Okay Jow Forums memes aside, what is wrong about being vegan...

If you live in the city, would it be possible to maintain chickens?

Stop attacking people who eat meat and most people wouldnt have any issues with vegans.

>be Mexican
easy

Just bought a place out in the countryside. Fixing it up and will be moving in within a month. Theres room for a small coop and a few chickens, nothing too big though.
I meant in a health/nutrition way. Anybody imposing their ideology on anybody else who doesn't want it is almost always annoying and hell.

Annoying as hell*

I've been a vegan for months now and the only issues that I've noticed was that at first I needed to eat to the point that I was uncomfortably full every day. Honestly though my body has never looked better and I've never felt better.

Everything

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>they are annoying(and I don't mean they bitch about it, I mean we can't go to restaurants without vegan dishes, have to make extra food for BBQ etc)
>söy
>carb based diet

Do you have a good source on that? What im looking at is saying that intrinsic factor is controlled by genes, but idk if they factored in variations in diets.
>restaurants
>bbqs
>implying I ever go out
Understandable though. If I ever actually have to go somewhere with family or something I just order a basic salad or random side dishes that happen to be vegan if it comes down to it. Just try to work with what's there.

Keep in mind that b12 deficiency can take up to 5 years to show up. Our liver's ability to store b12 is amazing, but it's also finite.

I take general multivitamins and get a bunch of b12 from energy drinks.

Yeah sure, you think it's not a big thing, and you can eat anywhere.
But since we don't want to be a dick (unironically) with our buddy, we can't choose restaurant without vegan dish, or we can't invite them

>You need to eat a high volume of food to get nutrients
>Any protein you're getting is either not complete, has shit absorption rates or both
>Too much fiber is bad for your digestive tract
>Hard to get essential fats (nuts alone don't help)
>Basically MUST supplement. Even the most famous vegans do so
>If you want to be vegan from a moral standpoint, the vegan diet is far more destructive to the environment and kills plenty of animals

I think the better question is why would you want to be vegan?

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>Okay Jow Forums memes aside, what is wrong about being vegan?
Nothing
>So far I've only heard about b12 deficiency (fixable via vitamins or even energy drinks)
Then it's not wrong
> and less than average protein intake (which hurts gains.)
Why are you telling lies in the OP of this shit bait thread?
You can get as much protein as you want in your normal calories, if you just make sure to watch what you eat
>But for the average person, what would be the main concern they face?
Societal pressure (being beta)
Tradition/habit (being a child)
Taste/pleasure (being a child)
Misinformation about stuff like protein intake (being stupid)
>Just eat meat user, we have canines for a reason
Is≠ought
Can≠should
Just stop eating meat user, we have brains for a reason. Use it to find a way to make delicious gains without hurting others.
5-year-old "logic"

It makes meat eaters feel bad about themselves.

What a dumb fucking post
>>You need to eat a high volume of food to get nutrients
No
>>Any protein you're getting is either not complete, has shit absorption rates or both
No, no and no
>>Too much fiber is bad for your digestive tract
You can't get "too much" unless you try
>>Hard to get essential fats (nuts alone don't help)
No
>>Basically MUST supplement. Even the most famous vegans do so
One pill
>>If you want to be vegan from a moral standpoint, the vegan diet is far more destructive to the environment
No
>and kills plenty of animals
Orders of magnitude less than an omnivore diet does

I think the better question is why would you go on the internet and tell lies?

>If you want to be vegan from a moral standpoint, the vegan diet is far more destructive to the environment and kills plenty of animals

An advocado (pretty essential fat for a vegan) will take 1000 liters of water to grow. Wild animals die because of droughts. So this seems pretty legit. If you want to do the animals a favor, don't go vegan.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=5hRHZEb_uXc

It's wrong the same way yelling at people or sleeping outside is wrong. My survival instincts just tell me not to.

1kilo (2 and a half advocado's) but you get my point.

I'm not even going to try and argue with you, but if you genuinely believe plant or wheat based proteins aren't complete trash in just about every way then you're straight up delusional.

There's nothing wrong with a vegan diet.
Try getting your whole family on it, they'll thank you later.

