I don't get it

Are you me?

globalresearch.ca/us-army-asked-twitter-how-service-has-impacted-people-answers-were-gut-wrenching/5678659

>"sexual assault" is the same thing as getting raped in the ass
Stop buying into the propaganda. Every one of these surveys asks questions like "has someone touched you in a way that made you feel uncomfortable" (which btw meets the definition of sexual assault under the UCMJ). Every one who answers "yes" to this question then gets reported as being "sexually assaulted".

>Honestly, it’s the loss of being around like-minded people and crushing loneliness after the service that creates many PTSD-like symptoms.
Yeah this. The problem isn't the military, but civil society.

just remember, the men who REALLY actually have PTSD never talk about it and sure as hell never get diagnosed with it.

We stand together alone user.

and they are all trained to kill fruitcakes like you.

PTSD became a quick ticket for a disability rating. In my experience most claims are either a way to get out early or a way to get some cash from the VA.
It's a social welfare program in a lot of ways. :/

Unfortunately truth to this as well.

If I felt like it, I'm confident I could just claim to have PTSD nightmares for gibs and a medical marijuana Rx.

Here comes the armchair psych students who never once wore a pair of boots in their life trash talking vets who have "supposed" PTSD for them "supposed" VA checks

And in the case of the linked story, ita half bullshit, half truth

As i had it put to me by a grandfather who spent the worst 2 years of his life in Vietnam in the 101st airborne, war is you doing whatever is necessary for you to make it out alive. The problem is when you get home and those rules are all you know, and all you know doesnt work anymore.

The experience is different for everyone. I knew a guy who joined the Marines straight out of school, 6 months into his actual service, he was in buttfuckistan, came home fine, did fine for a while but his perception of life was always skewed fifteen degrees from where it had once been

I knew someone else who told me a story from someone he served with, whose captain got a dear John letter, went on patrol, got out of the Humvee, screamed
>"God fucking damnit, its TOO FUCKING HOT"
Pulled out his M9, ripped off his helmet and put one through his gourd. 7 months into an 8 something month deployment, they were so tired hey radiod it in, loaded his body in back, and finished the patrol

My Uncle was in Intelligence and Communications in the Airforce for so long, he has stories about having to clean our what remained of buddies who hit an IED, out of the Humvee they took 4 hours prior. With pictures to match. Hes stable but Alex Jones level crooked 15 degrees

Your milage with the military will vary

People in our current society, love to play victim. It gets rid of blame on their own part. That's why PTSD is so prevalent. Just like women with anxiety. "I get nervous in social setting so I have anxiety, look at me, I'm a victim, my therapist says so"

PTSD is real, but way over played. I killed people in Iraq, saw lots of good friends die. It still haunts me. It has driven me to alcoholism and isolation. But at the end of the day, who is responsible?
It's me. I chose to serve, I chose to drink, I chose to isolate myself.

This too, I get 1100$ every month from the VA because of my back and PTSD. God knows it is comforting. But so many people claim this now that didn't see or do shit, it's nuts.

I'd agree with this 50%. If someone is walking around talking about PTSD and all the shit they supposedly saw, they're full of shit. I don't mention anything to anyone, unless they're a close friend, and I usually have to be drunk.
But why should I, as a White Male that served my country in combat not get paid monthly while niggers who aren't even American get far more benefits than I? Personally I see draining the current American system as a good thing as it will collapse sooner and we can have the real and final (race) war. I didn't lie or anything, I just told my story to the VA psych and I am now compensated for it. It's compensation for fighting for Israel and the memories and physical pain it left me with IMO. I gained good training and experience from my service, but it left me with terrible memories. The biggest deal are all the friends I lost, watch die, etc. Killing people was no issue at all. It was seeing my friends die.

Some people here are saying it's welfare, or what not. Sorry, but I and many other earned that. We did what a lot of you who criticize it didn't do. It's not a handout if you worked for it. Just like the GI Bill, it was not free, I fucking paid for it.

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Do it pussy. I did it and I get 10k/year tax free from the VA. I donate some of it to vets who I think earned it more than I did but I still pay the bills with it. Better us than some dindu on welfare. I make 300k/year because the VA money and gi bill helped to make me a financially stable civilian

Yeah, no, I'm not lying about having a medical condition for gibs. What kind of man does that?

