While there's no such thing as a perfect sword, there are those that are damn close.
So which do you consider to be so?
My personal fave is a cossack shashka. Straight blade with some curvature, thick cross-section, very sharp, better balanced than a katana but just as sharp, has a fuller.
True, it doesn't have a crossguard, but since it's a cavalry sword first, it doesn't really need one.
Which ones do you prefer, Anons?
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Swords actually require exercise to use, so Jow Forums is a bad place to start this thread
>Jow Forums is a bad place to start this thread
Man, this is literally the board dedicated to weapons. Where else to post it?
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A Sabre-Sidesword.
>better balanced than a katana but just as sharp
The property of a blade as concerns cutting is a bit more complicated than that. But yes, a shashka will cut fine. Though it often used the same blades that were used in other european cavalry sabres...
Ignore the retard.
OP, I like dark ages/migration period swords.
Mostly dicking with you. Jow Forums is probably the best place for the thread, since a small group of sword aficionados lurk here.
While the sword is aesthetically very pleasing (I have wet dreams about straight European swords), it looks mighty impractical
>heavy
>short handle for a footman sword
>a lot of weight on crossguard and pommel
>no taper or curvature whatsoever
>communist insignia
garbage, get one that does not have that
I just stole that image: I'm not wealthy enough to get me one, but I hope to soon.
Also, what does it matter whose insignia it has: if it's a good sword, it's a good sword.
Well considering they were used for over a thousand years and that's a museum grade replica of an actual sword, I think you're jumping the gun on your analysis.
>heavy
Somewhat, they were designed for hacking and slashing, the weight helps
>short handle
As did all swords from this time
>no taper or curvature
Of course not. It has no need for taper as it is not designed for stabbing, that would only decrease its effectiveness at cutting.
>curvature
What advantage do you think blade curvature lends you?
>a lot of weight on crossguard and pommel
And that's where you're most wrong, as a large portion of the crossguard and pommel are not metal.
There is literally no way to tell how heavy this is or how much distal taper it has. Or how heavy the hilt construction is. As for the hilt size, it is meant to constrain your grip somewhat... dark age swords were mostly cutting swords after all.
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>Cossack sword
>communist symbols
learn some history fag
My personal favorite swords would be either the euro longsword, or spanish rapier. DESU I'm more into shorter blades.
>very sharp
Even a stone cutter can be sharp. Sharpness is not the inherit characteristic of a sword or a knife.
>since it's a cavalry sword first, it doesn't really need one.
Well, many people would argue on that.
For example, koncerz had a crossguard.
>For example, koncerz had a crossguard.
As did the absolute majority of cavalry swords ever.
>personal favorite swords would be either the euro longsword, or spanish rapier
>into shorter blades
>favorites are rapier and longsword
wat
>shashkas were used by cossacks predominately
>USSR symbol is there because this is a replica
Consider the obvious, moron.
>wat
"Short blades" means "knives and daggers".
When you're confronted with a horseman, unless you have a spear, you're fucked. Only things you can do are:
>move out of the way (unlikely to succeed)
>parry the sword to buy yourself a few more seconds
If you're being charged, you have a split second to deflect the sword; you rarely have the time to aim for the hand.
>True, but that sword seems to be designed for thrusting (length and blade shape)
>Don't matter: a slightly longer handle is always beneficial for infantry swords
>it's a straight sword with no curvature: only thing that would benefit it in cutting is its weight
>curvature lets the sword slide
>didn't know that one: thought only gladius and spatha did those
You're right, but short swords such as xiphos and kopis (to name a few) are basically also short blades
>better balanced than
>has a fuller
There isn't a single proper way of doing things here. That's basically just the idea of there being a single best sword (that you have already tossed out) sneaking back in again. And even if we just look at, say, katana then different school for its use may have different ideas about how exactly it should be balanced, all as valid and right as the others. Then the fuller isn't something that's just a good thing period, rather the absence or presence of a fuller (and in the latter case how exactly it is to be shaped) is one of many things which must be brought together to form a proper whole as the smith plans out the blade geometry.
>but just as sharp
This on the other hand is one of the rare cases where swords are surprisingly consistent. The edge angle and outermost edge geometry for swords intended to be at leats half-decent in the cut shows a decisively low amount of variation, as smiths all over the place appears to have reached an optimum created by the properties of steel and flesh.
You may wanna watch this, he gets into the edge geometry thing a bit past 41:30, but all of it is good stuff: youtube.com
Thanks for the link.
What I meant about sharpness is that while, yes, all swords are meant to be sharp, some don't benefit as much from it (springsteels, straight swords, stoccos...). Swords with slight outer curvature benefit most from sharpness because they can slide with just a swing, unlike straight swords that don't slide nearly as much.
Also, shashka is a relatively wide cross-section sword. It's meant for cutting but can stab as well.