>Orders of magnitude less than an omnivore diet does
>what is fertilizer runoff, increased pesticide use, the literal pointless killing of the domesticated animals without a function
Your moral bullshit has more holes in it than a sieve

Literally nothing. I'm not a vegan but I give no shits if you decide you don't want to eat meat for moral reasons.

>Nutritionally though, what's wrong with it?
less efficient, more expensive, more time consuming
that's about it
also, apparently, there's some mental deficiency that comes with it because these retarded threads keep getting made

Proof?

This should be more than enough to get any sane person far away from the vegan diet.
pastebin.com/ZSKczhCx

Pretty much the B12 is all there is, get supplements or fortified foods and you are good to go, fermented foods help also apparently

veganism causes modern diseases like mental illnesses, autoimmune diseases, and metabolic disorders.
veganism isn't better for the environment, it's actually disastrous.
the only that's true is that animal factory farming isn't currently done humanely or sustainably.

this is a good intro:
youtu.be/QPW3rbqWNu4

When my vegan friends come to bbqs they just bring their own food

Pretty much everything you said is bullshit

>Muh avocados
Not only vegans eat avocados and not all vegans eat avocados

To answer your questions, they're all orders of magnitude worse that the respective omni counterparts. Do you know how trophic levels work?
Why are you lying?
Post source or fuck off

Trophic levels are irrelevant in all of my points, you retard. Unless you're arbitrarily deciding that mammals and domestic fowl are of higher life importance than the shit tons of other animals (including humans) that will get buttfucked from the environmental impacts of abandoning raising animals for consumption

Veganism is the result of OED, overactive empathy disorder, compassion is humanities greatest weakness. Any man who doesn't naturally enjoy hunting and killing is not really a human more like the domesticated farm animals they love so much.

>You sir, win the internet for today

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You are hopeless.
What do you think animals eat, YOU DENSE MOTHERFUCKER

Your teeth will fall out after 15 or twenty miserable years as a vegan eating entirely unhealthy food for a one-stomach animal (humans) Plus you'll end up a sickly skeleton like all long term vegans. If you're good with that, go for it.

youtube.com/watch?v=EFF30jfTubU
youtube.com/watch?v=1HwBtRlyxPs
youtube.com/watch?v=PJnPZgLHHWQ
youtube.com/watch?v=4nf7wAMwfrw

(and rabbits and gorillas have to eat those leave twice, that's a protip)

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Are you seriously convinced that animals eat more bugs than would be killed if we had more crop-producing farmland to bombard with pesticides?

You're also severely discounting the marine life getting wiped out from pesticide and fertilizer runoff, the use of which would, again, be massively increased with the conversion to more cropland. Trophic levels are fucking irrelevant here, you simpering dipshit

(sorry)
>rabbits and gorillas have to eat those leaves twice, ie caprophagy, that's the only way non-herbivore system animals like gorillas, can live on plants and actually thrive and be healthy and strong as fuck. Caprophagy look it up, it's the only way a human vegan could ever approach healthy)

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He (assuming some retard vegan) is probably alluding to the factory farmed meat, where the cows eat farmed grains, using up farmland for harvesting the grains, not pastureland, for the soya-fed cows)

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That's part of the conversion I mentioned, though. Humans can't survive off wheat and corn like cattle can. The farmland that currently grows crops that are more nutritionally sound for cows would need to be converted to more varied plants, some of which are not supported by the soils of those lands. This would require fertilizer use, fucking up local aquifers and leaking into rivers/oceans and more fucking pesticides as more varied insects come to eat the more varied crops

Here's your (you) buddy :^)

yeah I also heard ,that cows can live and graze on the western badlands, soil and climate do not produce anything whatsoever that humans can eat, but the cows can, making eating these cows meat a zero harm to the environment deal for us and the earth, and the cows live a carefree live of grazing and living large until they get the trip to cow Valhalla. (F)

(lot of acres to support one cow, but there's a lot of acres out there lol)

vegans prefer pic related, kill all animals and the earth.

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There's nothing wrong with it. Just like there isn't anything wrong with any other diwt. Do what you want. There are wrong ways to produce food, sure, but that is separate from the individual act of eating something.

It doesn't

>Vegans think we give a fuck about their sick cult lol.

