Australia announced finalists for the Land 400 Phase 3

>OHNONONONONONONONONONONO
Huh?

I don't see the Korean one winning, they're fairly enamoured with the modularity of the Lynx and its a bit of a newer design

More likely they'll opt for another 30 M1A2C's
Plus we can steal parts off the americans tanks then

Both designs are from scratch, with only few components compatible with existing vehicles

Is there any info on the redback? Apparently it has a fiberglass hull and is quite different to most other IFV in its construction.

It's basically an enlarged K21 with an additional layer of heavier armor. South Korean army is going to be ordering some too.

The CV90 was ejected from the US Army's OMFV program in the last few months. Probably the end for it as a platform.

Is buying a Hanwha not fucking stupid? if they have a conflict of some kind (within ~20 yrs) their supply would be cut off most likely? (or any other conflict in asia) This along with any other tension a south korean company brings. I'd assume the Lynx is the safest choice.

Am i talking shit or is there some truth in this?

>It's basically an enlarged K21 with an additional layer of heavier armor. South Korean army is going to be ordering some too.
I'm curious how much of an advantage fiberglass + external armor gives over building it out of steel RHA.

Hanwha touted it as a complete new design based on the previous study it has been doing already
However, whether there's any actual relation to K21, I do not know
Both bidders are setting up lines inside the country, in conjunction with employing local steel products

The redback apparently doesn't even exist yet. It's all CGI and marketing fluff.

how is the redback a finalist, when it doesnt even exist

You'd have to ask the Aussie military. But google it if you don't believe me, nothing but mockups and CGI pics.

Not in complete form
It's expected to show up by the next year for trial

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I don't even know what to say or think

pretty sure the germans will win the race.
They already won the with the boxer, so there will be already all plants, mechanics etc. trained on KMW equipment. It would be dubious to not buy from the germans.

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Lynx is Rheinmetall, not KMW

Remember that Australia has already bought tons of Boxers and trucks (several types even) from Rheinmetall.

If they bought Korean I'd be VERY surprised to be honest.

Meanwhile, Lynx has been physically driving on Australian soil for over a year now.

perthnow.com.au/news/sa/antonov-cargo-plane-drops-german-tank-in-adelaide-for-land-forces-2018-conference-ng-b4a95dc069ba1cb19a2637ea6f353a7a

Redback is a proper Aussie name for an Aussie vehicle, we don't even have lynxes here

>buy Boxer APC that doubles as IFV
>buy a separate IFV avoiding parts commonality, reduced training and maintenance costs
I fucking hate our government, I though we got the Boxer APC specifically because we could run it along side Boxer IFVs.

>Actual reason why the Redback is chosen
that would be a shitpost, but it would be an Aussie shitpost

it should be forbidden to look this german!!!

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Wheeled vehicles can't keep pace with the M1s and can't handle rough terrain too well.

Have you been to the north of Australia? It's either perfect for wheels or so muddy tracks wouldn't do much better.
Reduced ground pressure really isn't an advantage here.

I used to have exactly hair like that (same cut, natural flaxen blond color) and regularly received compliments about it. Straight, natural blonde hair, cut and styled like that just looks fucking awesome. The ultimate chad hairstyle. Aaaand then I when I was around 27-28 I started balding which I've tried to fight but unsuccessfully thus far. It all saddens me greatly, unironically. I barely even go outside anymore without wearing my fucking ball cap.

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I actually prefer redback just due to the fact that it has more road wheels and hydropneumatic suspensions, they're more saturated set up for the future provision
The actual trial stage will start after 12 months from now so there's still plenty of time

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Real talk: we need to scrap all these shitty programs and just invest in the SAS and having our own nukes. If the chinks invade we aren't going to stop them with our 60 tanks anyway.

Much better to have world class special forces that can protect Aussies abroad (anti-piracy, saving hostages) and the ability to nuke Beijing if they get too uppity.

We need a nuclear triad for sure, sadly we are a nation of political weakness and when we talked about getting nukes in the 50s the UK and US said no and we listened like bitches.

if they wanted a battle proven ifv they would have chosen the bmp 3 hands down not some """Battle proven""" asian shit

>If the chinks invade
But they won't, they'll just continue colonizing Australia until it becomes China.

