VEGAN / VEGETARIAN THREAD
First off, no hating towards meat eaters. Just curious if there are any vegans, vegetarians out there that received positive results from this diet.
Personally I've been 'vegan' for 4 months now and ate cheese/ice cream on two occasions.. So not entirely.
To be honest I didn't notice a lot of difference anywhere.
fit is a meat eater board
there are no actual vegans that post here, only larpers
Well even if they don't post here, there are definitely some out there, even strongmen that get good results on this diet.
I'm not implying it is superior for bodybuilding, but definitely possible. Considering vegans get older and rarely (if ever) get heart disease, cancer or diabetes it would be worth it imo.
strongmen become vegan after winning some titles only to say that they are vegan.
actual Vegans are skinny and malnourished
How do I make pea protein drinkable?
Tried adding cocoa powder but it did mothing
going to try squash today
vegans do not get older. that statistic is massively flawed, because almost everyone eats at least some meat - that includes gluttonous retards that stuff their faces full of mcdegenerate all day and therefore die young.
vegans seldomly eat processed foods, which is the sole reason they have higher longevity according to some retarded statistics.
if even adding tasty shit to it doesn't make it drinkable, then maybe take that as a sign that you are not meant to drink it.
>To be honest I didn't notice a lot of difference anywhere.
Inb4 back problems & rotten teeth.
also cancer and heart disease rates are high in meat eaters because frying with vegetable oils is what floods most peoples bodies with extremely inflammatory substances. most people fall for the retarded "muh healthy olive oil"-meme and even use it for frying, which is insanely unhealthy.
ironically it is therefore plants that are the reason for heart disease and cancer in meat-eaters, but vegans get this less for the sole reason that they fry less than carni-/omnivores.
I add one scoop of the banana flavoured myprotein instant oats and some banana flavouring powder by huel. Oats improve the texture and and banana improves taste
Can confirm, I LARP as vegan from time to time because it's pretty funny to
I doubt this, though many vegans indeed do advocate for not using (a lot) of oil.
Back problems from a vegan diet? lol
You can't by itself, it tastes like cardboard. I make a banana/pineapple smoothie and add some of the proteins to that. Drink it slowly over 1-2 hours time and swallow it with enough salliva rather than gulp it down.
>Back problems from a vegan diet? lol
without any retinol and vitamin D you are 100% guaranteed to get bone problems.
the only reason you don't have them yet is because vit A and D are fat-soluble and you can feed on your own stored vitamins for years. this is why initially veganism feels good (cutting out processed junk food) and then after a few years it turns on you. just wait and see.
Doens't sunlight exposure provide you with enough Vitamin D?
Researchers have reported that mushrooms can provide as much vitamin D as a supplement. Portobello, maitake, morel, button, and shiitake mushrooms are all high in vitamin D.
If you truly rely on meat for this I think you're doing something wrong.
I've been vegetarian for over a decade and a half and feel great, and I'd recommend you go that direction too desu. I get why you want to be vegan, but from all the vegans I've known you'll start feeling like complete shit after awhile if you keep it up.
someone who doesnt know shit about dieting might feel shit. Im a vegan and I feels tons better than I did eating meat n dairy every day
Any tips typical vegans or vegetarians skip out on?
I take a B12 supplement and Iopdine (kelp) every other day. That is about it.
The facts:
Veganism is the healthiest diet for humans.
There is absolutely nothing you cannot get on a vegan diet.
Vegans have a way lower rate of cancer or heart disease.
Vegans have a way lower BMI.
Vegans have a higher IQ.
Nonvegan diets have the worst environmental impact.
Conclusion:
There is absolutely no reason to not be vegan.
I've read some studies that suggested vegans perform worse with their brains due to lack of creatine.
Creatine supplementation increased performance compared to the carnivore group. This was intresting/troubling to me.
Healthier for the body - sure, this is a fact.