How about you do it and donate all of it to WWP or some other vets in need

You earned it, just do it, don't listen to these other retards

I get $1100 and I didn't lie about anything, I just told them my story, and the psych was like "Ok, yea looks like you have severe PTSD"
Think about all the ammo you can buy with that each month if you're already good to go. That money is there for you already, Congress set it aside.
It's compensation for what you saw and did.

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I've been to the VA shrink. They give me meds for the issue I have (depression.)

I didn't earn compensation for an issue I don't have.

every dollar not going to you, is going to some nigger welfare program.

Overthere feels more normal than being back here. Been my case for over a decade, kind of wish I still had assholes trying to shoot us and blow us up. Peace becomes counterintuitive, where you are forever waiting for the next shoe to drop, and it doesn't.

I was wounded, and remain a broke-dick. At the same time though I miss it, in the sense of purpose and comradery. Finally finding a new way to live life, but what I knew in uniform has remained more appealing than what I have now.

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I try to explain to people why I miss Afghanistan and they look at me like I'm speaking another language, user.

Not alone user. Once you do it, you can't turn it off. It becomes muscle memory the same as everything else we were taught to do. Threat-assessment, hypervigilance, it sticks to you and consumes every part of your "ordinary life"

Do such overseas, you are normal, do such here and you are an outlier. I drink more than I should everyday because it kind of deafens those instincts that stay with us. Really today, I'm just wanting to cry for the buddies we lost, my emotional numbness only allows me to cry at best once a year. You never realize how important crying is until you can't.

Lose family, lose pets, lose buddies, and you're still stuck.

Was at the VA doing rehab after I was wounded, and had a Vietnam Vet tell me a "joke"

>knock knock
>who is it?
>vietnam
>vietnam who?
>YOU DON'T KNOW BECAUSE YOU WEREN'T THERE

It is unknowable unless you have experienced it. Best of luck user, take care of yourself.

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>25% males (more or less) are sexually assaulted... No matter the deployment
What the actual fuck?? Is the US Army full of homosexuals or what?

Did you serve? All of that sounds like bullshit

It's pretty gay

I'm an American Infantryman. I love my flag, my country and hate out enemies. I'm not political. Just give me a rifle and point me in the right direction.

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I had a few infantry buddies in BLC, super chill dudes. Barely a lick of sense between the two of them, but they were good people. I miss that sometimes, the people, the lifestyle, the satisfaction from a hard day's work - but most of the time I'm glad I don't have the absurd hours, the awful leadership, the terrible PT that hurt more people than it helped. I did it, I'm glad I did it, I'm glad I'm done. Time to move on.

You too bro

Neverserved here, am I wrong to have imposter syndrome by being a Jow Forumsommando? From what I hear, it seems like I only missed out on a little bit of useful skills and excitement, and a lot of fuckery.
I worked at UPS for two years, and while that doesn't compare to being shot at or Field Day, I dare say I've had enough bureaucratic fuckery for one lifetime.

>I hate our enemies
>some one tell me who they are plz

You are allowed to think for yourself, you know that?

How old is too old to enlist?

>continuation of highschool
I saw it as more of a giant shitty Frat desu

I think Afghanistan/deployments/combat is its own fuckery that you'll simultaneously love and hate.

As for bureaucratic bullshit (most of the reason I got out), I think any job that is a big enough company could probably show you that. I also briefly interned with USFWS and that was full of bureaucratic bullshit as well, despite obviously not having anything to do with the armed forces.

>be american soldier
>willingly enlist so you can get paid for fighting america's wars
>cry and moan in agony when deployed even in the most low-intensity conflicts

Whining and suing seems ro be the favorite american passtimes

The way I see it is people harping on about the response to the Army's tweet don't realize that:
-It's twitter, more left than right
-Whiners tend to be more vocal
-People who had a normal or good experience either don't feel the need to share OR they don't want to waste time getting involved in a flame war

So basically getting touched on the shoulder could qualify?

Your so full of shit

Said every jack booted state agent and poor dumb cannonfodder for all millenia

Above 30-35 I would say but what do I know?

I don't totally get the American culture of vets seeming to constantly want to talk about how they "can't talk about it" when it comes to their tours of duty. I appreciate the risk of putting your life on the line same as anyone, but I can't tell if it's a cry for help or some sort of disingenuous attention seeking.

Is it just a product of American "thank you for your service" culture? Like, I don't understand what it's like hold someone's life in my hands and perform brain surgery, but I don't hear neurosurgeons constantly telling the public how impossible it is to appreciate the pressures of their job.