Vegan propaganda only works with weak minds (libtards).

>Implying the land we use to feed livestock can only be used for livestock feed and nothing else
>Implying grains and legumes aren't excellent sources of nutrition with only some veggies, nuts and seeds needed for micros which omnis should be eating anyway
95% of cows and 98% of chickens are factory farmed and fed corn and onions
Are you sv3rige? Or are there more room temperature IQ "people" like him browsing Jow Forums?

>Implying the land we use to feed livestock can only be used for livestock feed and nothing else
It can't be used in the way you're saying. Soil and climate play a pretty big role in that kind of shit. You can't just dig up a bunch of wheat fields, plant spinach and expect it to grow. For example, the American midwest grows a lot of corn. Not just because it's cheap and easy, but because corns are very suited to the area since it's been consumed in those lands for centuries by natives before mass modern farming techniques.

This goes for the whole variety of plant foods you have to eat to maintain optimal health and functioning and STILL doesn't account for supplemented nutrients

>Are you sv3rige? Or are there more room temperature IQ "people" like him browsing Jow Forums?
Literally not an argument. Of course I understand why when you know you're wrong and are just acting like a faggot for (you)'s

>95% of cows and 98% of chickens are factory farmed and fed corn and soya

Why are you telling me you fucking retard? That has absolutely nothing to do with me, and if I ate that (soya fed unhealthy) meat like I do (raw) you probably wouldn't see me posting again because I would be in hospital or worse.

But we do need the big factory farm industries, because only they have the money and political power to fight you lol. Accept your loss, or cry forever I don't care. I eat meat daily, you can cry bitter vegan tears.

>Meat eaters are so fucking stupid lol they have room temperature IQ.

Yeah, we aren't vegan geniuses like you who starve yourselves to death and end up emaciated toothless living corpses. I don't want to be that smart.

youtube.com/watch?v=4nf7wAMwfrw
youtube.com/watch?v=p7x8XtDBljU

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where do you even think the b12 in supplements comes from?

b12 supplements are often Vegan, it is created in a lab. B12 comes from Bacteria, not animals. Why didn't you check this before posting?

its gay

I don't eat a lot of meat mostly because i'm pretty poor and i think factoryfarm meat is trash. I hit my cal/protein/vitamin goals everyday. There is nothing wrong with being a vegan, there is nothing wrong with being vegetarian and their is nothing wrong with being a carnivore.

Just keep your fucking ideals to yourself

A pain in the ass to cook and come as close as you can to balanced nutrition, not alot of variety so it's boring, you are a pain in the ass to eat out with. Less protein availability. At least vegetarians get eggs and milk, and if you get free range eggs and milk then it's a victimless crime. Vegans are weird.

>victimless
except all the calves who get slaughtered for veal, and the mother cows who are forcibly impregnated, and the chickens that rot to death in the cramped conditions (maybe look up what free range actually is)

meat scum

i find it funny that a group of people dedicated ostensibly to being moral are so hostile and venomous. Reminds me of the left wing actually

I have never taken supplements or even given a shit about nutrition. I had a blood test done and all my levels are perfect, including B12.

I am skinnyfat and have zero muscle though.

So from what I can look at it from based on academic access apparently Gorrillas in the wild don't practice regurgitation and caprophagy to re-eat food and they generally just get enough out of just constantly eating all of the fucking time. Apparently the reason they do it in captivity is that they just aren't given enough food and enough time to properly eat it in a lot of places.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this.

So if we extrapolate, and this is just me spitballing, we could say that maybe people could get a decent vegan diet if they ate like gorillas and just spent the vast majority of their time eating and eating vast quantities of plant matter. At the same time that probably would have a lot of other unfortunate health implications like quickly wearing out your teeth and fucking up your intestines with sheer volume and stuff like that.

>Just keep your fucking ideals to yourself

This is something vegans will never do. The whole point of veganism is to shove their religion down everyone elses throats. (and to take away our right to healthy diet)

I think this is not bad though, who could be against any system or idea that starves, sickens and kills leftists by the millions world-wide??

