I'm 29 now, I work in 10-12 hours a day in finance, doing extremely mentally exhausting work (derivatives, sales and trading area) - so I'm basically chained to my desk and my job requires constant, extreme attention (like sitting for your university exams 10 hours a day). Now to be clear - I love my job. When I step off, I come back home completely exhausted, I usually listen to music, watch some Netflix with wife and go to sleep. My wife is also super hard working, we have a small mortgage we pay with ease and basically our life is comfy.
That said, I'm concerned about my health. Back in the days I've been riding bike a lot, lifting weights, lurking Jow Forums etc. I cooked for myself with ocassional proper cheat days.
Now I'm too exhausted to cook, I usually order a big lunch and that's my only meal during the day (so I usually fast for the rest of the day and drink water, tea and coffee). I also eat some office sweets from time to time. So I'm currently skinnyfat with some leftover strength in my legs and ass.
I tried to go back to gym, but I'm only angry as - when I work out in the morning I'm angry b/c I'm still asleep and I underpefrom. When I go after work - it's even worse as I'm exhausted. Basically going back to gym pisses me off as I underpeform and I fucking hate underpeforming - it embarasses me. Same shit with cooking. Tried to cook in advance for a few days, buy re-heated food after three days tastes disgusting and robs you from the dignity.
So here is a question for all the deskjockeys in high-stake positions - how do you cope with it?
6-7 at the weekdays which is good compared to my peers, 8-10 during the weekend, 12-15 if the week was super hard.
Ayden Sanders
fasting is good for you. take up running in the morning. it's free, and you are young enough where it won't destroy your joints and ligaments, providing you are meeting your nutritional minimums.
it's also great for mental health.
Jeremiah Roberts
IT guy here. Started to get into trading, first Bitcoin and cryptos, then stocks and forex. I love staring at charts, reading news, and looking for patterns. But I just can't do it 8-10 hours/day. It's too intense for me.
You need to look at your life as a whole. Money, work, fitness, housing, food, friends, spirituality, goals, longevity, etc. it's a bitch to balance everything, but it's part of what makes us human.
If you want to stay in finance, maybe go to an algo trading firm? Let the bots find the patterns, and you do just do the tweaks and other instruments that they can't handle. Or go into trading by yourself, and only trade for 4 hours a day (this was my original plan, trading the NY/London overlap period). There are lots of options. But working 10+ hours a day is a fucking horrible way to live.
Xavier Collins
I don't know what to tell you bro. I work 5x 7 hours a week, lift for 2 hours 5x a week and sleep 8 hours every night. However I most probably earn less money than you. Can't have it all (unless you bought Eth at $1 and sold it all last december)
Jonathan Young
Take walks everyday after work you have to start somewhere.
Joshua Robinson
>underperform
You say you're underperforming at the gym. Did you go? Did you lift? Did you run/row/elliptical/whatever? Did you do something? Fucking A. You didn't underperform.
You're not underperforming in the gym; you're overperforming at your job. Balance, user. Work 8, make your wage, then spend some time on you.
Owen Russell
I hate running, I'm a biking guy and once the weather is good I'm always biking to the office. That said lifting is my greatest woe. I miss it fucking much and I hate the fact I underpefrom now. How do the people have the power to lift so fucking hard when it's 21:00 at night?
Christopher Morgan
This, it's actually a stress reliever and it's a good time to mentally reflect on that day's events.
Kayden Barnes
mate 12 hours just seems like too much imo. you're supposed to get 8hrs sleep, so that leaves 4hrs free a day, which is probably partially spent preparing for work also. fuck that, work is just consuming you, simple.
Anthony Rodriguez
it's half mental. now that you are exhausting yourself mentally at work, you just don't have the mental energy to get yourself pumped for an extreme lifting session.
it sounds like you are way more productive at work that you ever would be in a gym. you need to go with that. shift gears, and become the best you in your current circumstance.
>i'm a bike guy
it is unwise to categorize yourself. it limits your potential.
Jaxson Young
I think the under-performance all stems from bad diet/ no program. Nowadays you can get instant oatmeal and 5 minute steam-able vegetables that make cooking very simple. I'm not anywhere as stressed as you, but it only takes me about 10-30 minutes to make a healthy dinner. I'd suggest buying a crockpot, and a george foreman grill. That way you can either cook juicy chicken in >10 minutes (while sweet potatoes or mixed veggies steam in The Wave), or you can throw pre-packed peppers in onions, chicken thighs, and jarred sauce in the crockpot and by the time you get home you'll have 2-3 hearty meals. You also don't have to go to the gym every-day, just go 3-4 times a week and if decide on what type of program you want to do.