>True, but that sword seems to be designed for thrusting (length and blade shape)
It is not. It's a direct descendant of the Roman spatha, which ironically enough was a cavalry sword that later saw widespread adoption in infantry in the later Roman empire, where it then spread to the Germans. Some people would call that a viking sword, but it predates the vikings by several hundred years. It might be more accurate to just call it a spatha. Just one look at it should tell you it is not a thrusting sword in any way shape or form.
>Don't matter: a slightly longer handle is always beneficial for infantry swords
Not true, depends entirely on technique. A longer handle feels more comfortable for many modern western techniques. That doesn't mean it is always beneficial. People actually knew what they were doing when they made swords, and made them properly for their intended use.
>it's a straight sword with no curvature: only thing that would benefit it in cutting is its weight
Uh, no.
>curvature lets the sword slide
Not really. Curvature helps with edge alignment, not much else.
>didn't know that one: thought only gladius and spatha did those
As said above, in practical terms that is a spatha, just not made by Romans.
>but short swords such as xiphos and kopis (to name a few) are basically also short blades
I agree that there can be little to no difference between short swords and long daggers.
But, for example, I don't admire chinquedas or larger swiss degens as much as I admire stilettos and left hand daggers.
A sword like that is not designed for thrusting, it can do it, but the optimisation leans quite heavily towards the cut. Handle length, there we're onto the "single best way of doing things" again. it worked for them, if it doesn't work for you then I'll put my trust in the guys who did use them and suspect that you're simply not using it correctly. The lack of profile taper... I don't know where you two are going with that discussion, and what on Earth do you mean about the sword sliding?
Now that spatha you have there is a bit different.
Longer blade, mild taper. Stabs very well, but can also cut. Fairly versatile for European swords of that time.
I've held a curved sword in my hand on few occasions. Wasn't well made (plain iron) but it behaved very differently when swings were made. Not at all like a straight blade I happen to own.
Behold, pure sex!
Whoa, looks sexy. Is that a fancy gross-messer or what?
>(springsteels, straight swords, stoccos...
Spring steel isn't a type of a sword, it's a very arbitrary grouping of steels with properties (high toughness) that tends to make them suitable for swords.
As for the shape of a sword, being sharp make sit cut better regardless of whether it's curved or not, and as such any sword that's isn't intended to only ever thrust and nothing else will benefit from being sharp. And there's certainly no shortage of straight swords historically that have been intended to be cutting swords first and foremost, for example it's basically what Europe went with all the way from from the Spatha to the High Middle Ages.
And fi the sliding part is you being worried about a straight sword only impacting in a purely percussive, perpendicular fashion with the target then the guy swinging it isn't using it properly. You add a bit of a slicing (parallel to the skin of the target) motion on your own, and can angle the blade a bit instead of just holding it perfectly perpendicular to the direction it travels. Even just an ever so slight pull on the handle at the moment of impact will make a huge difference.
A single curved sword is not a good thing to base your ideas about all curved swords on. There's a preposterously large amount of variation there, just as there is with straight swords.
>Now that spatha you have there is a bit different.
Well, yes. It's early and much more like a traditional Roman spatha, even though it was also found in Sweden.
>Longer blade
It is not. It's like 2mm shorter.
>Stabs very well, but can also cut.
How would you know?
I'm not sure if that's a very straight messer or a very long falchion
Swiss saber. Although that example has an atypical partial double-edge.
Looks a lot longer to me. At least 4 inches.
I know because I owned a blade very similar to that one. Poor quality so the bastard broke, but the idea was basically the same.
Well, you're wrong, because I'm pulling that directly from the smiths site.
Swordcucks are literally the worst.
It's neither messer nor falchion. It's abse don this thing: wallacelive.wallacecollection.org:443
Curved longsword? Hm, I'd just consider it a sabre, but if that's what Toby wants to call it...
Very sexy sword indeed.
I bought a "battle ready" saber from KoA and the pommel is loose after opening a few bottles of champagne with it.
I'd prefer buying from Windlass anyway, but thanks for warning me.
>I'd prefer buying from Windlass anyway
That explains why you have such "special" ideas about sword handling and balance.
Most of us were like him at one point, he'll figure it out. Hopefully
>1.62kg
>101.5cm
Dang that's fairly heavy for what it is! I suppose it's supposed to be two-handed or at least "one-hand-and-a-half" but for a weapon that's basically the size of a japanese sword, you wouldn't expect it to be x1.5 heavier.
Not such a proper comparison now that I look at it as the blade swiss sabre blade is 3in longer.
I like specialist weapons. Here’s a ming dynasty’ shoudao
>there are still people who watch and give money to this grizzly faggot
His desperate videos and comment sections give me AIDS.
