Fentanyl as a chemical weapon?

What's to stop some Mexicans from deploying this shit as a fatal weapon? It seems to come to the US in fucking boxcars and cops OD on skin contact.

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clintox.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Fentanyl_Position_Statement_2017.pdf
google.com/amp/s/www.history.com/.amp/news/opioid-chemical-weapons-moscow-theater-hostage-crisis
goodnewsnetwork.org/instead-of-buying-new-car-retired-paramedic-spends-40k-on-overdose-prevention-kits-that-have-already-saved-94-lives/
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

It appears OP is not reading current events
Mexico and China are dumping fentanyl in the US

>cops OD on skin contact
Nope, they have panic attacks because of the urban legends. It's very difficult to absorb Fentanyl through the skin.

clintox.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/Fentanyl_Position_Statement_2017.pdf

Is it hazardous in liquid form? Could it be sprayed on people like the toxin tractor from C&C generals?

>However, incidental dermal absorption is unlikely to cause opioid toxicity. If bilateral palmar surfaces were covered with fentanyl patches, it would take 14min to receive 100mcg of fentanyl (using a body surface area of 17,000cm 2 , palm surface area of 0.5% [26], and fentanyl absorption of 2.5mcg/cm 2 /h [24]).

>This extreme example illustrates that even a high dose of fentanyl prepared for transdermal administration cannot rapidly deliver a high dose.

>The above calculation is based on fentanyl patch data, which overestimates the potential exposure from drug in tablet or powder form in several ways. Drug must have sufficient surface area and moisture to be efficiently absorbed. Medicinal transdermal fentanyl utilizes a matrix designed to optimize delivery, whereas tablets and powder require dissolution for absorption. Relatedly, powdered drug sits on the skin, whereas patches have adhesive to hold drug in close proximity to the skin allowing both to remain moist. Finally, the above quoted figure 2.5 mcg/cm 2 /h represents delivery at steady state after drug has penetrated the dermis, which overestimates the amount of absorption in the first few minutes of dermal exposure.

>This initial period is of most relevance in unintentional exposure, because fentanyl that is observed on skin can be rapidly removed by mechanical (brushing) means or cleansing with water. Therefore, based on our current understanding of the absorption of fentanyl and its analogs, it is very unlikely that small, unintentional skin exposures to tablets or powder would cause significant opioid toxicity, and if toxicity were to occur, it would not develop rapidly, allowing time for removal.

You are an idiot
Transdermal patches.

>What's to stop some Mexicans from deploying this shit as a fatal weapon?
because it can be sold as a drug

>Mexico and China are dumping fentanyl in the US
China is dumping it in Mexico because they don't have the infrastructure to stop it

>This extreme example illustrates that even a high dose of fentanyl prepared for transdermal administration cannot rapidly deliver a high dose.

>it is very unlikely that small, unintentional skin exposures to tablets or powder would cause significant opioid toxicity, and if toxicity were to occur, it would not develop rapidly, allowing time for removal.

It's not an effective skin contact weapon.

Because it is much more profitable to sell it as a drug?

in powdered form in can be dangerous but it would have to be within an enclosed space

ThisYou are clueless

pharmaceutical fentanyl in the United States occurs on a small scale, with the diverted fentanyl products being intended for personal use and street sales. Fentanyl continues to be smuggled into the United States primarily in powder or counterfeit pill form, in large quantities. Illicitly produced fentanyl is synthesized
in clandestine laboratories and typically distributed in a white powder form, to be mixed into heroin or pressed into counterfeit opioid prescription pills.

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Fentanyl is transported into the United States in parcel packages directly from China or from China through Canada,
and is also smuggled across the SWB
from Mexico. Large volumes of fentanyl
are seized at the SWB, although these seizures are typically low in purity, less than ten percent on average. Conversely, the smaller volumes seized after arriving in the mail directly from China can have purities over 90 percent.
Because of the differences in both seizure size and average purity, it is currently not possible to determine which source, Mexico or China, is the greater direct threat as a supplier of fentanyl to the United States. While seizures likely originating in Mexico represent the largest total gross weight of fentanyl seized in the United States, the overall low purity of this fentanyl means a relatively small portion of a given fentanyl seizure is actually fentanyl. Fentanyl sourced from China arrives in significantly smaller quantities than fentanyl sourced from Mexico, but due to its exceptionally high purity, it both poses a greater risk to the purchaser/user and can be adulterated many more times. DEA reporting also indicates Mexican traffickers order fentanyl from China, adulterate it, and smuggle it into the United States themselves, meaning an unknown amount of seized Mexican parcels containing fentanyl are ultimately
of Chinese origin. In addition, Mexican traffickers’ primary source of supply for fentanyl precursor chemicals is also China.