I'm in that part of Institutional finance that is closer to 80s' that what you know from Jow Forums, so you're not an anymous algo, you've got a clients who trust you and they come to you with their woes and problems for that reason. There are other traders and salesguys at the bank who trust you, so you are at work basically all the time, as you, your name and your reputation is at stake. So you know, emails, trading other phone, cracking jokes and basically the common feeling that we're all in it regardless whether you're a fund, a bank or a broker. Also my niche is not going to see any algos for the next 40 years - it's structured/bespoke derivatives, good luck with algoing that.
I flaneur whenever I have an occasion. My holidays is always 20-40 km of walk a day and now as the weather is better I've been walking back from my job it was splendid.
You're right guys. My problem is I can't cope with the fact I used to be more active and stronger and my attitude with always trying to best myself is destroying it. So for past years gym was not a fun/relaxing place it used to be. Time to drink a coolaid and treat is as a session of relax, not as a challenge.
That doesn't mean you can't transition into another area of finance that would allow you have a better life. Or just suck it up for a couple of years, save a shitload of money, and move somewhere cheaper. Or whatever.
Cooper Thompson
Go lift before lunch. 30mins there better than nothing.
I'm clueless about equity. I do fx and interest rates, but I can't give you opinions and recommendations on positions I don't own.
Austin Morgan
Are they going to triple interest rates in an attempt to save the insolvent pension system?
Josiah Morales
Are stock market patterns a meme?
Evan Turner
Personally I was a strong oposser of artificially negative/low interest rate used for "recovery" (guess who benefited - big boys), so rates going up give me some vindication. We're going to see 2 or 3 more hikes (25 bps each) this year. I think that as of now 2 hikes are already in the price. Also I'm anti bailiout guy, so I believe some things needs to collapse to let others grow on the ruins, so if some companies go under because they are too leveraged and did nothing with it - too bad. You took a risk, milked it when it worked for you so you can't cry and demand bailout and intervention when you're on a losing side.
I think so, but if you can regularly make money from these then good for you.
Leo Brown
I know your feel. I'm an associate at a bank doing M&A. Burned out and too exhausted when I come home to do anything but eat and go to bed.
I haven't lifted weights since college when I had the time.
I bought myself a stationary bike and try to do 30 minutes 3x a week. So far it's working out and I'm sticking to it, but I don't have the energy to lift or do anything like that.
Not sure where to go from here, if I just save as much money as possible and then move on to something much easier, or what.
Parker Rodriguez
OP, have you considered a physically active hobby other than lifting? I don't have to work just as much as you but I know the fatigue after work. For me, it helped to have sports club with fixed hours and people you see every week you don't wanna disappoint and all that stuff. Most martial arts or even ball sports are more than sufficient to stay in shape, if that's all you want and you'll surely find something you like.
>t. junior lawyer
Noah Ortiz
oh shit man when it comes to hours you have it much worse than me, as I have free weekends and no pitchbooks to be prepared at 2 a.m. The memeway from wso about leaving M&A (and it's what people I know do) is leaving the bank to go to buy side. But also from my current job I know it's not sparkles and rainbows, as I'm mostly in touch with buy side guys like investment officers and other dudes that did m&a stint, so that I can structure some instrument to offset some of their risks from their investments. So guys still work a lot, but this time they're usually an equityholders (even minority ones with equity given as a bonus) in the PE fund they work at.
Imo the best way is to save money, gain experience (as such 1 year in such work is like 5 years of other), pay off your mortgage and other costs, save some more and start your own, local, healthy business where you won't be in front of a computer all the time - such as the gym.
I am in similar postion as OP and I find that a morning workout is the best. As far as food I always order out as it relatively cheap to my income level.
Nathan Gray
>people you see every week you don't wanna disappoint Great idea, but my autism would keep me fixated on not disappointing people. I tried this once, back when I had more free time, but then started to attend less and less as more work came. Now I'm too much embarassed to come back to that sports club like a biblical prodigal son.