>am I wrong to have imposter syndrome by being a Jow Forumsommando?
I really don't care, do what you want to do.
At least in my case, 98% I'm allowed to talk about. The 2% is mostly technological capabilities and special missions. Only have one mission that I can't talk about, mostly because it was politically sensitive. Done a dozen missions where we were supporting JSOC secret squirrels, and I can talk about those freely.

It really depends on your occupation and role. Those who have security clearances don't talk about it to maintain those clearances, especially since those clearances are a real job asset once you transition to civilian life. I only had a secret clearance myself.

>Only have one mission that I can't talk about, mostly because it was politically sensitive
Bergdahl?

>is war so fucking terrible
>war
>terrible
What are you retarded do you think that people are going for a picnic in warzones

It's a mix of LARP, genuinely traumatic experiences, and perhaps poorly worded versions of "you just wouldn't understand it unless you were there."

I was OIF, so not that one.

Funny enough we were working with a company of Iraqi Army in a remote village to find some AQI fighters. Nothing happened, but on our way back we ran into a huge sandstorm. We were following the IA trucks, and before we realized it, we found ourselves in Syria. Once we saw it, we noped off of following the IA and went back into Iraqi territory.

That also is not the special mission we did, can't really confirm what it was. I'm looking at a job in federal government, and don't want fuck myself over by disclosing something I shouldn't .

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>cant talk about ordering cag a box of mres
faggot

>"you just wouldn't understand it unless you were there."

Is that true though?

I guess that's kind of the real meat of my question: is the experience really THAT indescribable?

I haven't done most people's jobs, I haven't had plenty of life experiences. But it seems like military is the only one where the people who have done it treat it as beyond the reasonable comprehension of anyone who hasn't actually done it to understand what it's like.

The only thing I can think of that's comparable in the degree of "either you get it, or you don't" would be people not even bothering to explain sex to a non-virgin (which you can totally explain).

Nice beach. That story reminds me of a patrol in South America where they got butt-fuck lost and ended up in the wrong country. Both NCOs from either side were in a shouting match insisting that they were correct and triggers were almost pulled.

As for the Berg, my friend was a medic Bob on the FOB attached to his unit, but didn't get the gag-order, so he filled us in on how big of bag of shit that guy was and how he got people killed because he wanted to give his ass up to the Taliban.

>The only thing I can think of that's comparable in the degree of "either you get it, or you don't" would be people not even bothering to explain sex to a non-virgin (which you can totally explain).

Yeah, you can explain it. "Hot, wet, slippery and feels good" is a perfectly accurate description, but if you were a virgin you still wouldn't "get it."

I was talking to another user about missing being deployed. Everyone I've said that to who hasn't been innamilitary looks at me like I'm retarded.

Even if I explain it in what I assume is an understandable way, I don't think people get it.

I get it, it's nostalgia and sharing in the suck with guys you like in an extraordinary situation punctuated by the occasional fun and badass moments. I get that some people are shallow as a puddle on the driveway, but what's so hard to get about that?

I don't know.

I'm probably not going to be able to define it in a way that's a satisfactory answer.

>Nice beach
That is the Syrian border my man, nothing but sand there. Only water I ever saw was the Tigris River. We were able to kill three hajj under bridge 4 while they were trying to bury a weapons cache under the bridge.
>on how big of bag of shit that guy was
Heard the same, knew a guy who was wounded while search operations were ongoing. Fuck him.
Most don't understand service (everyone assumes BCT/OSUT is the worst it gets), let alone being deployed. I just try to put into terms of getting to do your job, rather than just training to do your job.

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I don't think it's really "indescribable" so much as "incomparable" to anything in the life experience of most people you're trying to explain it to. Seriously, how do you explain how fucking loud a firefight is to people who have literally never heard anything louder than maybe a fire engine siren going by? You can say "it's like X, but times ten", but you know that's not really getting the point across because they've just simply never experienced anything actually like the thing you're describing.

It's like trying to describe pain. You couldn't explain what it feels like to have your leg amputated with minimal anesthesia in a battlefront hospital to someone whose most painful experience in life has been jamming their finger in a door.

>"Hot, wet, slippery and feels good" is a perfectly accurate description, but if you were a virgin you still wouldn't "get it."

But that's just a really poor description of what sex is like. Technically accurate, but doesn't even begin to convey the experience.

