We know that debate can't make these people love guns, and they want to "do something" about muh mass shootings. Endless pilpul and hand-wringing over minute details like muh magazines or muh fully-semi shouldn't even be part of the debate.
Instead, shift the focus to how the gun is an irrelevant detail in a much larger issue (terrorism, poor mental healthcare, police apathy, etc).
>It doesn't matter what gun/tool the attacker used, it's not addressing what causes a person to decide to become a mass murderer
You have to provide a compromise that makes the antigunner look bad for refusing, like mental healthcare reform, police accountability, etc.
If they refuse, tell them that you're disgusted that they would risk people's safety for their own personal agenda or something similar.
Dealing with antigunners - a new approach
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You think people dont already try this retard? The left doesnt believe it. Its a full on does not compute. So you start with just trying to exonerate certain features.
They fully believe access to weapons are the reason for murder, and you arent convincing a bunch of cucked pacifists any other way
Point your finger at them and tell him to this is now a gun and you are going to kill them, now don't they wish they had a gun to save themselves? If that doesn't work. Pretend your finger is pointing at their real or imaginary kid, then ask him now what
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>pic related
>clean conscience while your wife and wife's daughter are tied up and used
Typical cuck fantasies
Take them shooting, it's the only way.
This is holophobia, and the only way to fix a phobia is to confront it
That's why you use social pressure against them (op link related) by providing a compromise that makes them look like an ass for refusing. You must use illogical means against illogical people.
That comes off as a bit hostile for my taste
> Hey user, thanks for the range trip. I really enjoyed it.
> But I still want you to get rid of your guns. I don't NEED them, so obviously you don't either. They're just fancy toys for you, and less people would die if we got rid of them all.
There is a fundamental disconnect on the liberty/safety axis there, and a range trip does nothing to fix it. It's no different than people that see no use to the 4th amendment, because we could catch more criminals without it and they have nothing to hide, so why should anyone else care either?
>That comes off as a bit hostile for my taste
But that's the point. If someone's going to hurt you or threaten you, you want to even the odds and cite murders that happen with or without guns. We don't live in a perfect world. Anything they counter with tell them they don't live in a perfect world. People need to be blunt and get to the point with these people.
> letting your family defenceless against armed invader
> clean conscience
these people are beyond sic
Youre either so incredibely new at dealing with this that your naivety is almost admirable. Or youre an actual retard whos as dense as they are
But they'll just go into how you're threatening them. It won't make any kind of point to them except that gun owners are mean and hostile and dangerous and that they should redouble their efforts to disarm us as soon as possible.
You wont change their mind anyways. What a waste of fuckin time this thread is.
BUY AMMO IF YOU WANT TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE
But it also reinforces the bias of "muh scary right wing gun owner", which already marks you as an outsider in their mind. If you can make them think that THEY are the crazy unpopular outsider, they're more apt to rethink their position or at least shut up about it and defer to you
>no actual argument
Oh now you feel threatened? So did I when someone threatened to kill me for my money last year. Do you want to wait until you feel legitimately threatened or would you rather not have to deal with that? Life doesn't have superheros, cops wont show up in time.
Honestly, any nod toward compromise or further gun legislation that you would be amenable to is just playing into their hands. The correct answer is a hard line against any further "compromise" because it is always detrimental to gun rights and works in favor of gun control advocates.
You've all seen the cake comic and other analogies for this. There is no "reasonable" or "common sense" gun control, there is only the suppression of your rights which you should oppose categorically.
Like I said, the world isn't a perfect world. My life was threatened and if you never experienced that then maybe you should reconsider your privilege. My aunt was raped at knife point, if she had a gun she could have done something about it and put a stop to it.
As usual the left romanticizes reality every time.
Ok, that's better. It adds the emotional dimension and you can accuse them of enabling rapists.
Conservatives have no shortage of idealists and romantics either. They just have less access to publicists for their fantasies.
Get in their face, shout at them, call them pieces of shit for trying to take your guns and for being anti-American, threaten to fuck them up, really get crazy. Then you instantly revert back to being calm and ask them how it felt to be confronted with violence and aggression.