Btw how is pic related doing? Haven't heard about Scooby for like 5 years
The hours aren't what gets me, honestly. It's the fact I'm basically on call 24/7 which makes planning anything impossible. I was an analyst at another bank and switched to my current one as an associate and the hours are better but still banking.
I thought about the buy-side and was preparing to interview at TPG near the end of my analyst stint. I actually make more money and am more stable in banking (my current one offered me a great package) that I decided to stay sell-side.
However I heard life at the mega funds like KKR and Blackstone is equally as shit. You'll make more money buy side if you reach partner but good luck with that.
Honestly not much you and I can do unless we get out of this kind of work, but we'll be taking a pay cut. Eat healthy and try to do bit of cardio / see the sun each week is what my goals are. Long term I plan to keep my expenses down, save / invest as much as I can, and get out of here within the next 10 years and transfer to some easy gig to keep my benefits or just retire and resume my pre-banking life.
Camden Brown
I’m the same age as you, work similar hours, also in the financial industry, but a different part of it. Here is what I do: If I get home early enough, try to start shuttting my mind down. Sometimes this doesn’t work if I’m getting emails or have to work super late, but every once in a while I’ll have to skip workouts. Go to a gym close to either home or work, so you can do it during your commute (I walk to work, so I make a stop on the way) and go in the morning. You’ll have more energy and won’t have to wait for equipment. Do a program where you can make progress every training session. This might have been the biggest thing for me, being able to add 5 pounds to the bar each workout doing SS. That got me super psyched to get to the gym each day and keep a book of results. For nutrition, I try to cook and get a serving of vegetables and fruit with every meal. I don’t always have time though, and sometimes dinner is my only meal if I’m super busy. I drink coffee during my workouts. Have another sport or fitness activity you can do once in a while to break up the monotony. I play open ice hockey twice a week in the morning before work. It really used to be a struggle for me to go to the gym, but what I outlined above helped me, so it might help you. Being able to track/see progress from every workout was the biggest motivator though.
I guessed that much from your competitiveness and the bias against underperforming. Maybe try a new sport one or two evenings a week or so?
Scooby unfortunately doesn't like us anymore and has left Jow Forums for good.
Asher Morales
Just did an internship at a bulge bracket. Trying to switch into tech before I graduate. Has anyone made the transition?
I don't think IB is worth it. You have the best exit opportunities but you also have a massive opportunity cost from working so much. Think about all of the things you could accomplish outside of work if you only worked 40 hours a week at 2/3rds the salary of IB.
literally just finished watching his "ten steps to financial success" video creepy
Jaxon Jenkins
You're not underperforming because you're exhausted but because you'ce been slacking off, got older and aren't even close to the level you once were. But keep at it and you'll see improvent. I feel like you have indeed become too comfortable and are finding excuses to stay comfortable. I get it that you're exhausted but 10-15 hours of sleep? Why would you waste so much free time. Dont you have anything you want to do? And excercising really helps to stay focused during long days at the desk. I run 4 miles when I wake up. Just do it for 5 weeks and you'll be able to do it within 20 minutes. It really wakes you up and gives you a boost.
Anthony Mitchell
Oh damn, that's a shame, I still keep some Scooby oc in my folder
Stay away from mega funds. KKR, BX, BR and others are basically GS, JPM or Citi of the sell-side, with 2-3 year stints and rotating doors.
Also again, thanks a lot for helping me cope with my attitude. I always aimed to overperform but it shouldn't be treating lifting and fitness like this.
Also tip for other desk-jocks - do intermittent fast guys. Once I moved to IF, I gained the following: > more clarity of thought > more decisivenvess and less cloudy mind > more drive to get the job done > no more gastric reflux (workplace stress is not a good combo with breakfast) > no more gastric pains > great peristaltics, I poop like a newborn baby, while majority of the office suffers from a stress-induced diarrhea or IBD
Thank god I got out of Finance when I did. Money isn't everything.
Angel Collins
How long have you been at your current job for? It's recommended to find a new job if you have been there for over two years. You can get a better wage, better hours and just overall better job if you put effort into finding it.
An alternative is speak to your boss about workload. I know you can do the job entirely and so does your boss but if it's raising this kinds of conversation clearly there's an issue.