>Doens't sunlight exposure provide you with enough Vitamin D?
yes it does - if you are a meateater and you spend a lot of time outside. your body needs saturated fat (no, not those crappy omega 6's from your cowfood) to actually build vitamin D. you don't get those (enough) as a vegan.
just for perspective: most people are vitamin D deficient despite eating lots of meat that already contains some and eating way more saturated fats than you on your vegan diet. you are basically guaranteed to become deficient, if you're not already.
>Researchers have reported that mushrooms can provide as much vitamin D as a supplement.
so, zero? supplements don't work. vitamin D supplements are only good for one thing: blowing out your kidneys. one tablet of ~4000 UI a day is enough for long-term kidney damage. why kidney damage? because it is not absorbed, but instead pissed out.
nutrition is more complex than just adding an isolated substance to your body - in nature, catalysts are often needed to actually take in substances. you can't just throw concentrated chemicals in and trust that they will get absorbed just as easily as the real deal (meat).
and about vitamin A: retinol is the only form we can actually absorb. there is this meme about beta-carotin being bioavailable when combined with fat, but the absorbtion is extremely minimal. you effectively need retinol, which is animal-only.
you should know that there is a special place in hell for people who knowingly and willingly persuade others to suffer.
no one could eat meat more than 4 times a year before 1920
the same for fish (unless you lived in a fishing community)
you could have eggs maybe once a month
cheese was not a thing anyone could eat often
same for milk unless you were a milk farmer
most people before 1915 were better vegans than today's vegans, and they didnt even have a choice
If any of this is true then how are vegans the one with the longest lifespan and lowest rate of cancer, diabetes and heart disease?
You need retinol, right?
This. The hunter meme is stupid, humans have always thrived on farming whatever nature provided them.
This includes animals - but to a lesser extent. You can't feed 30 people with just two rabbits for a week.
it doesnt because vegans are retards and dont take b12 (which they need since they dont eat meat and the water supply is filtered)
I too think meatcucks will end in hell.
>how are vegans the one with the longest lifespan and lowest rate of cancer, diabetes and heart disease?
you cannot possibly know this, because voluntary veganism is an extremely new trend.
i am saying voluntary, because 19 out 20 vegans are involuntary vegans in 3rd-world-countries that cannot afford actual food and would kill for a steak. these people have insanely low longevity, but conveniently do not get included in such studies.
even if it were the case:
1.) there is a selection bias: basically all completely oblivious and health-unconscious people eat at least some meat and therefore fall into the "non-vegan" category. this means that if we separately look at longevity, vegans will be up against health-conscious carnivores and omnivores AND every else that just eats junk food - obviously unhealthy people that will die very quickly. in other words there are no sensible studies that compare vegans to people who eat high-quality grass-fed meat. processed foods are the big culprit for longevity, and all processed-food-eaters are basically non-vegan, bringing down the numbers.
2.) most vegans are extremely young. it is quite clearly a trend, which means you cannot possibly know the longterm outcome yet.
3.) most of your claims are lies. vegans eat a carb-based diet with lots and lots of carbohydrates. your typical vegan eats hundreds of grams of carbs a day, which is basically a guarantee for diabetes later. if you honestly believe that eating thousands of calories worth of sugar every day will not put you at an insanely high risk of diabetes, you are beyond saving. you must be capable to see through this laughably transparent misinformation.
same applies to heart disease, which is caused by poor choice of dietary fats: almost all vegetable fats have ABYSMAL omega 6 : omega 3 ratios and are super unhealthy. consuming lots of seed oils, olive oil etc. will give you heart disease later. meat eaters are the greatest consumers of these oils (see 1.)).
>animals are "others" to him
>believes in hell, a place created by a deity that allowed man to basically eat everything except for bats and shellfish
Yeah, a lot of them refuse to supplement or to even eat foods that are fortified.
I have 15000% of the RDA in tiny pills and I eat one twice a week just to be sure.
IT's actually alarming how even omnivores are somewhat b12 deficient due to eating mostly highly processed or overcooked meats that have way less b12 bioavailability.