I do this to my martial arts students who get comfortable with fancy techniques that don’t really work. Start shouting at them and pushing them around, acting really fucking mad at them. Invariably they crumble and forget everything they’ve been taught, not once has one of them defended themselves. Most people don’t know how to deal with real aggression when actually faced with it.
>pushing someone when they are appealing to authority
That's just bullying user.
This is a good angle.
If they want to ban guns, ask them why they want women and minorities and gays to be defenseless.
Not to say the right doesnt either, but its a trend to see more on the left hold these outlooks of ridiculousness than the right.
I know, I feel like a dick doing it, but it’s a valuable lesson to them to be confronted with someone going nuts and getting violent for no reason.
These people think that watching their children be robbed, assaulted, raped and murdered is a morally superior position to using a firearm to stop the thugs attacking them.
Just how in the fuck do you think that you are going to engage in rational discourse with these people?
They do not even value their children's lives, just what argument are you going to propose to a person who would gladly climb up into a boxcar?
You cannot force a people to be free, you cant force them to value liberty and independence.
They value safety, comfort, feelings and emotions more than they value rights.
There is no convincing these people.
They are NPC's and when the war comes you will just have to cut right through them to preserve your constitutional rights.
1. What is your goal?
2. How will your proposed legislation achieve that goal?
3. How will you know it has succeeded?
4. What are some hurdles your legislation will have to overcome to succeed?
5. What are the negative or unintended consequences of your legislation?
6. Do any of those outcomes directly prevent your goal in #1?
Also, remember that the cost for making someone question their own position is an alternative that solves their problem.
>t. Bioluminescent african-american CIA employee
>said no one ever
Look, some of them are just gone forever, but with most people once a gun becomes a tangible object and not some mythic device of death dealing suddenly the significantly soften up their stance or even do a complete 180
user, that is literally the discussion I had with three people at dinner after taking them to a pistol range. Stop ascribing magical Wololo abilities to someone firing a gun.
>Tfw Brown
>Tfw Homosexual
>Not a crazy tranny-supporting freak
>Tfw interested in weapons to protect loved ones and because they're fucking cool.
I don't know what to do anymore brahs. I'm both brown and a faggot, and all I want to do is live my life in peace and safety. I once thought that liberalism could help me achieve this, but these people are increasingly off their fucking rockers. With each passing year their wishes get crazier and crazier. We're at the point where defending yourself is now taboo. I don't want to end up in a camp, but at the same time I want to be able to defend myself and plink for fun. Who the FUCK am I supposed to support in this shitshow of a country?
user, believe me, shit like this is like talking to a brick wall. Some of them may be open to debate and maybe even persuasion but many just don’t want to hear it. They don’t get why the 2A is as important as it is, even if you take them on a fully paid trip to the range with lunch to boot there’s still a chance they won’t budge, or if they do they don’t budge far past “common sense” gun laws, and we all know what those really mean.
Then you just reinforced an already pre existing bias of the crazy lunatic gun owner, and that if he didn’t have guns that wouldn’t happen. The problem is that they are extremely sheltered to any bad shit in the world, sure they may be aware of it but it never actually happened to them.
If push comes to shove tell them that as a brown gay guy you want the ability to protect yourself and that for them to want to restrict you of that literal right is homophobic and potentially racist, as they would indirectly be making you an easy target for potential hate crimes. Play their own shit game against them. Also don’t trust liberals at all, they’re all rabid snakes and no better than the neocons.
t. bi dude
>push around my students and yell at them
>they dont attack their instructor
gee professor.
How about you don't argue with these people at all?
Most of them will never change their mind, are dishonest and plan to take away ALL your guns including bolt action .22s and muzzleloaders.
On the other hand you risk becoming cucked by them when you compromise to make them happy.
>@WesternIdentity
Yikes
Martial arts are a meme designed by cucked countries where people were disarmed slaves.
Why else do you think Chinese are so huge on martial arts? Even a simple knife beats countless hours of training.
This time we do it together brother.
We will gas the (((media))) together this time.