I will continue to watch and lol as vegans wither, sicken, and die from their batshit "diet"

youtube.com/watch?v=4nf7wAMwfrw
youtube.com/watch?v=p7x8XtDBljU
youtube.com/watch?v=p6JBICT9OQ4
Below Freelee asks if meat eaters deserve to live
youtube.com/watch?v=ZDS_th9WPLE

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This doesn't make sense because if you were vegan you wouldn't be limited to leaves, you can eat whatever you want as long as It doesn't come from animals

Veganism is absolutely a left-wing religion. (thank God it is a suicide cult, a self-solving problem lol)
Funny thing to say for the plant-eater who destroys rainforests for his avocado addiction, plows over natural animal habitat for his endless soya needs for his faux "meat" products, and uses pesticides and insecticides to conduct a mass-genocide on small creatures in an effort to sterilize and destroy the earth. All done for 'compassion right?

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To be fair, Gorrilas at zoos aren't just fed leaves either and they still have problems apparently

IDK about wild caprophagy vs captive caprophagy for gorillas, we're gonna need some real poop experts to solve that, but yes, if human herbivores want to thrive like gorillas do, eating mostly leaves and shrubs, the humans would have to eat for over 12 hours per day like gorillas and horses do (both animals have very imperfect digestive systems to live as herbivores.) Horses hack is to partially digest the grass they eat, but eat a shit ton of it (vegans kind of mimic this, by consuming mountains of indegestible plants lol) and gorillas by eating 12+ hours per day, and digesting the food twice, using caprophogy.

Human vegans use none of these digestive hacks, therefore, eating plants with a carnivore one-stomach system, they are sickly and emaciated.

Keep in mind that Gorillas also eat meat unlike human herbivores (vegans) and gorillas have hind gut fermentation, humans don't , and horses have HUUUUGE Caecum, humans do not. (Horses have essentially two stomachs)

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Since it would help the conversation here, does anyone here happen to have acdemic access to be able to get us plebs in the tread some caps or something from any of the articles listed in here?
pin.primate.wisc.edu/aboutp/behavior/baker.html

>what is a sublingual vitamin?

>all vegans eat avocado and fake meat products
I was vegetarian for about 5 years and must say that most people just have zero understanding of nutrition and have wild assumptions about vegetarian food. But vegans are gay.

>Many of these hours are spent eating, as large
quantities of food are needed to sustain its massive bulk. It
forages
(looks for food)
in early morning, rests during the late morning and
around midday, and in the afternoon it forages again before resting at
night. Each gorilla builds a nest from surrounding
leaves and
limbs
to
sleep in, constructing a new one every evening. Only infants sleep in
the same nest as their mothers.
The Mountain Gorilla is primarily
an
herbivore
meaning a large part of their diet
is
leaves, shoots and stems.
They
also
eat
bark
,
roots,
flowers
and fruit. They will also eat
small
invertebrates.

Attached: Leave the Animals Alone.jpg (789x443, 56K)

humans also have the huge advantage of cooking and preparing foods in such a way that promotes healthy digestion.

I guess the question is "is that enough" and based on what I see from the average vegan I would probably say no based on their apparent psychical and mental health after sustaining such a diet in the long term.

That said, maybe there are people who it will work for, since different people can and do thrive on different things just because they're more naturally adapted to them, and also there are lots of different ways to practice veganism.

Still, from what I can see it's a kind of "why bother" sort of deal. You would probably be much better off with a standard omnivorous diet and I think it's perfectly reasonable to say that in most places it's easier to live with a healthy omnivorous diet while still taking the time to source all of your animal proteins from cruelty free farms than it is to live a "healthy" vegan diet based on the apparent work that some people have to put in to even get sub par results.

True, must be noted this is true, also fermentaition. (Raw vegans do not benefit from the cooking of vegetables)