Sure they will, as soon as the US isn't in a position to intervene China would jump at the chance to get trillions of dollars worth of resources for free.

True, it won't be long now:

abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/why-did-northern-territory-sell-darwin-port-to-china-what-risk/10755720

Buying capable equipment would be seen as aggression towards our sino trading partners

If aussies gonna get any non baby amount of those things they need to get a license and set up a local supply and production chain.

Would be quite the improvement.

Here's the schedule for LAND 400 phase 3
defence.gov.au/casg/Multimedia/LAND_400_Indicative_Timeline-9-9182.pdf

>Real talk: we need to scrap all these shitty programs and just invest in the SAS and having our own nukes. If the chinks invade we aren't going to stop them with our 60 tanks anyway.

>Much better to have world class special forces that can protect Aussies abroad (anti-piracy, saving hostages) and the ability to nuke Beijing if they get too uppity.

Absolutely based. Canada and the Scandis should have nukes too IMO

koreans are better at bribing tho

>aggression towards our sino trading partners

What aggression? Singapore already becoming a province of People's Republic of China.

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The all-wheel drive systems are pretty competent for what they are.
Biggest difference is in the running costs though, maintenance on wheeled is so much easier and less intensive than messing around with tracked. 2 blokes with a jack and brace can do your dud tyre in 10-15min, maybe less if they're potentially going to be shot at, whereas any kind of major track problems are usually a few hours, all the crew and whoever else they can wrangle into it.
Not that fuel use is always a consideration but you get a better range out of wheeled too, most tanks going hard will be lucky to crack 2-300km, IFV's are slightly further but some of the modern wheeled beasties can go for 5-750km on what they carry which is pretty fucking good really considering they're fat bastards.

Our heavy armoured is basically a protected species anyway, they just rumble around fucking clutches, squashing trees and reversing into (often expensive) things. Your chances of getting combat deployment as a tanker is very... very low

Krauts will absolutely seething to find out they're not in favor, the korean one is just more advanced in this case
I honestly fail to see any reason to pick lynx over redback if they've got the same level of protection

both of them look like those futuristic APCS that the euro faction had in Tom Clancy's Endwar

Blatantly false. Almost any tank is capable of 300-400 km at least. Get your wheel fetish out of here. 'beasties' lol.

Maybe if you're driving miss daisy at cruising speed on a road
Off road under combat conditions, through sand or some hills its 300km at best and frequently a lot worse

Germans are known bribers with several convictions

Lynx was the one set to win from the start. Especially after Boxer won and the plant got under construction in Queensland. It's the most modern and most ready. Another heavy platform with high protection and room for growth.

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Care to tell me what part of Lynx is so great compared to its rival other than political power?
I've been struggling to find out about all the hype towards it and came to the conclusion that it's just a resurrected marder 2

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>that chart says 40mm autocannon
>meanwhile the official company website says 30mm autocannon

>Hanwha is asian
nigga they are Korean. Koreans make exellent shit

>and came to the conclusion that it's just a resurrected marder 2
*ding* *ding* *ding*

>delusion

with refined Puma tech or at least with all the shit that actually works

It's newer, has the highest protection, has room for future expansion of capability (power, space, weight), fits a full section+, will be built here, in the factory being built right now for 225+ Boxer 8x8s and for maintenance of 3000+ trucks from the same companies.

It all depend how you squint while reading

Marder is way too expensive, too limited in capacity and capability, not enough seats and is too old. The Marder was never in contention for Australia's needs. Puma is the same, as sexy as it looks.

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>Care to tell me what part of Lynx is so great compared to its rival
The fact that Lynx actually exists, unlike it's CGI rival.

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Rheinmetall's got this in the bag.

Pretty much all large Army vehicle acquisitions have all come from Germany in recent years.

See G-Wagon, RMMV HX, Boxer, Tiger, Taipan. Once the Lynx is added the only non-German vehicles will be Abrams and PMV.

Sharing a turret with the Boxer is just icing on the cake.