Daily reminder that Adolf Hitler congratulated Jesse Owens on his Olympic victory, and the kike media covered it up.
dailymail.co.uk
We were never enemies, the Jews just fear us uniting together against their globalist kike world banking and Federal Reserve Judaism.
This time we do it together brother.
beyond sic(sic)
>>It doesn't matter what gun/tool the attacker used, it's not addressing what causes a person to decide to become a mass murderer
I've been saying this for over a decade but they can't move their focus away from the Gun. It always comes back to how the gun makes it easier for them to kill people.
You aren't going to change a liberal's mind in an argument any faster than they are going to change yours.
You should be trying to convince the moderate audience you are right, not the opponent. Keep your eye on the prize.
Worked for me, though, when my sister moved to a bad neighborhood.
>be 30 year old who participated in a devastating war
>want to get back at the people who killed you and your brothers
>become active in the community, amass lots of comrades
>20 years later start a war that ends up killing over 50 million people
>all without firing more than perhaps 20 rounds during a few fistfights between beers at one point
>BUT GUNS THO
Civic nationalism is the way.
Yeah. He said congrats mein nigger
They actually know exactly what they're doing. They are not trying to take guns for the safety of anyone. They are trying to take guns away from every single individual person. They do not want a farmer to defend his livestock from predators, they do not want an Olympic shooter to practice his .22 marksmanship, they don't want Grandma to be able to defend herself. They just don't want a human being to have a firearm unless they are sponsored by the infallible state.
These people are the same ones that gladly allowed Stalin to rise to power just to be starved to death by that same man months later. They are Marxists that are a poison on society and will never be reasoned with.
That is the thing. I am a homosexual and have some liberal views, but I understand the need for to protect our constitutional rights lest we lose them. I see what's happening in Europe and with China, and it has me increasingly appreciative and thankful for what we have here. Me owning firearms is a guarantee of my safety and my right to fend for myself and my loved ones. The fact that your standard liberal does not see the need for them is just, I don't know. You would think they would support women and fags like me owning such tools, but the globalists, Jews, elite, whoever- has turned them against the only thing securing our freedom.
I'm sick of it goddamnit.
>be straight
>have several lesbo friends and a couple of probably bi male friends
>they’re all pro gun and own guns
>they don’t understand why bashed fags are against gun ownership
It really is ((())).
Dealing with anti-gun faggots is about as useful as tits on a mosquito. You will never change their minds because they are weak and rely on the masses for an opinion. Just don't acknowledge them, and if they don't know your position just humour them. See how much retarded shit you can get them to agree with. There, I just saved you 10 hours of your life.
I wish. Mods are trash.
>If push comes to shove tell them that as a brown gay guy you want the ability to protect yourself and that for them to want to restrict you of that literal right is homophobic and potentially racist, as they would indirectly be making you an easy target for potential hate crimes. Play their own shit game against them.
this desu
t. also a bi dude
this
>you have to level with us here, this isn't asking for a ban or turn in, this is just us saying we need more precautions against these kinds of weapons!
"a semi auto glock 21 was used"
>well we still need to have tighter gun laws so people can't get their hands on stuff so easily!
"this happened in california where things are either illegal or neutered, and very hard to get legally"
and then it comes full circle with
>WELL THEN WE NEED TURN INS, LOOK AT AUSTRALIA!
every god damn time
>t. Jow Forumsthe_donald
Hey leave cucked pacifists out of this, I like guns they're the best deterrent an individual person can have to prevent violence, And they're cool as shit to boot.
Every rabid anti gunner I know aren't pacifists anyhow they're violent assholes that want to purge anyone who disagrees with them, They're fucking fascists without the cool aesthetic or edgy memes.
I'm gonna be honest with you as a guy living in the bible-thumpin', deep red, Trump country part of Alabama, I've had more luck getting conservatives to reconsider their position on gay marriage than I have getting liberals to reconsider their position on guns. You should probably check out gay Republican/conservative groups in your area, the gay right-wing isn't as organized as it used to be but it is still around. Also look into the Pink Pistols.
Imagine being this terrible of a poster and imagine the pre-written shateblue book they are about to reply with an assure me they arent a newmoralfaggot
>mods are trash
Its mods = fags retard