Delta III and 3 Victor IIIs for fuck's sake).
Navy maintenace is a joke currently, with much of the fleet kept in port to keep wear down, and the Kuz's refit being cut down to a minimum. But they can't scrap it and the remaining Kirovs because that would mean giving up the idea that they could be a major naval power.
The Russian air farce is mostly old airframes with upgraded avionics and systems, which are rapidly approaching obsolescence with no replacement nor budget for such in sight.
It's pretty sad 2bh.

It looks like you took a workhorse of a babushka and went crazy with plastic surgery on her, plastic tits, pumped up lips and all the other crap.

Why are fat americans calling other fat americans for vatnik, when they show them their homemade US border patrol larping?

Does americans seriously think anyone outside USA gives a shit about your racial make up, guns right or border control?

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We should ban all commie shithole IPs
This would reduce the amount of butthurt and shitpost comments by 99%

Russia is an impoverished shithole where 10% of the population is literally HIV positive. They have far bigger issues to deal with that to boost their dying aeroplane export business. We've reached a point where our EU aerospace industries are beginning to outdo Russia on the export scene.

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/thread

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She's just a farm girl who cleans up nice.

Because the ruskies can't build a jet engine worth a fuck and have already been passed by the slant eyes.

>I'm allowed to shit talk Russia
>Russia isn't allowed to shit talk back
I hate vatniks, but you're just as bad holy shit, can you imagine being such an entitled mutt with such a high opinion of yourself ? Your country is a multi cultural shithole with no national cohesion whatsoever, no history, no real pride, just silly patriotism built on nothing where being born white is seen as a liability nowadays. Fucking kill yourself, get shot in the upcoming race war you foreskinless freak.

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@38172420

Imagine being this mad over nothing

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>but you're just as bad holy shit,
No, no, just no.

Come back when russboos and vatniks behave normal again and dont try to turn every negative thing about Russia into another "what about the others" show for the 4000th's time in a row. You see americans or europeans starting to talk about Russia or trying to switch the topic onto other nations all the time? No! This is pretty much an exlusive thing to this degree around russian related thread and their cheerboys, that is what is this is about. Now go on your standard rant about me being obsessed with russians or butthurt or whatever you people say every time, but dont expect that anybody is still buying any of it.

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the only people allowed on the internet should be Americans, Scandinavians, and the Japanese.

This board would improve by 90% if you just banned Americans, Russians and butthurt belters.
>b-but Chinks!111
There's no real Chinese here, just trolls who troll American retards.

>the only people allowed on the internet should be retards, autists, and faggots.
Jow Forums is already that.

The board would improve 100% if they just banned everyone.

Super maneuverability were not the way of the future because BVR combat became a reality, avionics, radar, weapon systems all became more important for a successful fighter than it's ability to knife fight

>Tripfag talking back
Like I said back to plebbit

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This guy actually uses arguments and deserves a (you) for that

J-10 wasn't for sale until recently. J-11's are not for sale due to Russian export restriction.

Another thing you have to understand: China can only sell to politically reliable client states, so for things as sensitive as one of their currently front line 4th gen fighters, that really just boils down to Pakistan and Bangladesh.

it must be physically painful to live with this degree of retardation.

Agreed

>t. assmad chink/euro

>Having a margin of error so huge, that you can only determine within 2 billion.

>China can only sell to politically reliable client states
What? They've been selling weaponry to pretty much everyone in Africa, the Saudis, Venezuela, Argentina, and Thailand to name a few.

youtube.com/watch?v=thfKq71cNZM
For a certain individual in this thread.

Jow Forums pic with win-loss ratio between american planes and soviet shit.

I wouldnt worry about China. If the whole N Korea peace with S Korea and meeting with America go 100%. China will find itself in some deep shit. Basically Koreas, Japan, Taiwan, Philippines, Vietnam, Burma, Indiapoo, etc. All distrust China more than Japan now. It will not go down well for them in 50 years.

COME ON AND SLAM, AND WELCOME TO AMRAAM

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Ty.

They sell SAMS not aircraft
You cant rely on ikea to sell more floor tiles than furniture

Swedes said the same thing before peter built st. Petersburg

>COME ON AND SLAM, AND WELCOME TO AMRAAM
Literally chuckled.

I was specifically talking about the J-10. I should have been more clear.