Carfentanil is a better choice. It's more potent and LD50 is much smaller. I remember reading a story of a guy who didn't use a mask while working with the substance. Somehow tiny amount of powder came into his respiratory system. He told that he suddenly dropped onto the ground but remained conscious so he had to use all his willpower to literally force hist own lungs to ventilate for like 5 hours straight. He didn't even touch the powder, he just moved the substance from one plastic bag to another.

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Would Picrelated + 1 kilo of fentanyl dissolved in 1gallon of alcohol or maybe acetone work?

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>The squirtgun wars of cyberpunk 2020 will become real

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It’s a liquid paralysis blaster
Maybe we could add some type of a mild gelling agent to make it stick better. Maybe cornstarch? Plus It’s all natural and organic.

This sounds like the same FUD they used to tell kids about how you're a suddenly a lifelong addict of meth after one hit.

Pussy. I snort boxcarfentayl.

Have you ever shot a super soaker? The system is not sealed very well and it leaks water on itself pretty badly. This is also why the flamethrower version won't work.

>killing all your buyers
Yeah it can be done but it's retarded.

>weaponized opioid attack
>take some naloxone and give literally zero shits about it
Great idea OP

The government has been worried about this for a while because. I worked on a project for sensors that could detect poison gas (sarin and the shit you’re familiar with; vz etc whatever). My bosses went to a military conference related to the project and all the military people were concerned with weaponized opioids. They don’t want people misting stuff like fentanyl into a shopping mall and killing everyone, but there’s not too much to protect against that kind of shit.

Oh jesus, fentanyl napalm

Fentanyl napalm spraying suicide attack drones zipping around the battlefield with IR cameras/detectors feeding combat information back to enemy forces with encrypted datalinks

THIS IS NOT THE FUTURE I WANTED

The lethal dosage hugely depends on the tolerance of your body against opioids. If you've been doing heroin for years you will pretty much survive a frigate going through your veins.

not alcohol or acetone. DMSO.

This x1000

Russia did find a way to weaponize it into a gas. And has used it in hostage scenarios, they released it into a ventilation system, everyoned passed out, they removed and resuscitated the hostages and left the agressors.


google.com/amp/s/www.history.com/.amp/news/opioid-chemical-weapons-moscow-theater-hostage-crisis

Where do cartels find all of these chemists willing to manufacture hard drugs, anyway? Do they take applications from anyone with a degree, are they press-ganged into it somehow, or are they trained in-house? I'm curious as all hell because everyone with a brain knows Breaking Bad was bullshit.

carfentanyl is a real thing, its just a more concentrated form of fentanyl used for animals.

>Lead or silver
Same way they find IT professionals, bankers, and security: you can make good money working for them OR they can make an example out of you and your family.

>China is dumping it in Mexico because they don't have the infrastructure to stop it
>Unironically believing this

Someone needs to make a quality super soaker

>THIS IS NOT THE FUTURE I WANTED
It's the one I wanted

I couldn't tell you how cartels do it, but I can tell you that it's not hard at all for someone to figure out. If you have basic chemistry knowledge (i.e. you paid attention in high school chem) and are willing to do some research it's no big deal.

The harder part is finding the precursor chemicals you need.

This also the Sinaloa cartel has connections in all continents so it's not that hard to find people ready to win money that way.

>aerosol cans spray a mist of fetanyl over a busy city street via drones

They killed dozens of hostages too

Welp, no more outside I guess.

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This whole thread is on some fuddlore soccer mom panic.

Just dump it into a large body of water that is used to provide water to a population.

Lake tahoe is completely unsecured against such an attack, hetch hetchy is completely unsecured, there are a few more on the west coast I cant think of right now that don't have the requisite monitoring. The fact that they don't should be concerning to everyone.

Id be more worried about shit like carfentanyl or ohmfentanyl. The latter is almost 30 times as potent as plain old fentanyl.

it's really not hard to figure this shit out in minecraft. you can find several academic papers showing synthesis of fent. precursors are hard to find but the skilled player can probably craft them in minecraft with some trouble. IN MINECRAFT.

also, fentanyl has poor absorption across skin, as someone already pointed out and several retards argued against. fentanyl is soluble in DMSO, and DMSO very easily absorbs through skin.

