>Oleg Tishchenko, developer for the popular military flight simulator, DCS World, has been charged with smuggling F-16 fighter jet maintenance manuals to Moscow.
Allegedly, some Texan guy helped him buy buying some manuals off eBay in the US and shipping them to Oleg.
F
>The first began in June 2011, when Tishchenko posted in a Russia-based video game forum seeking help for shipping fighter jet manuals.
>Tishchenko, who identified himself on eBay as a developer for the Moscow-based Eagle Dynamics video game company, assured the Texan there was no problem because the manuals were “obsolete.”
Good to know that 'my uncle works at nintendo' is a valid disguise.
Good. DCS sucks. The missions suck. The updates break fucking everything. Shit doesn't work right half the time and nobody should EVER be charged $80 for DLC.
Also a Russian stealing? Imagine my shock.
Yeah, apparently the Texan won’t be charged. Sucks to be the dev, though.
Why was he trying to get the F-35 and F-22 manuals as well? It seems like that is what's going to get him jailtime
Well, even taking any of those F-16 manuals out of the country without direct approval from the government is illegal. They’ve been working on an F-16 expansion for DCS for awhile now, so it makes sense, but I doubt that’s going to be a great defense.
Really sucks for the developer, it is possible he just didn't know that it was illegal.
If he knew then well fuck'em.
He was working for Russian company. And all russian companies have connection to state.
Dude literally got baited by politics and inter nation hostilities, and all they wanted to do was fox-2 faggots on the interwebs
If the devs had hired an American citizen to use the manuals in America, there’d be no issue. The materials aren’t classified, but ITAR is pretty clear on what “non-US persons” are allowed to access.
AND livig caress the instrumentation of their planefus
rip
I doubt it would be an issue if he wasn't russian.
But still, dude should have take into account that relations between US and Russia is far from stellar.
Technically speaking, it’d be illegal regardless of what country he’s from. Being Russian certainly didn’t help his chances of not being prosecuted, though.
>Really sucks for the developer, it is possible he just didn't know that it was illegal.
This. Fuck, I'm a European and our shithole is buying F-16. Good to know that if I ever actually bought a manual of those for a Jow Forumsid back home, I'd get thrown into jail for it.
I fully understand keeping some stuff secret but a fucking book any civilian can buy and scan at a moment's notice?
That's worth jailing people over?
ITAR is pretty strict. Weapon optics, NVGs, technical manuals, encryption, and even rocket engine fuel injector plates are all examples of restricted tech. While it’s technically illegal for a non-US citizen to even look at any of those products without prior US government approval, the main reason this guy got arrested was for smuggling physical copies out of the US. Being a citizen of the Russian Federation certainly didn’t help.
Mate, I literally typed that shit into google followed by pdf and got a hit on the 3rd link.
Does this make me a wanted criminal who's getting vanned or someone on the other side of the pond a senile idiot who has no idea how the world works and apparently takes pleasure in fucking up one of the few simulator devs still out there?
All the manuals there had those funny prefaces about how super illegal it is to see them or how to dispose of them so they're not found out. Which I found highly ironic, but what can you do with a jet fighter designed back when microwaved were a sci-fi wonder and worldwide internet was unheard of.
Still, I hope the guy ends up okay in the end. Being Russian is to his advantage, being that Russia won't just give up a random citizen becaue US asked them to. God knows what it will mean for the game, though. And their career prospects as well.
It sounds a hell of a lot like those ARMA devs who got jailed by the Greekrupts for several years as they were hoping to string-arm the families to buy them back and sponsor the local police pensions.
The opinion of the Russian government is more or less irrelevant at this point. The guy’s sitting in a jail cell in Utah. You’re right that no one will go after you for simply viewing PDFs, even though it’s technically illegal. His mistake was trying to smuggle physical copies of the manuals out of the country. That will very much attract the attention of the authorities. The guy should’ve just had his contact in the US email him scans. I hope they decide not to pursue prosecution, though. He was clearly not using the manuals for nefarious purposes.
You can get classified shit off of Ebay in Muttistan?
>The opinion of the Russian government is more or less irrelevant at this point. The guy’s sitting in a jail cell in Utah.