This says more about the person describing it than the nature of the experience itself.

twitter.com/Chili_Cannon/status/1133377745214353408

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My bad, thought that was southern tip or Kuwait where the Iowas shelled, but I see it now. What exactly is the consequence for wandering into a neighboring nation (besides covering it up as a matter-of-fact)?

Then you give me a statement that you are completely confident both accurately conveys the experience of sex and can make the virgin "understand" the feeling of sex as though they were the one having it.

It was seeing all the sick/dead kids that fucked me up

t. was in Somalia

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“But we soon found out that the glory of war was at home among the ladies and not upon the field of blood and carnage of death, where our comrades were mutilated and torn by shot and shell.”

-Sam Watkins

Attached: Last Stand at Saylor's Creek.jpg (3298x2129, 1.53M)

We only noticed looking at our Blue Force Tracker, we just hauled ass back to where we were supposed to be. A lot the Syrian-Iraqi border is marked by sandberms, but we found a gap. We (well me) never found out how long it took the IA trucks to do a course correction. Don't think there was any diplomatic blowback, since we didn't get any blowback from command (at least us lowly joes). We were literally in nowhere, and I don't think any Syrians saw us. We were about 10 km in before we realized our mistake (well, the IAs mistake) Sandstorms suck though, another one we just had to stop our vehicles, because we couldn't see more than 5 meters in any direction. That one was a little trippy because damn near blood-red. I hate fucking deserts now, but that was actually a neat experience.

You are not alone, I was OIF 06-07. We were tertiary targets, hajj was mostly attacking LN forces and civilians. It was tit-for-tat payback between Sunnis and Shiites, innocent people being targeted everyday. We frankly failed in preventing such occurrences from happening, which honestly feels worse than losing buddies. We volunteered, the local population did not.

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>Somalia
I get it man, I've fucked around in Hati for peace corps stuff before. Its one thing when a grown ass man has drank himself into a stupor and gotten infected with bot flies but when it's a fucking kid its horrifying.
They just dont even have the fucking comprehension of what could cause that shit, or why it's wrong. Fuck. To them that's just how life is. I cant even fucking imagine.

You can't describe sex in a single statement anymore than "war is hell" conveys combat, that's my point. Point them in the direction of any of the myriad great writers who have devoted whole books to it.

>boredpanda.com
>what is the truth?

The truth is the complete opposite of the blog you just posted. Stop believing everything to you read on blogs.

All the rejects from my high school joined the army immediately after graduation. I think in times of not-so-necessary war, you tend to get people like that in the army rather than real patriot heroes.

Why even bring up the mission you arent allowed to talk about if you arent allowed to talk about it? The only possible reason is that you want to flex on some spergy Jow Forumsommando types. You seek validation from others by virtue of claiming to do a job that you think the neckbeards here would be envious of. Plenty of vets here have signed nda's for various operations. You're the first I've seen to brag about it. The military dick riding culture tends to create clout chaser tryhards such as yourself.

>high school in the USA is shitty and full of bullism

Bullshit. You know why they say that garbage? Because they changed the definition of bullying to teasing and making jokes. Back in my day, getting bullied meant getting punched in the face and/or kicked in the kidneys. In current clown society, saying the words "girl" and "boy" is now considered "bullying", "misgendering" and a "hate crime".

>PTSD

It's the exact same thing with so called PTSD. Back in WW1, two things were invented. Artillery and Shell Shock. Shell Shock is brain damage from repeated concussions, caused by artillery barrages.

But then the social scientists took over and redefined it as "Post Traumatic Stress Disorder". From brain damage to stress. What bullshit.

% males (more or less) are sexually assaulted

Hey, Tone. I think the yids are just fucking with us now.

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>times of not-so-necessary war

So basically every U.S. war post-WW II.

Some user asked a question pertaining to that subject, and I answered it on what I'm available to tell. This is discussion forum, and we were having a discussion.

Simple enough for you?

Dealing with the effects of prolonged extreme stress is a jewish trick now?

>It's the exact same thing with so called PTSD. Back in WW1, two things were invented. Artillery and Shell Shock. Shell Shock is brain damage from repeated concussions, caused by artillery barrages.

>But then the social scientists took over and redefined it as "Post Traumatic Stress Disorder". From brain damage to stress. What bullshit.

t. Brainlet

I feel like this post was made by a European 13 year old jesus christ the mind of a child is a wondrous thing

>t.