10 liter sprayer-drones are $1000 apiece on alibaba. That's less than a LMT AR and they give discounts.

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Education in mexico is free but the job market is awful. Average pay for a doctor is like 100 bucks a day. Synthesis isn't that hard (it's not r&d) and the pay is exponentially better than anywhere else, so recruiting is easy.

this wouldn't work. take an outlandish amount of fent, make the assumption that the water supply would be stagnant (ie freshwater not being continually introduced to dilute the solution.) calculate the concentration of the solution, then calculate the amount of solution required to be ingested for an ld50 dosage. if you can't do this or are too lazy, I can do it when I get home from work.

>dilution is the solution

it wouldn't work and if it did think of the collateral damage. drones are more effective.

its funny the weapons forum is getting scared of how easy it is to kill people

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he's a glowposter using reverse psychology, user. this is all speculation about minecraft-specific boogaloo.

Cops saying they can get high from feynt. That way they can self dose narcan to get a boost to get through a tough 18hr shift.

Can't wait for the narcan Aimo Kuvoinen to arrive and single handedly arrest entire gangs in a delirious state and wake up after a coma to be awarded the presidential medal of freedom

So all it'd take to send this country into chaos is misting the captiol with fentanyl gas? How easy would this be?

Just spray food with this wtf.

Using non-geofenced drones is critical, although not hard.
The hardest part would be buying pure product desu.

>the dmso squirt gun wars of cyberpunk will be real
jesus what a timeline.

It would work. It would make the water unsuitable for a large amount of purposes. Until the concentration went down to the point it no longer exceeds federal guidelines the watersource would need to be replaced or supplemented for commercial purposes. Residential areas would not be able to use their water source either.

You act like the only consideration for terrorism would be the death of people? I approach the question from what would cause the largest amount of economic damage and using fentanyl to contaminate a water supply would be pretty high up into cartoon villain status.

>Mexico and China are dumping fentanyl in the US
BASED chinks.

Acceptable losses

I used to do meth and was surprised how easy it was to drop.
I was certain I was gunna be in a dare handbook and now I own my own business.

let's just do this quickly. 2 mg overdose. Olympic size pool is 2.5E6 liters. assume you want to kill someone with an acutely toxic dose, 2 mg fent in let's say 350 ml of water or about a can of soda. 0.002 g / .35 L = 5.7E-3 g/L

(5.7E-3)(2.5E6) = 14250 g or 14 kg of fent to poison something as small as an Olympic sized pool. scale this up to the massive size of a water treatment plant that processes orders of magnitude more of water per day and you see why this is impractical.

You aren't getting the point of area denial.

You don't have to kill anyone to have an effect as a weapon. Simply contaminating the water to a noticeable degree will deny use of the water. The water treatment facilities are not set up to clean or control for opiods in the water, they do not regularly test for opiods in the water. Several 55kg drums would be enough to deny use of a water source and they would not be able to react fast enough.

They were actually terrorists in disguise, it was a flawless operation

if you're just trying to deny then clean why then why fentanyl? it makes no sense to synthesize or import hundreds of kg of a opioid to just deny an area of water. you're either wasting an absurd amount of time to synth it yourself in an industrial scale, or spending money and facing huge risks to buy it from chinks and import. it would be more effective to just blow up water pumps, fry the PLCs that control the plant, etc. or even use a poison less deadly but far less exotic and far easier to legally purchase. in minecraft.

>mexicans deploying as a weapon
user, murdering people isnt profitable. You murder to fend off rivals, disrupt investigations, and kill police. You dont launch a chemical attack against a school or mall just because. Theres no percentage in that

I didn't believe you user l, that doctors make like $100/day. So I looked it up it's 7k-35k a month in taco dollars, which is $359-1800 burger bucks. So you are wrong, but not in the direction I was expecting. That's insane.

revenge for the opium wars

Pleb. I step on it with pharmaceutical meth to make racecarfentanil. That’s just the ticket if you want to get down and dirty, do some serious King Hell journalism. You can cover ALL of the 2020 campaigns, from start to finish, in one night on that shit. This is not a drug for the faint hearted, though. Only Serious Professionals need apply. Once you feel the drug soaking into your hindbrain, it’s well past too late for second thoughts. A giant beaker of cheap gin can help get you through the self doubts, get you right out in front of the bastard. That’s where you’ll need to stay until November 3rd, 2020.