Ah, my bad. Didn't read through the article and assumed he was only charged now due to said stuff appearing in the game.
And yeah, not much we can do now but pray they'll somehow let it go.
It’s not classified, only ITAR restricted. Same law which makes it illegal to sell NVGs and weapon optics to non-US buyers.
>technical manuals
>nervous looks at my own library of Jow Forums shit from the sixties and seventies
am I gonna be alright?
So making photos of Saturn 5 engines in the museum is a crime for euros as well? Man, this would never fly if we were actually sovereign nations.
If you’re a US citizen living in America, you’re fine. If you’re not, you’re technically breaking the law, but no one’s going to go after you unless you get caught carrying shit like that across an international border like this guy was doing.
>get your friend John to get physical copies inside US
>have him scan them and upload to somewhere like TPB or any cp website
>download them in Russia
>????
>stay out of jail and have digit copies
Itar is retarded but Ivan didn't try hard enough. How do you even get caught doing something like this?
Usually older tech gets cycled out. In the case of the Saturn V’s F1s, they’re legal. Even when it’s still new enough to be ITAR restricted, It’s not the engine itself that is restricted from photography, only the injector plate. You’ll notice that many photos of SpaceX engines have the injectors either covered up or digitally censored out.
right, he was caught in the border...
not american, and yes, some shit might have been carried personally while other shit might have been mailed by parties who didn't knew any better
I'm glad I didn't got v&'d
He probably really really wanted the original copies for his collection of random .mil shit.
I'dve risked it
Just be careful. You’re technically breaking federal law by possessing the materials as a non-American, but it’s not like they’re actively looking for people who illegally obtained unclassified maintenance manuals. The only reason he’s being prosecuted is because the feds generally have to do something when they directly observe someone breaking the law. It certainly didn’t help that he was intending to take the manuals to Russia, though.
the funny thing is that I was already aware of ITAR regulations because I was looking into getting some neat surplus NVGs for cheap and other firearm parts that are easy to obtain in the US but prohibitively expensive where I live and I got cockblocked by the department of state
I just wasn't aware the tech manuals were covered under the same umbrella...
Yeah, even shit like research papers can be ITAR restricted. My university had to implement 2 factor authentication for the entire school just because the AE department servers contained ITAR-controlled information.
he couldn't just scan them and send them in pdf ?
It's still illegal, but it's unlikely he'd ever have been caught or prosecuted for it. A Russian national leaving the US with physical copies of fighter aircraft technical manuals is pretty much guaranteed to get fucked if caught, though. Not sure why he even risked it.
>He said he would like to acquire F-35 and F-22 flight manuals and he “could guarantee that these manuals will not be provided to any third party, and I think even not shown to anyone in our company.”
>yes please gibe sekrit documents on F-35 will not show to anyone else))))))))))))))))
>He said he would like to acquire F-35 and F-22 flight manuals
That's probably gonna fuck him in court.
Sorry, but am i supposed to feel sorry for that dumb fuck or what?
If someone had done that shit but trying to bringing russian manuals from Russia to the US as an american it would been all over every russian propaganda news outlet there is for weeks, not some minor news site and vatniks would not shut up about how stupid he is.
I mean, it's pretty clear that the guy didn't have any nefarious intentions, he was just getting material to help develop his game. Still knowingly broke the law, so I don't feel too sorry for him, but I can sympathize with his motives.
>I mean, it's pretty clear that the guy didn't have any nefarious intentions
And you know that how? How would it have been when he would have gotten those F-35 and F-22 manuals?
>How would it have been when he would have gotten those F-35 and F-22 manuals?
Why don't you tell us.
That’s a good point. However, with just the unclassified F-16 docs, nothing he’s done is too heinous. Still a felony of course. DCS is a pretty legit simulator, and I hope they don’t have too many issues with this whole thing.
Do you really think russians don't know exact specifications of F-35 and F-22?
And I don't think they need some guy smuggling manuals through the border to find them out.
I mean, they probably don’t.
Fuck! Oleg is kill!
He certainly looks unhappy.
Would have looked way more bad for him.
no
DCS is literally just a weak cover op for Russia to acquire intelligence western defense programs and systems.