The most bioavailable source of b12 is methylcobalamin and as far as I know it's only available in supplement form.
so you're not ok with eating animals, but supporting big pharma is a-ok?
I'm ok with not eating animals and I find no issues whatsoever with other people eating or not eating animals.
I also have no issues in buying supplements that are highly bioavailable and of high quality and cheap.
>but humans are meant to eat mea-
>where do I get protein
en.wikipedia.org
Meatcucks did report the article however. The results are clear as day.
>per 100 calories
shape of teeth generally doesn't correlate much with food source.
camels for instance have carnivore fangs for defence but don't eat meat. teeth are tools - and humans, as tool-users (unlike all other animals in that picture) have degenerated teeth, because they don't need them as tools anymore. this picture is 100% misinformation.
looking at the actual digestive tract (pic related) it becomes apparent that we are way closer, in terms of diet, to the wolf than to gorillas for instance. the small bowel is important for meat, which (especially if raw) gets digested before it even reaches the colon. it is therefore relatively large in us meat-eating humans.
>intake = absorbtion
>all protein is the same
>all amino acids are the same
What does the China Study say about the people in Tuoli?
their diet has been analysed in both captivity and in the wild, 90% of their calories come from plants, and the vast majority of their non plant food comes from insects and only a tiny ammount comes from meat of other animals which happens very rarely.
For example in captivity chimps are only fed vegetables, vegetable-like fruits like peppers and tomatos, some fruits, flowers, and some insects, frugivores all eat insects even if indirectly, for example figs are reinforced with wasps in the wild.
we are closer to the wolf than the gorilla in terms of digestion, but we are much closer to pigs than to wolves.
>90% of their calories come from plants
That's the relevant part of their post. Chimps aren't vegan. Humans aren't vegan.
What? lol
Humans by nature are not vegan - however history suggests humans have survived and thrived on a plant-based diet for the majority.
I personally believe meat (ORGANIC, not the industrial, chemical-fed junk YOU consume) once a week/month could benefit your health in a lot of ways.
>Humans by nature are not vegan
Bingo.
>however history suggests humans have survived and thrived on a plant-based diet for the majority.
Source.
>hundreds of grams of carbs a day, which is basically a guarantee for diabetes later
Not vegan, just bad at diet: what am I supposed to eat if not carbs?
sunlight
veganism is a "new" movement, there wasn't enough generations of vegans to make such statement
True, veganism is a modern construct anyway so who cares?
But what I'm saying is that chimps are still frugivores.
Just like cows eat trace ammounts of animals and insects but are still herbivorous.
It's true, even merely looking at stomach acidity shows that pigs are closer to humans in digestion.
Dogs have way stronger stomaches because they are meant to eat chunks of food that have bacteria or other bad shit that has to be killed in the stomach before going through the guts.
Dogs also have basically no colon, so they just shit out any kind of food that survives simple stomach digestion.
Pigs have a colon almost the same size as humans, but they have a bigger smaller intestine.
Stomach, spleen, bile duct system, small intestines, kidneys, bladder are the same proportion in humans and pigs.
>clearly seen taken a bite out of a chunk of flesh
>trace amount
trace ammount on a monthyl/yearly average
and plus in captivity chimps are in perfect help and live longer on a diet consisting of 0 non insectoid meat.
The exception doesn't make the rule.
If I'm reading this correctly, Humans and apes are rainbow gay people?
>comparing accidentally swallowing a bug when grazing to animals that literally hunt and eat other animals
>live longer
Because of vets.
It is far from a modern movement..
>conflating veganism with vegetarianism
Also, where's the source for that quote
Buddha was an advocate for not killing or hurting animals for consumption.
There are numerous quotes available of him suggesting this.
"Meat should not be eaten under three circumstances; when it is seen or heard or suspected that a living being has been purposely killed for the eater"
"Eating of meat extinguishes the seed of great compassion."
>There are numerous quotes available of him
I just asked for the source of the quote in but now there's 2 more.