Stay at quality lodgings on the campaign trail, so you know room service will be available to bring you another fax machine when the first one chokes to death on the first 500 pages you jam into it. And paper. You’ll want a case of it, at least. The good stuff, at least 96 bright. Anything less will make your eyeballs bleed when you’re scribbling your closing paragraphs by the light of a Bic clamped in your teeth. Ignore the pain, you have to make sacrifices when you’re chasing The Story.

Stay at the Holiday Inn Express. They have a machine that makes breakfast. It’s in a room off the lobby, tended by very polite Mexicans.

I really, really like this post and I don’t know why

Thats a lot in Mexico tho.

>racecarfentanil

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Probably be easier to hit some train station terminals

And that's why you go to Mexico on the weekend for hookers

Gotta have a counter drone with super narcan ready to go

>casually crossing the border
Don’t do this

Narcan is the worst innovation since women's suffrage.

I wonder why those ragheads in queens havent tried anything with fentynal dispersal.

>Fentanyl is transported into the United States in parcel packages directly from China
So intercept a few. Fix them to burst open when unpacked. Stamp "Unknown at this address. Return to sender." Toss back in the mail to China.

its because people don't read up on this shit outside of the fox news article they read on facebook.

>but there’s not too much to protect against that kind of shit.
Sprinkler system or EMS drone system loaded with DMSO-Naloxamine to spray everyone with irreversible super narcan. Naloxamine is super competitive to bind to receptors, even moreso than narcan. And when it does bind, it's "irreversibly" bonded to that receptor until it gets replaced by the body (long time). DMSO introduces anything dissolved in it into the bloodstream just by touching the skin. Crowd is saved :D

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We think alike brother

That's true, but Carfent is very easy to OD in the ug range. You throw that in an aerosol dispersal grenade and everyone in the room dies

Lake Tahoe has a volume of 150 cubic kilometers. You'd need well more than a couple of 55kg drums to even show up on tests. Pure fentanyl costs between $2600-$4000 per kilogram.

The CIA wouldn't be able to make any money off it, so I doubt they'd greenlight it.

>Don’t do this
Why not? I was thinking of going to Tijuana for the hookers with a few friends, is that a bad idea?

Don't give them any ideas

No. It's super easy to get in. Just avoid the most populated areas

Plenty of people do it and have nothing bad happen to them. I’m not even a risk adverse person but to me I would rather just stay in SD instead of going to Mexico and having to worry about my surroundings and the vibe I’m giving off. Drinking and hookers in Mexico can be fun but also you could get stabbed by some Mexican or shot but probably stabbed. If you go make sure you have like 5 + people with you

Kek

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If you guys are worried about Fentanyl , don't search for Carfentanil.

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Or Lofentanil for that matter.

goodnewsnetwork.org/instead-of-buying-new-car-retired-paramedic-spends-40k-on-overdose-prevention-kits-that-have-already-saved-94-lives/

>Tfw someone spent his entire life savings meant for retirement on narcan to give out for free to degenerate junkies

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I’m unironically worried someone will put 5 kilos of this shit in a small town’s water supply and fucking kill them all. 5 kilos is 1.7 million lethal doses.

Holy fuck.
>carfentanil: LD .02 mg
Five MILLION lethal doses per kilo. How is that not an outright chemical weapon?

See Nobody would even notice an amount that small.

>aerosol dispersal grenade and everyone in the room dies
Didn't the ruskies do that when a bunch of Chechens took over a theater with a bunch of hostages? Then they ran outta Narcan and lots of civilians got dead.

He’s off by an order of magnitude, and assuming the entire population is adult males. Small town water supplies do not process that many gallons of fresh water per day, a few hundred thousand gallons per 5k residents or so. Your dosage comes from every contact you have with water, and every ingestion. Not just drinking. Showering? That’s essentially 100% body contact. Eating utensils washed in contaminated water, cooking, brushing your teeth. Etc.

>mfw it was the same guy 94 times in a row

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Dude not that motherfucker, that squirt gun is the fucking squirt gun

>implying recovering from an OD is like blinking after a hard sneeze

Do you like being kidnapped and ransomed?

Then if they find out you're a poor fag, they kill you and dissolve you in an oil drum

And if they do get money from your family, they kill you and dissolve you in an oil drum

>what is skin absorption vs stomach absorption
>what is half life