Yeah, at least the F-16 stuff is just ITAR restricted, not classified. 5th gen manuals are definitely classified.
Number one, if he didn’t know it was illegal he wouldn’t look for straw purchasers. Number two, ignorance wouldn’t be an excuse anyway.
Yeah. I can’t really blame him for not expecting them to actual enforce ITAR. It’s not like they spend resources looking for people buying unclassified technical manuals. They’ll absolutely buttfuck you if you get caught, though.
This
> unclassified F-16 docs
It easily could be a two side job, one is for the game development the other is for supplying information to the GRU or russian aerospace industry. People seem to underestimate the industry espionage aspect.
Really? Because State and Justice are actually strict as fuck and providing the physical muscle for enforcement is one of DHS’s biggest tasks. They really do spend a lot of effort screening for and actively seeking violators and potential violators.
Definitely a possibility. I'm not sure how useful publicly-available documents are to Russian intelligence agencies, though. If you can find them online in PDF form, I doubt GRU needs physical copies smuggled in.
Since when? I was always under the impression that ITAR compliance outside of actual classified information was more of a technicality that you'd get fucked on if discovered, but not something that's actively searched out. My school spent like 2 years unknowingly breaking ITAR regs with some aerospace document storage, and just ended up changing policy once they realized they were breaking the law.
Could been a decoy and for his game developing side, i mean if he only got the F-35 or F-22 manual, it would have looked too suspicious, he definitly had to get the F-16 manual first.
Except that they do make the effort, and for just this purpose. Industrial espionage is a huge problem and the two worst offenders are.. well, take three guesses and the first two don’t count.
Yeah. Idk how anybody can look at a russian or Chinese company acquiring intelligence on any US systems and somehow believing that those governments won’t 100% get access to it.
I'm sure their governments are getting access if they want it, but I'm just skeptical that an F-16 manual that can be bought on eBay isn't something they already have.
It’s aggregate. A bit of info here and there and everywhere and at some point enough of the puzzle is solved that the image is discernible to a useful degree. Those manuals probably shouldn’t have been on eBay either, but that’s another point. A thing doesn’t have to be classified to be controlled.
Your impression is wrong, and if your program/school was doing business with a foreign body or associated with a foreign government to which export/access to that information is restricted you would likely have gotten a friendly reminder from DHS or State to knock that shit off, and if you didn’t get the message DOJ would send you a less friendly one.
Fair enough. My advisor was pretty freaked out when he told me about the whole thing. There weren’t any issues with dealing with foreign organizations, it was just due to how the documents were being stored on school servers.
He was using another man as proxy for buying those, good chance is he was just testing the waters how well that went and as preparation for the real juicy bits.
>You already bought me the F-16 manuals over ebay of all places and did something happen? Why wouldnt you be allowed to get the one from the F-22 and F-35. Just buy em already.
This whole thing reeks like an exuse to plausible denial any ill attempts. I mean look at the Skripal thing, the two GRU killers send to England claimed to only gone to England for a 2-3 days to look at a church and then had two different flying tickets back for different dates.
Imagine he bough the F-22 or F-35 manual alone, over a person as a proxy, how well would he been able to deny any ill attempt then?
No reason to allow them free access. The more they have, the clearer the picture they have. Not all pubs are real or the same versions either. It’s kinda like how if you go to download the anarchists cookbook, you might find ten versions with ten variations of their recipes. Having all of them plus time for analysis will help you put together the “real” recipes.
This is literally how 90% of intelligence work goes. The rest is just sourcing the materials.
On top of that, there isnt just ONE F-16 manual. There are a ton of different ones, all from different ages and all the older ones lack the information about the newer technologies implemented.
Yeah. So unless your storage was oconus somewhere we don’t trust, your org would be low on the list for attention. Plus the discrepancy was probably reported after it was found and fixed. When schools and businesses act in good faith like that and there’s no harm done.. it’s not really a big deal. Problem is solved.
Possibly yeah, or rather probably. Russian developers have been doing this for years, and DCS combined arms was actually a fair attempt at copying a legacy version of AAJTS.