I'm surprised it wasn't Lynx/Ajax as the shortlisted two, but not surprised CASG did that as they and most of the Army want (and with good reason) the Lynx to win. There is too much risk with the AS21, that's why CASG chose it, to make the Lynx the safe choice.

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Tiger is quite old now, and it's from France. They've finally got it in great condition now, but the hunt for a replacement has already begun.

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We don't need to stop them in a head on fight, just wait until they are more than three days travel into the outback and cut thier supply lines, Bunjil will handle the rest.

Interesting....had never looked at it from that POV. It even makes sense...

As far as I'm concerned all the potential winners are planned to be assembled within the country, so it's not such a huge advantage
Also hanwha is offering K9 SPH to the Australian army, which the aussies are very much keen on adopting at the moment, it's no coincidence that AS21, K9 and Abrams utilise the same allison automatic transmission
adbr.com.au/hanwha-asserts-prime-credentials-for-resurrected-sph-project/

The next evaluation is due to the next year see so as long as one can make the deadline it's all good to go
It still baffles me why krauts are so overly confident as if this is an assured win for them

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>There is too much risk with the AS21
I'm not sure what makes you think that way both KF41 and AS21 are newly designed based on their predecessors which is why they're able to pop up so quickly
KF41 is obviously an augmented marder
AS21 is heavily influenced by K21 and supposed K31

The K9 SPH is interesting as it came out of left field, and is certainly something the Army would love, but I don't think it's enough to compete with the Lynx offer.

But you have opened my eyes to more benefits of Hanwha's bid.

>active protection: no
Are southfront retarded? the picture clearly shows an iron fist system installed and the turret pic from shows that too

KF41 has been driven on Australian soil already. And has been inspected at sales shows around the world.
KF41 is brand new from the ground up. Neither a Marder nor a Puma were it's origins, not sure why you think that.
AS21 does look nice and modern, just like the KF41, but what it comes down to is the totallity of the bid and what has already begun with Phase 2.

The turret for the KF41 is already being built in bits here for the Boxer, and eventually for the KF41 too.

And that's not even to mention the actual performance of the vehicle
AS21 is equipped with pneumatic suspension system as it is already introduced in K21 whereas KF41 stuck to traditional torsion bars which everyone is moving away from
It has 7 road wheels on each side just in case of further increase in weight and mitigating ground pressure, unlike Lynx who has only 6 road wheels on each side
By just looking at the fly sheet, it's almost impossible to think Lynx could win without any auxiliary support as it severely lacks both crew convenience and design
Doesn't matter, the actual assessment begins only after 12 months from now no one cares what happens until then
And before you move on to the boxer narrative the Australian military has already made it clear additional points for commonalities with previously selected vehicles will be limited from the start.

You're definitely a fan of the AS21. I'm sure it's good but I don't believe it'll win, as Army has too many incentives with going with Rheinmetal/KMV again. I don't think 6 road wheels>7. Both platforms have great mobility and room for growth, and any support that you say is needed, will be needed for either vehicle.

>military has already made it clear additional points for commonalities
>no one cares what happens until then
Ahuh, sure.

The only better performance that AS21 might have is the Iron Fist as standard, which Army is planning to put on them and Boxers anyway. This isn't about performance, this is about the bid.

Just get that shit that makes your haid regrow, bro.

w-what's that?

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>You're definitely a fan of the AS21
I prefer AS21 only because its clearly a better option on the table
>I don't think 6 road wheels>7
Explain why the Russians suddenly decided to move on to the latter then we'll talk
>The only better performance that AS21 might have is the Iron Fist as standard
Don't forget to mention that AS21 is lighter than KF41 by several tons in dry weight, and that extra weight is saved from adopting pneumatic suspension and rubber tracks

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>Explain why the Russians suddenly decided
I can't, but if you can, I'll listen. The American's haven't, with their brand new AMPV. I don't believe one road wheel makes the AS21 mobility any better, considering the weight disadvantage of the KF41.

Lighter is good and all, but Army doesn't want it. It listed protection as it's main concern. Similar weight savings can be applied as rubber tracks are nothing new.
CASG also chose Boxer, the heaviest by far, of any 8x8.