I'm vegetarian with 0 issues lol, always been one. Gains are great, I'm 6ft tall and face is god tier. Stay mad meatcucks
post it
I don't know senpai, DYOR. There are numerous sources claiming all very similar statements regarding this concept so questioning doesn't make a lot of sense.
>I don't know
Then why spread sayings when you don't know they're even true user?
My biggest problem with vegans is their dishonesty.
>There are numerous sources
The primary source is enough.
I was fairly honest in that, actually. Direct and no going around it, what you are suggesting simply is not true.
You seem to be afraid that Buddha himself firmly supports not eating meat. Well, now you know. Do with it what you want.
>You seem to be afraid
Then I wouldn't be asking for the source for these quotes, user.
The amount of meat-eating cope in this thread
Remember to supplement your b12, lads.
>Prevents and treats deficiency in both vegans and non vegans
>CNS Boost
>Improves cardiac functions
>Might improve performance
T. Vegetarian 3 yrs
Not him but I take highly bioavailable megadosed vitamin D3 and vitamin K2 pills(with vitamin A, iron and zinc, calcium added) and I literally experienced remineralization of my teeth.
I'm vegan and my teeth are in better shape now than before I was vegan just because of this.
>supplements don't work
>they blow out your kidneys
you forgot to explain why supplements don't work, yet they cause issues in high doses, you can't have one or the other.
Vitamin D3 pills are the single BEST way to reverse vitamin D deficiency.
And in order to balance your vitamin D3 you need a good ammount of vitamin K2, that's it.
People don't get kidney issues from taking vitamin D pills and pissing them out, they get kidney issues because they have too much calcium in their organs which vitamin D3 ini really high ammounts chronically doesn't really help with and may in fact make it even worse if you don't have a proper ammount of vitamin K2 to decalcify veins and artheries and put the minerals where they belong like your actual bones.
Wasnt so hard, was it?
Vast majority of b12 deficient people in western countries are meat eaters, ironically.
In fact b12 bioavailability in meats has been studied already, and they are immensively inferior to b12 supplementation(average bioavailability is around 50%)
wait ... pharma-bought studies say pharma is better than actual food?
woah ... throwing all my meat and eggs out RIGHT NOW
Sorry to break your dreams..
80% of all medicine and antibiotics is fed to #ANIMALS#.
The B12 you consume through food is pharma-B12 unless you eat organic, grass-fed beef, which you don't. So you are basically eating second-hand pharma B12 pills through meat.
>which you don't
don't be so sure of that.
You don't need to believe what I say, just look at the rates of b12 deficiency in america for example, around 30% of americans have b12 deficiency, while less than 5% of americans are vegan+vegetarian.
The animals you eat are literally fed anti biotics(wether you want it or not) and fed supplements, "big pharma" makes way more money selling b12 supplements to industrial animal farms or conventional farmers than any other sort of commercially available supplement.
It's time to come to terms with reality.
i had my b12 checked and it was fine, so all your preaching is null and void. that was even before i switched to carnivore.
This - when I found out this truth there was no denying that the commercial meat you buy in stores or in restaurants is just full of shit.
Again, don't listen to the Infowars preachers. Veganism is safe. Just supp b12 and vit D and let the polcels with their heart disease. I hope you enjoy veganism!
moral of the story:
1.) eat animals or go deficient
2.) if you can afford it, slaughter yourself.
Yours is fine, but many others' levels are not.
I'm not saying you can't have ok b12 levels eating meat, what I'm saying is that eating meat is a rather inefficient way of avoiding b12 deficiency, doesn't even come close to a proper high quality bioavailable megadosed methylcobalamin supplement, it is by far the most bioavailable form of b12 in humans.
Moral of the story, even eating animals does not prevent b12 deficiency.
Supplementation is the only sucessfuly reported method of treating vitamin b12 deficiency.
The most bioavailable form of b12 is methylcobalamin, which is found in pathetic ammounts in all meat forms but mega dosed in most b12 supplements.