You are a faggot with no argument whatsoever.

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>he says while posting a gtav reaction image
Do you feel it? I feel it.

>Israels wars
FTFY
You don’t get ptsd fighting for something you believe in

Different user, but he isn't necessarily wrong.

It's been called a number of things over centuries, but the changing vocabulary doesn't mean any party is wrong. Shell-shock has been there even before WWI. Blast pressure is no small thing to discount, and will completely fuck up your mental factuaties and your ability to perform physically as you previously had.

Had a platoon sergeant that took three blasts in the span of one week. He was unable to speak, and drooling on himself after the last blast. Strong and good man, but experiencing such totally upended his life. Took him a year of rehab to get close to normal again. I knew one combat engineer who took 21 blasts in a single tour, he was much worse off.

The guys you serve with become a second family, and in many cases, a better family. Losing someone that you have spent nearly 24/7 with hurts, and that hurt isn't known unless you have been there and done that. More painful is you get to intimately know their families, and their pain and difficulty gets passed on to you, by sheer empathy.

Past vets experienced a lot worst, but didn't get to know the guys killed as well as we do today. Replacements would circulate in as needed. You spend as much of as year+, working alongside with them, meeting their loved ones, babysitting their children. When they get killed, you share that hurt. And in doing so, it makes such experiences exponentially worse.

lol, must be why all the WWII vets came home, beat their wives, and drank themselves to death.

T. Blue collar boomer

Soldier's heart
Shell shock
Battle fatigue
PTSD

Etc

Fold it up carefully, lay it aside;
Tenderly touch it, look on it with pride;
For dear to our hearts must it be evermore,
The jacket of gray our loved soldier-boy wore.

Can we ever forget when he joined the brave band
That rose in defense of our dear Southern land,
And in his bright youth hurried on to the fray,
How proudly he donned it -- the jacket of gray?

His fond mother blessed him and looked up above,
Commending to Heaven the child of her love;
What anguish was hers mortal tongue cannot say,
When he passed from her sight in the jacket of gray.

But her country had called and she would not repine,
Though costly the sacrifice placed on its shrine;
Her heart's dearest hopes on its altar she lay,
When she sent out her boy in the jacket of gray.

Months passed and wars thunders rolled over the land,
Unsheathed was the sword and lighted the brand;
We heard in the distance the sound of the fray,
And prayed for our boy in the jacket of gray.

Ah, vain, all in vain, were our prayers and our tears,
The glad shout of victory rang in our ears;
But our treasured one on the red battle-field lay,
While the life-blood oozed out of the jacket of gray.

His young comrades found him, and tenderly bore
The cold lifeless form to his home by the shore;
Oh, dark were our hearts on that terrible day,
When we saw our dead boy in the jacket of gray.

Ah! spotted and tattered, and stained now with gore,
Was the garment which once he so proudly wore;
We bitterly wept as we took it away,
And replaced with death's white robes the jacket of gray.

We laid him to rest in his cold narrow bed,
And graved on the marble we placed o'er his head
As the proudest tribute our sad hearts could pay --
"He never disgraced it, the jacket of gray."

Then fold it up carefully, lay it aside,
Tenderly touch it, look on it with pride;
For dear must it be to our hearts evermore,
The jacket of gray our loved soldierboy wore!

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The Army in my country would actually be great if it wasn't for the bureaucratic civilian fuckheads in our department of defense REMOVING CONTROL OF EVER DECISION THEY CAN FROM THE ACTUAL GUYS IN THE MILITARY BECAUSE FUCK EVERYTHING THEY WANT MONEY AND WE DESERVE NONE OF IT. They hand back so much of our budget to the government every year for brownie points and turn to us saying "Sorry we cant actually pay you anymore, cuts because :))))"

There you go, self medication through alcohol and drugs was called soldier's syndrome for the longest time. Hell, it is arguable that Alexander the Great died as a result of it 2,300 years ago. Every generation of veterans have experienced the same thing in one way or another. It is not a recent development, it has been occurring through the entirety of recorded military history, by a multitude of world-wide demographics.

PTSD is not new, just a host of definitions that previously existed before we arrived at the present definition.

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>the problem isn't the military, but civil society
>honestly believing this
I want to say both ok retard and are you ok retard

>Those dirty evil redneck terrorists are not complying with our unconstitutional laws. Go kill them.