Bingo. As I’ve been saying. They all represent little value on their own but put together represent a roadmap in development that can be very useful to a near peer adversary struggling to catch up and meet the US close to its own level.
The look of a man whos got a cyanide pill waiting in his prison wallet.
Guys, guys, guys. Yeah, yeah ITAR and all that gay shit, but here's the thing. These manuals are published online. So, y'know. Pretty much blow me.
Interesting, never really thought of that as illegal unless is was manuals/schematics to prototypes and stuff that's brand new. If he was actually asking for F-22 and F-35 documents and going "I won't show anyone else. Pinky promise." (especially if a Russian national, when there's already enough boogeymen built up about them) then that is kind of stupid.
Though I was at a militaria show a few months back and saw some original/repro manuals for WW2 and early Cold War vehicles. Wonder if in a few decades on will be able to buy stuff like that for things that are newer now.
It already had been talked about why this is a moot point, you might want to read the thread first when you are late to the party.
Looking up some stuff and Venezuela has F-16s and in the past they threatened to sell them to Iran. No wonder the US Govt doesn't want that kind of example or material being given out to enemy states. Sure the F-16 may be old, depending on the model, but it's still a capable aircraft and an adversary getting that wouldn't be good.
I thought moot was Oleg?
It's pretty much always illegal for any non-US citizen to handle documents like that or take them out of the country. He did both.
Fuck this itar shit. I can't even buy a headspace gauge from the US!
That's what you get for being a dirty foreigner. Also, you could probably buy it in the US and carry it back with little issue. You could get fucked if caught, though.
fudds on ebay really don't know any better, and will sell anything anywhere
the problem is buying from brownells or big online stores which lockup the sale if you're using a foreign credit card and shit
This, why do you think they only cover western aircraft in any detail.
Because western aircraft is the the most relevant, modern and mass-produced one? What else are they supposed to add besides russian aircraft, fucking brazilian Tucanos?
Because they probaly would get in trouble, when they would do such in depth information aquiring in Russ-... Wait a second.
You're paranoid. Not everybody is a spook.
Because the Russian gov doesn't allow them to.
They could very much make decent flight models and cockpits with US-based private Flankers and Fulcrums.
I imagine if he was JEWISH and sending these to ISRAEL it would be a-okay.
>It's still illegal
yeah, but they would never know
No, still wpuld be illegal, also Israel is an ally and literally has F-16 of their own. Go be a dumb nigger somewhere else.
>you proved my point
No, i showed how stupid and constructed you point is, polnigger.
>jew does a thing, its illegal but he won't be prosecuted because israel
he's right, insults get you nowhere, sugarplum
Do you got the memory of a goldfish?
>No, still would be illegal
Also that you are not capable of distingushing between allies that fucking own the F-16 and opponent nations like Russia is showing pretty badly, where your intentions are: You are a polnigger that cant stand it when someone talks bad about Papa Putins country since you grow up on a russian shill farm that breeds useful idiots, who get a stroke every time when there is topic when they havent tried to force something about da jooz into it.
he aint right, not the way he wants to make it sound like
also being a dumb cunt that ignores that isnt getting you anywhere either
>he's right but I can't admit it
funny, before our "greatest ally
showed up, the only enemy we had was the soviet union, and we didn't have any dual citizens in office either. Remember the USS Liberty.
>it aint like he implies, but i still must act like it is
so you wanna be a dumb cunt
what you trying there igor? tryin to distract from a russian fuckin up? and all you tryin is to play the jew card like always
choke on one of those fake russian rubber cheeses, if ya can afford one
bet you cant tho
>Remember the
How could anyone forget about it, when you sperglords bring it up every chance given? You bring it even up when there aint a chance.
>“could guarantee that these manuals will not be provided to any third party, and I think even not shown to anyone in our company.”
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
The way he means it? No, he is not right.
This guy gets it.
Jow Forums is always right
>vatnik and poltard chaf throwing intensifies
God forbid there is a thread on this board about anything russianthat aint derailed.
>it is real in my head
Wait, why was he buying copies if user above could see them in pdf format online?
no wonder that you and the vatnik suck each other off, you are the same, nobody really like you, everyone dislikes you and you cant stop repeating how everyone fears and likes you at the same time