>cuts through your shit weeb sword with my zweihander
>Ming Dynasty
>weeb shit
Are you fucking retarded?
the epee is the greatest alternative sword ever created change my mind
What's the general opinion on the Katana? Weebs and anti-weebs aside?
Surprisingly heavy for their blade lengths. But they are good swords.
Good swords considering the materials the Japanese had to work with, it's become really common to shit all over them as backlash over the ridiculous amounts of praise they used to get but those sides were pretty undeserved.
Also, I can't deny that they are pretty aesthetic.
I love late roman/migration era spatha. unfortunately i have never been able to find a decent reproduction that's of reasonable price without a custom made one from a smith.
I made a thread about them recently since deepeeka has a Sutton Hoo reproduction.However it doesn't look great and i doubt it handles well.Pic related my deepeeka late roman spatha i love the broad blade without a fuller but the handle is too long and way too large and it handles poorly.
That sword forged empires. Also there were longer variants. The dao forged empires, thus is superior to the zweihander that was only used to bully peasants.
Complicated historically and culturally. Overall I think they are the most interesting of all swords due to the unique and radically changing design, construction, philosophies and techniques used over the thousand plus years they have been extant. The fact you can buy an almost perfectly preserved sword from the very earliest period of the Japanese sword as we know it (Heian period 794-1185) is quite extraordinary.
Step aside, Sl*void
>Czech name
>Turkish blade
>Used to fight Turks with poles, croats and hungarians
Git out, stormweenie.
seething
You bet your ass I'm seething when some stupid cunt LARPs as german and incites hatred between us and people we're trying to live in peace with.
t. Tatar rape baby
I'm german you dunce.
ok kid. stop spamming this thread.
Claymores look cool, are they good?
my penis, cuz it grant life instead of taking it.
>half hander
idk if you could even penetrate denim armor with that, user.
What sort of claymore, the one-handed basket-hilted sword or the two-handed pseudo greatsword?
How are Regenyei swords?
I've been thinking of getting either one of those or an Albion, which is a little more expensive, for sparring.
You really have to work on your delivery mate. I guess the irony that you wont even put in the work to construct a proper joke is lost on you.
>Straight blade with some curvature
>better balanced
>just as sharp
>doesn't have a crossguard, but since it's a cavalry sword first, it doesn't really need one
Jesus make it stop!
it's very visually pleasing but i feel like thats just alot of weak points in the blade.
ehh... the japs almost only fought japs so their technology never really advanced at the rate the western swords did.
A samurai was really good at killing unarmored jap peasants because that's what the reality of sengoku war was.
Pit a samurai against a Roman much less a late medieval knight and he would be woefully under equipped to handle that situation 9 out of 10 times.
All-in-all it's really not that great of a weapon and more of a "status symbol" than a practical weapon that anyone would truly trust their life to in a fight where armor is involved.
Pretty good
To be fair those swords from the earliest period are a lot more fragile than they originally were,due to multiple polishing, and they were often cut down from their original length due to Edo period regulations.
Are any of you guys into cutting? I've been doing the standard bottles/jugs for a few years and recently started tatami which was much more interesting. The combination of regular cutting practice as well as sparring with a ton of weapons has dramatically improved my swordsmanship. I tend to use japanese stuff now but I used to cut/fight with longswords and they were great fun as well.
I've done a bit. Peter Johnsson has recommended rolled up, damp/wet-ish newspaper as a flesh simulant (tatami not always being readily available outside of Japan) with some duct tape for skin and plastic VVS piping for bone. I haven't bothered with the pipes, but otherwise that seems to make for a reasonable target, or at leats reasonably entertaining.
>since it's a cavalry sword first, it doesn't really need one
are you retarded? are the people you're slashing or thrusting at from horseback not armed? enjoy losing your hand.
I just saw one of my fellow "backyard cutter" autists do some tatami with a PVC core and that seemed pretty intense. I'll definitely try the duct-taped newspaper with piping sometime. I've recently been using a really heavy duty wide-blade katana and it needs some hefty targets.
I know you guys are weebs and romantics, but seriously why don't you guys cut ballistics gelatin? it's scientifically correlated to porcine (and therefor human) muscle tissue, you put a simulated bone in that and it would be accurately representative of a body
I guess I'm gonna go on a limb and say where, how and how much would I have to spend for a very well made katana. Preferably authentic Japanese steel. I'm willing to spend over 1K for sure. I've always wanted to have a real one since I was a kid, i figure..I have now tons of guns I like, why not a katana? plus my wife wants to use one for cosplay and larping for sure.
>A samurai was really good at killing unarmored jap peasants because that's what the reality of sengoku war was.
The 150 years of clannic wars wasn't really against "peasants", unless by peasant you mean blocks of ashigaru with iron armor and 20ft long spears.
Quite interesting talk on Chinese swords with Skallgrim.
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The Chu Longsword with 1,48m blade length is fucking dope.