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It’s okay my dude, I had this big curly afro I’d let grow out all the time that people absolutely loved. Now my hairline is starting to recede rather quickly. I’m just going to ride it out, there’s no reason to fight the inevitable.

youtube.com/watch?v=l1mBW5uf9Sg

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>Just get that shit that makes your haid regrow, bro.
I'm already using a low light laser device (Hairmax) but that doesn't seem to have an effect (or if it does, not a very big one). Now as for chemical stuff, minoxidil supposedly causes cardiac problems and finasteride fucks up your hormones or something.

There might be some good news on the horizon though. Apprently Japanese scientists are in the process of beating hair loss and want to commercialize it in the coming years (google riken hair loss) and, supposedly, mint and pumpkin seed oils are miracle cures (some studies claim they are but I haven't tried it yet).

>It’s okay my dude
Appreciate the kind words bro. We're all gonna make it, one way or another. We have to.

what is this thing the solution for? the m113s being phased out while being completely devoid of function since the striker was integrated? isnt it the bradley we're worried about replacing?

>You're saying as if it's a trivial task which isn't
Not him but it literally is.

>We'll Adapt Our Tracks to Every Vehicle
>All Rubber Band Tracks are retrofit; Soucy will design and build tracks adapted to any type of defense vehicle, whether a tank, an APC, an IFV, a recon or another vehicle requiring tracks.

>bradley
Are you serious? That vehicle is more than 3 decades old, the only reason why the US army selected it as AMPV is because they've still got shit tons of surplus
Bradley is going to be phased out by 2026 and the replacement is still in search
>I don't believe one road wheel makes the AS21 mobility any better
Actually, 2, one on each side
>Lighter is good and all, but Army doesn't want it. It listed protection as it's main concern.
Do you even read? The redback will provide the same level of protection as per the requirement while allowing a margin of a few tons
>Similar weight savings can be applied as rubber tracks are nothing new.
You're saying as if it's a trivial task which isn't especially applying new suspensions

I know how modification works but like it or not KF41 didn't opt for one

There are pics of Lynxes sporting Australian camo with rubber band tracks so I doubt it.

Well good for it now it only has to find new suspension units

Well I lost my giant post, thanks japmoot.

Essentially Lynx and Boxer arent the best choices for a rural desert country.

Australia needs to have a large unconventional punch, viral, bacterial, chemical, radioactive isotopes, anything it can manage. With delivery systems of course.
Also Australia needs to have a low grade counterpunch of insurgents, every citizen must be armed and there have to be armories spread across the country Finland style.

The AMPV is going to be the US Army's tracked utility vehicle to support mechanized operations and the current Bradley's and next gen IFVs.

It's not a Bradley, it's the Armoured Multi-purpose Vehicle. A completely new hull design.

Wow your IFV has 2(two) more road wheels!?
Less weight but same protection and room for growth? Doubt it.
It's not trivial, not sure why you'd think that. I just said using rubber band tracks is not an advantage as that's what KF41 can use too.

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>it's not bradley
Of course not, it's a neckless variant with new engine, thanks for reminding me
They're budget solutions for budget vehicles. nothing much
>nooooooooooooooooo you can't have a lighter weight while retaining the same degree of protection
Go figure

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To conclude, if you're going to use it as a reference for your counterstatement then you gotta come up with what's going to directly replace bradley, not m113

>then you gotta come up with what's going to directly replace bradley
You'll have to wait until Oct 1st, that's when bids are due for the Bradley replacement.

Neckless? Not sure what you mean. Without turret? It's not supposed to sport one, it's a support vehicle to keep up with mechanized units like the Abrams, Bradley or next gen IFV. AMPV is not a budget vehicle, it's quite important and doesn't blow the budget.
Go figure yourself out, you've stopped forming arguments

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What? It was in reference to the road wheels discussion. Not the Bradley, which currently has a program underway to replace it with the Optionally Manned Fighting Vehicle.
AMPV replaces M113 and other mechanized support vehicles.

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>Go figure yourself out, you've stopped forming arguments
He's an obvious Korean troll. Pay attention to his grammar errors, sometime forgetting to use articles like above.

>Articles do not exist in Korean. Learners have signifcant and often permanent problems with the complexities of the English article system.