More on Gorillas-----

>The
Eastern
lowland gorilla has longer teeth, stronger jaws, and a
broader body than the Western lowland gorilla
.
The Eastern lowland
gorilla is only found in the tropical forests of eastern Zaire, Africa.
Eastern Lowland Gorillas are predominantly
herbivorous
that means,
eating mostly leaves. They are known to eat only a few leaves from a
single plant, allowing the plant to regrow. They will also eat fruit, seeds,
bamboo shoots and insects.
>Gorillas also engage in Coprophagia
, They eat their own feces (poop)
, as well as the feces of other gorillas.
Chimpanzees have been seen doing the same thing
.
This
behavior may
help to improve
the use of vitamins or
other nutrients
made available
by the gorillas re
-
eating of seeds.
The Eastern Lowland Gorilla is the
largest of the gorillas and the largest living primate. The maximum size
of a male Eastern Lowland Gorilla can be over 550
lbs. and when standing 6.6ft.
in the wild. Large males can have an arm span of 8 ft

in. Some males are recorded to have weighed in at 750lb.

ippl.org/gibbon/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Gorillas-done.pdf

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OP here, didnt mean for this thread to devolve into the regular shitposting, been asleep so I haven't had a chance to respond to stuff.
Again, I only ever go to a restaurant with my family, don't really have any friends.
Please no shitposting
I don't push it on other people.
Sorry, made this thread trying to figure out any possible health risks/complications from being vegan, not to start a "lol, fucking meatcuck" thread.
Thats a pretty big filedump, I'll start sifting through it. Most of them appear to just be about vitamins, wouldn't a simple multivitamin correct those issues?
Any non YouTube sources? Not exactly the pinnacle of scientific accuracy.
Bacteria.
Im a fag anyways so oh well
I plan on raising my own chickens to reincorporate eggs into my diet.
I'm actually not a leftist, they annoy the shit out of me too.
Funny, but I'm not delusional and think that humans are naturally vegan or anything. I know we are supposed to be omnivores.

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If you add eggs and maybe some raw milk to your diet...

A you will no longer be vegan
B you will avoid the worst side effects of the unnatural diet called veganism.

Only doing what I'm doing now because of moral reasons. If I raise my own chickens, give them a happy life, there's no moral reason to not eat the eggs they produce. It's the conditions farm raised chickens are put through and the "culling" of male chicks that I have a problem with, not the actual act of eating eggs.

OK but if you eat any store-bought or farmer-bought vegetables, you paid for triple culling of natural animals.

1 When the land is cleared and animals lose their habitat.
2 When deer and racoons are massacred if they pilfer an ear of corn. Your money pays for the bullets.
3 Pesticides applied to every field, a mass genocide of small creatures.

All paid for with your money.

Not sure if this is meant to be bait or not, but I'm really trying to make this thread about the moral debate, just the health related issues associated with being vegan.

>If you want to be vegan from a moral standpoint, the vegan diet is far more destructive to the environment and kills plenty of animals

I was with you until here....
Fucking brainlet. I doubt the rest of the shit you say is true now.

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I have avocados weighting over 1kg each in my garden.

The mass production of vegetables and grain requires industrialized agriculture. Omnivore pastoralism is far more environmentally conscious.

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Nothing just get b12 from a pill.
Make sure you get Vit A and D (sunlight).
Some idiots says that you lack DHA but the body converts EPA to DHA, you just need to eat some "good fats".

Bacteria, they harvest with biotechnology.

Protein intake is actually an easy fix too.
>Ripple milk
>Wheat gluten based meat replacements
>Beans

I'd also say onions/tofu, but I don't want to trigger anyone

>If you want to be vegan from a moral standpoint, the vegan diet is far more destructive to the environment and kills plenty of animals
Most of the world's produce is grown to feed the animal agriculture industry, plus vegans make up a minority of the world's produce consumers. Nice try meatcuck.

Well, obviously there's being a faggot who doesn't eat a fucking delicious burger because some retarded animals die from it.
Burgers are good. They taste good.
Steak.
Bacon.
Good.

Stop being a faggot and not eating awesome as fuck stuff.

If you go vegan you might as well be sober/anti-drug your whole life with the whole body is a temple thing.

Because that is what (((they))) want you to do.

>wants to be moral vegan
>eats eggs

I'm already a faggot, don't drink or do drugs (unless if you count caffeine)
What's wrong with eggs if you raise the chickens yourself and treat them really well?

There's nothing wrong with being vegan.
We're born vegan.
Our ancestors were vegan.
Vegans produce no estrogen and their test levels are higher than steroid abusing animal murderers.
If you go vegan your maxes will double in just one hour and triple within a day.
Going vegan will make your feet small and give you abs