Unbelievable that China already had that sort of technology back during 300BC to create monsters like these, issued to heavy infantry as counter-polearm weapons, just like the German Zweihander much much later.
>iron armor
paper armor.
Ashigaru only had laquered paper armor.
>paper armor
>in Sengoku jidai
Yeah sure and euro knights couldn't get up when they fell because armor was too heavy and restrictive.
You see, me too I can into memes.
From what I can tell ballistic gel isn't all that similar to flesh, somewhat in the way way that a piece of jello and a piece of pork isn't all that similar. And for its intended use it doesn't need to be either. The point to it isn't to show you exactly what happens when it hits a human. Since the human body varies inside that'd be a futile thing to try anyway. Instead ballistic gelatin is supposed to be similar enough to flesh, relative to a small and fats projectile, that the test results will have a linear correlation to their penetrating capability in human tissue and thus allowing us to compare different bullets. So while the numbers you get are useful for comparison. Trying to translate the gel numbers to exact real world performance is a lot harder, which is where you get the twelve FBI inches. Someone did all the homework on what real world performance was considered necessary, then did all the work to translate that into gel inches, and with some rounding off and so the result was twelve.
As we go over to test cutting with swords the velocities involved get a lot lower. Our penetrator is no longer cavitation, and so suddenly friction between the sides of the penetrator and the target tissue becomes a major issue. And there gel and tissue would seem to start diverging quite drastically. The gel is sticky and "dry", while tissue will tend to be lubricated by a lot of bodily fluids (for both tatami and newspaper it's important that you soak the test medium before cutting). Another factor is that some tissue (like muscles) are fibrous, and can object quite strongly to just being torn apart. All bullets (more or less) simply crush a path, so they'd be equally bothered here, and so it doesn't disturb the comparison when the gel fails to provide this obstacle, but edged weapons will be more or less good at cutting things apart instead depending on the edge and cutting technique.
The idea of larping and cosplay with an authentic weapon sounds irresponsible.
For one that isn't badly rusted or so it'll be more than 1000 USD.
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The European twohander was almost certainly not a special anti-polearm weapons since the historical sources talking about their use don't say that's what they're to be used for. The whole idea was just someone's hypothesis, which has now been largely abandoned since there was no evidence to support it. I have no idea how things were in China, but the cynic in me would suggest the hypothesis that these swords being anti-polearm weapons ha simply leaked over from the European side of things and is thus just as faulty for Chinese ones. Whether that's actually true or not being another matter, but it may be wise to ask for some proper evidence before accepting the anti-polearm idea as true.
What's his problem?
he can spout anything he wants and people listen
plus hes basically stopped making videos consistently because he doesnt have to worry about bills
>he can spout anything he wants and people listen
Isn't that anyone with any influence? I've never heard him say anything ridiculous and not back things up with examples but I've only seen a handful of his videos
>stopped making videos consistently
Gay but I'd probably do the same thing not to mention he's probably bored of it but doesn't want to stop because he has to find other income. I'd be relunctant to find an actual job too after years of living off of just making videos.
Shashka is essentially a simplified design of cavalry saber and is a good weapon for beginners. Balanced firward for better cut, it allows even inexperienced wielder to lay a terrible blow to adversary. It sucks at fencing though.
What part of cutting mats and bottles is "weeb" or "romantic"? If anything the entire backyard cutting community is full of dudes who view swords as cutting tools and nothing more. You're the one who thinks cutting targets need to represent humans. Also gel has way more friction and is more expensive/time consuming to shape and cut.
It's actually the opposite for that last point. Skall is desperately trying to make money from his dead channel and his videos get worse and worse. He made a video recently referencing Dark Souls which really drives the point home. He's appealing to the whole group of basic-level HEMAfags who constantly spout the word weeb and talk about zweihanders and Souls stuff. He also bought subscribers to hit 1 million subs, as he currently has 1.2 mil and averages 50k views a video.
He's also a legitimate cuckold bear furry so I could've just said that and been done with it.
Some very nice cutting with Jian and Daos
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Apparently, edge alignment > blade design
Shame swordsage couldn't just be a cool guy and instead has to whine about drumpf, racism, and immigration policies. Knowing Skallagrim, swordsage probably bangs cara every night which is why they hang out..
Damn, dat White Arc looks nice.
Light weight swords that cut like some 5 pound Katana are my fetish
>5 pound katana
nigga
Exageration I know, but Katana are pretty heavy for their length.
Very informative and an interesting example of the delicate calculations that subconsciously go into something "feeling right"; thank you
That's what makes them cut through tank barrel dummy dumb
Yes, completely ignore the different blade styles, blade widths, edge geometries, and thickness. The whole "katanas are the same they never evolved" argument is trash as well.
Dat white arc cutting test conviced me to get one. It’s a steal for 250 lmao