>are there any vegans, vegetarians out there that received positive results from this diet.
Been vegan for two years. My skin is better. Otherwise no I feel the same as when I ate meat, so I think that's a good thing. I didn't turn anemic and lose all my gains and I didn't become some superhuman athlete either, everything was the same but I just wasn't eating meat or dairy anymore. And like I said my skin looks better in my opinion, probably from less oily junk foods. It's pretty much flawless now.
I am a vegan, been one for 17 years, and I got 100% of my gains while natty and on a vegan diet - but I don't post about here it because this board is full of frustrated, aggressive idiots and fallacious edgy cringelords - so any serious and honest discussion about lifting and veganism is essentially impossible.
2500 years ago they didn't have industrial farming. Being vegetarian was way less of a moral quandary than it is today.
Also though, the Buddha believed you could accept meat from others, just not slaughter animals yourself. It kind of needed to be this way because monks get their food by begging, and obviously beggars can't be choosers
What I was trying to say is that the principles of not harming sentient life go back thousands of years, Jainism for example.
Veganism rejects dairy and eggs because that causes harm to sentient life, when thousands of years ago it didn't do much harm to the animals because everyone lived in small villages
so you're putting more trust in manmade chemicals than in natural products (pasteured animals)?
>Supplementation is the only sucessfuly reported method of treating vitamin b12 deficiency.
and the last >2.000.000 years of evolution in which we haven't changed much? i guess we spent those b12-deficient, huh?
being deficient is also harm => veganism causes harm
the only true difference is that for some reason you seem more connected to lower lifeforms than to humans.
methylcobalamin is natural and synthesized from bacteria
I put more trust in my b12 pills than any supposed b12 concentration estimation on each respective food group these days.
B12 from eggs for example is literally less than 9% bioavailable.
researchgate.net
>and the last >2.000.000 years of evolution in which we haven't changed much? i guess we spent those b12-deficient, huh?
supplementation is the only succesfuly reported metho of treaing people or animals with b12 deficiency, that's what I said.
Never did I claim that it was impossible to get enough b12 from the soil/water/animals all before modern agriculture and civilization.
Supplements are just better at it.
Vegan whey protein tastes like shit tho and its really hard to get enough protein on a vegan diet without eating 3k calories+ a day
>vegan whey protein
Deer eat meat too on occasion. Not an argument.
>vegan whey protein
That's an oxymoron, I assume mean powered plant protein. I haven't tried too many brands but it tastes the same as whey protein to me, powdered shit filled with sweetener.
>its hard to get enough protein without eating 3k calories a day
You can easily get 120+ with 2300 calories, without using protein powder.
Has anyone had any experience with tofu sausages/patties/nuggets/etc? I want to become vegetarian and swap my meat out with tofu. How does it stack up with protein and b12?
rice protein in vegetable soups is unironically based and red pilled, I sue the rice protein as a soup thickener in the stead of potato starch, it adds to the flavour.
Hemp protein tastes like garbage though, peap rotein also tastes kinda bad, but rice protein isolate/concentrate for some reason taste good with salty foods.
>is natural and synthesized
you are fucking retarded, bro.
your body naturally synthesizes amino acids and fatty acids
your gut bacteria synthesize compounds from specific compounds you eat
you seem confused, synthesizing is not an unnatural process, but actually a natural one that is required for life to happen.
No - this is half-true. He implies an animal should not be killed for the purpose of feeding you - or anyone.
However in case you beg for food and someone offers you meat - you have no choice and accept it regardless.
Hahaha
I have some pea/rice protein powder and it tastes like ass - so does whey when unflavored.
brehs...
eating a diet consisting of natural(tm) fruits, veggies and grains that did not occur in nature, then supplementing with natural(tm) pills when you become deficient.
you're on a path to greatness, bro. keep it up!
Vegan sausage?? Fucking delusional
Some of these meat replacements taste great. Expensive ones are very similar if not better than real meat.
Since when was it a necessity that a sausage contains meat?