Dominic Butler
Too right brother - what point is the money if you don't have the time to enjoy any of it? Sure, you will retire in your 50s well off, but then what? You don't have any passions or interests you have kept to pursue, your relationship with your wife/children has been strained from the hours and they see you as a cash machine, you gave up your health and sanity working those hours, which cut your life short 10-15 years, and you haven't really done any good for the world or anything positive to be remembered by when you finally kick the bucket.
To OP - I suggest you pickup a cookbook and learn how to make stews, soups, pies etc on the weekend to have over the weekdays. Sit on an exercise ball in your office if they allow - being sat for longer than 2 hours at any one time is a health risk. Go for a brisk 30 min walk around the block at lunch and eat at your desk.
In terms of weights - take roids? That's all you can really do. If you are not sleeping and eating properly, you will stall out fast on any program. And just do fully body squat bench deadlift on the weekend.
Austin Torres
>willingly wasting your life being a cubiclecuck while you watch the youth and vitality drain from your body each day
Bentley Allen
When I used to run I would sleep 6 hours a day and have more energy during the day.
Obvious you have to go through the bullshit of getting to the point where putting 30+ miles a week just means throwing your trainers on, having a coffee then taking a shit and out the door for 45 minutes first thing. You don't even need coffee after a while.
Lifting heavy weights will have you fatigued all day at leat when starting. That said easy gains for first 6 months to a year.
The problem you're going to have is adjusting into something that works for you. You have absolutely no baseline to go from and you have little time to dedicate to getting it down to an art. I've already decided I want a squat rack/bars/platform etc... in my home so I can fit reps in whenever I please without having to pack bag, walk to gym, etc...
Fortunately I have all the time in the world to do what I want. But not that I didn't put in the hours to get here, and not like my business couldn't fall apart as it has several times before.
Don't for one second try this whole... I'm too tired or I'm too exhausted to cook bullshit. Microwave oats with peanut butter takes 3 minutes while you clean last nights dishes and your coffees heating up.
Throw a chicken breast in the flat grill while frying vegetables with a bit sauce... 5 minutes.
It's gonna take you 15 minutes to cook oats and 20 minutes to cook chicken and vegetables until you're competent enough to cook a fresh meal in 5 minutes. Stop underestimating the skill requirement that goes into exercise and cooking.
It's your responsibility to balance work hours. No one else cares about you but you. I'd be tempted MWF do a 30-45minute jog in the morning building up to eventually 4-6 miles, TTS do big 5 compound lifts 3x5 pushing it hard on Saturday morning. Sunday rest.
Samuel Rivera
>Tried to cook in advance for a few days, buy re-heated food after three days tastes disgusting and robs you from the dignity. Picky. Do mealprep, freeze what you aren't going to eat the next day, then nuke it before you consume it t.lawyer
Lucas Reyes
you're stressed. lifting helps with stress. suck up the fact that you'll "underperform" if you lift in the morning and do it. do it every day. wake up early and go to bed early to get it done. no more excuses.
Ryan Edwards
do you really wanna be that 30 year old dude in the gym?
Jose Perez
>everyone on Jow Forums is either a wealthy engineer or wealthy investment banker
never ends
Colton Wilson
As a 24 old i actually chose to work at solar developer shop instead of ib becauss i work 50 hours and can do my own side hustle and keep healthy work life balance. In toronto so marginal tax rate for me is 35 to 50%. So government takes a lot of your money so just not worth it imo. A lot of senior staff at my firm are ex bankers creating their own value,living wholesome family lives and are very happy.
Jonathan Ortiz
I'm learning to function with less sleep than I'm used to. Which means a still above average amount because I'm going from 11 hours to 8 hours. It's all about time gains.
Robert Perry
Me
On the side of the solar private equity type role, i am trying to build my asset mgmt business. Have some money to manage in low 7 figs. I really think your only option is to find a less stressful gig and or build a side business. When i interned at big canadian FI the compliance kills you if youre a markets guy that wants to do his own thing. Have a gym downtown toronto in my condo so i hit it at 6am before coming in at 8ish. My day feels great and we have adjustable standing desks.
Jose Rodriguez
>threads asking about work/life balance centre around anons who have that problem in their lives >the neets and students aren't posting for some reason - almost like they don't have the problem
What a shock, there are lots of anons on Jow Forums other than you, and they come from different backgrounds.
Christopher Fisher
Your only option is 2 hour sessions over the weekend.