>but who is responsible?
How about the government corrupted by corporate capitalist greed and influenced to keep the war machine running so defense contracts get renewed and the military gets more funding every year? There were no WMDs, every involvement in the middle east creates more issues than it solves, and the American people are always lied to.

Think back to 9/11. First responders were dealing with a litany of health issues stemming from the particulates in the air they breathed in, but NO ONE WANTED TO FUCKING PAY FOR THEIR HEALTHCARE. A bill was passed to BLOCK them from getting healthcare, removing government liability for their care.

Think about how fucked up that is: 9/11, a time our nation was under attack, an event that is used to rally Americans to resist every foe through nationalism and pride. And what of those who were on the ground, fighting the real fight and saving lives? Fuck 'em, they're not useful anymore.

Perfect example of the way those who perpetuate wars see members of the military. You're disposable, and they'll tell you what you want to hear as long as it gets you to sign.

While Alexander the Great and Macedonians used to drink quite a lot at the time, they didn't necessarily use it as a way to treat extreme fatigue and stress of their soldiers.
>ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12751970
>Every generation of veterans have experienced the same thing in one way or another
This is true, however, it's clear that the number of people traumatized by war as soldiers was way lower compared to modern times.
This is probably due to how people viewed each other, the kind of weapons that were available and how life itself was back then.

>the problem isn't the military, but civil society

They are two different worlds, mindsets, and realities than other. It is not an insult intended to either parties, just that we differ. Would say the same for LEOs, Firefighters,EMTs, Nurses and Docs. Where the other is less able to communicate that experience to any other.

I for one don't have a decent understanding of Chemical Engineers, doesn't make what they do wrong.

I beg to differ, through my own experiences and those of 200 others.
nytimes.com/interactive/2014/10/14/world/middleeast/us-casualties-of-iraq-chemical-weapons.html

I was a contributing source.

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I don't know if its PTSD per say but a lot of veterans go through shit thats pretty depressing and damaging all because of the way the military works, you'll have people with pregnant wives get moved through 5 duty stations in the smallest amount of times, people getting deployed and not seeing their kids for so long, hell, people in the navy, if they serve until retire spend half of their career on a ship. They experience their wives cheating or leaving them due to that shit, they experience children that hate them due to not being home, family members like parents growing distant cause they just dont see each other anymore, the only friends they have being fellow service members they won't talk to aside from facebook comments after their time is done yet everyone will pretend like theyre brothers in arms.

its a hard life even for people who dont go through the horrors of war, youre effectively owned by an institution that doesnt care about you aside from giving you this status that allows a discount at AMC.

>The discoveries of these chemical weapons did not support the government’s invasion rationale.
>After the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, Mr. Bush insisted that Mr. Hussein was hiding an active weapons of mass destruction program, in defiance of international will and at the world’s risk. United Nations inspectors said they could not find evidence for these claims.

Then, during the long occupation, American troops began encountering old chemical munitions in hidden caches and roadside bombs. Typically 155-millimeter artillery shells or 122-millimeter rockets, they were remnants of an arms program Iraq had rushed into production in the 1980s during the Iran-Iraq war.

All had been manufactured before 1991, participants said. Filthy, rusty or corroded, a large fraction of them could not be readily identified as chemical weapons at all...In case after case, participants said, analysis of these warheads and shells reaffirmed intelligence failures. First, the American government did not find what it had been looking for at the war’s outset, then it failed to prepare its troops and medical corps for the aged weapons it did find.

Your link does not support your argument. There was no active WMD production. It was a lie.

I'm just saying they were there, but from my own research it is clear that Iraq didn't have an active program.

Just saying they were still there, but admittedly didn't pose a present or meaningful threat to the U.S. or their allies. I acknowledge that, but it is personal for us who encountered them.

Was trying to link a Senate report that says the same.

I get that, man. They were there, but they were old caches, not the freshly minted ones US intelligence purported there was in order for us to go to war. But for the service members who had the misfortune of encountering them, I have no doubts it was personal.

I just don't like seeing my fellow man get fucked over, and then lied to about who did it and why. Every American deserves a better quality of life, one that isn't sullied by the preying of corrupt police or outlandish insurance costs simply to be able to afford to live or a suppressed minimum wage.

I have no objective disagreement, you are right. Take care user, good talk.

There's absolutely no problem with neverserved Jow Forumsommandos except for one common to civilians everywhere, being that people don't know when to shut the fuck up about military shit they know absolutely fucking nothing about.